| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 24 Sep 2006 : 08:09:24
theres the mage/warrior PrC Suel Archanamach listed in one supplement which gives a plot hook of involving the background of this prc with netheril. i was wondering if anyone ahd used this prc in the realms and what culture they tied it to
for that matter has anyone played or dmed with a mage/fighter. if so what was the experience like and how did you balance out your powers. what was the history of your character.... and if it was in 3.0+ edition, what classes/ prcs were used?? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 29 Sep 2006 : 04:08:48
lets say the leaders of house vyshaan etc. I know that in 2ed the elven house leaders were approximately 20th lvl give and take. But again that isnt during the height of elven power (the crown wars) and not the stats for the most powerful house, clan vyshaan. I know clans are bigger than houses and generally have more memebrs and therefore the potential for more powerful ones but still all these stats are 2ed so i would even subtract nearly 10 from the class levels, lol. |
| GothicDan |
Posted - 28 Sep 2006 : 19:29:06
The leaders of the Elven Houses during the First Flowering? Very variable, most likely, and dependent on cultures specific to region, nation, subrace, house history, etc. |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 28 Sep 2006 : 16:52:06
quote:
Originally posted by Beirnadri Magranth
hmm thanks for posting that. im hesitant to use to something from eberron (although sometimes i use things from swords and sorcery) but that class is very interesting. Still spell is really essential for a mounted character or a fighting character in general if s/he is a caster. Does anyone have anyother classes besides incantatrix (or for that matter feats etc.) that eliminate level adjustment to spells for casting with metamagic feats?
Eberron has a PrC called the recaster in the Races of Eberron...it is a race specific PrC (changeling) but it would do nicely (it's only a 5 lv one)
there is a non-WotC metafeat in the Ultimate Feats book named slow spell that makes a spell's casting time (a standard action spell) become a full round action spell...but it reduces another metamagic feat's modifier by -1...to a maximum of +0 modifier (it really works well with non-combat spells and extend spell, like spider climb and darkvision)
that feat to me germinates the idea of "negative metamagic feats"...you take penalities on your spells to lower metamagic modifiers...e.g. like a reverse heighten spell meta-feat...
quote:
Originally posted by Beirnadri Magranth
Oh, and for a sidenote what level usually are leaders of elven houses during the first flowering? I'm wondering because I want to use these classes but I dont want to have them be too high powered.
I would imagine they were near-epic or epic level... |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 28 Sep 2006 : 16:45:28
hmm thanks for posting that. im hesitant to use to something from eberron (although sometimes i use things from swords and sorcery) but that class is very interesting. Still spell is really essential for a mounted character or a fighting character in general if s/he is a caster. Does anyone have anyother classes besides incantatrix (or for that matter feats etc.) that eliminate level adjustment to spells for casting with metamagic feats? Oh, and for a sidenote what level usually are leaders of elven houses during the first flowering? I'm wondering because I want to use these classes but I dont want to have them be too high powered. |
| Bluenose |
Posted - 28 Sep 2006 : 09:29:41
Looked it up once I got the book back.
Knight Phantom prestige class (10 levels):
Requirements - Ride 4 ranks, Still spell feat, proficiency with all martial weapons, ability to cast phantom steed, citizen of Aundair, member of the Knights Arcane.
Progressions: Fast BaB, Good Fort, Poor Ref & Will saves, +1 caster level at every level except 1st
Class benefits: @ 1st level - Cast Phantom steed 1/day/level, no spell failure in light armour; @ 4th, get movement abilities like your Phantom Steed while dismounted 1rd/level/day; at 7th, nearby enemies save or become shaken due to ghostly appearance of caster; at 10th, turn your weapon into brilliant energy (but with a ghostly appearance).
Background flavour is that these are the fast moving element of the Knights Arcane, the ones who get used in emergencies to travel to trouble spots and for raiding behind enemy lines.
