| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Dargoth |
Posted - 20 Jan 2005 : 00:32:34
and noticed a few things
http://www.o-love.net/realms/fr_books_date.html
Where getting one more novel this year then we got last year 14 vs 13 
July/August is going to be a very expensive month for many Realms fans 
Farthest Reach
City of Splendors: A novel
The Emerald Sceptre
City of Spendors: the Source book
Champions of Ruin
Better get a big fat tax return this year
2006 is looking a little light for FR novels we've only got 8 announced so far that will be 6 down on 2005
Its some what disturbing that there are no FR trilogies starting in 06 either (Which leaves 2007 looking very bare)
Nothing by Elaine (After COS) or RAS for the next 3 years 
Admitedly the list doesnt include Eds 3 Knights of Myth Drannor books) |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 19:35:18
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
Also, Elaith Craulnober probably has a highly profile than any character with whom I'm associated. He appears in several FR game products, the MMO Neverwinter Nights, Ed Greenwood's novel Silver Fire, and several of my books and short stories. If my email is any indication, he is more frequently employed as an NPC in Realms-based campaigns than any of my other characters. All of these are good arguments for a short story in gaming magazine.
He's quite famous and popular. Or would it be infmaous? Hmmm....
quote:
As one reader observed on a message board forum, "Danilo must be in his early thirties now, so what sort of adventures could he possibly have?"
I did not need to hear such a comment before coffee. Oy!  |
| SirUrza |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 16:27:05
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
As one reader observed on a message board forum, "Danilo must be in his early thirties now, so what sort of adventures could he possibly have?" An older antihero would be far more palatable, but given Danilo's persona, he might be looking a bit long in the tooth to some readers.
Bah, 30 isn't THAT old, especially if they're active and not couch potatoes. Besides, Arilyn's still young, Danilo doesn't have a choice in what advantures he gets dragged into, and there's plenty of political plots in Waterdeep that don't involved running all over the Realms to deal with while Arilyn is doing the running. :)
As for converting old characters, unlike certain low level 1st edition dragon slaying characters, Arilyn and Danilo haven't done anything that wouldn't fight into a 7-12 character level range, especially since Arilyn's sword is a major artifact no matter how you cut it. |
| SirUrza |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 16:21:11
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
But, as I say, Wizards is trying to keep things fresh. Keep in mind that part of their recent strategy has been to ignore us old fans and focus on trying to draw in new ones... Cranking out more tales of characters that are already established is not the best idea, because it forces new fans to either seek out old material or forever wonder who or what that reference is about...
Then maybe Wizards should let the old novels fall out of print permanantly instead of reprinting them huh?
quote:
"Ah," you're about to say, "What about Drizzt?" Drizzt Do'Urden is a special case. No other character has drawn in more money for TSR/WotC, so for him they make an exception. They're basically holding on tightly to the proven money-maker, while trying to draw in more money with fresh faces -- one of whom may prove to be another cashcow.
I was subtly implying what about Drizzt and company.
quote:
As for what the fans want... WotC has not demonstrated a willingness to listen to us up until now. I doubt that will change any time soon. I don't blame the creators and writers, I blame the bean counters and number crunchers who actually run things. They need to start having the creators run the show, not be support staff for the higher-ups and finance department.
I'm not blaming the writers. I'm just whining and being my usual anti-Wizards self. (And yes, I'm do have a pro-Wizards self, they just haven't done anything to justify letting it out of the cage.) :) |
| ElaineCunningham |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 15:25:11
I can understand why the DRAGON editor preferred familiar characters. That helps create "brand identification" in a forum that covers a lot of RPG worlds, settings, and systems. People who've read my stuff are more likely to pick up a magazine that revisits an established character than go out of their way to read a story about some guy they've never heard about. Also, Elaith Craulnober probably has a highly profile than any character with whom I'm associated. He appears in several FR game products, the MMO Neverwinter Nights, Ed Greenwood's novel Silver Fire, and several of my books and short stories. If my email is any indication, he is more frequently employed as an NPC in Realms-based campaigns than any of my other characters. All of these are good arguments for a short story in gaming magazine.
The book editors, however, have different considerations. For one thing, they don't have to sell the setting. They need to balance the line. They're committed to bringing in new authors. They have to deal with changes to the rules and the setting. Let's face it--it's a lot easier to start fresh with new characters than try to retrofit a character or storyline to blend the one and the new. Also, the older characters are getting ... older. As one reader observed on a message board forum, "Danilo must be in his early thirties now, so what sort of adventures could he possibly have?" An older antihero would be far more palatable, but given Danilo's persona, he might be looking a bit long in the tooth to some readers. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 06:45:25
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
I'm not saying new characters are a bad thing. But Wizards is turning away old characters that authors want to write about and readers want to read about.
