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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 05 Aug 2020 :  11:36:43  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Thankyou for the thankyou

As long as there is new lore to discover in the novels I'm fairly certain I wont burn out.

I'm sorely tempted to skip the RAS novels from this point. I'm reading the novels to discover lore I can use and twist beyond the usual interpretation and RAS novels just aren't worth the effort for the 1 page of lore i commonly find in them.

Loved spellfire though, tons of information about the dalelands, lots of room to expand the cult of the dragon in the dalelands and to setup a zhentarim infiltration into the Sembian cell which might help explain the later north south split in the cult (1370 onwards) as the cult is supposed to hate the zhentarim.

And if you feel like it you could even double check my homework and make sure I got everything.

The Gencon seminar on saturday has me even more convinced that novels (and sourcebooks) should not be taken as read and there is plenty of room for interpretation in any lore we discover.

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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1180 Posts

Posted - 05 Aug 2020 :  12:19:59  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Kyre was a bit of a fascinating figure...I do wonder how she and other agents of Moander in the Realms got infected in the first place. It indicates she is some sort of planar traveller and got infected on another plane of existence where Moander is still strong? I need to re-read the book to refresh my memory.
I don't know how the Beholder got infected, but I love how Moander and Phalse's rivalry is brought up and still I don't understand why they would work together in the project or what Phalse's motivations are in creating Alias and her sisters. Beyond evil for evil's sake because it got him killed (not on his home plane so he's still alive) and the benefit was just a decent sellsword that he could have had for 50 silver pieces from the Flaming Fist or some such...
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 05 Aug 2020 :  12:54:58  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'm probably going to make kyre infected in faerun because that's what everyone is interested in (faerun). It is possible that kyre could have been doing what Alias did and spent all of 1357 searching out bases of moanders cultists and got infected there. Didn't know the beholder was a moanderite as well.

I'm going with phalse was actually a stooge of Flattery. Flattery was an archmage of immense power (reactivating a netherese enclave) and had allies in the abyss (or so he claimed). So phalse pretends to be working for someone while actually hiding that he is a free agent while truly hiding that he works for flattery (which else would know all about Finder than his own simulacrum).

Flattery wants to kill finder and the whole wyvernspur clan, but I'm wondering if he wouldn't also blame the harpers and so want to destroy them from the inside with agents that are awesome bards but totally obedient

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 05 Aug 2020 :  15:54:09  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
So Breck sex pests Kyre when he's 18 in 1356 DR. She leaves and disappears for a year or more (extending into 1357 when curse of the azure bonds has happened).

I'm guessing she went to investigate the moander rumours in yulash and cormanthyr and Westgate. She gets herself infected and returns to the Harpers and infects several of the more weak willed members as well as a few treants.

It was kyre that asked for breck to be on the tribunal knowing he would choose whatever she did.

I'm not going down the route of Moander controlling Kyre and wanting Finder captured because the gods motives should be mysterious and unknowable and it's all unreliable narrator, but at the very least the cult of moander would want finder and alias and dragonbait dead.

I'm also thinking the moanderite and the harpers have an ancient enmity extending back to when the elves of myth Drannor first trapped moander in yulash. Maybe some of those elven wizards went on to found the first incarnation of the harpers at twilight.

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maransreth
Learned Scribe

Australia
150 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  05:11:22  Show Profile Send maransreth a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison

Thankyou for the thankyou
Loved spellfire though, tons of information about the dalelands, lots of room to expand the cult of the dragon in the dalelands and to setup a zhentarim infiltration into the Sembian cell which might help explain the later north south split in the cult (1370 onwards) as the cult is supposed to hate the zhentarim.

And if you feel like it you could even double check my homework and make sure I got everything.



Just discovered something interesting - Gary, you must be reading the original book written in 1988, not a reprint Ed did in 2005. The reason - no mention of the Blood of Malaug - the malaugrym.

As my paper books are original prints, many years ago I invested in ebooks and that is what I am using to re-read the Realms. My copy in Chapter 6 Death in the Dark has a scene with two spawn of a malaugrym by the name of Amarune. I looked over your notes and there is no mention of the malaugrym at all.

So I went over to Goodreads and the original novel has 382 pages, while the revised edition has 416 pages. This would be where Ed got his way and had some of the edited scenes re-added.

So something to think on lore-wise - original or updated. I might add a section on malaugrym and you can edit the original post with the Spellfire information. There is mention of Doomstones and the Most High Shadowmaster having all the doomstones, yet one of the spawn found a "dead" doomstone in one of Malaug's Toril lairs.

Btw I remembered Amarune as that is the name of one of Ed's offspring, who appeared in Death Masks. Amarune is also the name used by some 5e publishers as there are two sets - Amarune's Almanacs: done by region type (artic, coasts, etc) and Amarune's Adventures.
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader

USA
3715 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  06:21:37  Show Profile Send Lord Karsus a Private Message  Reply with Quote
-That's interesting. I got into the realms in the early-2000s, and they started reprinting a lot of the older books around then, and I don't think I ever heard anyone mention anything about revisions or edits or changes. The only thing I can think is that the Avatar Trilogy was released with the authors' actual names (Scott Ceincin & Troy Denning) instead of "Richard Awlinson", the pseudonym that was on the covers of the original books.

(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)

Elves of Faerûn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerûn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  08:02:25  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Good spot on the revised edition, I shall have to find a copy of it and read the whole thing again to make sure I didn't miss anything.

Cheers

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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
Moderator

USA
36142 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  11:52:36  Show Profile Send Wooly Rupert a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus

-That's interesting. I got into the realms in the early-2000s, and they started reprinting a lot of the older books around then, and I don't think I ever heard anyone mention anything about revisions or edits or changes. The only thing I can think is that the Avatar Trilogy was released with the authors' actual names (Scott Ceincin & Troy Denning) instead of "Richard Awlinson", the pseudonym that was on the covers of the original books.



Crystal Shard was revised. Originally it said Drizzt was over 200 years old, but after the Dark Elf trilogy came out, it was revised to be inline with those books.

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  11:58:27  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Aww no, i really dont want to have to read an RAS book again, i think my copy said he was over 200 years old.

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  15:11:24  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Song of the Saurials (1358 DR)

Shadowdale Lore
The Nameless Bard held in the Twisted Tower of Ashaba awaiting judgement by the Harpers
Heth, a page boy in the Twisted Tower of Ashaba
Elminster was a good friend to Nameless before his imprisonment, but would not speak at his initial trial because he was angry at Nameless and felt betrayed (why???)
Han, a male songhorn player at the Old Skull inn (possibly a farmer???)
Durgo, middle aged farmer and son of Jhaele Silvermane, no sense of rhythm, dislikes dancing
Nelil, sister of Durgo and daughter of Jhaele Silvermane
Grypht (means High One in saurial, may be a name or a title) a saurial (has two horns on its forehead and a larger horn sticking out of its snout, a bony frill running down its neck and a serpentine tail, covered in green scales. He transported into the Harper trial (displacing Elminster to a place filled with brightly coloured feathered dragons, and larget cats twice the size of tigers) while looking for Dragonbait (he tracked Olive who is not with Alias). The Harper’s thought him an enemy and attacked. Grypht is a powerful mage.
Caitlin a guard in the Twisted Tower of Ashaba.
Captain Thurbal, a guard in the Twisted Tower
Sar, a guard in the Twisted Tower.
Shend, guard in the Twisted Tower.
Oakwood Knoll, west of the River Ashaba, a hill crowned with a single immense oak covered in mistletoe, ivy, and moss, surrounded by many small oaks.
Treants have been infected by Moander (like Kyre)

