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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
 Posted - 11 Apr 2006 : 23:45:17
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Has anyone used this race of pacifistic orcs in their game? I think they are pretty neat.
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Halidan
Senior Scribe
USA
470 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2006 : 21:04:32
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In a campaign I ran several years ago, my players all strted out as the slaves of an orc tribe in the Turnback Mountains, north of the Moonsea, on the western edge of the Tortured Lands.
After the players escaped, they encountered a dying orcish priest of Eldath. With his last breaths, he told the players that slavers had captured his acolytes and asked them to rescue the youngsters.
The players tracked down the slavers over the course of several days and assaulted their camp. They were a bit surprised to find out that the acolytes were 15 Ondonti youth. After the rescue, the players escorted the Ondonti back to their village. The youth were all members of the one remaining free Ondonti tribe (the one guarded by a water elemental servant of Eldath). They stayed with the tribe for several weeks, learning about their culture and history.
The Ondonti weren't the main focus of the campaign, but they made a nice side-adventure with an interesting and little know culture of the Realms. |
"Over the Mountains
Of the Moon
Down the Valley of the Shadow,
Ride, boldly ride,"
The shade replied,
"If you seek for Eldorado!"
Edgar Allen Poe - 1849 |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2006 : 21:52:56
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| Now that's an interesting side quest. |
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Reefy
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
892 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2006 : 01:22:31
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I'm playing a cleric of Eldath in Kaladorm's PBEM game (http://www.candlekeep.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=3966) and my character has an ondonti pupil of his, who has founded a small shrine near Lake Eredruie.
I like them as a race and am hoping we may get a mention of them in Mysteries of the Moonsea. |
Life is either daring adventure or nothing. |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2006 : 03:42:46
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| In an online game I've introduced ondonti Eldathyn paladin NPC. One of the things I just love about the Realms is all the interesting details you can find even with a less popular facet like Eldath. |
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Reefy
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
892 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2006 : 20:31:34
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quote:
Originally posted by RodOdom
In an online game I've introduced ondonti Eldathyn paladin NPC. One of the things I just love about the Realms is all the interesting details you can find even with a less popular facet like Eldath.
Quite, to be honest I don't think I'd ever paid any attention to Eldath before now, I'd just skipped over her (and indeed, thought she was a male god for a while...) |
Life is either daring adventure or nothing. |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2006 : 19:25:40
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| The Faiths and Avatarssourcebook, though it is older than the new Faiths and Pantheons is chock full of Eldath info. |
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Reefy
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
892 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2006 : 00:35:35
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| I know, it's a great book. I converted some of the deity specific spells from there to 3E, if you're interested. And made a new Initiate feat for her, as I felt the Initiate of Nature was inappropriate. |
Life is either daring adventure or nothing. |
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RodOdom
Senior Scribe
USA
509 Posts |
Posted - 17 Apr 2006 : 04:03:18
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| Please share ! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2020 : 07:02:32
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REZ SCROLL
So the Ondonti...pacifist orcs.
How were they made pacifists? |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2020 : 07:11:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
REZ SCROLL
So the Ondonti...pacifist orcs.
How were they made pacifists?
They started as a large group of orc children raised by followers of Eldath, and eventually formed their own community and culture based on Eldath's teachings. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 22 Sep 2020 07:12:27 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2020 : 07:58:51
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I remember that part...what I don't understand is that if they are Orcs...how is their innate savagery kept in check? Their desire to eat flesh, their impulsivity and quickness to anger?
I"m not asking really if there is already something in writing...but what do people think would be done to change orcs so completely? |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2020 : 08:09:55
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| Also, and kind of a different topic: how do these orcs have innate spells? |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2020 : 15:00:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
I remember that part...what I don't understand is that if they are Orcs...how is their innate savagery kept in check? Their desire to eat flesh, their impulsivity and quickness to anger?
The point is that it doesn't exist. FR is more nuanced with innate morality than traditional D&D. Same thing goes for other races, like the drow.
Or you could just say that Eldath waved her hand (or her priests cast some spell) and all that stuff disappeared.
If you want to go for a "dark secret" kind of narrative, you could have the Ondonti as magically brainwashed by their priests from childhood (or something like that), and that being kept a secret, but that's icky to me. And really, it defeats the whole point of adding variant cultures of monolithic races, and of the attempt to add some value to the underwhelming aspects of traditional D&D worldbuilding.
On a side note, this:
"Their desire to eat flesh, their impulsivity and quickness to anger"
sounds a whole lot like *many* humans to me, and humans can be pacifists too, so there isn't much to justify here. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 22 Sep 2020 15:05:13 |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 22 Sep 2020 : 15:02:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
I remember that part...what I don't understand is that if they are Orcs...how is their innate savagery kept in check? Their desire to eat flesh, their impulsivity and quickness to anger?
