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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
 Posted - 22 Oct 2007 : 16:11:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Zanan
Help yourself to page 53 of the Grand History. It explicatly spells that Jaezred is in fact the name of a clan of shadow dragons who conquered Chaulssin and eradicated the drow. The web-enhancement gives you the current population figures and the who's who there.
Clan Jaezred are the ones that enslaved the citizens of Chaulssin, yes. But, they have been defeated and the true citizens of Chaulssin took back what was rightfully theirs. Clan Jaezred failed to consider that their own tactics and magics worked against them. Thus, the Jaezred Chaulssin was born and the oldest Drow/Shadow Dragon is the Revered Grandfather. The true citizens were NOT eradicated, they were merely enslaved. If they were, the Drow/Shadow Dragon that created the Jaezred Chaulssin would have been dead and the Jaezred Chaulssin would have never existed.
Also, the WE that Mr. Boyd made for us, has the history of Chaulssin as well, it does not just have a few scant notes of who is there now. |
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDonLNKf6_KA9Qlal3Qu3zQ?view_as=subscriber |
Edited by - Drakul on 22 Oct 2007 16:16:17 |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2007 : 17:30:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Drakul
quote:
Originally posted by Zanan
Help yourself to page 53 of the Grand History. It explicatly spells that Jaezred is in fact the name of a clan of shadow dragons who conquered Chaulssin and eradicated the drow. The web-enhancement gives you the current population figures and the who's who there.
Clan Jaezred are the ones that enslaved the citizens of Chaulssin, yes. But, they have been defeated and the true citizens of Chaulssin took back what was rightfully theirs. Clan Jaezred failed to consider that their own tactics and magics worked against them. Thus, the Jaezred Chaulssin was born and the oldest Drow/Shadow Dragon is the Revered Grandfather. The true citizens were NOT eradicated, they were merely enslaved. If they were, the Drow/Shadow Dragon that created the Jaezred Chaulssin would have been dead and the Jaezred Chaulssin would have never existed.
Ifs and buts and a bit of hearsay.
quote:
Also, the WE that Mr. Boyd made for us, has the history of Chaulssin as well, it does not just have a few scant notes of who is there now.
What is it that you need to repeat to me what I have said before? But to spell it out:
Chaulssin (small city): Magical; AL CE; 15,000 gp limit; Assets
8,493,750 gp; Population 7,105 free; Isolated (zarithra [shadow draconic drow] 55%, z e k y l [half-shadow dragon drow] 44%,
draazekyl [drow-dragon] 1%); 4,220 slaves (dark bear [shadow
quaggoth] 48%, shadar-kaiFF 39%, drow 10%, spectral shadow
dragon 1%, other 2%).
Maybe you count the shadow draconic drow and half-shadow dragon drow and drow dragons amongst the drow too, IMHO the city has a population of some 700 drow and thus is no drow city any longer. For with the same authority I could claim that the city is lead and inhabited by dragons. And is surely not lead by a Vhaeraun (not any longer anyways) - worshipping cult of drow either. But we stray off topic here.
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Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 22 Oct 2007 17:33:59 |
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TobyKikami
Learned Scribe
USA
113 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2007 : 19:46:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Zanan
Maybe you count the shadow draconic drow and half-shadow dragon drow and drow dragons amongst the drow too
Maybe so. I haven't got the books with me right now so I could be overlooking something essential, but in War of the Spider Queen the part-dragon members of the Jaezred Chaulssin seemed to consider themselves drow, albeit part-dragon drow, not part-drow dragons, so it could still conceivably be considered a "drow city."
quote:
But we stray off topic here.
Okay, trying to steer back... Speaking of Vhaeraunite (or semi-Vhaeraunite) organizations, one thing I would have liked to see in this book was up-to-date coverage on, say, the Dark Dagger, or northeastern Eryndlyn (heck, all of Eryndlyn). Has the Dark Dagger network gone Harpery? Have there been massacres in Eryndlyn ala the Tower in Sshamath? I'm honestly curious.