If Elaine (or Ed or anyone else) has an idea for new characters and a new storyline I don't think that's bad, that's great. But tuning out old characters while OTHER people MUST write about certain characters or are fixed in their own little world of character is just wrong.
But, as I say, Wizards is trying to keep things fresh. Keep in mind that part of their recent strategy has been to ignore us old fans and focus on trying to draw in new ones... Cranking out more tales of characters that are already established is not the best idea, because it forces new fans to either seek out old material or forever wonder who or what that reference is about...
"Ah," you're about to say, "What about Drizzt?"
Drizzt Do'Urden is a special case. No other character has drawn in more money for TSR/WotC, so for him they make an exception. They're basically holding on tightly to the proven money-maker, while trying to draw in more money with fresh faces -- one of whom may prove to be another cashcow.
As for what the fans want... WotC has not demonstrated a willingness to listen to us up until now. I doubt that will change any time soon. I don't blame the creators and writers, I blame the bean counters and number crunchers who actually run things. They need to start having the creators run the show, not be support staff for the higher-ups and finance department. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 04:40:23
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
If Elaine (or Ed or anyone else) has an idea for new characters and a new storyline I don't think that's bad, that's great. But tuning out old characters while OTHER people MUST write about certain characters or are fixed in their own little world of character is just wrong.
Who are the "OTHER people" that "MUST write about certain characters or are fixed in their own little world of character?" |
| SirUrza |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 03:19:41
I'm not saying new characters are a bad thing. But Wizards is turning away old characters that authors want to write about and readers want to read about.
If Elaine (or Ed or anyone else) has an idea for new characters and a new storyline I don't think that's bad, that's great. But tuning out old characters while OTHER people MUST write about certain characters or are fixed in their own little world of character is just wrong.
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 23 Jan 2005 : 02:22:15
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
New characters should come from new authors IMHO.
I won't go that far. Many writers no doubt enjoy introducing new characters to readers.
I'm not going to agree with this statement, either. It's very limiting to authors. Under this philosophy, Elaine couldn't have introduced us to Liriel, Fyodor, Matteo and Tzigone. And what about Ed? No Glarasteer Rhauligan, no Caladnei, no new Chosen of Mystra -- ever. And what about the favored author of so many Drizzt fans? With your idea, the Cleric Quintet never could have been written, and we might not have ever even met Jarlaxle...
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
Wizards wanting certain established authors to create new characters but not making others to do the same just makes them look like they're looking for another Realms cashcow character.
I've heard this theory expressed before that WOTC was introducing many new writers and new characters because they were looking for the next Drizzt. I have no idea on the validity of such statements.
While I'm sure that WotC would love to have another Drizzt, I doubt that's their only intent. By constantly giving us new authors, we are also getting a constant influx of new ideas and characters. Some pan out -- Drizzt Do'Urden, Arilyn Moonblade, Erevis Cale. Some don't -- Mari Al'Marien, Wynter the centaur, Pinch...
Further, keeping up with new characters prevents what happened with Dragginglance. Look at that setting -- if Weis and Hickman weren't writing, nothing new happened. Everyone kept going sideways and backwards -- "let's explore the past of this character, totally ignoring continuity while doing so!" (Example: in the beginning of the Chronicles, Raistlin is getting tired after tossing off a 1st or 2nd level spell. In one of the short stories in the first Tales trilogy, it's before the Chronicles, yet he tosses off about four polymorph spells, no prob.) Or they would explore some other aspect of the past, like the Elven Nations books. The world became totally static, because no one was doing anything new.
So, constantly giving us new authors, and let both old and new authors play with new characters as they desire, is a good thing for the Realms. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 22:00:29
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
New characters should come from new authors IMHO.
I won't go that far. Many writers no doubt enjoy introducing new characters to readers.
quote:
Wizards wanting certain established authors to create new characters but not making others to do the same just makes them look like they're looking for another Realms cashcow character.
I've heard this theory expressed before that WOTC was introducing many new writers and new characters because they were looking for the next Drizzt. I have no idea on the validity of such statements.
What's interesting is we have heard that WOTC's novel department wants new characters these days apparently over old. Yet, not everyone feels the same way. Take a look at the following from Elaine Cunningham's blog
quote:
This week I had an email exchange with the editor of DRAGON magazine about the possibility of writing a tie-in story to support the upcoming Waterdeep novel. He was interested, and he expressed a preference for established characters. So it appears that I'll be writing a short story focusing on Elaith, as well as a 5000-word article on the restored bard college in Waterdeep. Like the novel Evermeet, this will be narrated by Danilo Thann.
So, the Dragon editor wants established characters, but the novel department wants new characters. To each his/her own it would seem. |
| SirUrza |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 21:38:50
Then just call me bitter for wanting to see good characters continued. New characters should come from new authors IMHO.
