| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Afetbinttuzani |
Posted - 25 Feb 2009 : 21:16:35
I was wondering if anyone has any thoughts on what the fate and function of the Moonblades might be in 4E Faerun.
Evermeet, as we knew it, is gone. What is left of it is on another plane and is run by a council, rather than Amlaruil or her kin. May Eladrin become blade-heirs, or are the Moonblades only relevent to the elf communities that inhabit Fearun on the prime material plane?
Please, no diatribes about4E. I'm looking for productive thoughts on how to imagine and manage the Moonblades in post-Spellplague FR. |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Alystra Illianniis |
Posted - 29 Nov 2009 : 20:21:24
No, Arilyn only has ONE of the three remaining Moonflower family Moonblades. There were two families that each still had three left, plus several families that had one or two. If I remember the end of Evermeet, Amlaruiel's son Lamruil had the Kingblade, which he used against Kynil. I just finished re-reading that book, so I think that's accurate. He is the designated heir, so far as I know. He may or may not have any children yet, but since he went off to start a new elven homeland north of the Spine of the World at the end of that book, it's kind of a moot point. Of the third Monnflower blade, nothing was ever said. There should still be a few other Moonblades around-Eliath's, for one, and several others. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 21 Aug 2009 : 01:28:51
quote:
Originally posted by Christopher_Rowe
That sounds like an excellent methodology, Diffan. And as an aside, AV2 came out yesterday!
Cheers,
Thanks! Yea, I really need to get that book. From what I read of the excerpts, the item sets, immurements, and story items seem really interesting and seems like fun to place into my upcoming 4e Realms campaign.
Good stuff all around! |
| Christopher_Rowe |
Posted - 20 Aug 2009 : 01:52:07
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
In 4e, I would have it work in reguard to the tiers of play. At heroic tier, It would have maybe one at-will ability (ie, you can make this sword burst into flame and your damage is now fire damage) and possibly one daily effect after that (add 10th level or lower effect from the PHB or AV here)
As a player gains levels and goes into higher tiers, the swords evolves gaining another at-will (but can't be used in-conjunction with the 1st at-will) power. And possible a second daily power.
With epic tier of play, the weapon would gain maybe a high level power based on a certain class (like the wizard's attack power maze at 25th level).
Something to that sort, but it can easily vary. It'll be easier to determine once the Adventurer's Vault 2 comes out sometime this year.
[/quote]
That sounds like an excellent methodology, Diffan. And as an aside, AV2 came out yesterday!
Cheers,
|
| Diffan |
Posted - 20 Aug 2009 : 00:55:25
quote:
Originally posted by Penknight
On a related note, for those that have used moonblades in their campaigns, how do you determine how many abilities the weapon already has before the PC claims it? Do you roll, or have another method?
In 3e (3.5) I think you rolled a %die and that told you how many abilities it was able to have. You then rolled on another table to see what abilities it received. The rest (RP wise) is up to the DM/PC. I could be wrong since I'm AFB right now.
In 4e, I would have it work in reguard to the tiers of play. At heroic tier, It would have maybe one at-will ability (ie, you can make this sword burst into flame and your damage is now fire damage) and possibly one daily effect after that (add 10th level or lower effect from the PHB or AV here)
As a player gains levels and goes into higher tiers, the swords evolves gaining another at-will (but can't be used in-conjunction with the 1st at-will) power. And possible a second daily power.
With epic tier of play, the weapon would gain maybe a high level power based on a certain class (like the wizard's attack power maze at 25th level).
Something to that sort, but it can easily vary. It'll be easier to determine once the Adventurer's Vault 2 comes out sometime this year. |
| Penknight |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 07:56:05
Ok, I was rather curious if you had a method for determining something like that. I once used one that was meant to be returned to the family as storyline experience, but the player thought that the weapon could be claimed by him. When the weapon shocked the crap out of him, he gave me a dirty look. "What the **** man?! What, only your character can have a moonblade? That's just bull****!"
As you can tell, he was rather put out with me. I've used dormant moonblades in my campaigns twice before, and every time, he has to draw it. The way I work it is the player has to come to me and let me know that he's wanting to claim a moonblade for his character, and then we set down and start talking about who has it in the family, its history, etc. Then later on, I roll up the abilities on it. I don't just throw them in to be used any other way. I've even stated this before to my players. I guess some people are just bad at listening. And to be fair, my character with his family's moonblade is a bladesinger that I played way back in 2nd Edition under another DM. The person that gets so... 'grumpy' even played with that character with his paladin. I don't want any of you thinking I do things with my character that I don't allow others to do.
