| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 10 Sep 2005 : 13:43:46
Hello and Well Met!
I am new to this site and to posting here. Please let me know if I should have put this in a better place... I was perusing the list of prestige classes and saw a Thayan Gladiator! I have been kicking around the idea of a gladiator character for a while, would this be a good template to use? What book is CoR? Thanks all! |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 21 Sep 2005 : 03:14:10
Thanks all for the great info! I will hasten to check out that download page. I fervently hope that the fee is small as my purse is light... |
| The Sage |
Posted - 21 Sep 2005 : 02:38:25
quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
Oh no, 2ed - The complete Gladiator's handbook out of the DarkSun campaign setting - great info on weapons, types of matches and the arenas themselves. Very good reading, and thankfully not that campaign specific.
I can certainly attest to that. The Complete Gladiator's Handbook was one of the shining lights of the 2e HANDBOOK series. A very well designed and thought out tome, good for all types of campaign settings -- even those based on historical real world eras. I've used most of the contents successfully in both my DRAGONLANCE campaign set during the days of Istar (and its famed Arena) and in my ancient world campaign series during the Golden Age of Rome.
quote:
I think you may be able to d/l it, though other scholars might know those websites better than I.
Of course, you mean "legal" downloads  . As such, RPGNow.com has a PDF version of the CGHB available for download for a small fee.
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| Crennen FaerieBane |
Posted - 20 Sep 2005 : 20:02:14
Oh no, 2ed - The complete Gladiator's handbook out of the DarkSun campaign setting - great info on weapons, types of matches and the arenas themselves. Very good reading, and thankfully not that campaign specific.
I think you may be able to d/l it, though other scholars might know those websites better than I.
C-Fb
C-Fb |
| Misericordia |
Posted - 20 Sep 2005 : 19:34:41
There was indeed a Complete Gladiator's Handbook, for use in Dark Sun. |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 20 Sep 2005 : 19:12:47
Pray thee, Learned Crennen, enlighten me...
Didst thou mis-speak, or was there really a Gladiators Handbook? Was it perhaps the Fighters Handbook thou speakest of... forgive my ignorance... |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 20 Sep 2005 : 06:09:36
quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
Well, have any of you ever played the Games Workshop Blood Bowl? That was a good testament to fantasy and football. Any game where you could win by scoring more points OR killing the other team is ok!
C-Fb
I once played a game of Blood Bowl, and I had the card that said the ref wouldn't catch any attempts to Foul. I wound up killing three people on the opposing team, and wounding so many others that my opponent had to give up at the half-time -- he couldn't get enough people back on the field! 
But... that has little to do with gladiators, Thayan or otherwise.  |
| Crennen FaerieBane |
Posted - 19 Sep 2005 : 22:08:30
And honestly a lot of the information in the 2ed Gladiators Handbook is still very useful for 3e games. I do miss them knowing how to use all of the exotic weapons though.
C-Fb |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 19 Sep 2005 : 21:04:50
I think the variant gladiator class has some interesting points to it. I don't know that I would automatically give them a better base attack bonus though. Back when Dark Sun had its own gladiator core class, the gladiator automatically knew how to use all weapons, without having to take any proficiency slots, so if want to follow this tack, they might get a free exotic weapon.
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| Crennen FaerieBane |
Posted - 19 Sep 2005 : 20:56:45
Well, have any of you ever played the Games Workshop Blood Bowl? That was a good testament to fantasy and football. Any game where you could win by scoring more points OR killing the other team is ok!
C-Fb |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 19 Sep 2005 : 17:27:16
How about the GutBusters doing a Mithril Hall promomtional tour in Waterdeeps Arena? That wouldn't last long...
Anyway, Here is my question. I posted this some weeks ago on the FR site forum with no responses. Do you sages think that a general Gladiator should be a PrC or its own fighter sub-class? Think of the old Swashbuckler Kits in 2E, and now, it is its own character class as put forth in Complete Fighter. Maybe the Gladiator class starts out as a general character much like a fighter, but with better base Attack Bonus than normal for a 1st level fighter. As a penalty he has to choose 1 type of weapon and armor to focus on... When the character gets to higher levels he can choose one of the gladiator PrC, such as Bestiarius, (such as Dorn from the Year of Rogue Dragon series) or several of the other historical Gladiator types. Redone to give them a strong Realms flavor... Sorry so long, What do you think? |
| khorne |
Posted - 19 Sep 2005 : 08:23:37
quote:
Originally posted by Sir Luther Cromwell
Hhmm, gutbusters playing rugby.
