| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 31 Jan 2013 : 15:54:25
I'd like to fill the temple to Gond in Melvaunt in my current campaign with some interesting contraptions and inventions. Anyone have some cool ideas or references to wondrous gondite inventions to present my players? |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Markustay |
Posted - 25 Feb 2013 : 15:20:53
By 1479 DR, we SHOULD have gas-powered street lamps, because RAS thought to use gas (and create piping and direct it) during the War of the Spider-Babe. Why everyone would have just ignored/forgotten about that after it was all over is beyond me.
Here's a thought: What if some natural gas pockets fell out in Plaguelands (or Wild Magic zones - pick your poison)? Can you imagine the strangeness you'd get by using plague-gas to light your lamps? I can think of hundreds of uses for such an in-game (and open-ended) phenomena.
"I swear! The flame actually left the lamp and attacked me!"  |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 25 Feb 2013 : 14:54:03
Whereas I envision Gnomas Edison, a tinker who loves to tinker and who worships Gond rather fervently through his understanding and innovation of craftsmanship and technologies. Bringer of such modest wonders as steam-powered street lamps, mechanical laundry devices, and automated self-resetting mouse traps. While blowing up an army (or all armies) on a battlefield is spectacular stuff, it's the paying subscribers/donators who really sustain Gond's greatest new inventions over time. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 25 Feb 2013 : 14:29:46
Hmmmm... I hadn't thought about usages for that particular bit (until now), but I would probably use both variations to create my 'adventure' situation.
For instance, suppose some ancient Elevn/Sarrukh/Imaskari/etc tome had details of a 'Chime of Draconic Summoning' (a purely magical device), and the CotD caught wind of that. Now, they'd have a great deal of trouble replicating the purely magical effect (being that the magics involved are no longer 'fully operational', or of the 'Elven High Magic' variety), so they enlist the aid of some gnomes/Gondsmen to help build something similar.
So, whereas the original 'ancient artifact' had the ability to lull the dragon into a semi-hypnotic state (perhaps still asleep even) and be able to call it forth (like sleep-walking) and have it be fairly docile (if handled properly), the 'new & improved' Arcanotech device would be like that car alarm - driving the dragons into a rage and having them arrive quite... PERTURBED.
Which is why you need to give gnomes HIGHLY detailed instructions... and make sure they were actually listening to you. They will try to (re)create something to do something irregardless of the specifics or consequences. You know how Genies (and other beings) try to twist the meaning of your 'wish' to their own ends? Gnomes do that sort of thing by accident.
"Why are you so upset? The device killed the enemy army, just as you requested."
"But... but... it killed EVERYONE on the battlefield... including my OWN army!!!"
Ohhhh... you didn't want that? Why didn't you tell me?"
Thats kinda how I picture Tinker gnomes. They're dangerous because they are so damn oblivious. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 24 Feb 2013 : 22:54:14
Your variation is as intriguing as mine.
The Realms seems to often emphasize the classic Krynn-inspired (and dangerously incompetent) "crazed gnome technologist" stereotype, basically the absent-minded eccentric brilliant scientist multiplied by the usual D&D extremes. These fellows are interested in devices which can accomplish a task, and how that task is accomplished, but they are utterly unconcerned with the practical usefulness or application of that task ... complexity always seems to trump efficiency.
While crazed gnomish tinkerers who build explosive-steam-powered wristwatches are entertaining (and certainly do represent part of Gond's faithful), I can't see them really accomplishing anything truly revolutionary except by pure accident. The Gondsmen of the Realms for the most part must be similar to technological innovators of our world - that is, they don't just build a device to do something because they can, they build it because it's necessary and productive and helpful (even if they need to artificially stimulate or create the need). Surely the race of gnomes must be able to produce an Archimedes, Babbage, Edison, Ford, or Zefram Cochrane? Even a Scheele or Paracelsus would be remarkable. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 24 Feb 2013 : 22:28:43
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
And what might happen when two disagreeable dragons should arrive simultaneously? Or ten, or twenty?
They'd have a late night dragon rampaging party/battle!
Ah, your intend is for it so be more of an annoying alarm. Such a pendulum device needs to be highly portable to ensure future uses though, because it would likely be dragonsmashed. I was thinking of more of a sonorous sleep like effect tailored to dragons, hence Soothing Pendulum...