Even if you ignore the citizen/member requirements it does look harder to get into than Eldritch Knight, and some of the equirements aren't too useful once you have the class. In the realms it looks like something that a certain elven kingdom that appears in Blackstaff might find useful, or that Silverymoon might use. What I want to look at is the rules for spellcasting while mounted, to see how useful it might be for some of the magic-using kingdoms like Halruaa and Thay. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 27 Sep 2006 : 22:21:34
That was it. I need to hunt that down, as they were telling me it was a lot better balanced than say eldritch knight (which isn't necessarily a bad prestige class, but it could use some tighter restrictions... not that I'd disallow it, but it would make more interesting if it were more "specific"). |
| Bluenose |
Posted - 27 Sep 2006 : 16:02:40
Knight Phantoms if I'm remembering correctly. From the Five Nations sourcebook, a prestige class specific to the Kingdom of Aundair. I'll look it up but I think one of the main requirements was the ability to cast Phantom Steed. I remember thinking that it would make an interesting class for elven light cavalry/spellcasters. |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 26 Sep 2006 : 21:21:05
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
Hey, along these lines, anyone seen the Eberron prestige class which is similar to all these "eldritch Knights" and "spellswords" and "Raumathari Battlemages"? Someone mentioned it on some board one day, it was supposed to have stricter requirements, but it focused on a class that used spells to create their mounts (frack, I can't think of the spell name right now, but I want to say its around 3rd-5th lvl... they're incorporeal mounts.... sounds like night or something)
I kinda know what you are talking about...Phantom Knight? |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 26 Sep 2006 : 21:18:32
Hey, along these lines, anyone seen the Eberron prestige class which is similar to all these "eldritch Knights" and "spellswords" and "Raumathari Battlemages"? Someone mentioned it on some board one day, it was supposed to have stricter requirements, but it focused on a class that used spells to create their mounts (frack, I can't think of the spell name right now, but I want to say its around 3rd-5th lvl... they're incorporeal mounts.... sounds like night or something) |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 19:58:10
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
My idea is much smaller in scale. My intent was to have just a small number of warforged in the Realms. 
that is cool...I should have mentioned that after the Sharn Wall (ending the Phaerimm War) was raised the surviving warforged were put into stasis and have been there since
I used Xothol (the dwarven magic school of Ammarindar) as the point where the Primians and dwarves constructed the anti-phaerimm warmachine and where the warforged were “birthed”...thus why the dwarf magic school was closed and hidden afterwords
(still copy-righted!  )
|
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 19:46:02
quote:
Originally posted by kalin agrivar
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
That thought has crossed my mind, too, and I believe the Sage pondered a similar thing.
roughly, I am working on an idea that my Primians (human progenator/Creator race) had to resort to constructing great war machines/constructs and "invented" the warforged as the perfect warriors to battle the endless phaerimm mind-slave armies with the Sharn accross ruined Netheril (in that time no one has described after the Fall of Netheril and the raising of the Sharn Wall)
and that is copy righted for my Primian project!  (plan to submit the first section once Alaundo gets back  )
My idea is much smaller in scale. My intent was to have just a small number of warforged in the Realms. |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 18:05:59
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
That thought has crossed my mind, too, and I believe the Sage pondered a similar thing.
roughly, I am working on an idea that my Primians (human progenator/Creator race) had to resort to constructing great war machines/constructs and "invented" the warforged as the perfect warriors to battle the endless phaerimm mind-slave armies with the Sharn accross ruined Netheril (in that time no one has described after the Fall of Netheril and the raising of the Sharn Wall)
and that is copy righted for my Primian project! (plan to submit the first section once Alaundo gets back ) |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 17:56:13
quote:
Originally posted by kalin agrivar
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Moradin
Kalin, that info about raumathar constructs have a good grasp in me, too: if you have tha Fiend Folio, take a look in the Maugs (pages 121-123), an inteligent construct mercenary of Acheron. Citing the book: "Scholars... suspect that maugs first served as shock troops in an ancient war between two long-lost empires. In the end, one empire or both discovered some means of transporting the maugs to... the second layer of Acheron..."