Now THAT would be something to watch. |
| Sir Luther Cromwell |
Posted - 18 Sep 2005 : 20:33:32
Yes if I may recall, to deal with any blood lust a gladiator might have after killing, if he won the fight without killing his opponent he would be given a christian to slaughter (correct me if I'm wrong, however).
And as far as combat without death in good societies is concerned, am I the only one who thinks Dwarves would make insanely good rugby players? They're stocking, short (can't get to the legs), and have a 'bear it all till the end' type of mentality. Of course, if Thimbledorf Pwent were to play, one would have to gently remind him NOT to bring his spiked armor.
Hhmm, gutbusters playing rugby. |
| Misericordia |
Posted - 17 Sep 2005 : 14:23:07
Death in roman arena was not so frequent, but still a common sight. In a particular type of game, called "munera sine missione", there was no mercy for the loser, and the game ended only with the death.
In normal games the outcry iugula! (Kill him!), if not the rule, was frequent.
To make sure the loser wasn't pretending to be dead, an attendant dressed as Mercury would touch him with his hot iron wand. Another attendant, dressed as Charon, would hit him with a mallet. |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 17 Sep 2005 : 13:37:28
The idea of non-lethal combat in many well-organized and good societies is not that hard to believe. After all, what is boxing? Kick Fighting? Ultimate fighter? Football? All of these sports have an element of violence and there is a danger of harm to the participants... The roman arena (according to a program on History Channel)actually did not have many deaths among the Gladiators! I think they said less than 90% of gladiatorial matches ended in death. Gladiators were to expensive to train and keep to waste that investment. Of course the criminals and unfortunate others were given to wild beasts and other less pleasant fates... I can easily see the arena in Waterdeep being packed everytime it was open... I do not see an arena in Silverymoon being very plausible... |
| Crennen FaerieBane |
Posted - 17 Sep 2005 : 02:31:21
Adding an arena to the fray in active Waterdeep allows for a great many adventures concerning the fixing of numbers, the stealing of the winnings, and all other sorts of great things that would be pretty grand on the scale...
Oh yeah, there's probably some great fighting, too. With the fame of Waterdeep, and the fame you could gain by winning there. It would be a draw for a great many warriors - especially if you don't die when you lose.
C-Fb |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 17 Sep 2005 : 00:55:51
From what I have heard about Waterdeep's Field of Triumph, its used more for parades, assemblies, and perhaps more formal tournaments rather than just gladitorial style thumping, though obviously thats possible, especially if you keep up with Eric Boyd's Age of Worms Realms conversion. |
| Chosen of Moradin |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 20:25:14
yes, that´s true but, anyway, I think that is a little weird the fact of an arena of non-lethal combat... this open space to... interesting dialogues:
"Well, now that I´m on the arena, I will finally fight valiantly, and spill the blood of my adversaries."
"Not exactly, boy. We´re in Silverymoon! Here the fights are not to death. Here we only Roleplay a Game, understand?"
Chosen of Moradin |
| Crennen FaerieBane |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 20:01:09
That's true - I think they are a needed background piece when we want our PCs to know that the city they have entered will chew them up and spit them out if they don't watch their step around town.
And, really, who's not into a little Bloodsport? Just ask Jean-Claude Van Damme!
C-Fb |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 17:26:28
quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
I wonder why we naturally assume the more ambiguous nation-states are supposed to have arenas? I mean Silverymoon or Neverwinter could have an arena as well, just a not-to-the-death fighting one, right? And you could still use all the neat feats and PrCs, just deal damage as subdual. And of course, no slavery.