Meanwhile the cultists could try to enter their lairs and secure their dragon hoards... Sure they'd need some knowledge of their lairs lay out beforehand to even be remotely succesful, and they are unlikely to know exactly how far the Draconic Soothing Pendulum can reach.
The truly brazen or confident wearers in purple then confront the tired dragon on its return to its lair, offering even more opportunities to expand its hoard if it turns dracolich or denying them a large part of their current hoard. They could further remind them that future periods of annoying but mesmerising gong sounds would be removed aswell upon turning dracolich. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 24 Feb 2013 : 21:03:53
quote:
Bladewind
I'm using the Cult of the Dragon, and a dragon attracting device would be highly desirable ... to easily contact dragons ... As undead they'd be immune to the draconic resonance effect. Excellent.
Undead are not, however, immune to wrathful dragons who - after enduring weeks of relentless, incessant, distracting, intolerable day-and-night gongalongagonging - respond to the "summons" in a bit of an unrested and unhappy state. Consider it less a magical effect than a psychological one ... not unlike a car alarm summoning angry neighbours after 2d12 hours.
[Edit]
And what might happen when two disagreeable dragons should arrive simultaneously? Or ten, or twenty? |
| Markustay |
Posted - 24 Feb 2013 : 18:43:52
I don't want to over-do the tech in my current campaign, but I have allowed it now to some small degree, but I'm still not sure if I want the steampunk 'clockwork' tech or the magitech variety. I do like all of your ideas above, though.
My biggest problem ATM is that I am using PF rules, and those gnomes don't really mesh well with the 'Tinker Gnome' concept. Right now I am toying with the idea of having the Grey Gnomes (ones that have gotten 'The Bleaching') be the same as the Svirfneblin, and just move those to the Shallowdark (not the Underdark at all really - more like the 'sub-cellars' beneath the cellars). I can picture them in The Warrens of Waterdeep.
I've also given most of the 'tech' over to the Dwarves (one particular group of them, anyway), and assigned the Halflngs the 'Tinker' role, so the standard D&D/FR Gnomes don't have a lot of room ATM. I'm thinking Paizo had the right idea, and turned their gnomes back into the 'magical illusionists' they were originally. Now that everyone can do everything in newer editions, they seem to have lost their place. They've become very redundant with Halflings.
Anyhow, I plan to give some of these 'toys' to my Duargar (who are also a 'shallowdark' race now... I'm not big on the Underdark... not very useful as is). I had the airships run by gnomes, but maybe I'll say the Duergar build them... they just have a fear of flying (so it's mutually beneficial situation to have the Grey Gnomes run some of their affairs). My Grey Gnomes are more like Jawas. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 24 Feb 2013 : 17:18:51
Ed's latest Forging the Realms article ominously refered to the possible threat of extravagant gnomish inventions created to maim and kill. If gnomes ever turned their cheerful ingenuity towards trapbuilding they could swiftly rule large swaths of the underdark and faeruns surface.
If I'd ever run with this premise I'm thinking gnomes would eventually be able to construct unstable multibombs, explosive threats that can raise havok on city level scales; tireless gondsmen militia, armed with highspeed spikedchains; and/or elite commando gnomes armed with multitools able to demolish anything given enough time, and easy ways of transporting them behind enemy lines through air, (sub)terranean or aquatic high-ways. |
| Calrond |
Posted - 23 Feb 2013 : 21:59:22
I'd imagine Gond's opinion of the use of his devices would be similar to the Lawful Neutral Mystra's opinion on the use of magic. Namely, they don't particularly care how you use it as long as you are advancing its use and not limiting others' use of it. Even in magical or mechanical "arms races", Mystra/Gond would be given more power by the overall use of the contents of their portfolios being expanded. So it's not too much of a stretch to think that Gond is not overly concerned with the implications of his inventions. The gods are playing a long game, and if one city gets obliterated by one of Gond's inventions, it would probably still lead to more reverence and more power for Gond in the long term. (Nuclear weapons being a reasonably accurate RL analogy.) |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 14 Feb 2013 : 14:21:28
That version would be perfect for my current campaign. I'm using the Cult of the Dragon, and a dragon attracting device would be highly desirable for them. They'd use it to easily contact dragons, confiscate hoards and blackmail them into service with it. As undead they'd be immune to the draconic resonance effect. Excellent.
