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Aglaranna
Learned Scribe
166 Posts |
 Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 16:46:22
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Well, my usual philosophy is "Observe until you figure it out", but I got impatient. Hee hee. So, where'd the idea for truename come about, and what's it for? How do you know what your truenameis? And no...I'm not telling you mine!
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"You can choose a ready guide
In some celestial voice
If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears
And kindness that can kill
I will choose the path that's clear
I will choose freewill." -'Freewill' by Rush |
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Aureus
Learned Scribe
Luxembourg
125 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 16:48:20
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| first name or entire name? |
That is not the weirdest thing that happened to me |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 17:16:34
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Pagan myths of Earth, basically. A lot of the old religions had/have the concept of true names. Big surprise there since D&D draws on a huge amount of pagan lore. Christian myth has some references to Gods true name as well. Alchemists and other early scientists/magicians used true names for different materials, beings, etc. Plus many different fantasy novels have used the concept.
As for how to figure it out.... I don't think there's a set way. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Aglaranna
Learned Scribe
166 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 17:22:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Aureus
first name or entire name?
Like in the Avatar Trilogy; Midnight's truename was Ariel Manx. Cyric overheard this and intended to controll her by it.
But Kuje, I'm still confused! How is that supposed to work? I'm trying hard not to break down in hysterics here! |
"You can choose a ready guide
In some celestial voice
If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears
And kindness that can kill
I will choose the path that's clear
I will choose freewill." -'Freewill' by Rush |
Edited by - Aglaranna on 29 Dec 2006 17:23:08 |
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Delzounblood
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
578 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 17:24:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Aglaranna
quote:
Originally posted by Aureus
first name or entire name?
Like in the Avatar Trilogy; Midnight's truename was Ariel Manx. Cyric overheard this and intended to controll her by it.
But Kuje, I'm still confused! How is that supposed to work? I'm trying hard not to break down in hysterics here!
Isn't your true name a name given to your soul by your god? or something.
I always thought it refered to your soul or spirit.
Delz
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I'm Back! |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 17:30:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Aglaranna
But Kuje, I'm still confused! How is that supposed to work? I'm trying hard not to break down in hysterics here!
I don't think any of us can give you a straight answer. Like was said above, true names are sometimes your spirit/soul, but it could also just be how you are named... Most modern pagans and or Wiccans also choose a magical name for themselves, which is basically the same concept of a true name, but there's no set system on how to do so. (And no, I'm not telling you mine.  )
But most true name/magical name concepts from Earth is just like what was in the ToT novel. If you know the persons true name/magical name, you have power over them and can control them. A lot of creatures from Earth's myths had/have true names, which you needed to know to summon them. Which is why that is still carried over into D&D for the beings on the planes. Etc.
I'm really not that comfortable discussing the Earth version of true names/magical names on the boards, but you were only getting a few answers, so I jumped into this topic. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 29 Dec 2006 18:13:45 |
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Aureus
Learned Scribe
Luxembourg
125 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 18:00:31
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Ah, now I get it
Drizzt was able to summon Errtu (is the spelling right?) because he knew the demon true name, dispite the fact that he can't cast any spells, only his drow spell-like abilities (sorry if I spoiled)
often the name describs what the being is and/or how it behaves
for exemple my D&D char's name is Aureus because he has a heart of gold (of course not literally you greedy dwarfs:P), meaning that he is a nice guy (aureus is latin and means "golden" for those who didn't know, but that's just excuse to me i just like the sound of the word) and my char's pet is Imbellia which is latin for "unfit for war", the wolf is a free hunter, not a killing tool like a soldier (again that's just an excuse, I just liked the word, in fact I looked in a latin dictionarie for something I could use as a name and Imbellia had a nice ring, got it? ;)) |
That is not the weirdest thing that happened to me |
Edited by - Aureus on 29 Dec 2006 18:18:35 |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 18:15:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Aureus
Ah, now I get it
Drizzt was able to summon Errtu (is the spelling right?) because he knew the demon true name, dispite the fact that he can't cast any spells, only his drow spell-like abilities (sorry if I spoiled)
often the name describs what the being or how it behaves, for exemple my D&D char's name is Aureus because he has a heart of gold (of course not literally you greedy dwarfs:P), meaning that he is a nice guy (aureus is latin and means "golden" for those who didn't know, but that's just excuse to me i just like the sound of the word) and my char's pet is Imbellia which is latin for "unfit for war", the wolf is a free hunter, not a killing tool like a soldier (again that's just an excuse, I just liked the word, in fact I looked in a latin dictionarie for something I could use as a name and Imbellia had a nice ring, got it? ;))
Pretty much, yup. :)
Alchemists and the early magicians and pagans basically had/have true names for animals, plants, elements (not to be confused with the elements of science), beings on other planes, etc. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Kes_Alanadel
Learned Scribe
USA
326 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 18:19:21
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| I thought that there was a Dragon article about true names as well, but for the life of me, I can't find it on my bookshelf....... |
Ack! I seem to have too much blood in my coffee stream!
When did 'common sense' cease to be common? |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 18:30:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Kes_Alanadel
I thought that there was a Dragon article about true names as well, but for the life of me, I can't find it on my bookshelf.......
Denouncements: Truenames, "Power of Truenames, The", by Mark Jackman, issue 346, page (88), for 3e.
or
Fetishes: For characters with truenames, "Truenames and Fetishes: The Power and the Peril", by Philip M. Greeley, issue 317, page (42), for 3e.
or
Truenames, "Truenames and Fetishes: The Power and the Peril", Philip M. Greeley, issue 317, page (38), for 3e.