C-Fb
'Tis true... But bloodsports are more commonly associated with decadent and/or evil societies. |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 17:16:55
May the Learned Sages correct me if I am wrong, but Waterdeep does have an arena where people compete without bloodshed. I first took notice of it in one of Elaine Cunninghams novels, (Dreamspheres?). Neat idea! Does this arena appear in the new sourcebook? Picking up my copy tonight! |
| Crennen FaerieBane |
Posted - 16 Sep 2005 : 14:49:55
I wonder why we naturally assume the more ambiguous nation-states are supposed to have arenas? I mean Silverymoon or Neverwinter could have an arena as well, just a not-to-the-death fighting one, right? And you could still use all the neat feats and PrCs, just deal damage as subdual. And of course, no slavery.
C-Fb |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 14 Sep 2005 : 13:59:46
heh heh . . . sure I can read a map . . . guess that's why my wife drives on long trips. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 14 Sep 2005 : 01:54:56
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
I'll have to check that out again. Last night when I was looking for it, I just looked at the map key for Ruins of Zhentil Keep, and couldn't find an arena, but I didn't do any in depth research to see if one was mentioned.
The Arena's first mentioned on pg. 54.
On the map, it's feature 4 -- in the Inner Quarter.
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| ShadowJack |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 19:09:15
I believe I still have the comics laying around home, I will have to check them out. Also, KnightErrant, you can download Lands of intrigue from WotC website. Thanks for the info! |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 17:47:18
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
Vajra was indeed from the comics, although I beleive she is also in Lands of Intruigue as well, though I don't have it handy to check.
Yup. Vajra Valmeyjar, Timoth Eyesbright, and Onyx the Invincible were all first introduced in the Advanced Dungeons & Dragons comic. Steven Schend later used them in Tethyr. Vajra is now a noble, and Timoth and Onyx, if I remember correctly, are both officers in the army.
The remaining character from the comic is of course the Moonstar agent and Lord of Waterdeep, Kyriani. |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 17:19:19
Vajra was indeed from the comics, although I beleive she is also in Lands of Intruigue as well, though I don't have it handy to check. I had once had a thought about someone as a slave in Hillsfar being sent to Westgate to "tour the circut" and make some more money, though I must admit part of that probably popped into my mind due to the movie Gladiator. |
| ShadowJack |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 17:13:27
I agree with you KnightErrant. I have always thought that Unther, Mulhorand and Thay are logical choices for Arenas. Hillsfar, of course, has always been mentioned. I also like the idea of Zhent controlled areas having small, but popular, fighting pits, for both slaves and free. The idea makes sense. I can also see these different Arenas having special contests between each other. For instance a campaign I am running has a character who was a gladiatorial slave whose owner trotted him (he is a centaur) to Thay, Unther and Hillsfar to compete for money. Does this seem plausible to you learned sages? By the way, who is Najra? Was she from the comic books? |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 16:25:48
I'll have to check that out again. Last night when I was looking for it, I just looked at the map key for Ruins of Zhentil Keep, and couldn't find an arena, but I didn't do any in depth research to see if one was mentioned.
Oh, all I meant by a fighting pit was an indoor arena that has limited room. Kinda like the one from Neverwinter Nights or even the place that Wolverine fought in the X-Men movie (the first one). |
| The Sage |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 05:45:51
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I figure you'd also find them in Zhentil Keep, and places controlled by or loyal to them.
Indeed. In the Inner Quarter of the city, among merchant headquarters and other prominent buildings, lies the Arena.
It's a reference from the Ruins of Zhentil Keep boxed set.
quote:
In other words, a gladitorial arena in the North stands out as an oddity...
I think that would depend upon where you are in the North, and what race you are talking about.
I would imagine that "fighting pits" and gladitorial-styled combat features prominently in orcish domains -- where positions of power within a tribe are decreed by the results of such contests.
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| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 13 Sep 2005 : 05:35:06
You know, its funny . . . I can easily picture a lot of "southern" nations having gladitorial arenas, but for some reason they didn't seem "notable." In other words, a gladitorial arena in the North stands out as an oddity, but in the south, it just seems like something any decadant noble might enjoy.
Although for some reason I picture Zhentil Keep having smaller "fighting pits" than grand arenas, but I would have to recheck my Zhent info to see if I am just imagining things . . . |