Liquid Ether Vial
Price 100 gp; Weight -
This semiliquid ethereal stuff is collected or conjured by intrepid planewalkes and conjurers in crystal vials. When imbibed the user is able to maintain larger summoning gates and can summon an extra extreplanar creature whenever casting a summon or calling spell in the next minute.
Etheroscope
Price 750 000 gp; Weight 15 000 lbs
This gargantuan glasssteel and brass optical device, consisting of turnable platform with multiple adjustable lenses and antennae fitted on mountaintop towers, is meant to pierce the phlogiston and see through the ethereal into distant spaces. It effectively works as a scry device with a casting time of eight hours that can cross planar boundaries, but it can provide only extremely distant views (as if at least 5 miles away from the intended target) of the ethereal landscapes it projects on its central projection surface. The device is constantly haunted by lost souls when active. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 13 Feb 2013 : 23:56:43
How about dragon summoning bells?
Large cast gong bells which reverberate on nearly subsonic frequencies perceptible to dragons (and a few other creatures) but not to most people (aside from making them feel mildly angry and nauseated). Attach said bells to a steam-powered metronome device which can beat them regularly and ceaselessly for weeks at a time.
Insert fuel, turn device on, wait for dragon to appear. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 13 Feb 2013 : 14:44:23
Vitrificator
Price 785 gp; Weight 8
The Vitrificator is a box weared as a backpack. It's attached with two flexible tubes that follow the arms. As a full round action, one end can absorb and suck in (semi)fluid alchemical substances (acid, entangling goo, liquor) while the other end spit out glass in various colors a round later. The user can shape the glass into useful objects if he has any skill in craft(glassblowing), profession(brewer) or has the brew potion feat.
Soothing Pendulum
Price 5 gp; Weight -
This jewelry is made with special electrum - thinaum alloy and soothes the mind when in motion. As a full round action, everyone within 10ft of the wielder gets a +2 to will saves and concentration checks as long as the motion of the pendulum is not interrupted. Some temples of Gond have enormous versions of Soothing Pendulums in perpetual motion in their grand halls (5000 gp; 80 lbs). |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 07 Feb 2013 : 23:54:27
Gond would only see the elegance with which the tools of war achieve their goals, their consequences are fully in the hands of those that have the intent to use them. Negative consequences are to be observed and seen as opportunities to improve the usefullness of the initial design.
Gond is a curious diety. The ritual Sacred Unmaking, where the clerics have to build all things in two's so they can wreck their newewst inventions, is an example of his destructive side. Some engineering can only be commenced after you demolish all obstacles on the projectgrounds (blow up a tower to build a new better one).
Just because I had so much fun using the inventions last session I'll prepare another one for the next:
Orgonic field perturbation inducer
Price 12000 gp; Weight 1200 lbs
This huge brass box is usually carried about on a cart or placed in the center of a flower garden. It allows plantlife within a radius of 100 feet to interact with creatures as if using a reversed speak with plants spell. Most plants are docile and rarely speak, but some flowers (especially carnivorous ones) have bad mouths and foul tempers. Plants also get more vigorous, essentially gaining a movement speed ranging from 5 to 20 ft dependant on their form as long as they stay in the perturbation field. They gain a slam attack (usually for 1d2 damage as a tiny plant). Some jungle plants under influence of an orgonic perturbation field inducer are rumored to have gained enough intelligence to allow the plants spellcasting, so beware of placing one near exotic looking plants. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 07 Feb 2013 : 06:03:30
Not to decry Ed, but I have trouble accepting Gond-the-God being so naive and unconcerned about the consequences of his inventions, especially if he takes them as seriously as we (people who regularly witness the power of science and technology) would expect. Surely Gond must realize the (destructive) potential of things like smokepowder howitzers and clockwork soldiers wearing steam-powered assault armor ... and the (destructive) potential of his own worshippers? Moreover, Gond is but one god, and not all the other gods (or their followers) would be blind to the possible applications of Gond's work. |
| Darkmeer |
Posted - 07 Feb 2013 : 04:40:31
I have lots of notes, and here's what I have in my notes from the So Saieth Ed:
quote:
So Saieth Ed
Lantan is of course 'on the list' of places to deal with, eventually (watch upcoming Realmslore columns for more about a different thus-far-neglected island), but in general I see two factors at work governing what fantastic gadgets from Lantan get into circulation: price (how many folk in the Realms will pay serious coin for, say, a clockwork toy, or even a clock when the sun and local religious observances govern daily events, and in daily society no one makes or keeps appointments "by the minute" or "on the hour"? palaces and temples have their own timekeeping, and no one else lives that way) and self-control: really powerful weapons (beyond individual battlefield firearms and the printing press, which have already found their ways onto the mainland) are probably either kept on Lantan, or are sent out of Lantan only under strict conditions (like having a Lantanna "minder" with them at all times, under the fiction that the gadget in question is so complex that it will only keep working under the continuous supervision and maintenance of a trained Lantanna. In other words, young maverick inventors of Lantan are going to be restricted in what they can export by their long-seeing seniors (who thanks to the religion of Gond have the moral authority to do so).
