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branmakmuffin
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
 Posted - 10 Jun 2003 : 18:46:46
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Are there firearms in the FR? If so, how do the mechanics of attack work (especially in 2e)? I have some adventure from an old White Dwarf that has a firearm in it and the attack mechanics are dopey: the target makes a save versus breath weapon (or something). If it's successful, the shooter misses.
I can't believe this topic never came up before. I did a subject seach of "gun" and "firearm" in all forums and got no hits.
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Elrond Half Elven
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
322 Posts |
Posted - 10 Jun 2003 : 21:39:48
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I think that, i.e. not certian, that in 2nd Edition you made an attack roll as normal, however if a 1 or 2 is roled then the firer takes 1d6 points of damage. I know that an Arquebus does 1d10 damge and for ever 10 that is rolled it does another 1D10 of damage. I am certian that there are other rules for firearms.
Try looking at some of the spell-jammer books. I am certian that they are included in them. Sorry i couldnt be more help.
Hanx Elrond |
Once upon a midnight dreary, while i pondered, weak and weary,
Over many a quaint and curious volume of forgotten lore-
While i nodded, nearly napping, suddenly there came a tapping,
As of some one gently rapping, rapping at my chamber door.
-The Raven by Edgar Allan Poe |
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Lord Rad
Great Reader
United Kingdom
2080 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 08:31:10
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 There will NEVER be any firearms in my FR campaign! I think its ridiculous for the setting and is just a poor attempt by TSR (at the time in the FR Adventures book) to bring another earth culture to the setting!
BOO HISS to firearms! |
Lord Rad
"What? No, I wasn't reading your module. I was just looking at the pictures"
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 08:40:39
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I agree. This is definitely the wrong direction to take in the FR campaign setting. Especially since we have d20 Modern nowadays anyway.
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 08:43:35
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I think I'd have to agree, Rad. Anytime someone tries to mix real firearms and magic in a medieval setting, it never seems to work out. The closest I've ever seen for that to work would be The Rose Sea, coauthored by S. M. Stirling and Holly Lisle. However, that one was far from an instant classic. Good, but could have been a lot better.
The only way I've seen that works is in a transfer story, where firearms are introduced, or (though I've never seen this one) expanded on by modern-day Earth humans when they get summoned to a fantasy setting. The best example of that one would be Joel Rosenberg's Guardians of the Flame series. That one was a superior story.
I have to say that firearms in D&D, at least normal D&D, are just too difficult. In FR it's impossible. I never liked the idea of smokepowder, and I've done my best to treat it like it wasn't there. I've always thought that spell-devices would be better. For instance, a 'gun' that fires magic missiles (I did a similar one for a non-D&D story once; it worked pretty well) would fit far better than a 'normal' gun. I've also thought that for a ship, 'cannons' that fire fireballs would be good as well.
I just recently looked at the plan for an elven naval spelljammer, and was strangely glad to see how many ballistae were on it. Somehow that seems better, don't you think? |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 08:50:16
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Yes it does seem better. Especially since, in my just completed Spelljammer campaign, a pair of players were attempting to modify a captured Elven Warbird and trying to fit black-powder weapons to it, in hopes of helping out the Elven fleet fighting against a massed Beholder invasion of the planet Relativity.
Fortunately as DM, I could put a stop to that little venture right away  .
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Yasraena
Senior Scribe
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 19:54:55
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I'd have to go with the majority here. Firearms of any type just DO NOT belong in a strictly fantasy setting. The two concepts are basically polar opposites.
It's the same premise as that old D&D module called (I think) White Plume Mountain, where your group of fantasy characters find a crashed spaceship with robots and energy weapons, etc.
Just a ridiculous idea. |
"Nindyn vel'uss malar verin z'klaen tlu kyone ulu naut doera nindel vel'bolen nind malar."