Alias Lore
She has been losing control and singing songs in strange unknown languages, not Nameless’ tunes, or twisting the words to darker versions about death and decay and darkness.
Sings Nameless’ tunes to defy the Harpers.
Knows thieve’s cant, magically implanted by the Fire Knives.
Emotionally immature
Alias and Dragonbait have been searching Moander’s temples since spring and finding them all abandoned.
Spent last winter serving as a guard in the Twisted Tower.
A trusted friend of Mourngrym
Alias does not dream.
Alias believes Zhara is a religious zealot, using Akabar to go on some fool quest and bring glory to Tymora.
Conditioned by Cassana to dislike priests.
Alias’ chainmail is heavily enchanted, very immodest looking, she acquired it from Cassana, offers more protection than a full breastplate. She has spare armour
One Alias clone is a sage in Candlekeep, Zhara a priestess of Tymora in Turmish, Jade a thief in Immersea (slain by Flattery), Cat a mage in Immersea, one a warrior in the eastern lands, one a lady of some power in Waterdeep.

Kyre Lore
Kyre, Bard, one of 3 judges. Beautiful, half elven woman, lustrous black hair, remote and aloof, not shy.
Wears an enchanted bright red orchid in her hair (enchanted to keep it in bloom). The tendrils of the stem are entwined in her hair, entering her ear and her temples. The orchid’s tendrils are spread throughout her body and allow her to shoot them out of her mouth and fingertips.
Kyre is an agent of Moander
Kyre knows of Grypht, was hunting him
Kyre was going to break Nameless out of his prison cell.
Kyre attacked Grypht with a walnut that produced a black substance that responds to the word “Darkbringer”, it trapped Grypht inside a soul trapping black gem. Kyre then tried to use it on Nameless (but he had remembered his name of Finder)
Walnuts function as soul trapping gems
Stunned Akabar
Thistledown seeds find a target and create fast growing, killing thistles with dagger like thorns that attack and smother the target.
Kyre was sent by Moander to find Akabar (it was thought Akabar was with Alias because magic could not detect his whereabouts). Kyre “recruited” many other servants on her way to Shadowdale.
Kyre brought Breck Orcsbane into the Harpers, the two have worked together on many occasions.
Kyre was killed by Grypht, the entire inside of her body was filled with rotting tendrils and vegetation.
Kyre was known for not making mistakes.
When Breck was 18 (2 years ago), he confessed his love for Kyre and pestered her so much that eventually she said they should stop working together and she went away for a whole year. When Kyre returned after Finder had been released Kyre asked that Breck be assigned to the Harper tribunal.
Kyre was different (unapproachable) after she returned from going missing for a whole year.
Kyre found the saurials and was living among them when the tribe was attacked by minions of Moander, Kyre was captured and became a minion of Moander

Dragonbait Lore
Communicates by releasing odours
Has learned thieve’s cant from Alias
Honeysuckle smell means tender concern
Ham smell means worried.
Brimstone smell means interested
Fresh baked bread means anger
Vanilla smell means amused
Roses means grief
Mint means shame / remorse
Garlic means stubborn
Violets means warning / fear
Lemon means joy
Chicken soup means impatience
Earthy smell means frustration
Warm tar means elation
Cinnamon means love
Known as Champion to the saurials.
From the same tribe as Grypht. Dragonbait and Grypht are friends.
Was in love with Coral but left over religious differences. Left to fight evil elsewhere and got captured by Phalse.
Has a new magic sword (flameblade???)
A circle symbol in the air (parallel to the ground) is the saurial symbol for death.
The planet where the saurials live has many followers of Moander around. The power of Moander is so great in the Saurial’s world that he can prevent Elminster from leaving.
Saurials refer to dragons as Lair Beasts
Grypht is known by the nickname Old Lair Beast (old dragon)
Soul singing is a sacred ability among the saurials (female only ability???). Allows the soul singer to voice the thoughts and feelings of the entire tribe in a soul song. Saurials believe soul singing is a gift from the gods.
Dragonbait’s mother had the gift of soul singing.
Dragonbait’s tribe are ruled by Overlord’s. Moander has possessed all the Overlords. The Overlords know that young cannot work so they break all the eggs and slay all the young and add them to Moander’s new body.

Other Lore
Moander’s temples around the Dalelands have all been abandoned
Priests of Milil wear crimson robes embroidered with gold dragons (standard ceremonial garb)
Transference, a spell that allows a wizard to swap places with another wizard (presumably he must know their name and location). It has no chance of error like Teleport.
Lhaeo bet his father’s sword that Elminster wasn’t dead. Is the sword valuable and or magical.
There arent any halfling bards according to Morala. Do the Harpers not admit halflings.
Cassana and Zrie Prakis originally lived in Ravens Bluff. They had too many powerful friends for the Harpers to get rid of them so Morala wrote an opera that exposed her worst secrets. Cassana couldnt stand ridicule and so was forced to flee to Westgate
Sarcasm is wasted on halflings in general.
Songhorn, a musical instrument, played in Shadowdale
Korhun Lherar, a sour cynical old man killed in the first battle of Shadowdale, his lands are overgrown
Halfling luck, a superstition about the good or bad luck of halflings (good for them, bad for everyone else)
Ironwood doors resist being chopped down.
Corx, an orc of the Torn Ear tribe near Spiderhaunt Woods that guards the tunnels of Finder’s Keep
The Torn Ear tribe of orcs is led by the beholder Xaran, they have been preying on small caravans in the Dales for 20 years. The Torn Ear tribes are able to detect and avoid adventuring bands disguised as merchants. They cut of ears and loot the most precious treasures. Experts at covering their tracks. In 1358 they attacked 3 times as many caravans as normal. Mourngrym sent two two parties searching for the Torn Ear warren this year, neither came back.
Xaran a beholder leads the orcs near Spiderhaunt Woods, it desires the secret of Finder’s simulacrum knowledge. Its eyes covered in a milky film, its eye stalks droop, silver moss hangs about the stalks like grey hair. It hovers awkwardly like an old man. Xaran described Phalse as a “bottle imp”. Xaran is in league with Moander. It wants Finder to retrieve Akabar and bring him to Xaran.
Grypht’s staff functions as his spell book (notches on the staff record the spells)
Supposedly Phalse created the Alias clones to kill Moander
Turmite, considered a vulgar form of reference by Turmishmen
Minions of Moander are able to produce a seed pod that burst and release a cloud of spores (seeds of possession). These can be used to make more Minions of Moander. Tendrils come to infest the body of the minions. Those possessed for several months cannot be cured, the tendrils rot their body and they would die anyway. Tendrils can be removed by cure disease or with cold (or fire).

