| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 07 Feb 2011 : 21:06:28
This is a question I posed to Ed a little while back. While I await the answer I thought I might open up discussion with the scribes here to get their opinion on it; always nice to get as many view points as possible.
From the ending of Elmister Must Die, we have a strong suggestion that Mystra's on the way back.
Now, it is established if not universally accepted that during the Spellplague, Asmodeus killed Azuth, Mystra's servant, in order to ascend to godhood.
It is my understanding,via wikipedia so I could be completely wrong, that Mystra left about half of her power contained in Azuth and her Chosen.
So. What would Mystra's return mean for Asmodeus' divinity, and what steps would Asmodeus take to stop it were he to find out? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Arioch |
Posted - 11 Feb 2011 : 08:26:43
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Anyhow, I am sure nearly everyone here who runs/plays D&D (not just fans of the setting) run their own versions of FR, but I am just as sure most of us aware of (and respectful of) the canon lore, regardless of weather we use it or not. what most of us do here is try to discover new ways to use the lore, twisting and bending it in odd directions no one has thought of yet.
It doesn't mean we don't like the canon or don't know it just because we may not use all of it in our own interpretations. Part of the fun of this site is bouncing ideas off of each other. Most of the theories we throw around are purely 'what if' type mental exercises (as in, "how can we make this work without breaking canon?").
I'll never use 98% of the stuff I discuss here, but its fun to think about.
That is exactly my opinion too! 
And, about the
quote:
MEGA-RSE that started with the theft of the Tablets of Fate and ended with the Spellplague.
I agree with you!! I had the same suspect a while ago, when I started this thread: http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=11771
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| The Sage |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 23:57:41
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Well, the vast majority of people who die (even in the Realms!) don't turn into spectres or other disembodied ghostly sorts who hang around pretending that nothing happened, oh it was just a bad day and I got killed but I'm okay now.
Yet Syluné became one, indicating that so far 100% of Mystra's Chosen seem to bypass normal operating procedure when they die. Perhaps one day spectral Elminster and Khelben will be handing out bits of stone from their towers.
No need for Mystra to resurrect her Chosen, they're apparently immortal even after death. 
Ah, but the same thing did not happen to Khelben.
Indeed. And, as I recall, Steven Schend talked about this when he spoke about Khelben's death, here at Candlekeep a few years back. I'll dig out the relevant replies. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 23:47:36
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Well, the vast majority of people who die (even in the Realms!) don't turn into spectres or other disembodied ghostly sorts who hang around pretending that nothing happened, oh it was just a bad day and I got killed but I'm okay now.
Yet Syluné became one, indicating that so far 100% of Mystra's Chosen seem to bypass normal operating procedure when they die. Perhaps one day spectral Elminster and Khelben will be handing out bits of stone from their towers.
No need for Mystra to resurrect her Chosen, they're apparently immortal even after death.
Ah, but the same thing did not happen to Khelben. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 23:44:31
I remember a while back Ed put out an article in Dragon concerning the "Friendly ghost of Silverymoon" in post spellplague realms. At the time I had speculated that she had been Alustrial, though there wasn't much in the article to support that. |
| Therise |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 23:16:25
Truthfully, a large number of powerful mortals in the Realms appear to bypass normal operating procedure when it comes to death. Hardly unique to Mystra's Chosen. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 23:12:02
Well, the vast majority of people who die (even in the Realms!) don't turn into spectres or other disembodied ghostly sorts who hang around pretending that nothing happened, oh it was just a bad day and I got killed but I'm okay now.
Yet Syluné became one, indicating that so far 100% of Mystra's Chosen seem to bypass normal operating procedure when they die. Perhaps one day spectral Elminster and Khelben will be handing out bits of stone from their towers.
No need for Mystra to resurrect her Chosen, they're apparently immortal even after death. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 22:42:03
As I recall, she could pop up anywhere where there were pieces of her cottage, and people would sometimes carry pebbles that enabled her to show up whereever they were. It's an interesting theory, but I'm inclined to assume that she was, in fact, destroyed, as those modules indicate.