Wizards wanting certain established authors to create new characters but not making others to do the same just makes them look like they're looking for another Realms cashcow character.
I won't even get into the pychology of not continuing character so that they can detach the read from the character after the trilogy is done and not have about supporting said character in the game products which could lead to negative feedback if the stats are poorly designed.
|
| ElaineCunningham |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 17:59:58
That's a good suggestion, Sirius. New and upcoming projects are listed on the home page of my website, www.elainecunningham.com, and I keep an online writing journal entitled Elven Bard. (www.elvenbard.blogspot.com)
Before someone asks, the blog title is NOT self-referential, but named for the main character in my upcoming Everquest novel. Still keeping that tenuous grip on reality, thank you very much.  |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 14:33:58
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
OK "What NEW characters are you working with?" ;-)
More so, what races are you working with, human, elves or others?
Somewhere on this forum, I want to say the author's thread, EC gave some brief information on a character or two from The Waterdeep novel. If I recall, the character mentioned was human. Other information on what EC is working with in other tomes could possibly be found on the author's blog. |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 14:31:31
quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
I wouldn't worry about Bob, he's going to do something. As for Elaine, I'd worry. Some of the comments she's made don't make me think things between her and Wizards are delicate.
Sorry I gave that impression.
For what it's worth, this scribe/reader never got that impression.
quote:
I'm still working in the Realms. albeit not exclusively. I was asked to write a novella for the upcoming anthology. I'm writing a story and an article for DRAGON as tie-ins for the Waterdeep novel. At this time, however, I'm working on two other books and a handful of short stories.
You sound quite busy and that's the impression I've always gotten from reading your postings here and elsewhere. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 14:31:25
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
OK "What NEW characters are you working with?" ;-)
More so, what races are you working with, human, elves or others?
Dang, he beat me to the punch. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 13:56:03
OK "What NEW characters are you working with?" ;-)
More so, what races are you working with, human, elves or others? |
| ElaineCunningham |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 13:47:28
quote:
Originally posted by SirUrza
I wouldn't worry about Bob, he's going to do something. As for Elaine, I'd worry. Some of the comments she's made don't make me think things between her and Wizards are delicate.
Sorry I gave that impression. Sometimes questions come in clusters, and repeatedly addressing certain topics can create an impression that doesn't reflect the whole picture. For example, I seem to have been typing a lot of replies, on the forum and in email, to questions about "When will there be another (insert character name) story?" As I've said over and over, the current zeitgeist at WotC is a preference for new storylines with new characters. In some ways I would RATHER write stories about Elaith, Arilyn, Dan and Liriel, but I've gone with the program to create new characters for the Counselors & Kings trilogy, and the Waterdeep novel has a whole bunch of new, young, low-level characters. Since no one asks, "What NEW characters are you working with?" most of my answers run along the lines of, "Nope, not doing that," "Sorry, no plans for a sequel," and variations thereof.
I'm still working in the Realms. albeit not exclusively. I was asked to write a novella for the upcoming anthology. I'm writing a story and an article for DRAGON as tie-ins for the Waterdeep novel. At this time, however, I'm working on two other books and a handful of short stories. |
| SirUrza |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 06:13:18
I figured it out!
Wizards just doesn't play to be open for business that long.  |
| Dargoth |
Posted - 22 Jan 2005 : 03:33:46
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
BTW, Ed tells me we can expect the usual extra Waterdeep “support” goodies on the website and perhaps also in DRAGON (not just by him).
Elaine has spilled the beans in her thread
|
| The Sage |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 14:26:25
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Sage, that depends on whether you follow the “save the best for last” philosophy or not.
Normally I do, however, there's been quite a number of recent novels that I've just simply wanted to sink my teeth into the moment I purchased them...  .
quote:
As someone who has SOME knowledge of what’s in all three, I’d say this: Champions of Ruin essentially has nothing to do with the Waterdeep novel, and so can be read at any time (myself, I’d read it first, and let it stew in my forebrain until after the other two have been enjoyed, for campaign development later).
Since the next stage of my PS campaign (which is set to begin around the end of June/early July) will likely involve some elements of ancient fiends operating in the Realms, this may be unavoidable.
quote:
The Waterdeep game product faces the usual problem of WAY too much data to squeeze into too few pages. It MIGHT contain tiny spoilers for the novel, but if so, I’d guess they’ll be the sort that leap out at the reader as spoilers only AFTER they’ve read the novel.
I wouldn't have it any other way... .
quote:
So for me, it’d be Champions first, then the Waterdeep game product, and then, left until last and savoured, the Waterdeep novel. Ed has in the past confirmed that it’s a “romp” but also addresses serious issues, and has cameos by some big familiar faces but essentially centers around new characters - - and like most of us, the combo of Elaine and Ed is a must-see for me.
