| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 11 Aug 2005 : 15:33:24
My question to you all are the following... What do you and your players like most? To play and fight against monsters (orcs, dragons, demons and the like) or do they favor to be put against the more humanoid NPC (human, elf, dwarf and so on)? If it is a mixture, please explain what mix works for you. |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| BARDOBARBAROS |
Posted - 25 Jan 2008 : 07:53:51
A mixture |
| Brynweir |
Posted - 02 Dec 2007 : 19:35:15
As a player, I like a mixture. The more surprises there are, the more interesting it makes it for me. |
| GRYPHON |
Posted - 02 Dec 2007 : 19:14:38
A mixture of both... |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 02 Jul 2006 : 14:17:08
There are alot of failed opportunities when i DM due to the fact that the common player sees to many threats where there arent any. I have had plenty NPC's killed before they could play out their intended role. Lots of opportunities to improvise new ways of giving them bits of crucial information.
All straight ahead threats arent monsters... If you can reason with them, talk to them or in another way get some roleplaying out of the situation, i will put them in the NPC category. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 17:02:55
quote:
Originally posted by Ergdusch
Question:
Ever happened to any of you that a worked out in every detailed NPC got hacked apart without thinking in mere seconds by your players even though they were suppose to interact with him and get crucial information from?
Somewhat sad - but somewhat amusing as well, seeing them struggle through the rest of the adventure rather aimlessly...
I've never DM'ed, but it's my understanding that PCs often do things like that. 
The easy solution, I would think, would be to simply reuse the details on another NPC, if the plot will allow for it. |
| Ergdusch |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 11:40:42
Question:
Ever happened to any of you that a worked out in every detailed NPC got hacked apart without thinking in mere seconds by your players even though they were suppose to interact with him and get crucial information from?
Somewhat sad - but somewhat amusing as well, seeing them struggle through the rest of the adventure rather aimlessly... |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 04:40:56
quote:
Faramicos
Let me give a clearer definition of "my" idea of a monster. In my mind, a monster is MINDLESS. If it gains intelligence, it stops being a monster and gains some attributes that makes it possible to roleplay, and thus makes it more a NPC than a monster. Just to be clear on the line bewtween monster and NPC... Dragon=NPC, Goblin=NPC, Zombie=Monster, Umber Hulk=Monster... Follow me?
I get your point. Then do you then think of guards, brigands, etc. of "NPC races" as monsters or npc's. I mean, do you use monster as the common term for all straight ahead threats that the pc's don't interact with? Just curious. |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 24 Jun 2006 : 00:34:32
Let me give a clearer definition of "my" idea of a monster. In my mind, a monster is MINDLESS. If it gains intelligence, it stops being a monster and gains some attributes that makes it possible to roleplay, and thus makes it more a NPC than a monster. Just to be clear on the line bewtween monster and NPC... Dragon=NPC, Goblin=NPC, Zombie=Monster, Umber Hulk=Monster... Follow me? |
| Mazrim_Taim |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 22:01:17
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Well, why does the monster have to be mindless? I usually use the monsters the same as the npc's even if the motivations can at times be a little alien.
It doesn't at all. I meant I like to show them, not only how to play smartly, but how to play their own classes well. I play my monsters based on their intelligence scores and any other factors that determine behavior.
The last NPC group I tossed at my PC's were a group of Adventurers dedicated to Bane who were trying to use the PC's to recover a cursed piece of a former artifact. The group of NPC's was almost a mirror setup, with a few variations, to my group of PC's. |
| Fletcher |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 19:16:10
I use a mix of both NPC's and Monsters. I love monsters for the combat, and NPC's generally as people working with/for or directing the monsters. (cult of the dragon and dracolich, Vampires and Necromancer Wizards. Orcish bandits and merchants looking to gain an advantage etc.)
And just often enough i make the villain and mastermind something like a Beholder or Succubus or Treant Druid to break things up and keep them entertained.
|
| Jorkens |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 17:39:46
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
'Tis a good point, and one I think more people need to realize. There's a habit on the parts of many folk to assume monsters just sit around, waiting for random adventurers to come by and slay them. The 3E monster descriptions that we've gotten to date, without the 2E ecology notes, add to that trend.
That's one of the elements I always liked with Dragonlance, that the place of the "monsters" in the world was clearer. I would love a product like the SAGA systems the Bestiary which is one of the best products done by TSR/WotC. |
| Wooly Rupert |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 17:33:20
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
Well, why does the monster have to be mindless? I usually use the monsters the same as the npc's even if the motivations can at times be a little alien.
