| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Sarelle |
Posted - 12 Jun 2004 : 11:58:24
I was reading "Birth control in the Realms" and a discussion of humans being one of the five creator races of Toril. And I remembered a question I'd had a while back -
What was the third creator race?
1. 'the' Creator Race (reptilian ones to be written up in SK  )
2. Dragons
3. -
4. Giants
5. Humans
Anyone know? Is the rest of my list correct? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| cpthero2 |
Posted - 01 Oct 2018 : 14:49:18
Master Krashos,
You definitely correct on your source. On page 2 (the Dawn of Time), it identifies five creator races and identifies Dragons as being one of them. So funny how the history bounces around! haha
Best regards,
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I'm pretty sure it was in the intro to Powers and Pantheons which essentially uses dragons instead of sarrukh - although it does talk generally about reptiles as one of the Creator Races.
-- George Krashos
|
| George Krashos |
Posted - 01 Oct 2018 : 12:48:59
I'm pretty sure it was in the intro to Powers and Pantheons which essentially uses dragons instead of sarrukh - although it does talk generally about reptiles as one of the Creator Races.
-- George Krashos |
| cpthero2 |
Posted - 01 Oct 2018 : 03:46:57
Master Krashos,
Which source was that, if you don't mind me asking?
Best regards,
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Although at least one source lists "dragons" instead of the "fey".
-- George Krashos
|
| George Krashos |
Posted - 01 Oct 2018 : 01:41:17
Although at least one source lists "dragons" instead of the "fey".
-- George Krashos |
| cpthero2 |
Posted - 01 Oct 2018 : 01:24:39
Senior Scribe Sarelle,
The five creator races, also known as Iquar'Tel'Quessir, are:
- Humans
- Batrachi
- Sarrukh
- Fey
- Aearee
Best regards,
quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
I was reading "Birth control in the Realms" and a discussion of humans being one of the five creator races of Toril. And I remembered a question I'd had a while back -
What was the third creator race?
1. 'the' Creator Race (reptilian ones to be written up in SK )
2. Dragons
3. -
4. Giants
5. Humans
Anyone know? Is the rest of my list correct?
|
| Lady Kazandra |
Posted - 29 Jun 2004 : 04:52:43
quote:
Originally posted by Durak
Does anyone have the Ecology of the Korred, published in Dragon #119. And know anyway i can obtain a copy?
The Sage has a second copy of this particular issue (along with most of the issues in it's year of print thanks to a pathetic mail order mishap  ). Unfortunately, I've claimed it for my own collection  .
If you can't get your hands on the article though, I'd be willing to summarise the specifics of it's contents for you?
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 28 Jun 2004 : 16:06:00
quote:
Originally posted by Durak
Does anyone have the Ecology of the Korred, published in Dragon #119. And know anyway i can obtain a copy?
Well, you could wait for one of us who has the Dragon Magazine Archive to dig up the article... Or you might be able to find it on Google somewhere. I'd try the latter approach, first. If that doesn't work, I can try to get to that in a day or two.
|
| Durak |
Posted - 28 Jun 2004 : 14:08:49
If i rememeber correctly (am at work.
The Creator race was the Sylvan (Hope i spelt that right ).
And the current remains of that cilivisation are the Fey, sprites, dryads etc.
But its also mentioned that Elves were not native to Toril. So no Elves were Fey on Toril. ( Could been fey on other worlds)
What i think that the Svylan did, was create a racial type based on Nature. The merging of themselves with nature, Trees to make Dryads. I wonder if they merged with Horses, goats to make centaurs and Satyrs. They would have i reckon great power in changing and worshipping Nature.
To me the name of their race seem to be of an Elf like creature, but i havent seen much lore on them. Dragonlance lore keeps getting in the way.
I wonder what races are classed as Toril fey. (At work no books)
Does anyone have the Ecology of the Korred, published in Dragon #119. And know anyway i can obtain a copy? |
| Lady Kazandra |
Posted - 26 Jun 2004 : 03:14:22
quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
That's where I got confused, too. I assumed fey came from Faerie, thus making it impossible for them to be a creator race. At the same time, though, fey are very much tied to the earth/sea/sky so in some ways it makes more sense for them to be native to Toril.
In some ways I think that fey would have gotten more secretive over the millenia - like elves - as humans expanded their empires, but as I said I just can't imagine them ever having empires.
To evaluate the evolution of elves/fey I always imagined it went something along the lines of:
1. Original, powerful, plane of Faerie fey along with the fey deities (Titania and co.)
2. Leshay (from the ELH - or an equivalent)
3. Sidhe
4. The first elves, that had the fey type and the elf subtype (I categorised these as Light and Dark Elves - the original Dark Elves being good-aligned, and slowly turning evil).