If you're at all interested in steampunk, a within-Lantan campaign might be the way to go, and I'd put it on two levels: secret inventions of sophistication being kept within families (just as the noble houses of Waterdeep show off some things at revels, but keep others as dark secrets), and a public (that is, openly within Lantan) mechanization that's about at the level of what Phil and Kaja Foglio have depicted in their marvellous GIRL GENIUS comics, with machines known as "clanks" and whatnot.
Whether or not the published Lantan ends up looking like this or not, Lantan is the "sleeping giant" on the Realms scene, with the potential to rise to become an alternative to magic, but easily kept down to the status of "oddity" if players and DMs don't want technology to play that large a role in their games.
And even more, not from Ed.
From Here we have the 2e Clockwork Gondsman, something I'm currently experimenting with to do some horrible fun things with a group of PC's soon.
So, Lantan has the current proto-rennaissance tech, even into some proto-industrial revolution tech plus magic (makes me think of the Iron Kingdoms, personally), but there is a perpetually medieval civilization as Ayrik says. Remember Gond is the god of invention, under Oghma, who limits what Gond is able to show his followers/give someone an epiphany. Oghma lets Gond have Lantan as a testing ground, once it survives there, it can survive anywhere, thus the rate of change is really slow on the mainland, but can be excruciatingly fast or proceed moderately on Lantan, dependent on the GM.
And my Gond Bit comes Faiths and Avatars, shown thusly:
quote:
Originally printed in Faiths and Avatars on Page 62
Gond is always making new things. He often presses Oghma for their
release into the mortal world without thinking through completely the
impact they will have. He is fascinated with making the theoretical real and either does not consider or often does not care about the implications for the use of his inventions and discoveries.
|
| Ayrik |
Posted - 05 Feb 2013 : 00:05:08
Another possible reason for perpetually-medieval civilization could be wizards and magic. The common belief held by everybody - except for some crazed adventurers and minority populations of insanely reckless gnomish inventors - is that magic offers the solution to all problems, magic can accomplish anything, magic is the art and science of Toril. Steam engines and clockworks and smokepowder have merits, indeed might be seen as a few outstanding examples of otherwise fruitless tinkering, but technology in general is seen as something of an idle curiosity with very little useful potential.
The gods needn't work to suppress and destroy anything their followers can barely imagine. And they'd have to wait in line behind the wizards, nobility, guilds, and other social orders who would oppose any technologies which challenge the status quo.
Things might change since literacy is apparently now widespread and the Realms seem poised at the brink of a Renaissance age. I desperately hope we don't see Faerūn turned into yet another trendy-generic Steampunked magitech world. |
| MrHedgehog |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 23:34:40
I think a lot of inventions would be destroyed by gods' clergy who don't like new things or change. Shar, Talos, Grumbar.... otherwise the world wouldn't remain medieval perpetually. If Gondites invented something unbalancing like guns good and neutral gods might want it snuffed out too. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 22:29:04
I must admit I've never thought of D&D settings going meta to the point of recursive self-reference within strange loops.
Perhaps the inhabitants of D&D worlds could learn the secrets of our world by piecing together the fragmentary ancient schema "clues" scattered throughout their universe? Architects-of-the-universe sorts of stuff. Or if not the actual creator(s) then at least all the subcontractors and inspectors (like Ao?) who've appeared to enforce local ordinances and bylaws. |
| Quale |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 21:59:25
I've considered that as one possibility. A cosmic competition, who discovers the dark, becomes a new power of the game. Organized by a sect called the Fool's Guild (who really wanted to attract high-ups to their ranks). Inspired by the comic in the last issues of Dungeon. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 20:26:53
Haha "gyoxchuggi" is awesome ... I've encountered analogues of your ancient schema in my gaming, bearing cryptic markings (lost names of Abyssal lords?) like "G7GAX" and "robnard". Perhaps ancient schema were scattered across countless alternate Primes, and can only be properly deciphered once scholars have painstakingly gathered all the pieces from gaming tables across the multiverse? |
| Quale |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 19:44:08
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
Any chance you can elaborate on the function of both 'ancient schema' and 'Babbage engines' in terms of *your* campaign, Quale?