On a related note, for those that have used moonblades in their campaigns, how do you determine how many abilities the weapon already has before the PC claims it? Do you roll, or have another method? |
| Jakk |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 07:21:47
quote:
Originally posted by Penknight
How did/do you do that for PCs? Do you roll a d20 or percent dice to see if the character could weild the weapon, or do you have another method?
For Moonblades, it would be entirely based on role-playing, with alignment playing a small role... to the extent that the player was playing his/her PC's alignment correctly. I wouldn't leave something like that to chance; if the player thinks his evil PC can fool the blade, I'm happy to let him annihilate himself.  |
| Penknight |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 06:24:52
quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
<chop>That way, moonblades can now be even more individualised but more importantly can lose the "pick me up and die" situation that was the case before. Just my 2 cp.
-- George Krashos
I really like that latter idea... 
I dunno... I liked the "pick me up and die" situation; it was still possible to get around it, if you corrupted the magic of the blade (as was done in at least one case; the Starym moonblade, IIRC). The only downside to that was, basically you had to be evil to even think about doing such a thing, as opposed to being good but not quite what the blade is looking for in a wielder.  Then again, I like "Russian roulette" situations for PCs... when I'm DMing. 
How did/do you do that for PCs? Do you roll a d20 or percent dice to see if the character could weild the weapon, or do you have another method? |
| Jakk |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 06:12:17
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
<chop>That way, moonblades can now be even more individualised but more importantly can lose the "pick me up and die" situation that was the case before. Just my 2 cp.
-- George Krashos
I really like that latter idea...
I dunno... I liked the "pick me up and die" situation; it was still possible to get around it, if you corrupted the magic of the blade (as was done in at least one case; the Starym moonblade, IIRC). The only downside to that was, basically you had to be evil to even think about doing such a thing, as opposed to being good but not quite what the blade is looking for in a wielder. Then again, I like "Russian roulette" situations for PCs... when I'm DMing. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 05:58:10
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I've always thought that the moonblades were 'evolving' swords, not only in the way that the novels portray them (i.e. gaining powers with each wielder) but also evolving in relation to their purpose. That is, once they fulfilled their first purpose (to establish the ruling line of Evermeet) then they began to change to fulfil another purpose, or perhaps each sword then evolved its own specific purpose(s) (perhaps related to the family that wielded it or the desires of its 'greatest' wielder or as a consequence of its environment etc. etc.). That way, moonblades can now be even more individualised but more importantly can lose the "pick me up and die" situation that was the case before. Just my 2 cp.
-- George Krashos
I really like that latter idea... |
| Jakk |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 05:44:13
My thought is that they would be limited to eladrin... sun elves, star elves, and moon elves in the Realms are treated as eladrin in 4E, IIRC, and in 3E and earlier they were given to moon elves only. Of course, that means that in 4E, suddenly sun elves can wield moonblades... I wonder how the moon elves feel about that? Or, maybe, with the change in magic, all elves and eladrin can wield them, as Diffan suggests. From what I know about the 4E magic item system, it should be easier to build moonblades as depicted in the earlier lore (with "evolving" powers, as mentioned by George). Beyond that, I'll let someone better acquainted with 4E magic take it from here. |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 03:43:42
I've always thought that the moonblades were 'evolving' swords, not only in the way that the novels portray them (i.e. gaining powers with each wielder) but also evolving in relation to their purpose. That is, once they fulfilled their first purpose (to establish the ruling line of Evermeet) then they began to change to fulfil another purpose, or perhaps each sword then evolved its own specific purpose(s) (perhaps related to the family that wielded it or the desires of its 'greatest' wielder or as a consequence of its environment etc. etc.). That way, moonblades can now be even more individualised but more importantly can lose the "pick me up and die" situation that was the case before. Just my 2 cp.
-- George Krashos
|
| Diffan |
Posted - 17 Aug 2009 : 02:52:53
quote:
Originally posted by Afetbinttuzani
I was wondering if anyone has any thoughts on what the fate and function of the Moonblades might be in 4E Faerun.
Evermeet, as we knew it, is gone. What is left of it is on another plane and is run by a council, rather than Amlaruil or her kin. May Eladrin become blade-heirs, or are the Moonblades only relevent to the elf communities that inhabit Fearun on the prime material plane?
Please, no diatribes about4E. I'm looking for productive thoughts on how to imagine and manage the Moonblades in post-Spellplague FR.
I feel that moonblades should and can still play a part in Faerun's history seeing as there is no one standing on Evermeet's throne.