Granted, there's not a lot of spare room for that, but then I have to wonder why this incredible pantheonic decimation got relegated to a trilogy while Lolth moving house warranted six books (in deckle-edge hardcover, at that). Unless they're going to pull another reset - hey, if the Grand History of the Realms can leave out key details of the ultimate outcome so as not to do like Power of Faerun giving away Last Mythal, what's stopping some of the key details from being "Selvetarm was hiding out in Godsbane the Crescent Blade all along, Vhaeraun's corpse is paper mache, and the name-wipe thing didn't work any better than it did the first time"? I can dream.
Not that I particularly want to wait longer for all this to be settled, but a longer series would give more space for interesting fluff regarding the assimilated Vhaeraunites or the not-covered Kiaransaleens (i.e. Larynda Telenna), and I wouldn't say no to even more on the Selvetargtlin. Then again, given the upcoming RSE, it may all be moot. |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2007 : 21:49:33
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| Not to start anything, Zanan, but you are the one that is not saying the exact same thing that I am saying. You keep on posting the lore, in your own words, yet, you act like you are the one that came up with the stuff. You say the Drow of Chaulssin were eradicated, yet, the history states that they were enslaved. Sorry, but you are the one that is contradicting yourself. I am not here for a heated debate. I am here to provide accurate info. And my info comes from actual sources and not from one that thinks he/she knows it all. So, how can what I have posted be hearsay, when it is backed up and confirmed by actual sources?? As for the Drow/Shadow Dragon, I count the Jaezred Chaulssin as being both. However, they began as Drow. Now, they are much more. |
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDonLNKf6_KA9Qlal3Qu3zQ?view_as=subscriber |
Edited by - Drakul on 22 Oct 2007 21:52:46 |
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Boccob
Acolyte
USA
1 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2007 : 21:56:17
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I liked the book and the series, but I can't decide if Eilistraee killed Vhaeraun or if Vhaeraun killed Eilistraee and is just masquerading as her to fool Lloth.
Also, since TWotSQ series, Lloth has gained Greater Diety status and you would think that her daughter would have no chance to defeat a diety who is so much more powerful than she is, because even if she did kill her brother (which I am not entirely convinced of) and took over his portfolio and worshippers that would only push her to Intermediate status at best.
Things that aren't so credible:
I don't believe that Cavatina could kill a balor demon lord so easily.
Nor is it very believable that drow high magic, even aided by Eilistraee, could wipe out Kiaransalee just like that.
I like Lloth (or Lolth if you prefer) and don't want to see her lose her place as head of the Drow pantheon. |
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TobyKikami
Learned Scribe
USA
113 Posts |
Posted - 22 Oct 2007 : 23:08:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Boccob
I liked the book and the series, but I can't decide if Eilistraee killed Vhaeraun or if Vhaeraun killed Eilistraee and is just masquerading as her to fool Lloth.
I like Vhaeraun well enough, but if the current Eilistraee turns out to be a corpse puppet it'll probably feel a bit like cheating. The viewpoint in the prologues and codas seems omniscient/limited third person focused on Eilistraee, and she of all people should know if "she's" actually Vhaeraun. This doesn't exclude something subtler, though.
quote:
I like Lloth (or Lolth if you prefer) and don't want to see her lose her place as head of the Drow pantheon.
I'm not so fond of her in herself, but I thought her regime did make a good backdrop for the rest of the pantheon, i.e. Selvetarm's (potential) angst and Vhaeraun's Men's Lib movement - though if "the rest of the pantheon" ends up consisting solely of Eilistraee, that's a rather different kettle of fish. |
Edited by - TobyKikami on 22 Oct 2007 23:09:25 |
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Inaubryn
Acolyte
40 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2007 : 05:54:40
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The Jaezred Chaulssin are most certainly drow. It is drow society that they are trying to "save". They are trying to wrest the drow from under Lolth's thumb. They were drow who stole Malaugrym secrets in order to split themselves into dragons. So, they now have both forms. If they weren't drow why would they even consider trying to change drow society and mindset?