Assuming, of course, that you use those modules in your Realms. |
| Christopher_Rowe |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 22:14:38
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
]Moreover, Syluné's lingering spectral presence was destroyed in 1374DR by Sharran ritual activities, though she again lingered on (this time as some sort of sentient silverfire) until completely destroyed (or perhaps sacrificing herself) in 1375DR while disrupting the Sharran ritual.
So Syluné was killed thrice. Symbolically rich, three is a witchy number and all. Arguably a bizarre form of triple-suicide.
I've always wondered if there might a sort of "out" for Syluné's ghost down at Castle Faerntarn in Tethyr, where flagstones from her cottage floor were included as part of the restoration in 1369, allowing her to appear there (though she habitually wore the guise of the Tethyrian Queen Alisande when she did). Like maybe she--or some part of her ghostly essence--managed to flee there or otherwise survive there in some fashion.
Cheers,
Christopher
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| Ayrik |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 22:01:08
quote:
Fuzzy Rupert
I should also like to point out that we know of at least one Chosen that died, but still lingered despite that death -- Syluné. I would consider her further evidence that Mystra generally doesn't raise dead Chosen.
Moreover, Syluné's lingering spectral presence was destroyed in 1374DR by Sharran ritual activities, though she again lingered on (this time as some sort of sentient silverfire) until completely destroyed (or perhaps sacrificing herself) in 1375DR while disrupting the Sharran ritual.
So Syluné was killed thrice. Symbolically rich, three is a witchy number and all. Arguably a bizarre form of triple-suicide. |
| Chosen of Asmodeus |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 20:46:27
quote:
Originally posted by Arcanus
What is Asmodeus god of exactly?
In the Realms, Asmodeus is officially the god of Sin. He's a god of tyranny, like Bane, but where as Bane's dogma is to rule with an iron fist, Asmodeus puts a silk glove over that fist. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 17:11:43
I should also like to point out that we know of at least one Chosen that died, but still lingered despite that death -- Syluné. I would consider her further evidence that Mystra generally doesn't raise dead Chosen. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 13:31:15
There's no reason for Mystra to reinstall dead Chosens into the Realms when she can easily take them to Dweomerheart (or wherever) to serve as her eternal servants. They might enjoy some special status or power, as do Lolth's Handmaidens and other beings. The most favoured Chosen might be divinely ascended to some lesser station (by Mystra and/or her church), they might even become as powerful as Azuth. They might be able to walk Toril again (when on missions and stuff), but not as normal living people. Such are my thoughts on this noble question. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 11:42:41
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Ah. Yes, that makes sense. Stupid internet failed to provide instant and accurate response to my query. Imagine that.
Really? When you search in google, the very first result you'd see is QUOTED FOR TRUTH.
I was just joking about QuantiFERON-TB.
Back to topic: When Mystra 3.0 finally regains everything she's lost, will she resurrect those Chosen who died during and after the SP, or will she make new ones?
I would imagine she'd make new ones. With the exception of the Srinshee (who is very much an exception!), I don't know of any Chosen that have returned from death. |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 11:41:04
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Ah. Yes, that makes sense. Stupid internet failed to provide instant and accurate response to my query. Imagine that.
Really? When you search in google, the very first result you'd see is QUOTED FOR TRUTH.
I was just joking about QuantiFERON-TB.
Back to topic: When Mystra 3.0 finally regains everything she's lost, will she resurrect those Chosen who died during and after the SP, or will she make new ones?
I got "Quite F'N True" somewhere
Anyways, Mystra will simply return as an exarch of Karsus (if my theory about Karsus is correct).
More likely she will come back as some form of essence with a divine spark, but not quite a deity. Perhaps as some form of guide for Elminster. |
| Alisttair |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 11:40:33
quote:
Originally posted by Dennis
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Ah. Yes, that makes sense. Stupid internet failed to provide instant and accurate response to my query. Imagine that.