Yasraena T'Sarran
Harper of Silverymoon |
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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 22:09:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Yasraena
I'd have to go with the majority here. Firearms of any type just DO NOT belong in a strictly fantasy setting. The two concepts are basically polar opposites.
It's the same premise as that old D&D module called (I think) White Plume Mountain, where your group of fantasy characters find a crashed spaceship with robots and energy weapons, etc.
Just a ridiculous idea.
That module was entiled S3 EXPEDITION TO THE BARRIER PEAKS. ACTUALLY it is one of the classics, and it was gygax's way of explaiing where mind flayers came from. I agree though, I do not think that a STRICT fantays setting should have firearms. I personally do not allow them.
White Plume Mountain was pure dungeon crawl. It was GREAT! IT was a trap hell where most D&D players of the 80's tested thier mettle.
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A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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branmakmuffin
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 11 Jun 2003 : 22:32:31
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Chaosium used firearms successfully in Glorantha, in my opinion. Black powder was one of the "magic" things of the Dwarves (as was iron).
I'm not going to have them in my FR campaign, but I disagree that they can't work in a fantasy setting. |
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Brynweir
Senior Scribe
USA
436 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 02:06:07
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quote:
Originally posted by branmakmuffin
Chaosium used firearms successfully in Glorantha, in my opinion. Black powder was one of the "magic" things of the Dwarves (as was iron).
I'm not going to have them in my FR campaign, but I disagree that they can't work in a fantasy setting.
I have to agree with branmakmuffin. I think that it is possible to successfully include firearms in a fantasy setting, particularly since different types of people are constantly performing research, one of them is bound to come across the idea sooner or later (just as they did in RL).
Although I do think it would be treated like Rosenberg in that only a select group would actually have the knowledge for making the firearms, and they would be outrageously expensive and difficult to obtain. I think, as a DM, you could also play around with it and make it difficult for players to keep the firearms in working condition. You could also add percentages for failure to fire, or potential backfire, etc. If you want to include firearms (I don't particularly care for them) then it would be up to the DM as to how common they would be, as well as potential mishaps. It could be fun or at least interesting. |
Anyone who likes to read something that's really dark and gritty and completely awesome ought to read The Night Angel Trilogy by Brent Weeks. You can check out a little taste at www.BrentWeeks.com I should probably warn you, though, that it is definitely not PG-13 :-D
He also started a new Trilogy with Black Prism, which may even surpass the Night Angel Trilogy in its awesomeness. 
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branmakmuffin
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 05:11:24
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When I played RuneQuest regularaly (looooooooooooooong ago) there was a always an edge to encounters with Dwarves because we didn't know if they had flintlocks or not. The GM didn't overdo it. Only Dwarves had them and precious few of them did.
Our fantasy characters, who of course fought skeletons and zombies and gelatinous acidic goo without batting an eye, were terrified of the possiblity of running into Dwarves with flintlocks. And they weren't even very good weapons from a game mechanics point of view. |
Edited by - branmakmuffin on 12 Jun 2003 18:31:54 |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 05:50:59
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I'd like to point out that I'd specified a medieval setting. I personally think it possible to use a "modern" fantasy with magic and such. In my Nine Elements story, the nine people who are transfered over bring knowledge of twentieth century (and before) techniques. This ranges from introduction of firearms (though I may substitute it for some sort of energy-type, like I mentioned before; the tactics would be the same though) to something simple like suggesting to a down-on-his-luck resident of the city that a rickshaw business might work (which it does, enough to support his family).
What I was saying was that in a strictly medieval setting it's just about impossible. If you want to preserve the feel of a world like the Forgotten Realms, you have to keep it at a medieval level. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 07:31:34
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I partially agree. To upset that balance in anyway, even with something as straight forward as the introduction of firearms, would grossly affect the fundamental structure of what makes the FR such a unique setting. It would affect the very things we like about the rules and the background material as well.
