| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Abenabin Gimblescrew |
Posted - 21 Apr 2011 : 05:16:15
I have for quite some time been torn with this world I have been working on for years on what type of cosmology I'd like to set up. I think I have finally settled on what I am going to do, but it got me thinking what others thought about cosmology in their fantasy.
So here is my question to you as the title of the thread implies - What type of Divine, if any, do you look for in your fantasy? Give your thoughts if you would as well as to why you prefer to see it in a fantasy world and why you think it is best for good fantasy story telling.
Note: Please avoid criticizing real world ideologies, this is meant to only pertain to fantasy worlds. Thanks in advance!
Okay, keep the punches above the belt. Tap gloves. Go! *Bell* |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 May 2011 : 06:36:06
I wouldn't have too many dieties, anyway, so breaking things down won't be a problem.
----
Edit:
Something struck me after rereading A Kingdom Besieged by Raymond E. Feist...
Pug, Tomas, and some members of the Conclave of Shadows postulated on the nature of their Overgod. And what they came up with is this: that despite his billions of years of existence, he is still like a child, grappling the meaning of what is good and evil, creating beings and watching them closely, trying to understand concepts from their behavior.
So, how would you want your Overgod to be? A fully aware being dedicated to maintaining the Balance (like Ao), or a child-like being learning things from his own creation (like the Overgod of Feist's Universe)? |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 13 May 2011 : 06:30:31
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
My deities would have their "areas responsibilities" [portfolios, if you wish], and in those areas, they are omnipotent---completely in charge. So there's no need for "assistants"---no lesser deities, no Chosen.
-So, the deity of nature would be just as strong as the deity of ham sandwiches?
-That kind of thing, I think, is the most annoying part of pantheons, personally. Once you step away from singular, more omnipotent deities (as in singular, or close to them), you start breaking things down further and further, to the point that you can really split hairs, and then with all of that in mind, have to balance things, and yada, yada, yada. Partially why I started moving away from a pantheon in my setting. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 13 May 2011 : 01:52:23
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-Why? The deity of nature would (a) be in charge of something more important and (b) have more followers than, say, the deity of ham sandwiches.
-I can agree, though, that generally speaking, I don't differentiate too much between the followers of strong deities and less strong deities.
My deities would have their "areas responsibilities" [portfolios, if you wish], and in those areas, they are omnipotent---completely in charge. So there's no need for "assistants"---no lesser deities, no Chosen. |
| Diffan |
Posted - 12 May 2011 : 19:06:49
For myself, I chose Pantheon because I feel the greater versatility is needed in a gaming-setting. Having multiple deities that all sort of rival with eachother (or create factions) makes it more Dynamic IMO plus it allows people that play in that setting for creativity overall.
But of course, it all depends on the world, setting, etc... if there is a large Divine aspect. For example, I think it's the book series by Feist that doesn't really have any Divine aspect (same goes for the books revolving around The Black Company) and it works well for those series. The fact that in those settings people believe in God(s) yet don't really have any evidence makes a connection with the reader (more or less). |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 12 May 2011 : 18:12:25
-Why? The deity of nature would (a) be in charge of something more important and (b) have more followers than, say, the deity of ham sandwiches.
-I can agree, though, that generally speaking, I don't differentiate too much between the followers of strong deities and less strong deities. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 12 May 2011 : 07:49:56
I wouldn't have lesser deities. Making them all equal would be easier to keep the balance. |
| boards |
Posted - 11 May 2011 : 08:32:50
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
I don't even use avatars. The gods in my setting appear directly, much like the ancient Greek ones did. They just dial down the divine aura and such when they appear to mortals.
-That's my definition of avatar. I imagine deities as, more or less, as formless- "globs" of spiritual energy (Incarnum, in 3e). They need to manifest physical forms to interact with the material world, so those material forms that they create are their avatars, and that's that.
