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Razz
Senior Scribe
USA
749 Posts |
 Posted - 25 Oct 2008 : 17:20:38
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Hello sages, I was wondering if you can direct me to the sources where information on the nation of Turmish is given. I've always been interested in this nation and felt that it was going somewhere in 3E (and hoped for a Vilhon Reach regional book one day...alas) but information on it has ceased.
Thanks if you can provide me information on it. I know the FRCG 3E and Races of Faerun offers some info. Champions of Valor has, also. Anything else would be appreciated.
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2008 : 17:26:28
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| the vilhon Reach source book has the most information I believe. The 4E FRCG pages 184-185 the 3FRCS starting on page 220. |
Edited by - scererar on 25 Oct 2008 17:39:51 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
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Fillow
Master of Realmslore
France
1608 Posts |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2008 : 20:51:23
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| Not a whole lot on Turmish, I'm afraid, but you can find a map of the place here. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
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crazedventurers
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1073 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 10:08:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Razz
Hello sages, I was wondering if you can direct me to the sources where information on the nation of Turmish is given. I've always
Ed wrote a series of articles for Polyhedron magazine - circa issues 95-115 or so (I don't have the mags to hand to check exact issues).
Cheers
Damian |
So saith Ed. I've never said he was sane, have I?
Gods, all this writing and he's running a constant fantasy version of Coronation Street in his head, too. .
shudder,
love to all,
THO
Candlekeep Forum 7 May 2005 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 13:26:24
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Aye. I referenced those articles in the scroll Fillow mentioned above.
I'll repost it here:-
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Didn't I answer this at WotC a while back?
Anyways... The coverage of Turmish in POLYHEDRON:- #96, 98, 101, 103–108. These contain some lore that didn't make it into Vilhon Reach accessory.
See Mel Odom's The Jewel of Turmish novel also.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 16:07:45
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Too bad it's impossible to get your hands on old Polyhedrons - I can't find pdfs of them anywhere.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 17:35:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Too bad it's impossible to get your hands on old Polyhedrons - I can't find pdfs of them anywhere.
It's not impossible, just difficult. I wish they were available as pdfs. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 18:59:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
Weren't there some on the Dragon Archive put out a couple of years ago on CD-ROM?
The Dragon Magazine Archive CD-ROM contains issues 1-250 of Dragon, and 7 issues (I assume that's all of them) of The Strategic Review.
I do not know of any electronic versions of Polyhedron -- legal or illegal. I do really wish, though, that they were available as pdfs -- the few Polyhedrons I own have some good material in them, and it's a shame that such good stuff is not more widely available. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 29 Oct 2008 19:01:35 |
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Brian R. James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
1098 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 19:11:07
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| Erik Boyd got his start writing for Polyhedron. There is some excelent Realmslore hidden within those pages. |
Brian R. James - Freelance Game Designer
Follow me on Twitter @brianrjames |
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ShadezofDis
Senior Scribe
402 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 20:41:07
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I actually managed to find those Polyhedrons and they're pretty decent. Mostly articles of locations with possible treasures, not terribly detailed (ie. not a lot of detail about the towns the locations are rumored to be in) but it's still some good stuff.
I've actually been running a game in Turmish for a good year and a half now but my notes are pretty much a mess but if you have some specific questions I can give you the answers that I made up. Clearly not official but if there are things you don't want to make up I probably have some notes about just about anything you might want to know. Just might take a few days to find the particular notes.  |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2008 : 22:43:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I do not know of any electronic versions of Polyhedron -- legal or illegal. I do really wish, though, that they were available as pdfs -- the few Polyhedrons I own have some good material in them, and it's a shame that such good stuff is not more widely available.
You'll find plenty of the printed editions at paizo.com and nobleknight.com.
**The Sage looks fondly at his own near-complete collection of POLHEDRON Magazines** |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 29 Oct 2008 22:46:52 |
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Razz
Senior Scribe
USA
749 Posts |
Posted - 30 Oct 2008 : 01:31:05
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Thanks everyone.