From a medieval-setting perspective though, it really all depends on what period of the medieval era you are basing your setting on. For example, when Europeans had first learned of the fact that gunpowder could be utilised to shot or propel an object with a large amount of force, back in the 1300's, the first very-crude projectile weapons started development (the rifle is generally considered to have been invented in the 1500's). From there on, the invention of this particularly powerful tool of battle rapidly changed the face of European medieval society and culture, not to mention the impact the firearm had on the waging of war. Chainmail, platemail, and suits of armor could easily be penetrated, affording the bearer little protection. Also, castles, and vast perimeter walls no longer offered the protection from attackers that they had once offered against armies armed with axes, swords, and bows.
To introduce firearms into FR would mean issues very similar to this would have to be addressed and dealt with, before the setting could ever work effectively for gaming again.
The point I am making is that, the introduction of firearms into a fantasy/medieval setting really depends on how much you use our own historical development as a model. And since the FR was designed to emulate early Earth European medieval society, this may suggest the possibility that sooner or later, a technological advance will come along and rapidly revolutionise the ways of war of Faerun, much like on Earth.
Although I hope this is never the case .
May your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 16:27:04
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Weelllll...
We know from Forgotten Realms Adventures that there are guns in the Realms. Jeff Grubb probably wrote that section which is reason enough to think it's on the level. Still, I ignore them because they don't add anything to the setting.
The reasons people don't like them in fantasy are interesting. Why single out gunpowder out of all the renaissance technologies to reject? I don't have the blood sugar right now to get into that. As for S3, there's a long tradition of wild-and-woolly genre-crossing fantasy which the World of Greyhawk certainly partakes of.
Modern Earth-style technological advancement is alien to swords & sorcery. There's no reason to think that because people can think of guns and make them in our reality that the same thing happens in a fictional construct. |
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branmakmuffin
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 18:39:33
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Bookwyrm:
quote:
<snip> What I was saying was that in a strictly medieval setting it's just about impossible. If you want to preserve the feel of a world like the Forgotten Realms, you have to keep it at a medieval level.
Strictly mediaeval, or strictly fantasy mediaeval? In a "realistic" mediaeval setting, no, in a fantasy mediaeval setting, why not? Glorantha is a fantasy Bronze Age world, yet firearms work fine in this setting, in my opinion.
Sage:
Adding firearms to a fantasy game would not allow someone to do anything that can't also be done with magic, if you assume, as Glorantha does, and as Robet Jordan does in The Wheel of Time, that black powder is a secret hoarded by its creators. There would be relatively few wielders of firearms just as there are relatively few wielders of magic. |
Edited by - branmakmuffin on 12 Jun 2003 18:45:43 |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 20:12:16
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| I don't know if I got my opinion across properly, Bran, but I'll see about looking into those works, so I can actually form an opinion about them. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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branmakmuffin
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 20:44:18
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Bookwyrm:
If it's your opinion that firearms can't work in a either "realistic" or fantasy mediaeval setting, OK. Perhaps you wouldn't think they work in Glorantha, either. |
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Elrond Half Elven
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
322 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 21:24:57
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In my honest opinion Fire arms don't fit into a Medieval Setting. I would also like to note that firearms do not historically fit into a medieval setting either. Well thats not true, there must be the cross over time from the Medieval era and the Renaissance where the platemail armored knight meat the lightly armored, musketeer (Or the early equivelant of the musketeer). This knight would have found that his armor was ineffective against the black powder weapon.
The Forgotten Realms has ceritan Renaissance elements about it, the rapier, the various polearms, the large cities (Sorry very large cities), and the printing Block. All in all the Forgotten Realms appears to have entered the Renaissance Era, or rather certian areas of the Realms. I however despite this do not feel that the Realms is ready, nor ever will be ready for fire arms. I do however, although will not allow it, think that allowing a Dwarf to have a very unsafe, very large, very expensive, fire arm that causes 1d8 damage and a lot of smoke would be quite a laught. However this i feel would need to be justified with a cost of 10 times the base price, and the rarity of the blackpower (hcih in my opinion could reach up to 100 times the cost), to ballance it out.