5. Modern elves (or rather, when they first migrated to Toril).
All interesting points. But just remember, the Unseelie Court has also played a rather significant role in the evolution of most fey (and to a lesser extent, the elves) on several worlds. If nothing else, Monster Mythology proved that.
The Sage has talked about this before, so I won't go into more specific details. Just try a search for 'Unseelie Court' information.
|
| Sarelle |
Posted - 25 Jun 2004 : 23:21:42
quote:
Originally posted by Senbar Flay
You have a point they don't seem like huge empire builders because even today they are shadowy creatures living the forest and they must have don the same thing long ago they were probabley more numerous. Also since elves are fey decended and they came from Faerie does that mean the Faerie fey are diffrent form the Torillian fey?
That's where I got confused, too. I assumed fey came from Faerie, thus making it impossible for them to be a creator race. At the same time, though, fey are very much tied to the earth/sea/sky so in some ways it makes more sense for them to be native to Toril.
In some ways I think that fey would have gotten more secretive over the millenia - like elves - as humans expanded their empires, but as I said I just can't imagine them ever having empires.
To evaluate the evolution of elves/fey I always imagined it went something along the lines of:
1. Original, powerful, plane of Faerie fey along with the fey deities (Titania and co.)
2. Leshay (from the ELH - or an equivalent)
3. Sidhe
4. The first elves, that had the fey type and the elf subtype (I categorised these as Light and Dark Elves - the original Dark Elves being good-aligned, and slowly turning evil).
5. Modern elves (or rather, when they first migrated to Toril). |
| Senbar Flay |
Posted - 25 Jun 2004 : 19:04:52
You have a point they don't seem like huge empire builders because even today they are shadowy creatures living the forest and they must have don the same thing long ago they were probabley more numerous. Also since elves are fey decended and they came from Faerie does that mean the Faerie fey are diffrent form the Torillian fey? |
| Sarelle |
Posted - 25 Jun 2004 : 13:21:54
quote:
Originally posted by Senbar Flay
Okay I have looked at both lists and they both have fey but what did they really do that is so great to become a creator race the others constructed their own empires and fought batles and stuff. But did the fey have cities or anything.
Did I hear someone picking a fight with the Realms' fey? If you pick a fight with fey, you pick a fight with me!!!
 
Seriously:
I too don't really know why fey are a Creator Race. Elves came from another plane, so even though elves are fey-descended they arn't Realms fey-descended. And as you said - I can't imagine them building cities, or empires other than forest ones. I always imagined them as shadowy watchers rather than having central roles. |
| Senbar Flay |
Posted - 24 Jun 2004 : 19:11:16
Okay I have looked at both lists and they both have fey but what did they really do that is so great to become a creator race the others constructed their own empires and fought batles and stuff. But did the fey have cities or anything. |
| Kuje |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 17:42:40
quote:
Originally posted by chosenofvelsharoon
i'm sorry kuje31,
i do too much skimming and not enough reading.
Your right, it was mentioned more than once on page one.
Nah it's cool. I was just pulling your leg and teasing with Sirius and Wooly. :) |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 13:52:17
quote:
Originally posted by chosenofvelsharoon
i'm sorry kuje31,
i do too much skimming and not enough reading.
Your right, it was mentioned more than once on page one.
I'm not kuje31. I'm not that lucky.
However, I don't think you had to apologize. I know of a thread where an explanation for an abbreviation was asked on the same page, twice.
That's what I need to ask next in the FR Trivia Challenge thread. |
| chosenofvelsharoon |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 10:00:58
i'm sorry kuje31,
i do too much skimming and not enough reading.
Your right, it was mentioned more than once on page one. |
| Arivia |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 01:17:40
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Regardless, I'm happy in my deluded state
I'm gonna remember you said that. 
Oh, we all remember what he says-it's very memorable. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 01:15:26
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
Regardless, I'm happy in my deluded state
I'm gonna remember you said that. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 18 Jun 2004 : 00:16:03
quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
Maybe I'm going senile now as well because I thought I posted that on page one. :)
I thought it had been mentioned too. But, when I see the same thing come up again, I figure I either didn't see it like I thought or I have my threads mixed up. Regardless, I'm happy in my deluded state until someone comes along to rock the boat again. |
| Kuje |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 23:42:54
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
That sounds like the Creator Races paragraph on page 261 in the FRCS' History chapter.