According to the Dragondex. :)
There's also the Tome of Magic 3.5e sourcebook that has a whole chapter of true name magic. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 29 Dec 2006 18:33:09 |
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Kes_Alanadel
Learned Scribe
USA
326 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 18:33:36
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*Grin* Thanks much Kuje. I thought I was losing what little mind I had left.  The Truenames and Fetishes article was the one I was thinking of.
(Figures that I was posting the same time you were editing) |
Ack! I seem to have too much blood in my coffee stream!
When did 'common sense' cease to be common? |
Edited by - Kes_Alanadel on 29 Dec 2006 18:35:54 |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 18:42:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Kes_Alanadel
*Grin* Thanks much Kuje. I thought I was losing what little mind I had left. The Truenames and Fetishes article was the one I was thinking of.
(Figures that I was posting the same time you were editing)
Grin.
Well, we can't have you losing what little sanity you have left. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Besshalar
Learned Scribe
Finland
166 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 19:07:00
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And for nonrealmsian take on truenames read the Earthsea novels by Ursula Leguin.
Edit: The first four books are definite recommended reading for any fantasybuff anyhow. |
The large print giveth , and the small print taketh away.
-Tom Waits |
Edited by - Besshalar on 29 Dec 2006 19:08:08 |
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Aglaranna
Learned Scribe
166 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 21:33:41
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Why, thank you! Sorry about the hysterics...I'm a nervous wreck and now we all know it...But sometimes I wonder how certain things get thrown into the Realms. Ah, the curse of not being omniscent.
p.s. Are you sure I can't know your truename?  |
"You can choose a ready guide
In some celestial voice
If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears
And kindness that can kill
I will choose the path that's clear
I will choose freewill." -'Freewill' by Rush |
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Aureus
Learned Scribe
Luxembourg
125 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 21:50:01
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you can find them out simply by observing people ;)
the main character in Earthsea was pretty good at it if I remember correctly
tell me what I am |
That is not the weirdest thing that happened to me |
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Besshalar
Learned Scribe
Finland
166 Posts |
Posted - 29 Dec 2006 : 22:24:39
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I think the Fr truenames need to be spied or cheated out of their owners but yes in Earthsea Sparrowhawk (Ged) was extremely good at making educated guesses on peoples truenames...
As an addendum to my previous post :Oh and do not I repeat DO NOT just watch the scifi channel produced load of hogwash..... |
The large print giveth , and the small print taketh away.
-Tom Waits |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 00:55:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by Kes_Alanadel
I thought that there was a Dragon article about true names as well, but for the life of me, I can't find it on my bookshelf.......
Denouncements: Truenames, "Power of Truenames, The", by Mark Jackman, issue 346, page (88), for 3e.
or
Fetishes: For characters with truenames, "Truenames and Fetishes: The Power and the Peril", by Philip M. Greeley, issue 317, page (42), for 3e.
or
Truenames, "Truenames and Fetishes: The Power and the Peril", Philip M. Greeley, issue 317, page (38), for 3e.
According to the Dragondex. :)
There's also the Tome of Magic 3.5e sourcebook that has a whole chapter of true name magic.
Also, Ed's thoughts on truenames:- http://www.geocities.com/TimesSquare/Castle/2566/ed-truenames.htm
See Volo's Guide to All Things Magical and Seven Sisters also. The Book of Exalted Deeds also has a small section on truenames.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
Edited by - The Sage on 30 Dec 2006 00:56:05 |
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Marc
Senior Scribe
658 Posts |
Posted - 30 Dec 2006 : 14:04:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Aglaranna
So, where'd the idea for truename come about
In addition to what Kuje said, ancient cities like Rome also had a sort of a true name, the real name of the city was kept secret by high priests (pontifex maximus). They believed that if their enemies would learn the name the consequences would be catastophic
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36805 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2007 : 20:57:51
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
See Volo's Guide to All Things Magical and Seven Sisters also. The Book of Exalted Deeds also has a small section on truenames.
And Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (formerly a suppressed work  ) is available for free from the Wizards downloads page. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Aglaranna
Learned Scribe
166 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2007 : 21:32:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
See Volo's Guide to All Things Magical and Seven Sisters also. The Book of Exalted Deeds also has a small section on truenames.
And Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (formerly a suppressed work ) is available for free from the Wizards downloads page.
And since we all love Volo...*clicks link* |
"You can choose a ready guide
In some celestial voice
If you choose not to decide
You still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears
And kindness that can kill
I will choose the path that's clear
I will choose freewill." -'Freewill' by Rush |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jan 2007 : 23:59:48
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Oh, and I forgot... Ed also describes a few specific truenames for certain Realms NPCs and how they function for them in his compiled replies here at Candlekeep -- specifically the '04 and '06 files.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Daviot
Senior Scribe
USA
372 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2007 : 03:30:44
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| And if memory serves, there's at least a mention of truenames under Oghma in the Faiths and Pantheons sourcebook. I just don't have it handy currently. |
One usually has far more to fear from the soft-spoken wizard with a blade and well-worn boots than from the boisterous one in the ivory tower.
My Tabletop Writing CV. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2007 : 04:29:26
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Yes, there is.
'Tis the Oghmanyte ceremony known as "The Naming" whereupon a child follower of Oghma, when reaching the age of 12, is told his/her "True Name" that is said to represent the follower's true essence.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Tyr
Learned Scribe
225 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2007 : 15:50:39
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Yeah, I think the truename is the name given to your essence/spirit/whatever when you are first created and before you are actually born. Rather than your normal name that your character's parents give them or they take up for themselves.
Ariel Manx isn't Midnight's truename, its her actual name, atleast thats how I see it. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36805 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jan 2007 : 17:23:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Tyr
Ariel Manx isn't Midnight's truename, its her actual name, atleast thats how I see it.
She flat out said that it was her true name. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Truenames