Mines fairly similar. My gods live in a dimension of almost pure energy, when they come to the material world they create a body, but that body can only hold a fraction of the gods power. That fraction of power is however about at much power as any mortal could develop, so there is no way any wizard could take on a god in its own dimension. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 11 May 2011 : 05:54:25
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
I don't even use avatars. The gods in my setting appear directly, much like the ancient Greek ones did. They just dial down the divine aura and such when they appear to mortals.
-That's my definition of avatar. I imagine deities as, more or less, as formless- "globs" of spiritual energy (Incarnum, in 3e). They need to manifest physical forms to interact with the material world, so those material forms that they create are their avatars, and that's that. |
| Alystra Illianniis |
Posted - 11 May 2011 : 05:51:00
I don't even use avatars. The gods in my setting appear directly, much like the ancient Greek ones did. They just dial down the divine aura and such when they appear to mortals. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 11 May 2011 : 05:39:14
I don't like nor dislike the concept. I just don't see how it could work well in my setting. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 11 May 2011 : 05:26:39
-In my own setting, I don't use Chosen. Powerful Clerics, or religious non-Clerics wholly dedicated to their deities? Yeah. But, Chosen? No.
-That is not to say I don't like the concept of Chosen, though. I do. I just don't use it. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 11 May 2011 : 05:23:14
I'm not sure if I'd use Chosen. Avatars, yes. They are a necessity. But Chosen? Most probably not. I prefer my wizards to be indifferent to the gods. |
| AleksanderTheGreat |
Posted - 10 May 2011 : 16:32:13
I voted "Other", as in "Multiple pantheons", just like in Forgotten Realms pre-spellplague. I love to have many choices and a pletora of dieties makes the setting more interesting and colorful. :D |
| Dennis |
Posted - 10 May 2011 : 16:25:34
Hmmm. Jane from Twilight could pass as a goddess of undeath. And the demonic fetus Xingax from the Haunted Lands would be a horrifying god of plagues.
I think I'll have to reconsider my previous post... |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 10 May 2011 : 13:44:52
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Did I mention that all my deities would assume handsome human forms? Even the gods of death and undeath would be "darkly" attractive.
-For whatever reason, in my setting, The Raven Queen (the Grim Reaper), I often envision her as a dark haired, emo little girl, kinda like Raven from Teen Titans (the cartoon), only maybe a little younger (10ish, instead of 14ish).
Isn't that too young?
If I were to make a god look that young, I'd pick the God of Mischief.
Ever watch the TV show Angel? Spin off of Buffy the Vampire Slayer? Good show; had a character, evil incarnation of the setting sun, as a little girl. Couldn't have been more than ten. Very creepy.
That being said most art I've seen for the Raven Queen makes her look to be in her late thirties to early forties appearance wise. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 10 May 2011 : 07:38:29
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Did I mention that all my deities would assume handsome human forms? Even the gods of death and undeath would be "darkly" attractive.
-For whatever reason, in my setting, The Raven Queen (the Grim Reaper), I often envision her as a dark haired, emo little girl, kinda like Raven from Teen Titans (the cartoon), only maybe a little younger (10ish, instead of 14ish).
Isn't that too young?
If I were to make a god look that young, I'd pick the God of Mischief. |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 10 May 2011 : 05:57:41
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
Did I mention that all my deities would assume handsome human forms? Even the gods of death and undeath would be "darkly" attractive.
-For whatever reason, in my setting, The Raven Queen (the Grim Reaper), I often envision her as a dark haired, emo little girl, kinda like Raven from Teen Titans (the cartoon), only maybe a little younger (10ish, instead of 14ish). |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 May 2011 : 19:52:58
Did I mention that all my deities would assume handsome human forms? Even the gods of death and undeath would be "darkly" attractive. |
| boards |
Posted - 09 May 2011 : 09:57:32
I like to have a pantheon, or actually multiple pantheons for different cultural groups. However I dont like them to be bound to domains, I have them more as extremely powerful beings who watch over things in their interest. I also like their power to be seperate from worship, but that worship allows them to work on the mortal realm. No worship means no influence on the world, not extinction. |
| BARDOBARBAROS |
Posted - 07 May 2011 : 14:07:38
Pantheon |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 27 Apr 2011 : 06:18:06
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
What does the Po mean in regards to Divine Rank?