Yeah I actually did find a set of PDFs a long time back of Polyhedrons. Not all of them, but a decent chunk. I can't remember where I got them anymore, unfortunately. |
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Caladan Brood
Senior Scribe
Norway
410 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jun 2015 : 21:48:51
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*necro*
I've read The Vilhon Reach but I'm still not sure how to envision Turmish in terms of architecture, clothing, culture - is there any real-world comparison? Am I to think "Turkish"? |
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Rymac
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 19 Jun 2015 : 22:33:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Caladan Brood
*necro*
I've read The Vilhon Reach but I'm still not sure how to envision Turmish in terms of architecture, clothing, culture - is there any real-world comparison? Am I to think "Turkish"?
Although I hesitate to apply real-world analogues to things in the Realms, I've equated the Turmish to be have a middle-eastern to near-Asian quality not unlike the peoples of India. That's how I've pictured the architecture and art in the Turmish culture. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jun 2015 : 04:17:31
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Morocco might be closer, both ethnically and culturally. There was a Turmish Mage pictured on some 3e (magic) supplement, but I forget which.*
The dynamic between RW Morocco and Spain is very similar to Turmish and Sembia.
*EDIT: Complete Arcane |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 20 Jun 2015 04:23:15 |
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Rymac
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jun 2015 : 05:05:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Morocco might be closer, both ethnically and culturally. There was a Turmish Mage pictured on some 3e (magic) supplement, but I forget which.*
The dynamic between RW Morocco and Spain is very similar to Turmish and Sembia.
*EDIT: Complete Arcane
I get that. Basically, something akin to a berber ethnicity. However, I remember, at least from the OGB, that the Turmish have a rich mahogany skin tone. That with the architecture described made me think of the Indian people. I always fixated on the tall Indian henchman (wielding a circular saw blade thingy) in the Octopus-- James Bond movie. |
Edited by - Rymac on 20 Jun 2015 05:12:34 |
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Caladan Brood
Senior Scribe
Norway
410 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jun 2015 : 11:43:45
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| But Morocco is mostly desert (don't magic missile me if I'm wrong) while Turmish is lush and fertile right? |
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Rymac
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jun 2015 : 17:18:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Caladan Brood
But Morocco is mostly desert (don't magic missile me if I'm wrong) while Turmish is lush and fertile right?
Along the Atlantic and Mediterranean coast inland to the mountains, no. On the other side of the Atlas mountains, yes. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jun 2015 : 16:42:10
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Turmish is mostly mountains - it has very little forest (within its borders) and from what I gather the interior is more of a 'scrub plains' type of environment, so perhaps something akin to Australia (with the majority of folks living along the coast), with only a few inland settlements along trade routes or in the few fertile regions.
Perhaps even like the American midwest - farming is possible but its not exactly ideal.
So no desert, but they have their own problems - they are insular and yet have a trade-based economy. I figure because other then the traders themselves, Turmish doesn't have a whole lot to offer that isn't available cheaper elsewhere. You would think they have mineral wealth, but the surface of the mountains is swarming with large, organized orc clans and the underdark beneath them has at least two dark dwarven settlements. This leaves them with the coast and the inhospitable interior to build their economy upon.
So trade up the Vilhon Reach from the waterways (the new canal and also the old Tethyr Road) is their primary source of income, and they probably trade for most of their consumables (the lands directly to the south are rich and fertile). *I think* the winds in that region tend to blow South, AWAY from Turmish (so little moisture) and toward the Old Empires/Chondath. So yeah, not a desert, but still fairly arid compared to other nations around the Inner Sea.