Really? When you search in google, the very first result you'd see is QUOTED FOR TRUTH.
I was just joking about QuantiFERON-TB.
Back to topic: When Mystra 3.0 finally regains everything she's lost, will she resurrect those Chosen who died during and after the SP, or will she make new ones?
I got "Quite F'N True" somewhere
Anyways, Mystra will simply return as an exarch of Karsus (if my theory about Karsus is correct).
More likely she will come back as some form of essence with a divine spark, but not quite a deity. Perhaps as some form of guide for Elminster. |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 09:46:17
quote:
Originally posted by Arik
Ah. Yes, that makes sense. Stupid internet failed to provide instant and accurate response to my query. Imagine that.
Really? When you search in google, the very first result you'd see is QUOTED FOR TRUTH.
I was just joking about QuantiFERON-TB.
Back to topic: When Mystra 3.0 finally regains everything she's lost, will she resurrect those Chosen who died during and after the SP, or will she make new ones? |
| Brix |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 09:14:52
quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
I have far from finished it--let alone perfect it.
You must hurry, before even the small rest collapses |
| Markustay |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 06:49:06
Weather I personally think anything is 'broken' matters not.
What matters is weather the current iteration of the realms is lucrative. If so, ignore most of us here, but if not, then perhaps listening to us wouldn't be such a bad idea.
And I truly doubt the teeny, tiny 'pie slice' that is D&D in Hasbro's massive pie could possibly do 20%... I doubt all of WotC (with MtG and Pokemon) tanking could account for that - its the recession. Everyone is suffering, and the first thing hit in tough times are non-essentials (and toys/games sit near the top of that list).
Anyhow, I am sure nearly everyone here who runs/plays D&D (not just fans of the setting) run their own versions of FR, but I am just as sure most of us aware of (and respectful of) the canon lore, regardless of weather we use it or not. what most of us do here is try to discover new ways to use the lore, twisting and bending it in odd directions no one has thought of yet.
It doesn't mean we don't like the canon or don't know it just because we may not use all of it in our own interpretations. Part of the fun of this site is bouncing ideas off of each other. Most of the theories we throw around are purely 'what if' type mental exercises (as in, "how can we make this work without breaking canon?").
I'll never use 98% of the stuff I discuss here, but its fun to think about.
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| D-brane |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 05:08:20
quote:
Originally posted by Erdrick Stormedge
However, nothing will please all the fans who frequent these halls. I am of the opinion that many of these fans are as, or more, invested in their own interpretation of the Realms than the canon version of the Realms.
Can you actually provide evidence of this assumption? Because I've been here at Candlekeep for nearly 7 years, and I can say with a fair degree of confidence that I've encountered just as many scribes who are fervently adherent to the canon Realms, as there are those who focus entirely on their own work for the setting.
quote:
Some scribes at Candlekeep refuse to agree on basic definitions of words in English.
Okay, are you just being intentionally provocative here, or do you sincerely believe this?
quote:
There are many who frequent these halls who categorically reject everything that great developers like you have done in the past 2 1/2 years...
Again, I'm going to have to ask for evidence . . . because just about every scribe I've talked to about the 4E Realms, has said there are some parts they like and some parts they don't. That doesn't really sound like they "categorically reject everything that great developers like you have done in the past 2 1/2 years..." So I have to assume you're just trying to deliberately set out to cause conflict here, by spouting assumptions as facts, or you're simply mistaken in your assumptions.
Either way, some of your prior comments in both this and other threads recently, are really making me think you've got some axe to grind at Candlekeep. Now I'm no moderator, but we really don't need your type here! |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 05:03:11
Ah. Yes, that makes sense. Stupid internet failed to provide instant and accurate response to my query. Imagine that. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 04:53:17
I would assume Diffan means Quoted For Truth. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 04:51:03
I barely understand quantum mechanics and don't have the slightest clue what a qualitative interferon-gamma might be. If Diffy's talkin' about quick fourier transforms then I'm good to go, I can do FFTs in my sleep (and, sadly, have actually done so during exam-cramming week). |
| Dennis |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 04:34:30
NO. It's QuantiFERON-TB. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 04:16:12
Quantum Field Theory? |
| Diffan |
Posted - 09 Feb 2011 : 04:00:16
quote:
Originally posted by Erdrick Stormedge
You rock, btw.