Po = Power
Wf = Worshiper Faith
Wb = Worship Base
P1 = Portfolio 1
P2 = Portfolio 2
and so on... |
| MrHedgehog |
Posted - 27 Apr 2011 : 00:36:19
What does the Po mean in regards to Divine Rank? |
| skychrome |
Posted - 27 Apr 2011 : 00:15:01
Voted Pantheon.
I don't know, but it is difficult for me to imagine my preferred fantasy setting without a pantheon of gods. It just feels right (and different from reality, and that's what I like about fantasy). |
| Lord Karsus |
Posted - 26 Apr 2011 : 07:09:43
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
I also prefer power independant of worship in my pantheons. My own gods have power depending on the importance of their domains. In other words, the god of death or goddess of the earth would be much more important than the god of plagues or goddess of peace. They have more influence over peoples' lives.
-This is the formula I worked out to determine the relative power of a deity:
Po = (Wf x Wb) + P1 + P2...
where
Po = Power
Wf = Worshiper Faith
Wb = Worship Base
P1 = Portfolio 1
P2 = Portfolio 2
and so on...
-This is very rough, as mentioned. Arbitrary numbers are assigned to the variables, to make the data interpretable. So, let me use a quick example, using Deity 'A', 'B', and 'C'.
Deity A: 100 followers, very high fervor, 3 portfolios (1 worth 100, 2 worth 50)
Deity B: 1,000 followers, moderate fervor, 5 portfolios (5 worth 50)
Deity C: 10,000 followers, low fervor, 1 portfolio (1 worth 100)
Deity A
Po = (15 x 100) + 100 + 50 +50
Po = 1,700
Deity B
Po = (10 x 100) + (50 x 5)
Po = 1,250
Deity C
Po = (2 x 10,00) + 100
Po = 20,100
-Thus, we have an explanation as to how there are deities who have lots of worshipers who are Intermediate Powers, deities that have few worshipers who are Greater Powers, and everything in-between. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 26 Apr 2011 : 01:55:07
Unlike most gods in fantasy settings, I would like mine not to have exact forms. They would be more like a "presence." And they would only don a "form" at whim, or when they deem necessary, like appearing before their faithful, or when having a congregation. |
| Alystra Illianniis |
Posted - 25 Apr 2011 : 19:25:24
I also prefer power independant of worship in my pantheons. My own gods have power depending on the importance of their domains. In other words, the god of death or goddess of the earth would be much more important than the god of plagues or goddess of peace. They have more influence over peoples' lives. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 25 Apr 2011 : 08:34:34
I prefer to make the gods' limitation internal (their very nature) than external (people's prayers). I would also shy away from having them subsume each other. Challenge, yes; but definitely not subsume. |
| ChieftainTwilight |
Posted - 24 Apr 2011 : 09:47:14
I would have to say that if hypothetically there were a system where the Gods power wa sin fact independent of worship or belief, that they would have a ban on them preventing their direct involvement in the world; that would give them a reason to have followers, because they would need mortal agents to do their dirty work on the Prime Material Plane.
however, I personally like the idea of Gods requiring worship/belief in order to exist. it makes things all the more dire, and also adds a certain intricate simplicity that I like. |
| MrHedgehog |
Posted - 24 Apr 2011 : 08:57:04
Chosen of Asmodeus - Other than worshipers how would you determine which Gods were more powerful? Would they have God levels? Why bother having followers then? Although I suppose in real world mythologies a Gods power was independent of mortals. Poseidon wouldn't be less powerful if you didn't worship him...he'd just do nasty stuff to you = P
I prefer the concept of faith and belief in a God determining its power...in Planescape terms with belief shaping the universe. Although not necessarily number of worshipers determining their power. For example Hathor might be worshiped as much as Horus-Re...but Horus-Re would be more powerful because people believe he is, for example. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 24 Apr 2011 : 01:38:59
I wouldn't make an Overgod. It's better to see the children (gods) play at the park (heaven) without the parents' supervision. |
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