EDIT: Sembia, for its part (in my RW comparison) is a lot like Spain during the period when there were several Moorish kingdoms there (see my favorite movie of all time, El Cid). So you get a wee bit of that 'Middle Eastern' vibe there as well, but only in styles and perhaps architecture 'borrowed' from Turmish and other southern nations. Whereas Sembia (and Cormyr and perhaps even Impiltur) is known for its patrols and trading on the Sea of Fallen Stars, I think Turmish may dominate most of the southern routes, at least up to the Alamber sea, and therefor isn't as 'in your face' (well known) as the others amongst the Heartlands nations and peoples. Thus, Turmish is actually on par (and perhaps 'friendly rivals) with Sembia in regards to commerce, but its subtler and therefor less notorious.
Just MY OWN TAKE, BTW. We don't have a lot of canon on either of them, but from doing the maps I get a 'feel' for what a place is like. Certain types of terrain tend toward certain types of cultures. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 22 Jun 2015 16:52:17 |
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Caladan Brood
Senior Scribe
Norway
410 Posts |
Posted - 22 Jun 2015 : 18:41:02
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| Thank you for the excellent input. There are so many places to explore in the Realms. I've "been" in the North for a while but now I've set my sights on the south (of the Sea of Fallen Stars). There's always something to learn. With all the sources spread across editions, magazines, game etc it is in fact overwhelming. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2015 : 00:26:10
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The best basic primer is Races of Faerun. It provides a broad overview of who lives where and some historical background.
You can then drill down from that source.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1288 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2020 : 13:13:26
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Sorry for the resurrection of the scroll.
I was re-reading Jewel of Turmish this week and it struck me that the Turmish described by Akabar Bal Akash in The Finder's Stone is really not what we get in the Jewel of Turmish novel. I asked Ed on Twitter and he says that it is because Turmish is a big country and has various sub-cultures.
My own suspicion is that Jewel of Turmish was written about the Emeral Enclave first (something Akabar never mentioned once despite it being a prominent feature of Turmish culture IMHO) and without any reference to the trading culture where men have many wives (something with more of a Middle-Eastern, Northern African flair?).
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2020 : 18:25:19
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The people of Turmish were originally the dominant race from what is now Turmish all across to the east in what is now Chessenta and further east as well.
I have always seen them as originally from further south, and the Durpari as another offshoot.
So, to me, they are more akin to a dark skinned Indian/Persian culture. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
Edited by - Dalor Darden on 08 Jun 2020 18:46:14 |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1288 Posts |
Posted - 08 Jun 2020 : 20:16:26
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It was always just odd to me how different Turmish is from what Akabar described it as in Finder's Stone trilogy (exotic trading obsessed culture) compared to Jewel of Turmish (which is very generic wilderness and Alaghon a generic medieval port city).
I wondered which is more Ed's vision for the land, and it appears both are. Which strikes me as odd. Given Jeff Grubb co-wrote the OGB, I'm going to go with Akabar's version in my head canon.
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6361 Posts |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1288 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2020 : 00:33:44
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I read up on the 2nd edition Vilhon Reach sourcebook; great stuff. It doesn't really differentiate between north and south Turmish, but is much more in keeping with the Akabar Bel Akash version:
The people of Turmish are tall, mahogany-skinned, and generally well-educated,
especially in business and agriculture. Custom dictates that the male merchants of
Turmish have square, neatly trimmed beards. This custom has given rise to the phrase
as square as a Turmishan#146;s beard, used to indicate a fair deal throughout the Reach |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2020 : 12:26:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Seravin
Sorry for the resurrection of the scroll.
I was re-reading Jewel of Turmish this week and it struck me that the Turmish described by Akabar Bal Akash in The Finder's Stone is really not what we get in the Jewel of Turmish novel. I asked Ed on Twitter and he says that it is because Turmish is a big country and has various sub-cultures.
My own suspicion is that Jewel of Turmish was written about the Emeral Enclave first (something Akabar never mentioned once despite it being a prominent feature of Turmish culture IMHO) and without any reference to the trading culture where men have many wives (something with more of a Middle-Eastern, Northern African flair?).
There is the possibility that Akabar bel Akash and his family are actually of Calishite origin (which would explain the "many wives" thing) and that he is part of an ethnic minority in that realm. Something that is very common IRL.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Turmish
