| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 01:58:53
Yeah, the material we use to make countertops. Although most of our "absolute black granite" is synthesized through industrial fuse-sintering processes and is actually much harder and tougher than natural slabs of black granite (which is still quarried, although unethical producers use chemical stains/dyes to sell inferior granite as premium black granite).
I've noted a lot of black granite (wizard) towers scattered around the land, obviously because it's a richly symbolic trope. The Boareskyr Bridge is described as being carved from a monolithic chunk of black granite, as are various monuments and "pagan" idols and elf droppings scattered in every hidden corner of the land.
But where does it come from? Exactly where in the Realms is this stone mined and quarried? It's heavy and tends to be brittle, so is probably used "locally" because transport by ship and wagon is sure to damage some percentage of this valuable cargo.
Is it found in quantity anywhere under the sands of the Anauroch, in Vaasa, in the general proximity of Mirabar or elsewhere in the North? I ask because I'd like to plop a cold black granite fortress on top of an intimidating little mountain range. A fortress of black stone, rusted iron spikes, skeletons, icicles, and mud-trampled snow ... it'll be glorious to behold. Er, for no particular reason, hehe, just because.  |
| 30 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 16 Feb 2013 : 03:38:54
Hey just get a Bard with a Lyre of building *G*
Clearly magic of many kinds can speed construction or construct a structure.
quote:
The lyre is also useful with respect to building. Once a week its strings can be strummed so as to produce chords that magically construct buildings, mines, tunnels, ditches, or whatever. The effect produced in but 30 minutes of playing is equal to the work of 100 humans laboring for three days. Each hour after the first, a character playing the lyre must make a DC 18 Perform (string instruments) check. If it fails, she must stop and cannot play the lyre again for this purpose until a week has passed.
If you get a very good Bard can play though the entire week *EG* |
| The Masked Mage |
Posted - 16 Feb 2013 : 02:49:18
By far the simplest way to get what you are after is magic. If you have it then use it. The biggest expenses in construction are labor and supplies. Both can be easily supplied by magic. Depending how far back you go in rules, the spells might not even be hard to come by. "Create Matter" would accomplish almost everything you need done all on its own, no hassle. Even a moderate level wizard could create sufficient materials to create a castle in a matter of weeks (compared to months or years of mining a quarry). Combined with simple stone shape and telekinesis spells and your castle is done in no time. If you've got elves, just grow your building.
If you are seriously thinking about interstellar transportation of large scale goods / buildings, then I'd suggest there is only one way to accomplish this with "reasonable" prices. That way would be the Arcane, or by extension the Reigar as proxies of the Arcane. I imagine it would not be the first time either groups have responded to a request, especially since both have colonies on worlds lacking the natural supplies to construct their holdings. |
| coach |
Posted - 15 Feb 2013 : 18:00:28
Castle Perilous lists it's material as "dark stone" bound in iron but since it was raised in one night by demons hard to say what the material is |
| coach |
Posted - 15 Feb 2013 : 17:58:27
The Damaran Gate and Vaasan Gate are made of granite (per The Rite)
The Granite Tower is made of "dark black granite" (per The RotA trilogy)
Ancient unnamed elven city located in the Novularond Mountains is made of granite and marble buildings (per Ruin)
that's three canon references located in the Cold Lands region, safe to say Vaasa/Galenas might be a source |
| Markustay |
Posted - 12 Feb 2013 : 00:44:21
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
<snip> ...and Zhengyi's Tower Perilous.
Otherwise known as 'Chrenshinibon East'? 
I just thought of something - maybe Chrenshinibon was really just Zengyi trying to combine the Castle Perilous with a Cinabon franchise. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 11 Feb 2013 : 21:19:49
Mwoohaha the Citadel of the Raven, of course. Darkhold too, I would presume, why not?
Interestingly found in Melvaunt near the Moonsea. Not too far off from the Bloodstone lands and Zhengyi's Tower Perilous. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 10 Feb 2013 : 17:20:53
Found a thread referencing that the Dragonspire Mountains are quarried for Black Granite. I subsequently suspect that many parts of the Citadel of the Raven are carved from the stuff. |
| xaeyruudh |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 22:11:30
sleyvas wins.
Good thing I wasn't drinking anything when I opened this thread... |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 21:24:36
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Large-scalar fixed structures, things like castles and pyramids, involve tremendous mass and stresses distributed across many smaller pieces in carefully balanced ways, gravitational forces and even the foundation/terrain are vital components of large structures. A pyramid would simply crumble apart if you somehow gently rested it on a different flat facing.