And Vhaeraun ain't dead. Then again if he is... expect Lolth to come out on top as the only drow deity left. |
Edited by - Inaubryn on 23 Oct 2007 06:08:57 |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2007 : 11:13:13
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Well, TGHotR spells exactly what Clan Jaezred is and what the drow of Chaulssin have become. Same goes for the WE of Dragons of Faerūn. If there are different opinions on that, so be it. Just make sure that opinions are marked as such.
Do they want to "save" the drow from Lolth? Hardly likely. The Vhaeraunians simply want the power that Lolth and her priestesses excert on the race for their own. No good intentions behind their power play whatsoever - as is in fact always the case in religious conflicts.
Same goes for the dragons. They want to dominate and if it comes via religious help and over a powerful race, all the better. And all that should indeed be common knowledge.
In any case, we will soon* know what becomes of the Vhaeraunians, Eilistraee & Co.. One would hope that the authoress in question will shed some light on events in former Vhaeraunian enclaves such as Chaulssin and Ched Nasad too. I for one would not be surprised if the dragons simply switch their allegiance to Shar or the like.
*as in: June 2008 ... thanks to WotC. |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 23 Oct 2007 11:15:05 |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
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Lady Fellshot
Senior Scribe
USA
379 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2007 : 16:32:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Drakul
Sorry, but Vhaeraun wants some equality between both sexes, which is more than what Lloth will ever offer. Vhaeraun's Dogma is not to dominate, but to create a co-operative existance. This is just part of his Dogma. Straight facts and no hearsay.
I think I said something similar earlier in this thread, but I agree with you anyway. In any case, I can n't read the bookany more, lest it interfere with my own FR projects any more than it has.
I have to give up the cranes. Real life is calling for them. |
Rants and reviews that interest no one may be found here. |
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TobyKikami
Learned Scribe
USA
113 Posts |
Posted - 23 Oct 2007 : 17:39:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Drakul
Sorry, but Vhaeraun wants some equality between both sexes, which is more than what Lloth will ever offer. Vhaeraun's Dogma is not to dominate, but to create a co-operative existance. This is just part of his Dogma. Straight facts and no hearsay.
But then it's indicated that a number of his nominal worshippers in power, like the Dragon's Hoard and the Jaezred Chaulssin, play rather fast and loose with the letter of the (seemingly quite admirable) dogma. Which is a bit disappointing, but not altogether unexpected.
And it's too bad about the cranes. |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 11:19:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Drakul
Sorry, but Vhaeraun wants some equality between both sexes, which is more than what Lloth will ever offer. Vhaeraun's Dogma is not to dominate, but to create a co-operative existance. This is just part of his Dogma. Straight facts and no hearsay.
That is only his carefully worded dogma. If you read the novels or the sourcebooks, you see that this is simply not true. His clergy is utterly (and I call 99% males "utterly") male dominated, his priests and followers state again and again that they want to have the drow follow the "natural order" of how it should be, i.e. "males rule like everywhere else", and if you call that "gender equality" than there's something horrible wrong. Check out any other Faerūnian faith which is not gender-restricted and have a look how "gender equality" should work.
You see, you just have to look up any source on the Vhaeraunians, Lords of Darkness, that web-enhancement on Chaulssin and look for yourself how this "gender equality" de facto works. It is nothing but a complete vice versa of the roles played in a Lolthite society ... with only one difference: even female wizards are not allowed into powerful positions. So de jure, Vhaerauns dogma may call for "gender equality" and the like. In reality (just read the sources), you have to dig very deep to find even half a handful of "powerful" females among the Vhaeraunians THROUGHOUT their entire history within Realmspace.