That being said, moonblades should still function in the hands of any "worthy" eladrin (moon, sun, or star elf), elf, or half-elf wielder. As to what their abilities do.....well I'd consult the DMG under the Artifacts section and then make the weapon's abilities as you go. You could use the Magic of Faerun (3.0 supplement) as a basis for certain moonblade abilities as well as certain powerful weapons listed in the Adventurer's Vault and PHB. |
| Afetbinttuzani |
Posted - 15 Apr 2009 : 16:08:31
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by kysus
Last i heard arilyn moonblade was in possession of the moonflower blade unless something has happened to her that im unaware of, which is possible since i havnt been keeping up with much lately so do forgive me. But if she is still in control of that blade and is alive that would make her the next in succession for the throne to evermeet.
No, the moonblades weren't to select the individual, but to select the family -- and this was done by who had the most moonblades. There are several Moonflower moonblades. And Arilyn has aunts and uncles who stand before her in terms of succession.
In any case, it seems doubtful that a half-elf would ever be accepted as ruler of Evermeet. I suspect there would be bloodshed if it were attempted. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 15 Apr 2009 : 14:06:30
quote:
Originally posted by kysus
Last i heard arilyn moonblade was in possession of the moonflower blade unless something has happened to her that im unaware of, which is possible since i havnt been keeping up with much lately so do forgive me. But if she is still in control of that blade and is alive that would make her the next in succession for the throne to evermeet.
No, the moonblades weren't to select the individual, but to select the family -- and this was done by who had the most moonblades. There are several Moonflower moonblades. And Arilyn has aunts and uncles who stand before her in terms of succession. |
| kysus |
Posted - 15 Apr 2009 : 10:19:20
Last i heard arilyn moonblade was in possession of the moonflower blade unless something has happened to her that im unaware of, which is possible since i havnt been keeping up with much lately so do forgive me. But if she is still in control of that blade and is alive that would make her the next in succession for the throne to evermeet. |
| Penknight |
Posted - 16 Mar 2009 : 18:47:24
quote:
Originally posted by ranger_of_the_unicorn_run
Shadowdale: The Scouring of the Land is the name of the adventure.
Ok, thank you! |
| ranger_of_the_unicorn_run |
Posted - 16 Mar 2009 : 17:23:45
Shadowdale: The Scouring of the Land is the name of the adventure. |
| Penknight |
Posted - 16 Mar 2009 : 17:02:08
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
-The Warblade is found in the Shadowdale adventure. IIRC the Crownblade is in the possession of the New Coronal of Myth Drannor at the end of the Last Mythal Trilogy.
BRIMSTONE
Could someone please tell me the name of this adventure? I don't think I have it. Thanks. |
| Rinonalyrna Fathomlin |
Posted - 27 Feb 2009 : 01:17:03
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
That bit of lore can be worked around, though.... That particular moonblade could have gone thru a peculiar set of circumstances, allowing it to be wielded by any worthy elf. Perhaps at some point in the blade's past, it's moon elven wielder died in combat, and a distant relative of mixed gold and moon blood, snatched up the sword. It liked him, so it adapted to being wielded by worthy gold elves. Or something.
Well, I didn't say I was against the idea of moonblades being less exclusive in that way, I just mentioned that as an example of how the moonblade lore has changed over time.
quote:
Originally posted by Afetbinttuzani
I'm afraid I'm ignorant on this. Could you expand a bit on these Myth Drannor blades?
Not from off the top of my head, sorry. However, in addition to the 2E sources mentioned above, there are indeed 3E updates on the swords in Lost Empires of Faerun, and Dagniron's Elves of Faerun project should have some good information too. Hope that helps. |
| The Red Walker |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 18:17:25
quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
-The Warblade is found ... <snip>
... by a certain resident half-elf ranger, thank you.
(desperately trying to get this canonized )
Why thank you for your support and recognition of my ranger!! I had no idea it was known he found it! |
| Ashe Ravenheart |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 16:17:45
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
-The Warblade is found ... <snip>
... by a certain resident half-elf ranger, thank you.
(desperately trying to get this canonized) |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 14:01:03
-The Warblade is found in the Shadowdale adventure. IIRC the Crownblade is in the possession of the New Coronal of Myth Drannor at the end of the Last Mythal Trilogy.
BRIMSTONE |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 13:56:45
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
quote:
Originally posted by Afetbinttuzani
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
The famous blades involved with Myth Drannor aren't moonblades.
I'm afraid I'm ignorant on this. Could you expand a bit on these Myth Drannor blades?
-The Artblade, The Crownblade, and The Warblade. I think they are detailed in Lost Empires of Faerun. 
-Those are the swords you were asking about, right? 
BRIMSTONE
As well as the Cormanthyr: Empire of the Elves IIRC, or maybe just mentioned in there, as well as in Fall of Myth Drannor.