This ring some little bells in my mind about Raumathar/Narfell war.
wow..I missed that...I'll need to look that up tonight...
though I know it is on the verge of heresy here , I have been thinking of Eberron's warforged in the Realms...and the possibility of a Realmsian version of the worforged from the ancient past...
That thought has crossed my mind, too, and I believe the Sage pondered a similar thing. |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 17:13:27
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Moradin
Kalin, that info about raumathar constructs have a good grasp in me, too: if you have tha Fiend Folio, take a look in the Maugs (pages 121-123), an inteligent construct mercenary of Acheron. Citing the book: "Scholars... suspect that maugs first served as shock troops in an ancient war between two long-lost empires. In the end, one empire or both discovered some means of transporting the maugs to... the second layer of Acheron..."
This ring some little bells in my mind about Raumathar/Narfell war.
wow..I missed that...I'll need to look that up tonight...
though I know it is on the verge of heresy here , I have been thinking of Eberron's warforged in the Realms...and the possibility of a Realmsian version of the worforged from the ancient past... |
| Chosen of Moradin |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 17:10:41
Kalin, that info about raumathar constructs have a good grasp in me, too: if you have tha Fiend Folio, take a look in the Maugs (pages 121-123), an inteligent construct mercenary of Acheron. Citing the book: "Scholars... suspect that maugs first served as shock troops in an ancient war between two long-lost empires. In the end, one empire or both discovered some means of transporting the maugs to... the second layer of Acheron..."
This ring some little bells in my mind about Raumathar/Narfell war. |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 16:00:01
what I would like to see about Raumathar is their lore about constructs...somewhere I read it was Nar demons vs Raumathar battle magic and constructs...I had an image of the Brothers War in the Magic storyline...kinda like Urza vs Mishra...
I'm using that idea in my project |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 15:56:07
quote:
Originally posted by Chosen of Moradin
I will use the vyshaan idea, too, being the most logical possible. The imaskar is a good option, too. The raumathari already has a PrC, so I will stay with this two options.
Yeah, the description reminded me of what might be in Raumathar, but for some reason the Raumathari Battlemage slipped my mind.
Beirnadri, the Raumathari Battlemage is in Unapproachable East, and information on the Ruamathar in general is in Lost Empires of Faerun, as well as scattered stuff in a lot of 2nd edition sources. |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 15:36:22
I am so ignorant on the eastern parts of faerun. I really need to study the lore of mulhorand etc adn that whole east sea of fallen stars area. but the same thing goes for calimshan and the south. grr. anyway my point is i dont know that much about raumathar so where is this prc thats location specific to that? |
| Chosen of Moradin |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 15:20:30
I will use the vyshaan idea, too, being the most logical possible. The imaskar is a good option, too. The raumathari already has a PrC, so I will stay with this two options. |
| Kalin Agrivar |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 14:07:37
quote:
Originally posted by KnightErrantJR
Personally, the first thing I thought of was Raumathar, since they were martial and warlike and wizards as well. You might even find a practicing master of the art in Almorel, since it was a city of Raumathar before it fell.
that is what I thought too..."another warrior/wizard PrC"...like the spellblade, the Raumathar one, Eldrich Knight |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 13:56:40
Well, from what I read, you could use this for the Vyshaan. I could picture the Ilythiiri or the Vyshaanti having this PrC floating around as well, and they are both "fallen" cultures, so the art would be all but lost in the modern day, having only a few practitioners. I could see it.
In fact, while the book mentions that this class is only learned from reading ancient texts, if it were an elven tradition, there could be a kiira that has the information needed to learn the information about this PrC in it. |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 07:21:13
Why I was thinking about this in general is not the fact that I love magic and wizards but a thread that dealt with the possibel resugence of a vyshaanti prince. He was described as a mage/fighter and I liked the idea of ancient elves in particular to haev that dual proficiency (especially based of the art of the crown war battles in LEoF, with the mage wielding a sword in a duel on the staircase) |
| KnightErrantJR |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 04:33:57
Okay, reread the passage in question (cool of Rich to actually throw some Realms languages in there as examples). So the whole point is that its a warrrior/arcane combination that serves as an assasin/bodyguard for full blown wizards and it comes from an ancient society and thus has to be learned from an old source.