QFT!  |
| Erdrick Stormedge |
Posted - 08 Feb 2011 : 23:45:43
The allusion was apparent before the clarification, Matt.
You rock, btw.
quote:
Originally posted by Matt James
As to my idea, it was a bit of a throwback to this fine website. My intent was to say that in the deepest, most protected halls within Candlekeep, the scribes within maintained and nurtured an intact piece of the weave (and in turn, Mystra). Despite all that was crumbling around them and their way of life, they cared for and helped to bring back to health the Weave-- albeit in a new form. Nothing would be the same, but they managed to save the essence of the weave and thus prevent a complete collapse of their world.
You see, I wanted to parallel the concern and dedication of this website and have it translate to the game. I have far from finished it--let alone perfect it.
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| Erdrick Stormedge |
Posted - 08 Feb 2011 : 23:44:01
quote:
Originally posted by Christopher_Rowe
Do you scribes think there's a way to manage the return of Mystra that satisfies the story demands set up by her most recent death, the bulk of the lore that preceded the Spellplague, and the changes in the world wrought by the Spellplague and the conjunction that returned portions of Abeir to the world?
Christopher, I would like to add that not only is it possible to manage Mystra's return in a way that satisfies the goals you outline above, but it would be easy to do.
FR is a fantasy campaign setting. Anything will work.
(I think Greenwood is working on this now, if EMD! is of any consequence.)
However, nothing will please all the fans who frequent these halls. I am of the opinion that many of these fans are as, or more, invested in their own interpretation of the Realms than the canon version of the Realms.
Some scribes feel that the canon Realms have irreconcilable errors.
Some scribes at Candlekeep refuse to agree on basic definitions of words in English.
Others feel that the setting is in some way 'damaged' by the work of authors and developers that they don't like, and frequently denigrate those individuals.
There are many who frequent these halls who categorically reject everything that great developers like you have done in the past 2 1/2 years...
(And now Hasbro is reporting a nearly 20% drop in Q4 earnings... unrelated, I'm sure, but still...)
So I'm sure whatever Greenwood does will be well received by a majority here. (But not all.)
Regardless, the idea that a significant 'overhaul' is required to bring the One True Spell back to (prominence in?) Faerun is, in my opinion, a direct slap-in-the-face to a great many who have contributed to this awesome, 25 year old sandbox.
(Yeah, yeah... Greenwood's Realms pre-date the OGB...) |
| Matt James |
Posted - 08 Feb 2011 : 23:25:06
As to my idea, it was a bit of a throwback to this fine website. My intent was to say that in the deepest, most protected halls within Candlekeep, the scribes within maintained and nurtured an intact piece of the weave (and in turn, Mystra). Despite all that was crumbling around them and their way of life, they cared for and helped to bring back to health the Weave-- albeit in a new form. Nothing would be the same, but they managed to save the essence of the weave and thus prevent a complete collapse of their world.
You see, I wanted to parallel the concern and dedication of this website and have it translate to the game. I have far from finished it--let alone perfect it. |
| Matt James |
Posted - 08 Feb 2011 : 23:17:33
I had visited the idea of writing a non-canonical adventure regarding it, but nothing that would ever be considered official. |
| Brix |
Posted - 08 Feb 2011 : 22:46:23
quote:
Originally posted by Christopher_Rowe
quote:
Originally posted by Brix
I really can't remember. I had a scroll here that dealt with ressurection of Mystra. Someone mentioned he ran the module at a convention. Maybe one of the James brothers?
Think I found the scroll, but couldn't find a post that read like that. I'll keep digging though.
I couldn't find it as well, but I'm sure it was Matt, maybe over at his website |
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