I'm not saying it's impossible. Castles float in space and the astral and the inner planes. But they are constructed differently, always require magic to sustain their integrity, and they are probably impossible to land on a planet without sustaining massive damage.
Well stresses clearly can be a factor, of the first few pyramids had a few issues in construction as I recall. Castle building the same as pyramid becomes a better skill after the learning curve. You only need to hire an expert and the chance of flawed construction are low. |
| sleyvas |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 20:40:46
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
quote:
Kentinal
Also you can just get dress stone to use as facing, done well no one would not know the difference.
Those rock-humping dwarves would know.
just because you saw a dwarf female with a phallic shaped, well polished stone implement doesn't mean that every woman that also met said dwarf female didn't order a similar implement the following week after they had their little party. Nearly every race in Faerun includes some rock-humpers. Of course, dwarf females consider it some kind of religious experience, but that's another story. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 19:50:17
Large-scalar fixed structures, things like castles and pyramids, involve tremendous mass and stresses distributed across many smaller pieces in carefully balanced ways, gravitational forces and even the foundation/terrain are vital components of large structures. A pyramid would simply crumble apart if you somehow gently rested it on a different flat facing.
I'm not saying it's impossible. Castles float in space and the astral and the inner planes. But they are constructed differently, always require magic to sustain their integrity, and they are probably impossible to land on a planet without sustaining massive damage. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 19:14:41
If you were building a pyramid from materials gotten from space, wouldn't it be easier - especially using SJ rules - to simply build the damn thing is space and tow it to where you want it? (and now I am picturing ready-made pyramids dropping from the sky).
And now this has me thinking - why not construct something in the Earth Elemental Plane? You have plenty of free labor - Earth Elementals! It solves all your problems - you just have to have magic available that can shift that thing back to your plane when its done. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 18:59:25
Most spelljammers carry about the same cargo tonnage as standard ships, and travel times between worlds are roughly comparable to travel times between continents. Although the ride might arguably be a little bumpier overall, which could damage some of the cargo.
I've never built a stone structure like a castle or pyramid. But it seems to me that (regardless how detailed the plans might be) there would be advantages to having quick communication between the construction guys and the quarry guys. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 18:56:00
If you take into account 'towing' (which with RW physics, something quite tiny CAN tow something quite enormous in space, so long as the tiny thing had 'thrust', and the other isn't held in place by other forces, like gravity). Even in (water) shipping it works this way, but to a much lesser degree; HUGE barges are towed by small boats, and I've personally seen a fairly decent sized boat being towed by a jetski.
SO, the Mercane (or whoever) find a big chunk of granite/marble/whatever in space (or have it moved to space by several vessels or one operating over time), and then they tow it to where they need to go. The normal cargo-capacity of vessels becomes a non-issue.
Now delivery - thats a whole 'nother problem. Be careful to stipulate how you want that handled, otherwise you may have a granite mountain dropped on your head after your final payment is made. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 18:44:18
Mercanes would atleast know of a location where natural black granite is quarry-able, albeit off-planet.
Though I don't know how spelljamming ships work to know their use as granite block transport, I think having enough lift to escape the atmosphere would make hauling black granite seem like a relatively easy task. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 18:30:51
quote:
Bladewind
Also, Mercanes will sell Black Granite if your price is right.
Do you mean they specifically sell black granite, or that they sell black granite under the umbrella of "everything"?
I can't see spelljammer (ship) transport being very efficient for such quantities of stone, unless just moving it between two distant lands on Toril (which is really still just ship transport, albeit much faster). Although "local" spelljamming does invite a new array of adventure possibilities. |
| Bladewind |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 18:19:41
A fire mage might have found a 'recipe' for black granite manufacture. With enough heat, water and stone a fire mage can forge his own rocks with just the right atributes. Add spells of transmutation and a mage can get as gaudy as he wants with his building blocks.
Also, Mercanes will sell Black Granite if your price is right. |
| xaeyruudh |
Posted - 25 Jan 2013 : 17:13:14
I like this thread. I don't recall seeing any serious exploration of rock types/whereabouts in Realmslore.
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Props for color-coordinating their lair - good fashion sense is so hard to find in dungeon design these days. 
 Classic.
quote:
And now I'm picturing a tiefling version of Tim Gunn clapping his hands and telling laborers, "make it work people!"
Oh, man. You had to put Tiefling Tim Gunn in my head. My imagination will never be the same.