Maybe I'm going senile now as well because I thought I posted that on page one. :) |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 21:50:32
quote:
Originally posted by chosenofvelsharoon
according to forgotten realms campaign setting (3e) i forget what page, beginning of the chapter that's "the dawn of "something or another
it's saurials(reptilians that produced nagas, yuanti, and others)
dragons, giants, amphibious shape changers(produced dopplegangers and the fish people, i forgeth what they're called), and humans.
That sounds like the Creator Races paragraph on page 261 in the FRCS' History chapter. |
| chosenofvelsharoon |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 21:20:03
according to forgotten realms campaign setting (3e) i forget what page, beginning of the chapter that's "the dawn of "something or another
it's saurials(reptilians that produced nagas, yuanti, and others)
dragons, giants, amphibious shape changers(produced dopplegangers and the fish people, i forgeth what they're called), and humans.
other races came here from other planes, or were created artificially by god's or other races.
"and naught shall be left but shattered thrones, with none to rule them but the dead. Dragons shall rule the world entire" |
| Sarelle |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 13:34:03
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Sarelle,
You're going to lose some money soon. ;-)
--Eric
I reckoned without the craftiness of certain Sages. Yay! |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 17 Jun 2004 : 04:10:38
quote:
Originally posted by Sarelle
Who wants to bet against my $/£100 that no mention of Isstossef-anything is mentioned in SK? No one? I'll reduce the odds to 1000000/999999!
I'll bet anything you like - oh, and I'd prefer to agree to payment terms now.
Can't wait for Serpent Kingdoms.
-- George Krashos
|
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 21:11:28
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Sarelle,
You're going to lose some money soon. ;-)
--Eric
Tease! July or the end of June needs to get here quickly as there are two products I want now. |
| ericlboyd |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 20:16:27
Sarelle,
You're going to lose some money soon. ;-)
--Eric |
| Nephilim |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 18:16:01
I have just re-read the entry in FRCS(3rd Ed).
It clearly states the 5 creator races as:
Saurians (Dinosaur/Lizardfolk)
Dragons
an Amphibious race (that has now devolved to the Locathahs and Dopplegangers)
The Fey [although what they actually created is open to argument]
and finally Humanity. |
| Nephilim |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 18:08:55
I beleive that the Neverwinter Nights game revolves around this reptillian creator race and the "Words of Power" they created. |
| Sarelle |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 17:27:01
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Durak
I just got the pdf for that FRE5 Lord of Darkness book. Was reading up on the Greater Mummy.
[snip]
As you can see the replilian race is differently named here, maybe its a clan name in stead of a race name. The story mentions the lizardmens(current race) hatred of the Bullywugs.
Also it hints, i am not sure if all the creators had made them, that these reptiles were the creators of Nether Scrolls.
Perhaps that was the name of an ancient city/nation/tribe?
Interesting take WK - I agree. "of ancient Isstosseffiil" sound more like he belonged to a city than anything else. Isstossef might be like Waterdhavian.
Who wants to bet against my $/£100 that no mention of Isstossef-anything is mentioned in SK? No one? I'll reduce the odds to 1000000/999999! |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 16 Jun 2004 : 17:10:36
quote:
Originally posted by Durak
I just got the pdf for that FRE5 Lord of Darkness book. Was reading up on the Greater Mummy.
quote:
Surrounded by dusty carvings of beasts
no man has seen, Hsssthak of ancient
Isstosseffiil broods upon his ebony
throne, in an airless hall deep beneath the
mighty desert. Across the eons he has
rested here, but he has found no peace.
He dreams dark visions of an age when
his people ruled, practicing mighty sorcery,
creating exotic new life forms, and
forever battling both the winged folk of
the Aearee and wretched wet-skinned
batrachi.Of the Isstossef, only Hsssthak now
remains, his dry, withered features barely
hinting at the lost glory of his reptilian
race. Someone taking a quick glance at
him would identify him as human, yet his
taut snake-like skin, dry, bony tail, and
distorted features categorize him otherwise.
The time of the creator races was waning,
the dinosaurs dying out and being
replaced by other creatures more able to
withstand the new, colder climate. Seers
among the reptilian creator race felt that
a time might come when the lizard folk
would need help to reclaim their rightful
place in the world. Hsssthak, once a noted
sorcerer among his reptilian people, willingly
allowed himself to be mummified in
order to protect part of the heritage of his
race the ability to magically modify other
creatures. Hsssthak patiently awaits
the day when the descendants of his
ancient race will come seeking the golden
spell scrolls that he guards.
As you can see the replilian race is differently named here, maybe its a clan name in stead of a race name. The story mentions the lizardmens(current race) hatred of the Bullywugs.
Also it hints, i am not sure if all the creators had made them, that these reptiles were the creators of Nether Scrolls.
Perhaps that was the name of an ancient city/nation/tribe? |