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Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 24 Oct 2007 11:23:35 |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 12:01:53
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| Yet, by your site alone, there are 7 that show female followers of Vhaeraun. Thats more than a handful. Also, just because there are 7 known Traitor Priestesses/Masked Traitors, does not mean that there aren't any more. Thus, there is more equality than you think or know. |
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDonLNKf6_KA9Qlal3Qu3zQ?view_as=subscriber |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 12:28:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Drakul
Yet, by your site alone, there are 7 that show female followers of Vhaeraun. Thats more than a handful. Also, just because there are 7 known Traitor Priestesses/Masked Traitors, does not mean that there aren't any more. Thus, there is more equality than you think or know.
Now what? 7 priestesses throughout the 4,200 (in words: FOUR THOUSAND TWO HUNDRED) years of existence of Menzo and you tell me that is a sign of gender equality?
It just tells you how small the influence of the worship in that city was and that the number of females among his faith solely comes from "traitor priestesses", which, by lore, make up the 1% of his faith. If there would be "gender equality", his faith would not just have 1% of Masked Traitors, but 30 to 50 % female clerics or the like amongst his normal clergy too. But there isn't. By the same lore that holds his "dogma". |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 24 Oct 2007 12:35:39 |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 13:41:03
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At the risk of startin somethin, do you have problems readin things?? For some reason you always fail to read what people post. In case you missed it, I'll quote part of my recent post and bold it:
quote:
Also, just because there are 7 known Traitor Priestesses/Masked Traitors, does not mean that there aren't any more. Thus, there is more equality than you think or know.
If you continue missin key points in peoples' posts, then I don't know what to tell you, other than you did not write this lore or come up with the info that WotC has provided. Try not bein so superior, when you are far from it. |
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDonLNKf6_KA9Qlal3Qu3zQ?view_as=subscriber |
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TobyKikami
Learned Scribe
USA
113 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 15:32:12
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To be fair, it's hard to see drow females rushing in droves to an organization that supports redistributing the power they're used to holding - even Eilistraeens have issues with that. On the other hand, it's quite easy to see drow males signing up, seeing as they're at a disadvantage under the current regime and the "natural" desire would be a bigger piece of the pie.
There's a bit of a chicken-egg or whatever you'd call it: are/were there fewer girls worshipping Vhaeraun because of outright reverse discrimination, or because there honestly aren't that many who would want to join? |
Edited by - TobyKikami on 24 Oct 2007 15:32:50 |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 16:20:31
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Thanks for addressing my ability to read or comprehend, Drakul. I am not missing things, I just stated facts. I had hoped the reasoning behind that was clear enough, but if it shall need spelling:
DD says Vhaeraun wants gender equality, according to his "dogma".
DD says that 99% of his clergy are males. If that's not a clear indication of how he views gender equality, I'm asking you what is?!
DD says that his clergy includes 1% females and these are the Masked Traitors. To give some flesh to these bones, you cited that there are 7 known Masked Traitors within Menzo' history. A history that stretches for about 4,200 years. We do know of about exactly two more Masked Traitors, one is Shakti, the other comes from the BG II PC game. You could very well anticipate a few hundred or even thousand more, but there is nothing in the sourcebooks to validate such assumption. For ...
... given that we indeed have a tradition of Vhaeraunians on the surface, away from the cities ruled by the Lolthites, I am asking you here and now, why does his clergy, after even more than those 4,200 years since Menzoberranzan's foundation still includes 99% males? How does that sit with the dogma? And these 99% relate to a date roundabaout 1371 D.R., not some time in the past. Go and check, as I said, any recent novel or lorebook on the Vhaeraunians and tell me if you find something about gender-equality in there, any powerful females who have something to say in their political or clerical structure?
On the other hand, if you think that 1% of female members in a clergy does indeed show enough gender equality, I understand your point of view. |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 24 Oct 2007 16:21:34 |
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TobyKikami
Learned Scribe
USA
113 Posts |
Posted - 24 Oct 2007 : 17:41:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Zanan
... given that we indeed have a tradition of Vhaeraunians on the surface, away from the cities ruled by the Lolthites, I am asking you here and now, why does his clergy, after even more than those 4,200 years since Menzoberranzan's foundation still includes 99% males?
