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Torkael
Acolyte
39 Posts |
 Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 17:19:12
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Are there any gods that hold the following portfolios?
1. Gambling
2. Time (past, present and future)
3. Stupidity/extreme simple-mindedness
4. Deformity, exile, outcasts
5. Plantlife (or death)
For (5) I'm looking into the idea that since plants are considered living beings, then they must go somewhere when they die... So is there a god of death for the plants? On a similiar note, where do animals go when they die?
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"No, I will not create a song dedicated to dancing dwarves. Especially dwarves worshipping Eilistraee." - Tenasa the bard |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36910 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 17:40:55
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Mystryl used to hold time. There's some debate on this, but I am of the opinion that, although it's not been specifically stated, Mystra 2.0 now holds the portfolio of time, but hasn't done anything with it.
Gambling isn't specifically covered, I don't believe, but both Beshaba and Tymora cover games of chance.
Plants are alive, indeed, but most of them don't have souls -- so they'd not need a deity or an afterlife. I think most non-intelligent animals would either not have souls, or would simply go to nature deities like Chauntea. Intelligent animals would either go to Lurue or to whatever deity most closely matches their alignment. |
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Aquanova
Seeker
USA
63 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 17:43:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Torkael
Are there any gods that hold the following portfolios?
1. Gambling
2. Time (past, present and future)
3. Stupidity/extreme simple-mindedness
4. Deformity, exile, outcasts
5. Plantlife (or death)
For (5) I'm looking into the idea that since plants are considered living beings, then they must go somewhere when they die... So is there a god of death for the plants? On a similiar note, where do animals go when they die?
I'll try to tackle this the best I can. 
1.) Not that I know of, but Tymora/Beshaba would be the best bet, seeing as gambling is itself almost entirely dependant on luck.
2.) Labelas Enoreth of the Seldarine is currently the only deity (of whom I know) who has the Time portfolio. He also has Longevity and History as portfolios.
3.) Stupidity would belong to Bahgtru of the Orc pantheon. 
4.) Ghaunadaur of the Dark Seldarine has Outcasts in its portfolio. After that, it breaks down into specifics, such as race.
5.) Not that I really know of... I think that maybe Talona could be a stretch, since her Blightlords tend to control/destroy/infect plants... but there really isn't anything concrete at all as far as that portfolio goes, at least to my knowledge. I'm sure some of the older members here may be able to think if there were some older deities or gods of certain races who are centered on plants....
EDIT- OMFG Rupert got in before I finished my post.  |
Edited by - Aquanova on 01 Oct 2006 17:44:51 |
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Torkael
Acolyte
39 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 18:04:25
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So no one really claims gambling?
I still find it hard to grasp the difference from being alive and being alive with a soul  Blame it on the upbringing...
A thought just popped up regarding stupidity... The god itself doesn't need to be an idiot, as long as s/he appeals to them. Plus having simple minded followers would probably mean easier manipulation and better loyalty.
...
What are Ao's rules about rising to godhood again? |
"No, I will not create a song dedicated to dancing dwarves. Especially dwarves worshipping Eilistraee." - Tenasa the bard |
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Kaladorm
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1176 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 18:18:27
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| Plant death could well be covered by Rot and Decay. Last I read Finder Wyvernspur had those but I don't think thats corect anymore |
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Silvanus79
Seeker
USA
58 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 18:39:10
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I had never really considered before the fact that nobody has the time aspect in their portfolio. Interesting.......there're dozens of ideas there. And Kaladorm, I believe you are correct, he received them from Moander, though I am fairly certain he doesn't have them anymore. Could one of you experts expand on this? I think I missed a story or something. As for the gambling portfolio, I would partially agree that Tymora and Beshaba both hold a little sway over this, but as a chronic poker player, I can tell you that there is a significant amount of skill involved in gambling, so those two might not quite work...
Now, as for stupidity, who knows. Maybe there is one out there. I know that if I was the god of stupidity, I wouldn't want that aspect of my portfolio published....... |
Procrastinators unite! Tomorrow. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36910 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 18:58:00
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Tymora and Beshaba both sponsor a lot of gambling, and it's not uncommon to find gambling in their temples and even in their domains. And while skill may be involved, luck is still a huge factor. So, even though neither one formerly claims gambling as a portfolio, IMO it clearly falls under their jurisdiction.
I don't see a need for a deity of stupidity... Who want want to worship the god of idiots?
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Silvanus79
Seeker
USA
58 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 19:25:21
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| Actually, now that I think about it, I believe Oghma would be the god of stupidity. To clarify, he is the god of knowledge. Nowhere in his portfolio does it say that he is the god of those who have knowledge any more than those who do not. So, is it not safe to say that he also presides over the lack of knowledge? Stupid people simply haven't been blessed by Oghma, and as such are less intelligent than the rest of us. In other words, knowledge is something that everyone possesses, just in different degrees, and as such, Oghma would preside over all of it. |
Procrastinators unite! Tomorrow. |
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Kaladorm
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1176 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 20:08:19
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Interesting point there Silvanus. Most portfolios tend to have a counter i.e. Tempus and war, Eldath and peace; Tymora and good luck, Beshaba and bad luck. However I don't think we can extend that idea for all porfolios (or maybe even Oghma's)
Whilst he would certainly hold the portfolio over all knowledge, he would probably find it highly distasteful to be known as governing those with so little knowledge to be called stupid. Perhaps he would, being a good natured god, be willing to accept those who are stupid but willing to learn and actively seek knowledge, but not otherwise. After all, Torm would certainly not take those who abandon their duty, despite being god of it. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4695 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 20:19:10
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Hmm, instead of calling portfolio one of stupid, it might be better called something along the line of defending the weak, the meek, etc.
