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Ionik Knight
Learned Scribe
USA
222 Posts |
 Posted - 13 Oct 2010 : 17:41:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
We've got yet another edition war brewing right here... Perhaps we could get back to the original topic? I'd hate to have to close another thread because we started having the same arguments for the 15,486,168th time.
Third Edition, Fourth Edition..bah a Realmsian craves not these things. |
Fools to right of them,
Jesters to left of them,
Clowns in front of them
Pun'd and parody'd. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4436 Posts |
Posted - 13 Oct 2010 : 19:29:06
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@ Markustay: Thanks for the compliment and response. Of course, your right and I don't think WotC really thought how big this edition change would affect the game so much. I'm under the impression that they felt it would go much more along the lines of the 2e to 3e shift. And I think back then, there wasn't an over-arching system like 2e. With 3e/3.5/PF, the OGL is everything and even I admit that it's soooo versatile that it's second to none for creating ANY kind of campaign you could possibly dream of (from medieval, to high-magic, to low-magic, to tech and future stuff, to a combination of all of that plus more). It's a big reason why I still utilize my 3.5 books still and enjoy playing with that system.
Though I also feel 4E has it's certain charm too. The fact that one class doesn't out-shine another yet can remain different in the way people can play it is a boon IMO. I like how 4E divorced the rules of the game from Roleplyaing in terms of restrictions and limits placed on characters for no other reason than to drive a theme or "feel". I like how the powers structure (at-will/encounter/daily) system works. It prolongs game-time and there's less of a need for rest and recovery. I like that ANY class can heal itself (albiet 1 per encounter) which gives the clerics and other Leader classes options to do their own thing and NOT be a heal-bot 90% of the time.
Now to be fair, I think even if WotC had never changed the edition and Pathfinder came around with their system, WotC would've seen drop in sales regardless. Like it was said before, gamers love their new "shiney". A new rule-system that practically converts itself to WotC system, new class features, a re-vamping of the old classes, better skill system....yea they would've taken a hit anyways. But I think at least with 4E, I can switch between the two for a change of pace. Sometimes being over-whelmed with options, feats, and powers can just get annoying and a simple +5 HP, +1 to BAB, a bonus feat is all I really need to stay interested (at least until I get bored again and change it up).
But many people don't have that mindset. They feel that the edition they've always played is the best, bar-none, and playing anything else is a waste of their time (I'm guilty of this too as I can't play 2E. It's just too horrible IMO to have any fun in).
And like you said, it's Apples and Oranges. I just hope we can have fun at the same fruit-stand and enjoy what brings us all together.....Orange Julius....er I mean the Forgotten Realms. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2010 : 03:09:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Diffan... I did run a campaign using Modern d20 and the package someone downloaded for me ...
That's a big part of the equation, I think. People will immediately start updating their torrent collections with each and every new Wizbro product that becomes available. The little d20 guys don't suffer as much of a loss because their stuff just doesn't have the same repute or value as the "official/canon" products.
To be honest, I think most of WotC's D&D sales (in physical products) probably comes from the initial frenzy immediately after the first core sourcebooks are released for the newest edition du jour. Afterwards it's just gift bundles, boxsets, and limited rare collector's editions - all of which include a trail mix of other Wizbro accessories (maps, figs, props, etc) that wouldn't otherwise sell in quantity. I'd have to pay ~$30-$50+ for each hardback PHB in the 4e set (yeah, local game stores are a ripoff), or maybe ~$15 each in eBook/pdf formats. Or I could let WotC shoot itself in the foot while paying for a single low-cost DDI subscription (and printing out the database like a madman!).
Competition is good. And newer is not always better. Can't say I like 4e at all (at least insofar as the Realms setting goes), though I hear it's quite popular. Low-cost 3e/d20 materials work well enough ... lol, lower-cost 2e materials even better. |
[/Ayrik] |
Edited by - Ayrik on 14 Oct 2010 03:13:56 |
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Kno
Senior Scribe
452 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2010 : 13:22:23
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| the state of the pen and paper game industry is great, both types of players are getting what they want, competition benefits all |
z455t |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2010 : 13:28:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Kno
the state of the pen and paper game industry is great, both types of players are getting what they want, competition benefits all
Quoted for emphasis :) As a side note, I am enjoying the DARPG as well. I could see running a Realms campaign using that system. |
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Bluenose
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
134 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2010 : 14:44:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Knight of the Gate
What *I* saw was a backlash against- not a ruleset, not a change in direction, not a 'rebooting', but in a (again, IMO) systematic destruction of the most fully-realized game world ever. Is this 'Just My Opinion'? Yes.
It's also a very hard to prove one. Not the 'destruction' bit - that is, as you say, a matter of opinion. But my copy of the Traveller Bibliography makes your 'fully-realized game world' claim look extremely flimsy. And if you think the Spellplague is bad (or regard the reaction as extreme), I can top it with Virus.
And I can think of how the cycle went afterwards, and wonder whether/hao FR might happen the same way. |
These, in the day when heaven was falling,
The hour when earth's foundations fled,
Followed their mercenary calling
And took their wages and are dead.
Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
They stood, and earth's foundations stay;
What God abandoned, these defended,
And saved the sum of things for pay. |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2011 : 20:02:53
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So... According to Lisa Stevens, CEO of Paizo Publishing, the reports she's getting from distributors is that Pathfinder is not the top-selling RPG in the market. This does not take into account board-game tie-ins or such, just the books and digital copies of those books. Add to that the fact that the Core Rulebook has been sittin' pretty at the #1 Book in Gaming on Amazon for quite a while and I think we may just be seeing a new king.
Post #1
Clarification |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36797 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jul 2011 : 20:54:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
So... According to Lisa Stevens, CEO of Paizo Publishing, the reports she's getting from distributors is that Pathfinder is not the top-selling RPG in the market. This does not take into account board-game tie-ins or such, just the books and digital copies of those books. Add to that the fact that the Core Rulebook has been sittin' pretty at the #1 Book in Gaming on Amazon for quite a while and I think we may just be seeing a new king.
Post #1
Clarification
I believe you mean "Pathfinder is now the top-selling RPG in the market"?
Some very good news for Paizo, and I so would love to see the private reaction of WotC execs to that tidbit!  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
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Well... Isn't that Interesting?