One eye to lift and one eye to sleep,
One to charm man and one for beast.
One eye to wound and one eye to slow,
One to bring fear and one to make stone.
One eye makes dust and one eye brings death,
But the last eye kills wizards more than all of the rest. The adventurers rhyme about beholders

a tune of Finder's, "The Hero of the Watch," a seemingly innocuous song about a cat that saved a regiment of soldiers from an attacking horde of goblins.
The Shards of Selune (guardians and powerful minions of Selune) sing one of Finder’s songs (The Tears of Selune) as a duet with one of the temple’s priests in honour for their goddess. The song was designed by Finder to be sung as a solo.
Charon, the boatman of the Styx in Tarterus, red eyes, haggard face, nearly skeletal hands. Finder paid for passage with the Horn of Blasting.



Moander Lore
Moanderites are building him a new body
Moander wants Akabar to possess him again and to witness his return.
Moander possessed Coral, a saurial priestess of a god of luck, she has pearly white scales and leads a tribe of saurials. Coral’s sister Lily died last week but she laid an egg
Moander controls the mind and bodies of many saurials in the tribe.
Coral is sacrificing many beings to give life to Moander’s new body.
Coral loved Dragonbait but the two argued over theology (Coral worships a luck god, Dragonbait worships a justice god), so Dragonbait left to fight evil elsewhere (where he was captured in Tarterus by Phalse)
Moander’s minions travelled to the saurial world and kidnapped Dragonbait’s tribe and marched them through Tarterus to Faerun.
Coral wears the garb of a high priest, a clean white robe with a red eye painted in the centre surrounded by a mouth of fangs.
Coral is the Mouth of Moander, the most powerful Minion of Moander.
Akabar’s blood is the seed of Moander needed to animate his new body. The seed is a blood red gem created from a single drop of Akabar’s blood (while he consumed a strange mushroom).
Moander’s new body had been built around the gate to Tarterus.


Harper Lore
A Harper tribunal involves 3 Harpers (senior or just nearby agents???)
Morala of Milil, Harper and eldest of the 3 judges at Nameless’ trial. Ancient woman, Morala sentenced Nameless to prison after he created Flattery, she never liked Nameless. Snow white hair, wrinkled skin
Breck Orcsbane, youngest of the 3 judges. Ranger, male, long plait of yellow hair that reaches his waist, brawny. 20 years old
Kyre, Bard, one of 3 judges. Beautiful, half elven woman, lustrous black hair, remote and aloof.
The Harpers are accustomed to abiding by Elminster’s counsel
In the past Harpers were able to intimidate ordinary folk into obedience.
Elminster is the most powerful ally and adviser of the Harpers.

Nameless Lore
Born 350 years ago in a small village in one of the northern nations (Cormyr), second son of local gentry. Completed training at bardic college. Chose the life of a wandering adventurer, his music became popular and his fame attracted young adventurers to his cause. Nameless and his companions became the founding fathers of the Harpers.
Using magic and blessings of the gods he lived well beyond the natural years of a human but mortality prompted him to look to preserve his songs. He created the finders stone to record his work.
Viewed Finders Stone as a failure so tried to create a simulacrum of himself containing his personality and his knowledge of music (memories???)
Finder created Flattery, used a shard of paraelemental ice (learned how from Elminster but was told not to do it) to create him and it exploded killing and apprentice and causing another to lose her voice (she later killed herself). This story was a lie Finder told when he summoned the Harpers
Harpers removed Nameless’ name from everywhere, even his own memory. Imprisoned him on another plane where he would live in good health and relative immortality due to the nature of the plane.
Nameless was exiled 200 years ago
Nameless was a Master Harper
Nameless was able to scry on the realms while in exile in the Citadel of White Exile
Nameless was tricked into making Alias for Cassana and the Azure Bonds cabal
Nameless was always adept at charming people to spending their lives on his schemes.
Finder left the Wyvernspurs, feeling they did not understand him. He established Finders Keep in the southern edge of Spiderhaunt Woods.
Owned an exquisite songhorn made of black wood and decorated with gold.
Maryje was one of Nameless’ apprentices, the one that killed herself. She loved Nameless but could not speak the truth of the accident.
Finders Keep is a ruined manor house. The tunnels beneath the house are partially collapsed (caused by Flattery), they lead to Finders Workshop where Flattery was created.
Flattery was created with Finder’s thoughts and memories. Finder hit Flattery when he couldn’t sing his songs (at only 3 days old). Flattery refused to sing or speak anymore, he escaped on his 13th day of life.
Finder had two apprentices when he created Flattery, Kirkson and Maryje. Flattery killed Kirkson with a disintegration ring aimed at Finder (Kirkson jumped in the way) and injured Maryje (slashed her throat) then ran away. Kirkson gave Flattery his name as a joke. Nameless lied about the incident because he thought the Harpers would hunt down Flattery.
Nameless teleported the injured Maryje to Shadowdale and then returned to Finder’s Keep to hide all evidence of Flattery’s existence. He then asked Maryje to lie for him. Maryje couldnt lie (why???), but couldnt betray Finder either, so she stopped speaking.
Finder was never allowed to wield the Wyverns Spur because his brother used it all the time (jealous)
Finder’s Dagger is inset with emeralds and topaz. Was a gift from his grandfather (Paton Wyvernspur). So magical it survived a beholder’s disintegration ray. It has “certain power against evil creatures”.
Also known as the Crafter (because he made magic items)
Finder’s mother used to use the saying “sweet Selune” all the time.
Now that Finder is away from the Citadel of White Exile, he is starting to age rapidly.
The tunnels and workshop beneath Finder’s Keep are inhabited by orcs who used a secret passage to gain access
Finder used to hit Flattery when he did not sing his songs.
Flattery gained access to the workshop three years after he escaped and Finder was imprisoned, he stole all of Finder’s magic. Flattery helped the orcs trap the tunnels so they could catch and slay intruders (Flattery hoped Finder would return and be killed).
The Harpers removed all mention of Finder and his songs from popular culture within 18 months of Finder’s imprisonment.
Kirkson took pity on Flattery and used to give him books to read (including one of Finder’s spellbooks). Flattery escaped his cage using magic and stole a disintegration ring from Finder’s desk (why did Finder have a disintegration ring???). Flattery tried to disintegrate Finder (and wanted to disintegrate Maryje as well) but Kirkson jumped in front of the green disintegration ray (Flattery was going to leave Kirkson alive)
Maryje went mad after Finder was imprisoned. Flattery returned to stalk her and drove her to suicide using nightmares and suggestion.
Finder had a horn of blasting in his workshop beneath Finder’s Keep (it survived Flattery’s rampage).
Finder had earrings made by elves (from Myth Drannor) that bestowed tongues ability on the wearer.
Finder is obsessed with immortality
Finder gets infected by a seed of possession (from Xaran) but the potions he consumed earlier mean he cannot be possessed by Moander. The vines growing inside him will now make him immortal.
Finder owns a ring of protection and a ring of cold resistance.
He blew a fanfare he'd once composed in honor of a legion of soldiers who had all been killed in a single day in battle

Finders Stone
The Finders Stone was originally an artefact that Finder altered by inserting a shard of paraelemental ice into it so he could store spells and knowledge (and a sentience???)
Serves as a compass of detection emitting a beam of light to indicate a path
Can protect itself with blinding light
Has a mind of its own, directs the wielder to help find the lost find their way.
Has a shard of paraelemental ice at its heart
Can act as a rechargeable wand, allowing the wielder to cast spells that Nameless knew. Wielder needs to sing particular tunes or melodies to access the songs. Only a Wyvernspur can use these spells. Alias is classed as a Wyvernspur.
Can store information like a journal, can recall an entire library of tomes.
Can recall and sing songs in Nameless’ voice, exactly as he sang them.
Can project an illusion of Nameless singing the song.
Finders Stone can only sing when commanded, has no grasp of listeners reaction or emotions. Nameless viewed the stone as a failure. A sharp for a tongues spell. E flat for a teleport spell.
Nameless spent a decade searching for the stone. Spent another decade improving it at the risk of his own life (adding the paraelemental ice).


