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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Oct 2007 : 18:02:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Charles Phipps
quote:
Five generations of Oboulds -- not necessarily five generations of the general orc populace.
Which could be significantly more given Obould I was Chosen of Gruumsy.
Or significantly less, since rulers often fail to live to old age. |
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Crust
Learned Scribe
USA
273 Posts |
Posted - 08 Oct 2007 : 19:00:15
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Certainly it's true that most orcs (if not all orcs) seek only to die in battle in the name of Gruumsh. It's even mentioned in the novel a couple times. Most humans, dwarves, elves, halflings, etc. would rather NOT die in battle, so that major difference in philosophy might trump any good/evil ambiguity.
It also makes another subtle reference to our own world.  |
"That's right, hurl back views that force ye to think by name-calling - 'tis the grand old tradition, let it not down! Anything to keep from having to think, or - Mystra forfend - change thy own views!"
Narnra glowered at her father. "Just how am I to learn how to think? By being taught by you?"
"Some folk in the Realms would give their lives for the chance to learn at my feet," Elminster said mildly. "Several already have."
~from Elminster's Daughter, Ed Greenwood |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 09 Oct 2007 : 03:39:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Orcs have not, in recent memory, shown any signs of civilization beyond a tribal level. And they've shown little desire to advance past that level. So, I don't care who their neighbors are, and I don't care if they have magical healing. If these things weren't a factor in the past (as they obviously weren't, or we'd not be having this discussion), then they aren't a factor now.
And not only have they never shown a desire to be civilized, they've never shown any desire to suddenly be nice to their neighbors as well (ie. to trade rather than take by force).
I've started reading this novel, by the way--see my comments in the Book Club. I do agree that letting us know in the prologue that the orc kingdom would be successful and a "beacon of hope" ruins the surprise for the reader. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 09 Oct 2007 : 03:42:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Charles Phipps
True but Obould VI is also probably middle aged.
The book says he's "young", but of course he could still be middle-aged. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore
1425 Posts |
Posted - 09 Oct 2007 : 04:59:43
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quote:
Or significantly less, since rulers often fail to live to old age.
Given Orcish Lifespan and the massive timeskip involved, unlikely.
quote:
I've started reading this novel, by the way--see my comments in the Book Club. I do agree that letting us know in the prologue that the orc kingdom would be successful and a "beacon of hope" ruins the surprise for the reader.
I don't know, I don't think the reader's value from it is diminished because it's all about the build up to this improbable situation.
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My Blog: http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/
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Edited by - Charles Phipps on 09 Oct 2007 05:30:07 |
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Rinonalyrna Fathomlin
Great Reader
USA
7106 Posts |
Posted - 11 Oct 2007 : 01:48:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Charles Phipps
I don't know, I don't think the reader's value from it is diminished because it's all about the build up to this improbable situation.
I still would have prefered to be surprised. |
"Instead of asking why we sleep, it might make sense to ask why we wake. Perchance we live to dream. From that perspective, the sea of troubles we navigate in the workaday world might be the price we pay for admission to another night in the world of dreams."
--Richard Greene (letter to Time) |
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Charles Phipps
Master of Realmslore
1425 Posts |
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The Orc King prologue discussion (SPOILERS)