Personally, the first thing I thought of was Raumathar, since they were martial and warlike and wizards as well. You might even find a practicing master of the art in Almorel, since it was a city of Raumathar before it fell. |
| Purple Dragon Knight |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 04:17:48
Rename the Suel Archanamach class to "Mage Killer" and you have the best replacement for the 3.0 Mage Killer class from Magic of Faerun.
3.0 Mage Killer never got an update to 3.5, so if you don't want to fuss and have an official, bonified 3.5 class that has been invented with the same goal in mind, go for Suel Archanamach (sp?)
If you ask me, I'd name the class Netherese Enforcer, and have these guys be the "police force" of Netheril (imagine a squad of ten of these fellows breaking into an outlaw Netherese archmage to bring him to justice... heck, I could even imagine the underworld movements of old Netheril recruiting these "ex-cops" for their anti-mage tactics; men with this training could quickly rise up to power with such revolutionary cells, seen as the 'voices of the people' and the non magic-using lower classes at the time... hmmm...) |
| Archwizard |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 03:01:58
I agree. If the Core rules played with general fantasy archetypes, the classes, prestige classes, feats, spells, etc. could possibly be more easily adapted to other settings. Which is what WotC is doing with the Core anyway, despite claims of it being Greyhawk. We also see setting specific ideas making their way into Core (Red Wizard, Archmage, Thayan Knight, spells from the Spell Compendium, the Eberron races in MMIII & Races of Eberron.) |
| GothicDan |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 02:44:21
I agree with Wooly. I see no need for a default world. And that would also encourage more rules-tinkering for specific worlds to better reflect their idiosyncrasies (a la books like Volo's Guide to All Things Magical). |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 25 Sep 2006 : 01:37:56
quote:
Originally posted by Silvanus79
Hmmm...didn't he also have a cameo in the first (dare I mention this on a real D&D board....) D&D movie? He was one of the mages in the council.
However, back to the Greyhawk/Realms topic, I think it's an excellent choice, putting Greyhawk as a default. Simple reasoning: it keeps the Realms a little more specialized. In other words, Greyhawk has become so...scattered...that nobody recognizes it as true Greyhawk anymore. I would hate for that to happen to the Realms. The thought frightens me.
Okay, my last off-topic post in this thread: I don't see why there has to be a default world, at all... 1E and 2E didn't have them. Really, the only part of Greyhawk that's used by default in the core rulebooks is the Greyhawk deities. |
| Silvanus79 |
Posted - 24 Sep 2006 : 22:16:23
Hmmm...didn't he also have a cameo in the first (dare I mention this on a real D&D board....) D&D movie? He was one of the mages in the council.
However, back to the Greyhawk/Realms topic, I think it's an excellent choice, putting Greyhawk as a default. Simple reasoning: it keeps the Realms a little more specialized. In other words, Greyhawk has become so...scattered...that nobody recognizes it as true Greyhawk anymore. I would hate for that to happen to the Realms. The thought frightens me. |
| Archwizard |
Posted - 24 Sep 2006 : 22:14:46
I found the class interesting, though I don't get a Netheril vibe from it. Perhaps empires like the Shoon (evil-ish empire with magely upperclass with a need for bodyguards), Imaskari (elite guard for the Sorcerer-Kings) Narfell (Anti-Raumathari Battlemages). A possible modern realm for them could be Thay, with the Arcanamach acting as personal anti-wizard guards for various Red Wizards. |
| Beirnadri Magranth |
Posted - 24 Sep 2006 : 19:42:15
hes done alot of 3+ edition work that ive seen at my local game store
but anyway this is all kinda offtopic and i dont know if i cant get away with it, even if it is with a mod. |