Akabar bel Akash
Third wife is Zhara, priestess of Tymora, reddish brown hair, an Alias clone. Zhara once broke Kazim’s arm.
Akash and Kazim are Akabar’s other wives.
Akabar has been experiencing nightmares. Zhara says they are warnings from the gods of light and that Moander the Darkbringer is returning
Akabar has 4 children
Akabar’s blood is the seed of Moander needed to animate his new body

Turmish Lore
“Of no small water” – means not insignificant
“Of the first water” - means first rate
Akabar’s wife is heavily veiled.
Turmish women are proud of their homes and children, run efficient households and businesses, always polite and softly spoken (respectful)
Multiple wives allowed if they can be afforded, referred to as sister-wives

Languages
Kyre, means flawless in elvish

The Lost Vale
The Lost Vale lies beyond the Desertsmouth Mountains between Mount Andria and Mount Drix, just south of Mount Hans.
Wizard’s Folly, a mountain in the Desertsmouth Mountains that looks like its been sliced in half (vertically). Was a whole mountain 30 years ago until two wizards decided to use it as a battlefield.
Magically hidden, you cannot find the vale, you have to be taken to it by someone who has been there. The magic of the vale keeps the vale warm in winter.
There is a gate to Tarterus near the Lost Vale.
Singing Cave at the edge of the Lost Vale (you can find the Singing Cave, so not protected by the magic of the vale???). Home to orange swallows, red and yellow skinks, a carpet of moss and ferns just inside the cave mouth.
Vale is 5 miles wide.
Borders Anauroch in the west
Steeper slopes of the vale are meadows covered with wild flowers and woods filled with a great variety of trees and ferns.
Most of the vegetation has been hacked down by the saurials, leaving reddish brown earth bare. The rotting vegetation has been dumped in the centre of the vale to form a large hill (Moander’s new body)
Three different kinds of saurials. A few were as small as halflings and had long slender necks and snouts and leathery wings hanging beneath their forearms. These flew into the clearing laden with nets of captured birds and fish and eggs and small forest creatures. Another large group of the saurials were approximately the size and shape of Dragonbait. They carried underbrush and small saplings or buckets of water. A third group, the largest.in number, were bigger than Dragonbait, a little taller than Akabar, but much more powerfully built, with sharp diamond-shaped blades running from their skulls and down their backs to the ends of their spiked tails. These creatures dragged great trees toward the pile. None of the saurials appeared to be as big as Grypht.
Coral, a soul singer (same subrace as dragonbait), pearly white colour
Lily, Coral’s sister (same subrace as dragonbait)
Overlords rule the tribe
Sweetleaf (same subrace as dragonbait), a stranger to the tribe, possibly from another tribe. Cleric
The Lost Vale was once the home of elves, they left long ago.

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 07 Aug 2020 :  15:36:57  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Song of the Saurials finished, another solid novel filled with realmslore, not quite as good as Finder's Stone and to my mind it is because of the god stuff. Moander creating a new body and taking saurials through Tarterus, Finder walking through Tarterus and the Abyss to kill Moander, the last two chapters were lacking in detail or interest.



A few thoughts on the lore present in the novel.

The Finder's Stone was an artefact before Finder started messing with it, so Finder didnt originally create it, might be good to try and link that to another magic item in the realms (i'm tempted to try and find one linked to Tymora since he invokes her name so much).

Finder's Dagger belonged to Paton Wyvernspur, it has power against evil creatures, i'm wondering if that was used to slay the wyvern and gain the wyvernspur from it.

The saurials supposedly come from another planet, but Moander was able to control the entire planet to put a dimensional lock on it and prevent Elminsters from escaping. That level of control is usually limited to pocket planes created by mages that want to control it. Apart from the "planet" the saurials come from being large enough to hold "lair beasts" (dragons) and several tribes of saurials (sweetleaf is described as a stranger to the tribe so he must have come from another), i see nothing that proves it was a separate planet the saurials come from (that is only the interpretation of the word the saurials used to describe their homeland). So given the unreliable narrator and the potential translation issue, i'm going to have the saurials come from a pocket plane created by sarrukh of Isstosseffifil, or from Abeir.

The last two chapters where Finder went to Tarterus and killed Moander's true body are not good so i'm getting rid of that. Finder became immortal as a result of the vines, and there are many instances in realmslore of beings absorbing the power of things they slay, so Finder kills Moander's body in the Lost Vale and gains enough power to become a demigod, no need for the other planes stuff that nobody else witnessed and so may not be true (he just vanishes into a gate and is never seen again).

Flattery had Finder's thoughts and memories so despite both books saying he did not know about the Wyvernspur that cant be true and he did know. He may not have known about the crypt and where it was hidden (because the wyvernspur was not always hidden in the crypt, that could have happened after Flattery was made, probably as a result of accidents befalling the wyvernspurs who held the Wyverns Spur). It is also intimated that Flattery worked with the orcs to guard the workshop in the event of Finder's return (Flattery collapsed the tunnels and someone created those intricate locked doors that were well beyond the skill of orcs but formed part of a trap the orcs used).

A few of Finder's songs seem like they might be written about real events, most likely in Cormyr or the Dalelands. A legion of soldiers slain in a single day, a cat that saves a regiment of soldiers from a goblin horde all seem like likely Cormyrean events.
Finder himself went to bardic college, i'm not aware of any bardic colleges in Cormyr (most certainly not 350 years ago), i think bardic colleges were mostly concentrated in the north so perhaps he went to Silverymoon.

Lastly it looks like Cassana and Zrie Prakis used to live in Raven's Bluff before being forced to move to Westgate because of the opera Morala wrote that made public much of Cassana's dirty secrets (she couldnt start being criticised).



There were a few inconsistencies regarding the speech of saurials and who could understand them. At several points it was made clear that not everyone could understand Grypht but then in other places everyone was joining in an argument with the Saurial. Finder's Stone could translate any language in the realms but not the saurial language because it was not from Toril, but then later Finder had a nice cosy saurial chat with Coral, implying he knew more about the saurials than he let on. Finder also knew everything about the Lost Vale despite it being hidden for ages and i believe destroyed long before Finder ever existed. Hidden motives and links could be made between Finder and the Lost Vale and the saurials based upon the amount of knowledge he has regarding them.


All in all a realmslore rich novel.