In my opinion Fire arms do not belong in the Forgotten Realms setting as their is still far too much emphasis on Plate mail armour and bastard swords. Certian Domains in Ravenloft allow firearms, and i love this. But that is as far as it goes i am afraid.
Hanx
Elrond |
Once upon a midnight dreary, while i pondered, weak and weary,
Over many a quaint and curious volume of forgotten lore-
While i nodded, nearly napping, suddenly there came a tapping,
As of some one gently rapping, rapping at my chamber door.
-The Raven by Edgar Allan Poe |
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Mournblade
Master of Realmslore
USA
1287 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2003 : 22:46:26
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I have a rating system in my campaigns, often behind the sscenes that players are not necessarily aware of, it is just for my personal reference. I have a Magic Rating and a TECH rating. Worlds with very low tech ratings can not get past simple machines or medieval technology. I call the tech rating 3 for Forgotten Realms (my own use of course) This means that Firearms can never happen, because technology just will not work. The forgotten realms MAGIC level is a 10, becasue just about everything is possible. Another example is a star wars campaign I am trying to get off the ground. STAR WARS I consider to have a tech rating of 10 and a MAGIC rating of about 7 (the force). The ratings are more or less arbitrary and just a personal reference for me.
I also had a character one time Captain Goldblade that I kind of have an incarnation in EVERY campaign I run. He has a HUGE spaceship, with two drives... Tech drives (in any high tech rating world, it works as you would imagine, a regular spaceship) and then MAGIC DRIVES, A cluster of Staff of the Magi and other artifacts that acts as the ship engine in MAGIC strong worlds. Essentially the magic then provides all the power for his ship.
Though I do not have time to run the number of games I want, there is ONE game I have been DYING to do! I wanted to run a D20 Modern Age in the 21st century equivalent of the Forgotten Realms. It would be an alternate future world, where magic decreased and technology increased. The year would be about 2200 DR. SOme ideas I had were:
Waterdeep is THE Superpower, encompasing ALL of the North and Western Heartlands (including... the Candlekeep University). Cormyr is a CLOSE second in Power. Vaasa and Damara are united into another Superpower opposing Waterdeep, and SHOU LUNG is on the level of power of Cormyr. Modern Thay is to REAL THAY what Modern Egypt is to Ancient Egypt. ANd of course there would be more things like that.
I have been dying to do this for a long time. But I have no idea when I would get time.
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A wizard is Never late Frodo Baggins. Nor is he Early. A wizard arrives precisely when he means to... |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 00:12:56
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Okay, I'm upset at something. Did you know that if you hit the ESC button, your entire post disapears Okay, I'm upset at something. Did you know that if you hit the ESC button, your entire post disappears and you can’t get it back? This is the second time today that this has happened to me, and each time it was with a sizable post. I’m going to have to take to typing stuff up in WordPerfect instead of in the post window.
Okay, let’s see if I can remember all the stuff I’d written down before. At least the significant points. I’m so absent-minded . . . .
First, Mournblade, I should point out that a Future Realms has already been mentioned here.
Now that I’ve annoyed Alaundo by doing what he was about to, I’m sure , I’d like to say that I’d be interested in what you make. You seem to have the appropriate attention to detail for such a project. I assume you aren’t going to have a gunpowder bit to it, but I wouldn’t have a problem with it then. The setting would have changed enough that I’d be able to accept it, assuming that things would be worked out to a realistic degree.
I’ve always been interested in the what-ifs of history; I did a thesis on that being the best way to learn history, rather than just memorization. After all, anyone with a brain can memorize facts. You only understand them when you have the ability to turn them on their head, like with alternate history. That’s when history makes sense. There are so many points in history where events hung on a spider’s thread. I’m not just talking about the obvious things, like the American Second Civil War. (Note: I say second because the ‘Revolution’ wasn’t, under the definition -- it was a civil war. If it had been a real revolution, the war would have been about changing British government, not seceding from the Empire.)