Are you saying here that given their own settlements and adherence to dogma as written, we should expect to see a gradual evening-out of the gender disparity in the clergy since there would be a roughly even number of male/female births and more of the girls would be initiated?
That does make sense, but consider that the birthrate may not be very high since they probably don't have many females with them to begin with, and even if a drow female would be okay with gender equality she'd probably draw the line at becoming a breeding machine (the Dragon's Hoard "solved" this by shipping in outcast surface elves, but their approach is openly admitted to be unorthodox). Besides, a good chunk of the clergy would continue to be drawn from disaffected males still underground.
quote:
tell me if you find something about gender-equality in there, any powerful females who have something to say in their political or clerical structure?
Well, Shakti Hunzrin stuck some kind of control-gem in the head of the leader of the Dragon's Hoard (with Vhaeraun's apparent blessing, at that). Would that be something to say? |
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Drakul
Senior Scribe
USA
367 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 16:58:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Zanan
Thanks for addressing my ability to read or comprehend, Drakul. I am not missing things, I just stated facts. I had hoped the reasoning behind that was clear enough, but if it shall need spelling:
DD says Vhaeraun wants gender equality, according to his "dogma".
DD says that 99% of his clergy are males. If that's not a clear indication of how he views gender equality, I'm asking you what is?!
DD says that his clergy includes 1% females and these are the Masked Traitors. To give some flesh to these bones, you cited that there are 7 known Masked Traitors within Menzo' history. A history that stretches for about 4,200 years. We do know of about exactly two more Masked Traitors, one is Shakti, the other comes from the BG II PC game. You could very well anticipate a few hundred or even thousand more, but there is nothing in the sourcebooks to validate such assumption. For ...
... given that we indeed have a tradition of Vhaeraunians on the surface, away from the cities ruled by the Lolthites, I am asking you here and now, why does his clergy, after even more than those 4,200 years since Menzoberranzan's foundation still includes 99% males? How does that sit with the dogma? And these 99% relate to a date roundabaout 1371 D.R., not some time in the past. Go and check, as I said, any recent novel or lorebook on the Vhaeraunians and tell me if you find something about gender-equality in there, any powerful females who have something to say in their political or clerical structure?
On the other hand, if you think that 1% of female members in a clergy does indeed show enough gender equality, I understand your point of view.
I did not say that they were from Menzo history. I said that there were 7 known Masked Traitors. As for what I have said and what you have said, well, they are completely different. You post something from a source and turn it around and make it sound different. I posted something from the source and made it sound as it is supposed to sound. You do miss other peoples' points and you do it rather often. I will repeat something I revently said and this will be the last time I will repeat it. Just because there are 7 known Masked Traitors, does not mean that there aren't more of them out there.
As for Vhaeraun havin mainly males in his clergy, well, lets think on that, shall we?? The males are tired of being under the rule of Lloth, and rightfully so. Therefore, it is obvious that he would start with the males. The females, few in his clergy, or perhaps not, will be difficult to sway. As they are trapped by the tyranical rule of Lloth. After all, they used to co-exist with their cousins on the surface.
I suggest that you keep others' points of view in mind and consider them. We do consider yours, however, your posts seems to claim that you wrote the stuff and not WotC. We are all 'experts' in Faerūnian Lore, some more than others. So, try to be more considerate in the future, if you can manage that. |
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDonLNKf6_KA9Qlal3Qu3zQ?view_as=subscriber |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:00:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Drakul
I did not say that they were from Menzo history. I said that there were 7 known Masked Traitors.
Yes, of course. All found in Menzo's history by none other than myself - in the Menzo boxed set. So there is no relevance whether you named the source, it is simple fact. Just check the said source for yourself. And rest assured, there are no more bar Shakti and that BG II lass anywhere else in written lore.
quote:
As for what I have said and what you have said, well, they are completely different. You post something from a source and turn it around and make it sound different.
How can that be? I simply stated what is in the book. I did not change a word of that. What can be misunderstood in a 99% male clergy?
quote:
I posted something from the source and made it sound as it is supposed to sound.