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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1180 Posts

Posted - 08 Aug 2020 :  00:43:56  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote

"Turmish Lore
“Of no small water” – means not insignificant
“Of the first water” - means first rate
Akabar’s wife is heavily veiled.
Turmish women are proud of their homes and children, run efficient households and businesses, always polite and softly spoken (respectful)
Multiple wives allowed if they can be afforded, referred to as sister-wives"

Well...if you read The Jewel of Turmish you'll see zero of that lore and see instead a very typical fantasy setting with forests and druids and ye olde port towne with a handful of references to square beards.
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 08 Aug 2020 :  07:00:45  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Cant say I'm surprised, some novels are just bad, but as I'm discovering they aren't all bad, they just need reworking a bit

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maransreth
Learned Scribe

Australia
150 Posts

Posted - 08 Aug 2020 :  12:41:14  Show Profile Send maransreth a Private Message  Reply with Quote

Going back a track, after reading Spellfire I had a thought - don't dracoliches have a phlactery, similar to a standard lich?

If yes, then I assume Spellfire is powerful enough to destroy the dracolich so that it cannot regenerate?
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 08 Aug 2020 :  15:50:00  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
That is something many have discussed over the years. Reading the novel recently I think that rauglothgor could have been utterly annihilated because his entire body was atomised and so the negative energy that animates him could likewise have been destroyed but more crucially it is possible that his phylactery was hidden in his new, secret, and super protected lair, and so the phylactery could have been destroyed by he balhiir or by spellfire. So I reckon rauglothgor is likely gone forever but there is a chance the balhiir drained the magic of his phylactery and released his soul, then his body was destroyed and so his soul could hang around as a ghost dragon.

Shargrailar was only blasted by spellfire and was still in unliving when Delg was smacking its head in with his axe. He is almost certainly back in his phylactery but I reckon the zhentarim infiltration of the cult and or cult infighting means that shargrailars phylactery was stolen and hidden so as to weaken those allied with shargrailar. His blood has been kept in a goblet that a fang dragon near aglarond has, and I vaguely recall a piece of the original body is needed, his phylactery could have been sent or sold to anywhere (probably in the opposite direction). Which means the cult are almost never going to find him.

The other dracolich probably suffered a similar fate to shargrailar as its body wasnt totally destroyed by spellfire and its phylactery must therefore have been stolen and hidden so that he couldn't animate a new body.


Just my thoughts but as everyone has pointed out, the dracoliches should have reanimated, and only rauglothgor could possibly have been prevented by spellfire. So other mundane means (theft) must stop the reanimation process.

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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1180 Posts

Posted - 09 Aug 2020 :  15:03:21  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I do have a vague memory of references to the Spellfire dracoliches being alive as newts or salamanders in a 2nd edition sourcebook, possibly the Cult of the Dragon sourcebook or the Draconomicon sorucebook. But this is a memory I have from the 1990s, and I'm not with my stash of books to look it all up.
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore

USA
1122 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  15:30:21  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ed has this to say in So Sayeth Ed part 9, page 21:

"This was the case for all three dracoliches featured in SPELLFIRE. Rauglothgor's phylactery was indeed present in its cavern, and the balhiir did indeed destroy it. Neither Aghazstamn nor Shargrailar the Dark have yet reappeared in the Realms, but their phylacteries survive, so they could quite possibly do so."

Edit: The 3e Dragons of Faerun lists the location of the phylacteries for Aghazstamn and Shargrailar: the hoard of Aurgloroasa.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents

Edited by - TheIriaeban on 10 Aug 2020 15:58:48
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  16:50:12  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Excellent find, and if i recall correctly didnt Augloroasa have a host of thieves and spies working for her, so she could have easily arranged the phylacteries to be stolen in order to remove competition in her territory and to allow her to gain power in the Cult of the Dragon (pretending she wanted to become a dracolich).

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  16:52:53  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sojourn (1340 – 1347 DR)

Drizzt Lore
Spent the last 4 decades underground
Piwafwi magic began to fade after 50 days, the fabric itself dissolved after 100 days.
The drow believe the sun will burn them away to dust
Drizzt journeyed to Maldobar first then to Montolio’s Grove in Dead Orc Pass, spending a year there until 1341 DR. He spent the next 6 years wandering, nearly reaching Luskan in 1343 DR but fearing to enter. He found the Weeping Friars on the road outside Luskan and followed them ever since. He has travelled to Mirabar 3 times with the Weeping Friars (always by the tunnel route).

Ulgulu Lore
Fiend from Gehenna, sent to grow in Faerun, every kill makes him stronger. Barghest whelp. Commands a group of gnolls that worship it as a god. Purple skin, can tear a tree from the ground with his bare hands.
Nathak, goblin in service to Ulgulu, spindly limbed, eaten by Ulgulu
Kempfana, brother of Ulgulu, calmer of the two fiends (although has devoured scores of servants). Scarlet skinned, barghest whelp.
Lagerbottoms, hill giant in service to Ulgulu, Lagerbottoms used to be the boss until Ulgulu and Kempfana arrived.
Tephanis, quickling in service to Ulgulu. Was alone (lonely and unexciting) stealing from humans before Ulgulu came along. Desires companions, excitement, to be useful. Has an elegant and valuable dagger.
Ulgulu and his goblinoid servants carefully prey on the humans of Maldobar (taking only those lost in the wilds)
Ulgulu and Kempfana slain by Drizzt.

Maldobar Lore
Maldobar, a village 50 miles up the Dead Orc river north of Sundabar
Liam Thistledown, youngest child, 10 years old, compulsive liar, sandy haired
Shawno Thistledown, second youngest child, 11 years old, anxious, worrisome
Eleni Thistledown, 15 years old, pretty, huge soft eyes, smooth golden skin, dimpled cheeks
Flanny Thistledown, 12 years old, male
Connor Thistledown, eldest child, nearly 20 years old
Bartholomew Thistledown, father of Connor, Eleni, Flanny, Shawno, and Liam, 45 years old. His father and his grandfather had lived and died in Maldobar. Owns a farm on the outskirts of Maldobar. Dislikes Roddy McGristle and his uncouth behaviour.
Markle Thistledown, father of Bartholomew.
Benson Delmo, mayor of Maldobar
Drow had never been heard of near Maldobar
Roddy McGristle, bear sized, hairy, battle seasoned, mountain man, bounty hunter and fur trapper often hunting orcs, ignores his farm if he can. Owns a finely crafted and magical huge axe called Bleeder and two yellow hunting dogs. Dirty, burly, uncontrollable, volatile. Drifter, has been in Maldobar for a couple of years, owes allegiance to no one. Has dealt with Graul the orc king for aid in hunting bounties (from rival orc tribes).
All the Thistledowns slain or eaten by Ulgulu.