(Sorry about that. Mournblade, can I borrow your ring of rant repulsion?)
Anyway, the particular event that I’d had in mind was during the second World War: Australia almost got invaded by the Japanese. Sage might not have been alive if that happened. Or, perhaps . . . . See what I mean?
In a more fantastical sense, magic is the ultimate catalyst of alternate history. How would the flow of history, at least in the real-life sense that it has today, have been shaped by magic? Of course, a lot of that depends on the specific rules for magic in that world. In some worlds, technology can’t work. I actually find that a bit silly sometimes. In Christopher Stacheff’s A Wizard in Rhyme series, the American who gets transferred over finds that his matches don’t work. I don’t like the idea that the molecules suddenly won’t combust like that, but I’ll buy it. The point I do find annoying, though, is this: telescopes don’t work. That’s just impossible. Why? Because your eyes work on the same principle. If the lenses in the telescope won’t bend light, then how are you able to see?
(Er -- sorry again. Mournblade? I think I need that ring . . . .)
Getting back to the topic at hand.
Anyway, that sort of thing is the main reason I’m taking so long on the background for my Nine Elements story. Certainly, I’m a huge believer in good backstory, even if some things never see the light of day. (I’ve said before that I was greatly influenced by David Eddings’s The Rivan Codex, which is basically all on his story notes and some tips for the masochistic struggling writer (he states right away that you should try something easier, like neurosurgery).) Mostly, though, I’m just fascinated by figuring out all the ways that Earth history could have changed because of my system of magic. (By the way, there’s no POD for this story (that’s Point of Divergence for the uninitiated) since magic’s been around far longer than actual history.)
(Mournblade, would you have a ring of parentheses repulsion on you as well? I seem to be using more than my share . . . .)
On the same vein as the above, take a look over [plug]here[/plug] for something similar.
Okay, in conclusion, I went on even longer than originally. Obviously, it’s not a good idea to give me extra time to think of things to write.  |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
Edited by - Bookwyrm on 13 Jun 2003 00:16:29 |
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branmakmuffin
Senior Scribe
USA
428 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 00:34:07
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Mournblade:
What is it that keeps saltpetre, coal and sulphur (or whatever black powder happens to be made of) from being combined into black powder? DM fiat? A mysterous etheral essence that prevents these ingredients from combining with each other? Gods striking down any creature that stumbles on the recipe? |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 00:50:39
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| Bran, I personally prefer: "An explosive black powder? Never heard of it." |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 07:17:13
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Bookwyrm said -
quote:
I’ve always been interested in the what-ifs of history; I did a thesis on that being the best way to learn history, rather than just memorization. After all, anyone with a brain can memorize facts. You only understand them when you have the ability to turn them on their head, like with alternate history. That’s when history makes sense. There are so many points in history where events hung on a spider’s thread.
In a session of my 'Philosophy of History' lectures, there was a portion of a Hegelian text I read (I can't remember the name, I think it may have been the Philosophy of History) that detailed a similar theory. Although, Hegel also alluded to a comparison of events, thinking more about how the 'what-if' scenario related to actual events and forming basis for facts from that.
Mournblade, if you get this project of your's done, I would like to see the end result. I think it would make for quite interesting reading. Plus if you need any help, I would like to offer my assistance, if time is your main concern.
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 07:25:47
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I must not have made myself clear (yet again) as I thought that was what I was trying to say. At least, if I understand you correctly.