Ahhh! I have the Markusmind. Make it stop! |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 23 Jan 2013 : 01:48:50
Odd you should mention that. I teased the PCs relentlessly about their fashion sense and décor (through a pair of effeminate NPC bard-architects they had hired) ... mostly because of their acerbic responses. They firmly maintained the golem was just better "camouflaged" to gain combat advantage. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 23 Jan 2013 : 01:29:56
Interior design just become or hire an illusionist. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 23 Jan 2013 : 01:21:10
Props for color-coordinating their lair - good fashion sense is so hard to find in dungeon design these days.
And now I'm picturing a tiefling version of Tim Gunn clapping his hands and telling laborers, "make it work people!"
Extreme Dungeon Makeover: Realms Edition |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 19:43:12
My players were once greatly impressed by a module's description/artwork of walls made from slabs of glossy black marble with veins of silver, emerald, and ruby. Impressed enough to spend exhorbitant resources and effort in obtaining a large quantity for their own projects, and eventually construct a matching marble golem guardian. |
| Markustay |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 19:06:14
Lets see... do people in the Reals import marble/stone from 'far away'?
quote:
Greyspace, pg.50 - a SJ product about the GH setting:
"Whatever process or catastrophe shaped Ginsel into its present form had a strange effect on the planet's geology. Forms of hard, metamorphic rock similar to marble are native to Ginsel the likes of which have never been seen anywhere in the universe. <snip> Rumors claim that one entire wall of the palace in the city of Rauthaven on Toril is made of Ginsel Marble; knowledgeable stoneworkers deny this is possible, because the value of so much rock would be immeasurable."
Apparently, people from FR have been known to import their stone/materials from VERY far away.
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
True marble is almost always a light colour, ranging from gleaming or translucent pure white through pieces of the rainbow towards brown-grey/gray*, blue-grey/gray*, or blue-black. Most varieties have veins of precious metals, crystal flakes, or nodes of other minerals irregularly submerged within them which sometimes "leech" darker colours into the adjacent marble stone; sometimes creating striking dark contrasts.
This is brilliant - fantasy marble could contain veins of mithril, adamantium, etc, and also bits of fantasy crystal/quartz/semi-precious stones in it.
I'm picturing a royal blue marble with veins of Mithril in it now.  |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 19:03:14
Looked at spell list, if you do not want to go the the best source I have a different way to do this.
Stone wall though the stonewall is thin, but then you can stone shape it. All you need as a component is Arcane Material Component A small block of granite. After you make your first stone wall of black granite, You can Sore shape it into components of more small blocks of black granite and build your wall.
These are lower level spells as well *Grin* |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 18:19:40
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
quote:
Kentinal
Also you can just get dress stone to use as facing, done well no one would not know the difference.
Those rock-humping dwarves would know.
Hire some of them to do the work *wink* |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 18:14:06
quote:
Kentinal
Also you can just get dress stone to use as facing, done well no one would not know the difference.
Those rock-humping dwarves would know. |
| Kentinal |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 18:08:17
Well it does depend on level and degree of power one has.
Also you can just get dress stone to use as facing, done well no one would not know the difference.
Teleport object, 50 pounds per level, a 15th level can teleport 750 pounds 75 cubic feet. That should be enough for a days work.
As for dealing with the locals, a deal might be made, even not should have enough defensive and offensive power to deal with any that does not want to make a deal. |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 17:16:52
There are, of course, some difficulties involved in moving such a quantity of stone.
Consider the awesome Getty Center near Los Angelos, California. It is primarily constructed of 30" (76cm) cubes of quarried travertine, each weighing about 250lbs (115kg). The entire castle-like structure used some 16,000 tons (14,500 metric tonnes) of stone and basically took over a decade to complete. How much stone can a wizard and his spells and pets carry? That's a lot of interplanar trips.
The inner planes are also home to some nasty critters. Natives of Elemental Earth tend to be unwelcoming to interlopers who poach or harvest the resource. Elementals are far more of a problem than local kobolds and trolls. |
| Jeremy Grenemyer |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 07:26:08
quote:
Originally posted by Ayrik
Damn those rock-humping dwarves, taking the mystery out of everything!
I hasten to add a dwarf might be impressed by the stone, but he or she would be equally unimpressed with a wizard who can't be bothered to go and find good stone the right way.
Why reach beyond the world for what's already underfoot? (Well, somewhere underfoot.) |
| Ayrik |
Posted - 22 Jan 2013 : 07:19:04
Damn those rock-humping dwarves, taking the mystery out of everything! |