Other Lore
A small settlement of wild elves in the Cold Wood were raided around 10 years ago by drow (Drizzt’s raid where he saved an elf child).
Adbar pony’s are sturdy.
Barghest whelps can change shape, dimension door, project image.
Average bounty for a drow head in the Savage Frontier is 200 gold.
Grubby the Wiseless, pretended archmage, goblin wizard in the North.
Stone giants north of Maldobar
Kellendil has elven kin in the foothills of the mountains near Dead Orc Pass and elsewhere in the foothills of the northern mountains.
Goblin tongue has over 100 words for killing and hatred but no words for compassion or friendship
New moon, holy time for orcs (when new raids are decided)
Adbar brandy, strong drink
“Mangura bok woklok” means stupid blockhead in giantish
Winter wolves are perversions of nature (magically made???)
Battle in Montolio’s Grove happened in 1341 DR
The tunnel route to Mirabar, normally reserved for mine carts rolling down from the Spine of the World Mountains, approaches Mirabar from the North. The Weeping Friars using the tunnel route approach from the south and must make a complete circuit of the city.
Hephaestus (not his real name), an old red dragon living in the caves northwest of Mirabar as long as anyone can remember (including dwarves). He is lazy and stupid and tolerated by the city because he rarely bothers it. Smelts ore for money (expensive). There is a route to his caves in the tunnel leading north out of Mirabar. Destroyer of Cockleby, Destroyer of 10000 cattle, He who crushed Angalander the Stupid Silver
Mergandevinasander of Chult, a huge black dragon who lives in a grove of fallen trees in a thick swamp. Has purple eyes.
Icewind Dale has a 7 month winter

Westbridge Lore
Westbridge is a town situated on the Long Road between Waterdeep and Mirabar.
The Harvest Inn, comfortable bedding at reasonable rates
Derry’s Tavern and Eatery, a renowned story swapping bar with adventurers from as far away as Luskan and Sundabar, serves mutton and biscuits.
Roddy McGristle moved from Maldobar after failing to kill Drizzt at Montolio’s Grove. 1345 DR he left Mirabar via the tunnel route (was he in trouble???) and moved to Westbridge.
Westbridge is 300 miles from Mirabar.

Weeping Friar Lore
The Weeping Friars, a monastic order of Ilmater that believes there is a finite amount of pain in the world. They endure more pain so others dont have to.
Some are true believers, others are fake and beg for money claiming they will endure pain on behalf of the sufferer.
They often travel to Mirabar for the winter (they want to be painfully cold).
Not a popular order (because of the beggars???).
Often they are drunkards (helps them to endure the pain???)
Brother Matheus, portly man, beggar, not devout, rational and leader of his band of friars
Brother Jankin, dirty, unkempt, drunkard
Brother Herschel


Sundabar Lore
Fredegar “Rockcrusher”, known as Fret, Helm’s court attendant (also attending Dove), white robed, perfectly trimmed white beard, grey eyes, accomplished sage on dwarves (and social etiquette). Fret had spent many years in Silverymoon and contributed many times to the library of Silverymoon. Friendly with Dove. Expert on demihuman issues and social customs of various races, a fine composer of musical works. Dislikes dirt. Live’s in Helm’s castle in Sundabar. Possesses a silvered light hammer.
Dove Falconhand visiting Sundabar, forest green cape, dislikes formality. Thick hair, delicate but calloused hands
Gabriel, tall, stern faced, warrrior
Helm Dwarf-Friend Master of Sundabar, friendly with Alustriel
Dove, Gabriel, Fret, Kellindil an elf archer (has a flaming sword), and Darda a human warrior (short, heavily muscled, stubby beard) return to Maldobar to hunt the murderer of the Thistledown family.

Dead Orc Pass
Graul, chief orc in the region. Owns one of the mountain valleys near Dead Orc Pass. Had been chieftain for many years (unusual for an orc). Has orcs, worgs, and even a stone giant. Has a thousand orc warriors in service.
Montolio’s Grove is a series of caves dug around the roots of huge and tightly packed evergreen trees, with willow lean-tos connecting and protecting the outside of the caves. An armoury of gathered weapons is stored in a cave under a large tree. A library of books stored in the caves.
Caroak, winterwolf, allies with Tephanis as Drizzt moves into the region.
Rogee’s Bluff, an old path collapsed many years ago.
Caravans from Sundabar pass through here.

Montolio Lore
Montolio DeBrouchee (known as Mooshie to friends), a former ranger of great, legendary, renown, now living a life of seclusion in the mountains around Dead Orc Pass.
Has an owl animal companion called Hooter).
Considerable age (70+), crinkled and wrinkled with a huge grey moustache.
Friends with Bluster the cave bear.
Nearly blind, uses the owl to see.
Tall, straight, very old, wild grey hair.
Expert archer, has a heavy longbow (uses the owl to identify targets).
Has taking part in a dozen wars, spent an entire winter trapped on a mountain with a broken leg, killed a giant with only a dagger.
Considered eccentric because he dislikes humanoids and lives with animals.
Worships Mielikki.
Montolio’s personal weapons (a sword, shield, and helmet) bear the mark of the taloned owl.
Montolio was once forced to kill a man (perhaps why he became a hermit???).
Knows Roddy McGristle but does not like him. Knew the Thistledowns.
Spent his life fighting goblinoids and giantkind while protecting humans, elves, dwarves, gnomes, halflings.
Went blind 5 years ago.
As a ranger he often acted s a scout (alone or for huge armies)
His mentor was a ranger named Dilamon (female) who was so skilled with a bow she never missed in 10,000 shots. She died defending a farmhouse from giants, she drove off the giants and saved all the farmers.
His last adventuring company was the Rangewatchers, they battled a red dragon that was burning villages. Slew the dragon, 3 Rangewatchers killed, Montolio had his face burned off. His face was saved but his eyes were beyond repair. Montolio could not deal with the pity, he came to Dead Orc Pass to die (and to kill orcs).
Owns a unicorn head pendant (symbol of Mielikki)
Says that Guenhwyvar is in service to Mielikki
“The heart of a ranger is a heart of Mielikki”
Montolio uses his animals to alert caravans moving through Dead Orc Pass, Graul wants Montolio dead but his shaman is scared of the blind ranger (believing him bad magic)
Graul and his orcs attacked Montolio’s Grove. A hundred orcs, 10 worgs, a giant, and Caroat the winter wolf were slain in the attack.
Montolio died in his sleep that winter.
Citadel Adbar lies northeast of Montolio’s Grove.

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  17:03:04  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Sojourn (1340 – 1347 DR)

Drizzt Lore
Spent the last 4 decades underground
Piwafwi magic began to fade after 50 days, the fabric itself dissolved after 100 days.
The drow believe the sun will burn them away to dust
Drizzt journeyed to Maldobar first then to Montolio’s Grove in Dead Orc Pass, spending a year there until 1341 DR. He spent the next 6 years wandering, nearly reaching Luskan in 1343 DR but fearing to enter. He found the Weeping Friars on the road outside Luskan and followed them ever since. He has travelled to Mirabar 3 times with the Weeping Friars (always by the tunnel route).

Ulgulu Lore
Fiend from Gehenna, sent to grow in Faerun, every kill makes him stronger. Barghest whelp. Commands a group of gnolls that worship it as a god. Purple skin, can tear a tree from the ground with his bare hands.
Nathak, goblin in service to Ulgulu, spindly limbed, eaten by Ulgulu
Kempfana, brother of Ulgulu, calmer of the two fiends (although has devoured scores of servants). Scarlet skinned, barghest whelp.
Lagerbottoms, hill giant in service to Ulgulu, Lagerbottoms used to be the boss until Ulgulu and Kempfana arrived.
Tephanis, quickling in service to Ulgulu. Was alone (lonely and unexciting) stealing from humans before Ulgulu came along. Desires companions, excitement, to be useful. Has an elegant and valuable dagger.
Ulgulu and his goblinoid servants carefully prey on the humans of Maldobar (taking only those lost in the wilds)
Ulgulu and Kempfana slain by Drizzt.