Which elevates you into the position of someone who KNOWS how things should be read, yes? No, you have your opinion on that and have every right to present it as such. No problem whatsoever. Just do not tell othes how they should read books or understand them. For omnipotent folk like that will soon find themselves pretty isolated.
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You do miss other peoples' points and you do it rather often.
Thanks for the insult.
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I will repeat something I revently said and this will be the last time I will repeat it. Just because there are 7 known Masked Traitors, does not mean that there aren't more of them out there.
Fine. You said it before. It was understood. Please care to read my reply saying: It is your every right to believe that there are more, but we have no knowledge of more, whether in lorebook or novel.
quote:
As for Vhaeraun havin mainly males in his clergy, well, lets think on that, shall we??
I did that before really.
quote:
The males are tired of being under the rule of Lloth, and rightfully so. Therefore, it is obvious that he would start with the males. The females, few in his clergy, or perhaps not, will be difficult to sway. As they are trapped by the tyranical rule of Lloth. After all, they used to co-exist with their cousins on the surface.
Now, I kindly remind you of the point I made above: It would be a reasonably fair assessment for ... let's say a couple of hundred years or so. But we talk of a clergy that has developed for millenia, more than 13 millenia to be precise. And you really want to reason that even after that long a time, the males are still not trusting a few hundred generations of females born right between them? And thus, at 1371 D.R. still have a ratio of 99:1 between males and females?
May I remind you that after even two years, quite a number of Eilistraeens did indeed trust their new-found ex-Vhaeraunian brethren? As described in LP II. Maybe not whole-heartedly, but we speak of just two years.
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I suggest that you keep others' points of view in mind and consider them. We do consider yours, however, your posts seems to claim that you wrote the stuff and not WotC. We are all 'experts' in Faerūnian Lore, some more than others.
No insult intended here, but that's simply not true. I do not claim anything, I relay facts as given in sourcebooks. I did exactly that in my last post and went on asking questions whether - after considering these facts - you still want to uphold your claim that Vhaeraun is after "gender equality", as described in his dogma. So far, you did not answer the question(s), but tell me that I ignore your points or keep misunderstanding you.
And let me be precise here: I do not want to know what might be possible or what could be there. I want your opinion on whether you really think that the Vhaeraunians of Faerūn are actually doing what their deity's dogma says. And before you write an answer to that, consider what I wrote above.
quote:
So, try to be more considerate in the future, if you can manage that.
Again, you make it personal (CoC and all?). No need for that or any other form of lecturing.
And while we are at it ... it is good to know that all this goes out of the window after LP I and II. As it looks, there's all said on the topic of this thread and this debate looks more like dragging on for nothing but debate's sake. Which is not to say that I wouldn't like to see a good answer to my initial question, Drakul. |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gęš a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerūn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 25 Oct 2007 23:10:37 |
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TobyKikami
Learned Scribe
USA
113 Posts |
Posted - 25 Oct 2007 : 23:49:05
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quote:
And you really want to reason that even after that long a time, the males are still not trusting a few hundred generations of females born right between them?
So a few hundred more generations of females are born into Lolth's society and taught of their gender's superiority. Why would they trust those females more? And as I said, you can't count on an influx of births to even it out given that they wouldn't have that many female adherents to give birth to begin with; you can, however, count a lot more on the recruiting from those few hundred generations of males in the interim.
By the way, here's another bit of fluff conspicuous by its (apparent) absence: Where's Jezz the Lame got to? So far as I can tell he shows up at Malvag's meeting in Sacrifice of the Widow, tells them it's a stupid idea, walks out, and... what? Continues harassing the Dales to this day? Falls into a plot hole? Packs up and moves to Kara-Tur? Without even an "I told you so?" |
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Arkhaedun
Senior Scribe
869 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2007 : 00:29:15
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| I'm really tired of the sniping and flared tempers here. I'm closing this one pending reveiw. if you have any questions, PM a mod. |
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Storm of the dead (Spoilers)
Topic Locked