If I can delay my campaign plans, I can probably work it like that.
quote:
BTW, Ed tells me we can expect the usual extra Waterdeep “support” goodies on the website and perhaps also in DRAGON (not just by him).
It just keeps getting better...  .
|
| George Krashos |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 12:45:54
  What?! Heresy! Time for those Tyrran inquisitors to track you down Wooly - and bring you to account in that peaceful oasis of goodness known as Impiltur. That is, if the Queen of Whispers doesn't get to you first.
-- George Krashos
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 11:21:40
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
No, no! We want Impiltur. And plenty of it!
-- George Krashos
Impiltur? What's that? |
| Kajehase |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 06:23:14
quote:
Originally posted by SiriusBlack
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
Anyway, as I indicated in my blog here -- http://www.livejournal.com/users/paulskemp/ -- the next trilogy will be tied to a "Realms Shaking Event." I can't give any particulars now, but will as soon as I can.
Wild speculation will begin in lieu of details. It will and I'll start it. The next RSE is most likely tied in to the Year of Risen Elfkin. Thus, it's obvious, Cale has elven blood in him and will rise. Case closed.
But from what? His bed? His chair? Or perhaps from a chair on his bed? |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 04:54:01
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
Anyway, as I indicated in my blog here -- http://www.livejournal.com/users/paulskemp/ -- the next trilogy will be tied to a "Realms Shaking Event." I can't give any particulars now, but will as soon as I can.
Wild speculation will begin in lieu of details. It will and I'll start it. The next RSE is most likely tied in to the Year of Risen Elfkin. Thus, it's obvious, Cale has elven blood in him and will rise. Case closed. |
| George Krashos |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 01:37:02
No, no! We want Impiltur. And plenty of it!
-- George Krashos
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 21 Jan 2005 : 00:11:33
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
BTW, Ed tells me we can expect the usual extra Waterdeep “support” goodies on the website and perhaps also in DRAGON (not just by him).
Web goodies and the Dragon articles from Elaine? Rock! That is wonderful news!
As a Waterdeep junkie, I want all the Waterdhavian lore I can get. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 20 Jan 2005 : 22:48:19
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
Rad,
I announced the follow up trilogy in my thread some time ago. The trilogy has been a go for months. Where have you been, sir? 
Anyway, as I indicated in my blog here -- http://www.livejournal.com/users/paulskemp/ -- the next trilogy will be tied to a "Realms Shaking Event." I can't give any particulars now, but will as soon as I can.
 Ack! You mean i've been going through all these weeks\months of depression for nothing?!  How I missed reading of this, i'll never ever know!  ::wanders off scratching his head::
Well i'm beside myself with this news, regardless, and I'll look forward to your continued updates and leaks of information on this upcoming trilogy within your thread at Candlekeep |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 20 Jan 2005 : 21:58:54
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
the next trilogy will be tied to a "Realms Shaking Event." I can't give any particulars now, but will as soon as I can.
Well an Earthquake comes to mind ;-) though I suspect it will be larger then that. Good luck on the series I look forward to it. |
| PaulSKemp |
Posted - 20 Jan 2005 : 20:54:24
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Rad
WOW! Excellent news. I'm extremely excited about Midnight's Mask, but the excitement was mixed with an underpinning glumness that there will be no more Cale, after having followed him since reading of him all those years ago in Halls of Stormweather. This news has now just sent me very giddy
What more can you tell us Paul? Anything at all?
Rad,
I announced the follow up trilogy in my thread some time ago. The trilogy has been a go for months. Where have you been, sir?
Anyway, as I indicated in my blog here -- http://www.livejournal.com/users/paulskemp/ -- the next trilogy will be tied to a "Realms Shaking Event." I can't give any particulars now, but will as soon as I can. |
| Lord Rad |
Posted - 20 Jan 2005 : 17:11:39
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
The sequel trilogy to the Erevis Cale trilogy is (last I heard) scheduled to start in '06. Given that, I wouldn't worry too much about what you see and don't see on the '06 release schedule. It's in process, is my guess. Things will become clearer in time and I'll bet you a 100 Sembian fivestars that the volume of books released in '06 will number about the same or more as the number released in '04 and '05, respectively.
WOW! Excellent news. I'm extremely excited about Midnight's Mask, but the excitement was mixed with an underpinning glumness that there will be no more Cale, after having followed him since reading of him all those years ago in Halls of Stormweather. This news has now just sent me very giddy
What more can you tell us Paul? Anything at all? |
| SiriusBlack |
Posted - 20 Jan 2005 : 16:38:58
quote:
Originally posted by PaulSKemp
The sequel trilogy to the Erevis Cale trilogy is (last I heard) scheduled to start in '06.
Will this trilogy reunite Cale with Tazi?
SB who had to ask. |
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