Maldobar Lore
Maldobar, a village 50 miles up the Dead Orc river north of Sundabar
Liam Thistledown, youngest child, 10 years old, compulsive liar, sandy haired
Shawno Thistledown, second youngest child, 11 years old, anxious, worrisome
Eleni Thistledown, 15 years old, pretty, huge soft eyes, smooth golden skin, dimpled cheeks
Flanny Thistledown, 12 years old, male
Connor Thistledown, eldest child, nearly 20 years old
Bartholomew Thistledown, father of Connor, Eleni, Flanny, Shawno, and Liam, 45 years old. His father and his grandfather had lived and died in Maldobar. Owns a farm on the outskirts of Maldobar. Dislikes Roddy McGristle and his uncouth behaviour.
Markle Thistledown, father of Bartholomew.
Benson Delmo, mayor of Maldobar
Drow had never been heard of near Maldobar
Roddy McGristle, bear sized, hairy, battle seasoned, mountain man, bounty hunter and fur trapper often hunting orcs, ignores his farm if he can. Owns a finely crafted and magical huge axe called Bleeder and two yellow hunting dogs. Dirty, burly, uncontrollable, volatile. Drifter, has been in Maldobar for a couple of years, owes allegiance to no one. Has dealt with Graul the orc king for aid in hunting bounties (from rival orc tribes).
All the Thistledowns slain or eaten by Ulgulu.

Other Lore
A small settlement of wild elves in the Cold Wood were raided around 10 years ago by drow (Drizzt’s raid where he saved an elf child).
Adbar pony’s are sturdy.
Barghest whelps can change shape, dimension door, project image.
Average bounty for a drow head in the Savage Frontier is 200 gold.
Grubby the Wiseless, pretended archmage, goblin wizard in the North.
Stone giants north of Maldobar
Kellendil has elven kin in the foothills of the mountains near Dead Orc Pass and elsewhere in the foothills of the northern mountains.
Goblin tongue has over 100 words for killing and hatred but no words for compassion or friendship
New moon, holy time for orcs (when new raids are decided)
Adbar brandy, strong drink
“Mangura bok woklok” means stupid blockhead in giantish
Winter wolves are perversions of nature (magically made???)
Battle in Montolio’s Grove happened in 1341 DR
The tunnel route to Mirabar, normally reserved for mine carts rolling down from the Spine of the World Mountains, approaches Mirabar from the North. The Weeping Friars using the tunnel route approach from the south and must make a complete circuit of the city.
Hephaestus (not his real name), an old red dragon living in the caves northwest of Mirabar as long as anyone can remember (including dwarves). He is lazy and stupid and tolerated by the city because he rarely bothers it. Smelts ore for money (expensive). There is a route to his caves in the tunnel leading north out of Mirabar. Destroyer of Cockleby, Destroyer of 10000 cattle, He who crushed Angalander the Stupid Silver
Mergandevinasander of Chult, a huge black dragon who lives in a grove of fallen trees in a thick swamp. Has purple eyes.
Icewind Dale has a 7 month winter

Westbridge Lore
Westbridge is a town situated on the Long Road between Waterdeep and Mirabar.
The Harvest Inn, comfortable bedding at reasonable rates
Derry’s Tavern and Eatery, a renowned story swapping bar with adventurers from as far away as Luskan and Sundabar, serves mutton and biscuits.
Roddy McGristle moved from Maldobar after failing to kill Drizzt at Montolio’s Grove. 1345 DR he left Mirabar via the tunnel route (was he in trouble???) and moved to Westbridge.
Westbridge is 300 miles from Mirabar.

Weeping Friar Lore
The Weeping Friars, a monastic order of Ilmater that believes there is a finite amount of pain in the world. They endure more pain so others dont have to.
Some are true believers, others are fake and beg for money claiming they will endure pain on behalf of the sufferer.
They often travel to Mirabar for the winter (they want to be painfully cold).
Not a popular order (because of the beggars???).
Often they are drunkards (helps them to endure the pain???)
Brother Matheus, portly man, beggar, not devout, rational and leader of his band of friars
Brother Jankin, dirty, unkempt, drunkard
Brother Herschel


Sundabar Lore
Fredegar “Rockcrusher”, known as Fret, Helm’s court attendant (also attending Dove), white robed, perfectly trimmed white beard, grey eyes, accomplished sage on dwarves (and social etiquette). Fret had spent many years in Silverymoon and contributed many times to the library of Silverymoon. Friendly with Dove. Expert on demihuman issues and social customs of various races, a fine composer of musical works. Dislikes dirt. Live’s in Helm’s castle in Sundabar. Possesses a silvered light hammer.
Dove Falconhand visiting Sundabar, forest green cape, dislikes formality. Thick hair, delicate but calloused hands
Gabriel, tall, stern faced, warrrior
Helm Dwarf-Friend Master of Sundabar, friendly with Alustriel
Dove, Gabriel, Fret, Kellindil an elf archer (has a flaming sword), and Darda a human warrior (short, heavily muscled, stubby beard) return to Maldobar to hunt the murderer of the Thistledown family.

Dead Orc Pass
Graul, chief orc in the region. Owns one of the mountain valleys near Dead Orc Pass. Had been chieftain for many years (unusual for an orc). Has orcs, worgs, and even a stone giant. Has a thousand orc warriors in service.
Montolio’s Grove is a series of caves dug around the roots of huge and tightly packed evergreen trees, with willow lean-tos connecting and protecting the outside of the caves. An armoury of gathered weapons is stored in a cave under a large tree. A library of books stored in the caves.
Caroak, winterwolf, allies with Tephanis as Drizzt moves into the region.
Rogee’s Bluff, an old path collapsed many years ago.
Caravans from Sundabar pass through here.

Montolio Lore
Montolio DeBrouchee (known as Mooshie to friends), a former ranger of great, legendary, renown, now living a life of seclusion in the mountains around Dead Orc Pass.
Has an owl animal companion called Hooter).
Considerable age (70+), crinkled and wrinkled with a huge grey moustache.
Friends with Bluster the cave bear.
Nearly blind, uses the owl to see.
Tall, straight, very old, wild grey hair.
Expert archer, has a heavy longbow (uses the owl to identify targets).
Has taking part in a dozen wars, spent an entire winter trapped on a mountain with a broken leg, killed a giant with only a dagger.
Considered eccentric because he dislikes humanoids and lives with animals.
Worships Mielikki.
Montolio’s personal weapons (a sword, shield, and helmet) bear the mark of the taloned owl.
Montolio was once forced to kill a man (perhaps why he became a hermit???).
Knows Roddy McGristle but does not like him. Knew the Thistledowns.
Spent his life fighting goblinoids and giantkind while protecting humans, elves, dwarves, gnomes, halflings.
Went blind 5 years ago.
As a ranger he often acted s a scout (alone or for huge armies)
His mentor was a ranger named Dilamon (female) who was so skilled with a bow she never missed in 10,000 shots. She died defending a farmhouse from giants, she drove off the giants and saved all the farmers.
His last adventuring company was the Rangewatchers, they battled a red dragon that was burning villages. Slew the dragon, 3 Rangewatchers killed, Montolio had his face burned off. His face was saved but his eyes were beyond repair. Montolio could not deal with the pity, he came to Dead Orc Pass to die (and to kill orcs).
Owns a unicorn head pendant (symbol of Mielikki)
Says that Guenhwyvar is in service to Mielikki
“The heart of a ranger is a heart of Mielikki”
Montolio uses his animals to alert caravans moving through Dead Orc Pass, Graul wants Montolio dead but his shaman is scared of the blind ranger (believing him bad magic)
Graul and his orcs attacked Montolio’s Grove. A hundred orcs, 10 worgs, a giant, and Caroat the winter wolf were slain in the attack.
Montolio died in his sleep that winter.
Citadel Adbar lies northeast of Montolio’s Grove.