Babbage engine is on display in the Hands of Time shop in Sigil. Designed by a Mathematician and built by the Teknists (homebrew sect), it's their response to the celestial etheroscope and planology (they consider it pseudoscience). The engine is not yet fully operational at its highest functions. Timekeepers at the shop are searching for a suitable gear spirit to increase its efficiency, or even a moigno that could be lured to enhance the calculations.
Ancient schema is a thinaun tablet, the cornerstone of the Hyper House (homebrew post-Faction War Cipher HQ). It can't be deciphered. Master of the spirit who placed it there, said that one symbol resonates the word ''gyoxchuggi''. But he turned Anarchist and disappeared (retired pc actually).
Autopantograph I think is like a copy machine, something between Grundlethum's Automatic Scribe and Halavar's Universal Pantograph. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 17:02:40
Wait... Perhaps the Thaumometer is the same device used in Pratchetts Discworld:
Thaumometer
Price 375 gp; Weight - lbs
This wooden and mithril cube can detect exact locations and quantities of magic. Most detect magic through a complex tangle of antenna inside the cube that penetrate up to 5ft of earth, 1 ft of alloyed metal or an inch of copper. Eight dials of each magic school point towards the strongest auras of their repective school of magic in a 30 foot radius. Otherwise it functions like a wand with 100 uses of detect magic. It overloads (2d6 electricity damage, refles save for half) when more than 5 strong magic auras are detected at once. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 16:45:08
I want them all explained!
Thaumometer
Price 1300 gp; Weight 3 lbs
This wooden and mithril device can detect the exact quantities of metals in (metamagically enhanced) alloys. The percentages of volume of bronze and copper could be measured from a electrum alloy, for example. Most have a pair small antenna that penetrate up to 5ft of earth, 1 ft of alloyed metal or an inch of copper. Holding it in place for a couple of rounds, it can reveal the amount of metals, the total mass of the sample and finally the volume percentages of each detected metal on three scalelines fitted in the handle. It can be tuned to specific alloys, such as bronze (copper and tin), brass (copper and zinc), steel (iron and carbon) and mithril (iron and mithral), usually to detect imperfections in constructs. |
| The Sage |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 15:08:15
Any chance you can elaborate on the function of both 'ancient schema' and 'Babbage engines' in terms of *your* campaign, Quale? |
| Quale |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 08:31:31
I don't know, I just listed the devices my artificer pc has heard of so far. I think it's a wand that channels energy from the paraplane of magma. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 08:18:57
lol, I sort of expected that it turns things into (al)chemically hardened glassy ceramics, sure. I meant what form does it take? Is it a powder, liquid, grenade, seige weapon, wand, sword, cannon, wagon, ship, castle, kiln, trap, monster, symbol, power word, ritual, curse, spell, furry garment? |
| Quale |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 07:55:58
it can transform certain alchemical substances (fluids) into glass |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 05:13:12
What is a vitrificator ... an alchemical petrification/mummification substance? a dessicating weapon/device? a superior kind of kiln/forge? |
| The Masked Mage |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 02:37:22
i like the tempest prognosticator - very amusing |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 04 Feb 2013 : 02:18:16
Or the unstable vehicle the autopantograph.
Autopantograph
Price 300 000 gp; Weight 9500 lbs.
Autopantographs are usually railed metal carriages driven by a lightning engine and magnetic conductors fitted on the roof. These coaches can only house a single rider, but a fully charged vehicle is capable of great speed (120 ft with clumsy maneuverability) and drag power (str 40), but are quickly exhausted (losing 30ft speed and 10 str power each hour). They are tentatively used to quickly transport wagons of goods along railtracks in gnomish mines with dangerous conditions. Most tend to explode in a violent shower of electric balls and superheated metals after a few years of service. Miniature autopantographs are rumored to have been designed to make use of this unstableness. Handcrosbow fitted, spiderlegged and wheeled autopantographs are gnomish inventions serving as mobile sentries with an electric suicide bomb attack. |
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