Didn't one of them also appear in a novel or short story somewhere? Can't remember for the life of me. |
| Brimstone |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 13:48:21
quote:
Originally posted by Afetbinttuzani
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
The famous blades involved with Myth Drannor aren't moonblades.
I'm afraid I'm ignorant on this. Could you expand a bit on these Myth Drannor blades?
-The Artblade, The Crownblade, and The Warblade. I think they are detailed in Lost Empires of Faerun.
-Those are the swords you were asking about, right?
BRIMSTONE |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 12:21:43
I think one could still be used for a story arc in a campaign somehow...I wouldn't mind giving one to a PC...maybe Moonblade wielder as some sort of Epic Destiny (or Paragon Path)...........as a side note, they would make good weapons of legacy in 3E. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 08:01:51
quote:
Originally posted by Afetbinttuzani
quote:
Originally posted by scererar
Well if Moonblades are still a factor of establishing rulership of Evermeet, now may be a good time (in 4E lore) for one to play that role.
page 132 FRCG
"Contact points and routes between Faerūn and Evermeet were severed during the Year of Blue Fire,and they have been slow to reknit in the years since. Queen Amlaruil is gone, and the throne stands empty; Evermeet is currently governed by its Royal Council. Some suspect that a Moonflower heir yet walks Faerūn, severed from his or her native land".
If this is so, the Moonblades may not be as redundant as all that. They may still have a role to play.
The question of whether Zaor named a blade-heir for his Moonblade, "The King's Blade", before his death has still not been answered. Also what happened to "The King's Blade"?
I don't think so. The ruling family was selected -- and that's what it was about: selecting a ruling family, not a single ruler.
Besides, there are plenty of Moonflower candidates for the throne. We have potential rulers with Lamruil, his unnamed nephew, and the lost kids of Amlaruil and Zaor: the twin that wasn't slain by the Elf-Eater in the Moonshaes; Hhora, a priestess of Hanali Celanil; and the female twin warriors, Lazziar and Genstarzah. We actually don't know where any of them are; other than Lamruil, all of them disappeared in various different ways. Elaine has said that Amlaruil knew the fates of her children and that some of the missing ones were alive and hidden away.
A couple of the kids have totally unrevealed fates -- the male mages Zandro and Finufaranell.
It's not unreasonable to assume that most of those missing ones are dead, but that's still six of them to look at. If as many as four are dead, that still leaves two, plus Lamruil, Elaith's son, and any kids Lamruil has had. Lamruil was a bit of a player when young, so he's likely got at least a couple of bastard children. |
| Afetbinttuzani |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 06:09:54
quote:
Originally posted by scererar
Well if Moonblades are still a factor of establishing rulership of Evermeet, now may be a good time (in 4E lore) for one to play that role.
page 132 FRCG
"Contact points and routes between Faerūn and Evermeet were severed during the Year of Blue Fire,and they have been slow to reknit in the years since. Queen Amlaruil is gone, and the throne stands empty; Evermeet is currently governed by its Royal Council. Some suspect that a Moonflower heir yet walks Faerūn, severed from his or her native land".
If this is so, the Moonblades may not be as redundant as all that. They may still have a role to play.
The question of whether Zaor named a blade-heir for his Moonblade, "The King's Blade", before his death has still not been answered. Also what happened to "The King's Blade"? |
| Afetbinttuzani |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 05:59:12
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
The famous blades involved with Myth Drannor aren't moonblades.
I'm afraid I'm ignorant on this. Could you expand a bit on these Myth Drannor blades? |
| scererar |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 03:26:14
Well if Moonblades are still a factor of establishing rulership of Evermeet, now may be a good time (in 4E lore) for one to play that role.
page 132 FRCG
"Contact points and routes between Faerūn and Evermeet were severed during the Year of Blue Fire,and they have been slow to reknit in the years since. Queen Amlaruil is gone, and the throne stands empty; Evermeet is currently governed by its Royal Council. Some suspect that a Moonflower heir yet walks Faerūn, severed from his or her native land". |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 26 Feb 2009 : 02:15:38
quote:
Originally posted by Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
That being said, though, the function of the moonblades seems to have been shifted a bit in the lore, though--in the short story "The Bladesinger's Lesson" (in Realms of the Elves), it is revealed, thanks to a half-gold elf, that it's possible to wield a moonblade simply by being a "worthy" carrier--you don't even need to be related to the family connected with the blade.
That bit of lore can be worked around, though.... That particular moonblade could have gone thru a peculiar set of circumstances, allowing it to be wielded by any worthy elf. Perhaps at some point in the blade's past, it's moon elven wielder died in combat, and a distant relative of mixed gold and moon blood, snatched up the sword. It liked him, so it adapted to being wielded by worthy gold elves. Or something. |
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