Not to sound like I'm just a me-too-er, but . . . me too. You've got two potential helpers, Mournblade.  |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 07:56:41
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Oh, I understood your post just fine Bookwyrm, your point was clear. I was just saying that I had read about the same thing. It intrigued me at the time because I was reading the Age of Apocalypse storyline. A major story involving a big 'what-if' scenario. Plus, in my chosen profession, it takes a lot of studying potential 'what-if' scenarios to determine the best way to write a program .
And since you mentioned it, I often play around with these what-if ideas, placing them alongside major historical events, and thinking about alternatives. For example, what would have happened if the 13 original colonies had lost the Revolutionary War (civil war )?. How would have the history of the world been affected by such a gross diversion of events.
In fact I went through a phase of creating adventures for FR with just this method and approach .
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 08:19:12
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The Bookwyrm makes a strangled noise as he searches through the files in his desk
Arhg! Don't you hate when you switch computers I mean desks and you can't find anything because nothing's in the right place? 
I'd had an alternate history time line someone had made with just that senario in mind . . . it started out earlier than the War, but that was a major point. It only lasted two years before being put down, and there ended up a sort of semi-sovereign nation of North America that the Empire granted independance to in the 20th. At least I think that's how it went. I haven't read it in more than a year, and it must have been lost when my computer got wiped er, desk got emptied out. Yes. Careless janitors. That was it.
Anyway, I got some extra points with my History professor for giving him a copy. He was very interested in my ideas on how to learn history by looking at what didn't happen. I also introduced him to 1632 and 1633 (by Eric Flint and the second coauthored by David Weber), the Belisarius books (by Eric Flint and David Drake), Guns of the South[i] (by Harry Turtledove) and actually bought him a copy of a wonderful but sadly out of print (it seems) book called [i]The Proteus Operation (by Paul Hogan).
I'll send you a private scroll on that last one. Don't want to try Alaundo's patience to the very end, since I seem to be going waaaaay off topic lately.
I will say that it was due to this approach that the professor nominated me for a history award (that's a bit more than an empty acheivement). He said he got word that I'd won it, and had been prepared to talk about my ideas and such at the awards ceremony. Unfortunately, he said he had to swollow it all, because I wasn't there. I was at home. Why? Well, seems no one thought to make sure that I had been told to show up . . . . |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 08:39:34
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Sounds great Bookwyrm, thanks.
That last portion of your post is a really sad tale. But I think we have all suffered similar episodes in life such as the one you just described, and without going too much further off-topic I will just say that it involved a graduation, a physics award, and an ill-informed recipient (me  ).
Anyway, thanks again for the info.
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 13 Jun 2003 08:40:05 |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 08:58:02
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Well, on the bright side, it came with a 5gp (50 USD) gift card to a big-name bookstore chain (I'm assuming they aren't in Australia, but it's Barnes & Noble). It was originally for the campus bookstore but my professor appearently put his foot down about that. He basically bullied them into giving me more than just a glorified discount on schoolbooks. It was my fiction that had interested him, after all.
Of course, I wouldn't have minded a $50 discount on books for next semester. After all, fifty bucks saved either way, and if it were the campus discount, then I could have bought twice as many used books.
But hey, I wasn't about to complain. First of all, I don't actually pay for my own books. And second, when was the last time a professor wanted his students to read more (unassigned) fiction rather than a textbook? |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 09:08:34
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I was granted a one week (5 days) stay-and-visit pass with my late-received award. It entitled me to a tour of the top Australian Theoretical Physics research facility. I could sit in on topic discussions with scientists, participate in exercises, and generally learn a little bit about what I would be doing if I were to choose a career in theoretical physics rather than computer programming.
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 09:14:21
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Woa.
Okay, yours beats mine. The only one I can think of offhand that I would want more than that would be breakfast with Steven Hawking or something. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2003 : 09:17:57
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An afternoon chat about the nature of the universe and the history of Astronomy with Astronomer Royal, Martin Rees, perhaps .
May all your learning be free and unfettered
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 13 Jun 2003 09:18:39 |
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Firearms in (A)D&D