Many Paladin orders are expexted to provide aid to those unable to aid themselves.
The portfolio name is the problem. Give it a better lable and odds are good you will find many deities that in effect are patron deities for those of low ability. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36910 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 21:58:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
Hmm, instead of calling portfolio one of stupid, it might be better called something along the line of defending the weak, the meek, etc.
Many Paladin orders are expexted to provide aid to those unable to aid themselves.
The portfolio name is the problem. Give it a better lable and odds are good you will find many deities that in effect are patron deities for those of low ability.
Well, you could call it the god of the weak, or something, and Ilmater would likely cover it... |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Kaladorm
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1176 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 22:24:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
Hmm, instead of calling portfolio one of stupid, it might be better called something along the line of defending the weak, the meek, etc.
Many Paladin orders are expexted to provide aid to those unable to aid themselves.
The portfolio name is the problem. Give it a better lable and odds are good you will find many deities that in effect are patron deities for those of low ability.
Well, you could call it the god of the weak, or something, and Ilmater would likely cover it...
Ahh politically correct gods. 'No I'm not the god of the stupid. They prefer to be called intillectually challenged; |
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Silvanus79
Seeker
USA
58 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 22:54:04
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Does that mean we now have to refer to Umberlee as "The Occasionally Slightly Irritable with a Tendency to Lash Out at Random Victims Queen"? Or is Tyr now the "Physically Challenged God" because he's missing part of an extremity? We could go on for days about the politically correct versions of the gods...  |
Procrastinators unite! Tomorrow. |
Edited by - Silvanus79 on 01 Oct 2006 22:56:29 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4695 Posts |
Posted - 01 Oct 2006 : 23:20:12
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| I do not think of it as a matter of politically correct, just that it strikes me as odd a profolio (which is an assept of the deity) to have such a limitation. Stupid deities do not tend to do well as far as rank, interaction, etc. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2006 : 01:53:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
Mystryl used to hold time. There's some debate on this, but I am of the opinion that, although it's not been specifically stated, Mystra 2.0 now holds the portfolio of time, but hasn't done anything with it.
I'm between interpretations for the most part... I'd like to think that just because it isn't listed, doesn't mean Mystra 2.0 doesn't have access to it. Rather, its absence likely reflects the lack of emphasis the current Mystra has placed on the portfolio and thus, the fact that she, as Wooly said, gains no power from it.
However, I also acknowledge the fact that the original Mystryl had other portfolios that were largely claimed by several other deities after she was destroyed. For example, song, spellcasters, spring and invention. That is, unless there was a lore-reason for why would the portfolio of time was specifically singled out and handed over to Mystra, in spite of the fact that we've already seen that the first Mystra didn't gain all the same portfolios that Mystryl had claimed, even though Mystra 1.0 was the reincarnation of Mystryl.
As is it... I'm more inclined to accept what we've now established as "plausible fact" until we have heard otherwise. I'm content to believe that the Time portfolio is currently unclaimed in the human pantheons (though held in the elven pantheon by Labelas)... it's largely supported by the lore and we've seen nothing to suggest otherwise at this point.
Alternatively, I can also see Jergal ending up with it.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2006 : 01:54:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Aquanova
2.) Labelas Enoreth of the Seldarine is currently the only deity (of whom I know) who has the Time portfolio. He also has Longevity and History as portfolios.
Interestingly, I've thought about the possibility that the Time portfolio may have ended up in the hands of Labelas...
To which, Eric added:- "...depending on whether you see the human kingdom of Orva being a Netherese survivor state."
Orva's status as a human kingdom is probable, according to Eric, who said:- "I add the [probable] qualifier because I had to insert a little bit of Realmslore in Demihuman Deities in the write-up of Labelas Enoreth. (Look at the alias list.) This was to patch up the lack of a time portfolio among any human Realms god and because the only gods left to detail at the time were nonhuman gods.
--Eric"
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2006 : 09:45:55
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Well from memory it seems to me that the Volo guides generally presented a connection between gambling halls and Tymora. Plants would in my opinion be divided in some fashion between Silvanus and Chaunthea, with Moander and Talona as a corrupting factor.
As for a god of stupidity, with the gods basically being manifestations of their portfolios, do you think this god would even understand his own divinity ( for some reason I am sure it would be a male god if it existed) and why would any one pray to a god of stupidity? Maybe there is a sort of demon tempting sages and thinkers from acting according to their sense, but not a god as I see it.
There could of course also be a heresy of Tymora advocating acting against common sense so as to put your life in the hands of faith and luck and with that giving ties of stupidity to the gods of luck/ill-luck. I know this one is a bit far fetched. |
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Another gods question