'Tis a good point, and one I think more people need to realize. There's a habit on the parts of many folk to assume monsters just sit around, waiting for random adventurers to come by and slay them. The 3E monster descriptions that we've gotten to date, without the 2E ecology notes, add to that trend. |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 15:34:27
Well, why does the monster have to be mindless? I usually use the monsters the same as the npc's even if the motivations can at times be a little alien. |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 14:09:14
Precisely. And there is more finece to a well played NPC than to a mindless brute of a monster. Anybody have some experiences with memorable NPC's they would like to share? |
| Mazrim_Taim |
Posted - 23 Jun 2006 : 01:30:58
I like a mix, well. I lean more towards monsters. But I like to throw a very smart band of NPC's at my PC's every once in a while to show them just how powerful a well played class is. |
| Ergdusch |
Posted - 22 Jun 2006 : 11:15:10
quote:
Originally posted by Mace Hammerhand
Mixture 'tis for me, and prolly for my players as well, they haven't really faught any NPCs yet, mainly because I didn't want to... The last time I pitted a group against a worthy adversary the group wined and complained afterwards because I actually played the character to the max, we'll see how the party will fare against their own duplicates when I run "Ravager of Time", because I will play their own selves to the max then also!!!!
Maybe they learn something...like reading the rules themselves!
Nice one! 
To my voting:
I voted the mix. I use them all from Orcs Orges Gnolls to Dragons Demon & Devil to the whole scale of undead to NPC's. Diversity rules!
|
| Alisttair |
Posted - 21 Jun 2006 : 15:49:57
A bit of everytying makes things more interesting. |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 16:59:41
they probably learn something about their own characters. I just arranged a battle against a copy of the group and all of them where surprised with how hard hitting they actually is, if played correctly.
A fun little experiment, enjoyed by both DM and players. |
| Mace Hammerhand |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 13:12:21
Mixture 'tis for me, and prolly for my players as well, they haven't really faught any NPCs yet, mainly because I didn't want to... The last time I pitted a group against a worthy adversary the group wined and complained afterwards because I actually played the character to the max, we'll see how the party will fare against their own duplicates when I run "Ravager of Time", because I will play their own selves to the max then also!!!!
Maybe they learn something...like reading the rules themselves! |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 12:40:44
One thing I have learned is that if I want a villain that I want my players to really hate, humans or elves are usually my best bet. There seems to be something about these races that leaves my players bearing a grudge. Monsters, humanoids and for some reason dwarfs are often well liked even if they are adversaries.
I don't think it comes from some sense of betrayal when its a human villain and I dont play them as worse than monsters so I am not really sure why this happens. I have seen it with several players who never even met each-other; if I want a villain that the players will go out of their way to kill elf or human it is.
Any one else seen the same tendency in their campaigns? |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 09 Jun 2006 : 12:23:06
I have just played a session where they where to assassinate a high priest of Cyric. They didnt know how powerful he realy was, but as they initiated the adventure them selves, i chose not to adapt the power of the encounter to their level. Pointing out to them that the world isnt created for them, but around them, and an encounter they seek themselves can be of all levels of power. They survived, but heavily damaged. 2 headshots saved them. Otherwise they would have been dead, all of them. But the encounter served the purpose of making them uneasy when around enemies in the future as they cant know how powerful i have made them... And they are as powerful as the setting dictates... A great human villain. |
| Jorkens |
Posted - 08 Jun 2006 : 12:47:59
I voted mixture. It is difficult to say which category I use the most in adventures. Humans, demihumans and some humanoids I generally use for intrigue, but a hidden or surprising monster works well in the same adventures. Humanoids and monsters are more common in "quest-type" adventures. However many of these "monster" encounters how ever are potentially non-combat
I have never been a fan of demons as presented in the game so I generally don't base adventures around them. Mostly I like keeping players guessing to a degree and making them a bit unsure on who they're real opponents are. Often I end up winging it and changing the real opponent as the game evolves. |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 23 Aug 2005 : 13:42:15
That is how it should be. Impose paranoia in the players. Makes them more aware of their surroundings. Makes for lots of good RPG... |
| warlockco |
Posted - 22 Aug 2005 : 15:42:18
quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
He he he... That is a lesson learned for them... Dont underestimate ogres just because you have gained some levels yourself.
Quite right, my players have learned to fear their foes when they seem "ordinary." |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 22 Aug 2005 : 14:33:42
He he he... That is a lesson learned for them... Dont underestimate ogres just because you have gained some levels yourself. |
| warlockco |
Posted - 22 Aug 2005 : 13:02:10
My player's didn't quite enjoy their introduction to Ogre Blackguards 
They survived only because they fled the fight. |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 22 Aug 2005 : 12:28:58
I agree... It gives a cool twist and it surprises the characters the first time they meet a snarling orc who turns out to be more than they expected. Give them levels and personal characteristics and a cool NPC is in the making... |
| Sir Luther Cromwell |
Posted - 15 Aug 2005 : 01:03:21
You see, I live with the philosophy that if they can be trained, it will be trained. the 'typical' example of any specie is boring, predictable, and somewhat of a snore. Now obviously, a Bullete with character levels is a bit of a stretch, but creatures that normally wouldn't take levels are interesting enough in that they don't have to.
I mean, who honestly wants to face your average orc? Ok, Orc's with levels in the Barbarian class can be assuming. Orcs with ranger or druid levels, now we're talking. Orcs in Monk levels: my players found them quite amusing.
|
| Shadovar |
Posted - 13 Aug 2005 : 01:39:00
quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
OK... I can follow you. Thanks
No problem. |
| Faramicos |
Posted - 12 Aug 2005 : 15:13:33
OK... I can follow you. Thanks |