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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore

USA
1122 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  17:58:59  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison

Excellent find, and if i recall correctly didnt Augloroasa have a host of thieves and spies working for her, so she could have easily arranged the phylacteries to be stolen in order to remove competition in her territory and to allow her to gain power in the Cult of the Dragon (pretending she wanted to become a dracolich).



She has manipulated the Night Knives thieves guild out of Selgaunt in the past and has charmed adventurers to do her bidding, too.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  18:09:37  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I'd never really thought about internal strife in the cult of the dragon before but it must be quite common.

You have the senior members that are allied to different dracoliches or prospective dracoliches, and they can call on their aid for favours and treasure. Then there are those in service to the senior members who derive their power from their boss, and then there are those who actively guard the dracolich lairs to keep the power bases safe.

When a dracolich is killed a great swathe of members are bereft of their most powerful ally, and the other dracoliches or dragons would quickly want to secure more power for themselves, so if they can have the phylactery stolen then more cultists will serve them and more money will enrich their hoards. Then there is the division of wealth from missing dracoliches. Without a dracolich at their back, senior cultists would be missing a key ally and so might actively use their old patrons hoard to bargain patronage from another dracolich.


Plenty of potential for intrigue within a cult cell, and then you have outside infiltration like the zhents

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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  19:23:12  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well Sojourn wasnt all that bad, i think i prefer aboveground to Underdark novels. A few bits of potential lore in here, the naming is truly awful though - Lagerbottoms (is lager even a thing in Faerun), Mooshie (Montolio DeBrouchee, i cant even begin to think how i can phonetically rewrite that name to be realmsian), Roddy McGristle (rolling dice and looking up words in the dictionary based upon page and line number on the dice?).

Got a new weapon to detail, Bleeder, sounds like a dwarf weapon that Roddy took off an orc. A few names of dragons to place. Montolio appears to have taken part in some big wars at some point in the last 50 years, and then got his face burned off by a red dragon, so thats something i can try and place.

This novel along with several others has reinforced the impression i have that the entire Ranger "class" is all based upon some old religious or secular order that was dedicated to protecting the settlers of the Savage Frontier probably in times shortly after 0 DR. I'm going to guess that it was actually set up by elves that wanted to protect the humans so they could survive and take over the mantle of keeping the orcs out of the North.

A new Ilmatari monastic order in the Weeping Friars, they hurt themselves so others suffer less (believing there is a finite amount of pain in the world), could be a loviataran, ilmatari heresy because these monks are more often beggars and thieves that are not popular in the North.

Thankfully its a few books before i have to read another RAS novel, get some variety in the style.

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ElfBane
Learned Scribe

USA
235 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  22:01:03  Show Profile Send ElfBane a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison

- Lagerbottoms (is lager even a thing in Faerun)



WHAT!? Ya can't have the Realms without Beer!!!!
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore

USA
1122 Posts

Posted - 10 Aug 2020 :  22:23:19  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by ElfBane

quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison

- Lagerbottoms (is lager even a thing in Faerun)



WHAT!? Ya can't have the Realms without Beer!!!!



Aurora's got ya covered:

"GOLDEN SANDS BREWS: Southern brews, including these Calishite beers, are rare, interesting, and lighter drinks called lager."

Edit: Page 127 of Aurora's Whole Realms Catalogue in case you need the full reference.

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents

Edited by - TheIriaeban on 10 Aug 2020 22:25:43
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1180 Posts

Posted - 11 Aug 2020 :  00:26:07  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I know it's not strictly lore related, but it always bugged me that Roddy got away with murdering Dove's friend. I would have thought Dove (if not Drizzt or others) would not let Roddy just go away after murdering a powerful ally of a Chosen of Mystra. In the graphic novel, Roddy doesn't murder anyone, which I think works better for the narrative.
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader

United Kingdom
6026 Posts

Posted - 11 Aug 2020 :  07:57:36  Show Profile Send Gary Dallison a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Roddy was a truly despicable human being driven purely by hatred and pride.

I think he might have murdered a few of the weeping friars as well.

I havent a problem with him escaping justice, the realms is not a soap opera (despite the best efforts of TSR and WoTC to make it a divine soap opera), and sometimes baddies win, or at least get to keep their worthless hides.

I guess the difficulty might be in proving that Roddy murdered Kellendil (if he is indeed dead) and then tracking Roddy down). Roddy himself was a skilled tracker and could have covered the scene and hidden the body so no one else could prove he committed murder. Also he strangled Kellendil which leaves a lot of room for the elf to survive.

I will probably have Roddy end up in hiding out in the docks area of Luskan where he is just one of many criminals on the run and not such a big fish anymore. He would undoubtedly get in a fight over his wounded pride, and get a knife in his back for his troubles.

Bruenor casually hacking off his dog's leg and eating it, and then presumably leaving the dog to bleed to death, is the casual sort of cruelty I've come to expect from Bruenor, I'm not sure why he is liked so much.

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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1180 Posts

Posted - 11 Aug 2020 :  15:30:47  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Also Drizzt is really, really far from a ranger and demonstrates zero Ranger abilities or traits in many of the books. It's like dual wielding scimitars made him a ranger, rather than having a racial enemy, tracking, druid spells (which he never ever casts in any book ever), or a real affinity for the wilderness given he spends most of his life in Menzo and Mithril Hall / Silverymoon etc. Sojourn makes him a ranger I guess because of Montolio training him, but Drizzt would have been trained in fighting in Menzo, not rangering, and he's not with Montolio for most of his life/career or anything.
Did Bob ever address why Drizzt exhibits no ranger skills or abilities or spells in the novels? I know Bob knows 1st/2nd edition D&D rules where ranger Drizzt originated.

Edited by - Seravin on 11 Aug 2020 15:31:44
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore

USA
1122 Posts

Posted - 11 Aug 2020 :  22:15:23  Show Profile Send TheIriaeban a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Gary would have to answer for sure since he has read the book much more recently than I have but doesn't he track those Hooked Horrors in the first book?

"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."

My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore

Canada
1180 Posts

Posted - 12 Aug 2020 :  13:06:32  Show Profile Send Seravin a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hmm I guess that's the case, but who trained him as a ranger in Menzo given that was before he met Montolio? I think I've read that his low wisdom score prevents him from casting druid spells as a ranger, which is kind of funny given how he's supposed to have the wisdom of Solomon based on his Mary-Sue qualities and diary entries reflecting on life.
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