I"m not asking really if there is already something in writing...but what do people think would be done to change orcs so completely?
I think this is "all nurture and no nature".
Orcs are not evil savage beasts at birth but if the only way to survive is to raid others and eat them they end up doing that, Eldath showed them another way.
Much later, the Kingdom of Many-Arrows achieved something similar when (some of) the orcs finally had a usable patch of land for their own and didn't need to raid for sustenance anymore. Although admittedly Many-Arrows was not a pacifist kindgom, but they were not bloodthirsty savage beasts either. |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 26 Oct 2020 : 09:33:07
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Senior Scribe RodOdom,
No, but I think the RP challenge of playing a pacifist is awesome and really hard!
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 00:20:15
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| The Ondti need some attention. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 04:49:14
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Great Reader Darden,
quote:
...how is their innate savagery kept in check? Their desire to eat flesh, their impulsivity and quickness to anger?
This is absolutely, in my view, the best and more relevant question here. If it is a genetic compulsion to behave the way they do, what is happening to facilitate such a radical change from their inherent nature?
I would be extremely interested in hear the very fine print details as to why it would be nurture over nature.
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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Demzer
Senior Scribe
877 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 10:12:13
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quote:
Originally posted by cpthero2
Great Reader Darden,
quote:
...how is their innate savagery kept in check? Their desire to eat flesh, their impulsivity and quickness to anger?
This is absolutely, in my view, the best and more relevant question here. If it is a genetic compulsion to behave the way they do, what is happening to facilitate such a radical change from their inherent nature?
I would be extremely interested in hear the very fine print details as to why it would be nurture over nature.
Best regards,
Read the replies above by Irennan and me, we got it covered. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11899 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 13:21:51
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You're all wrong. Totally absolutely wrong. Nope, don't tell me you're right, because you're wrong. The true secret .... you ready for it.... warning it's graphic... the worship of Eldath requires a certain medical procedure to be performed on orc male infants. It's called circumcision, and its meant to make it easier to keep them clean "down there". It causes great psychological stress on orc males in their infancy, and they never ever ever ever recover from it.
Or at least that's what a Leiran bard was singing about the other day. It was quite a catchy tune called "Bring back my foreskin to me", and it was lamenting the loss of such a vital element of orc biology.
"Briiinnnng Back,
Briiinnng Back,
Bring Back my Foreskin to me, to me
O Briiinnnng Back,
Briiinnng Back,
Bring Back my Foreskin to meeee," |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 29 Oct 2020 13:52:04 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 14:28:44
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LOL
On a different "note"...how do they innately cast spells if they are "just orcs"? |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 17:04:35
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Great Reader sleyvas,
lol, very nice.
What is truly remarkable is that with the layered meanings I had squirreled away in there, that you ultimately understood that I was clearly implying Orc foreskin. haha
quote:
Or at least that's what a Leiran bard was singing about the other day. It was quite a catchy tune called "Bring back my foreskin to me", and it was lamenting the loss of such a vital element of orc biology.
I believe this is the Leiran bard you were looking for the other day. This is another hit, beyond the foreskin song...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nNGKK_tv44
"Into the Mist" is obviously a very provocative, Leiran song. ;)
quote:
"Briiinnnng Back,
Briiinnng Back,
Bring Back my Foreskin to me, to me
O Briiinnnng Back,
Briiinnng Back,
Bring Back my Foreskin to meeee,"
Also, you really are good sir, missing out on your calling as a lyricist... just sayin'.
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3807 Posts |
Posted - 29 Oct 2020 : 22:05:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
LOL
On a different "note"...how do they innately cast spells if they are "just orcs"?
Eldath's blessing, probably. A deity granting a boon doesn't equal to a deity rewiring someone's breain.
You may ask what's the difference between a deity blessing someone with a few powers and blessing them with a more productive behavior. From a narrative standpoint, while making choices the result of something that isn't under the control of a character is a mistake (because narrative is about choices and understanding that you need to change to overcome obstacles), giving power isn't necessarily a mistake (though it can become one, depending on how you handle it). |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2020 : 23:47:05
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Great Reader Irennan,
Good point there. I think the ethic involved and the aims/goals of the deity as well, are going to play an integral part of that spell casting allowance.
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2020 : 00:52:27
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| It could be that their pacifistic nature was bred into them over time. The orc children were taken to Myth Ondath. It could be that the mythal there did something to them over time. 78 years is enough for a couple orc generations. As for the innate spells, that was very likely a gift from Eldath to help them after the Ice Queen destroyed their home. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2020 : 06:43:20
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Senior Scribe TheIriaeban,
That is an exceptionally cool idea. Imagine the gray orcs discovering this somehow and going into a religious frenzy over it! What a way to bring Eldath front and center into a campaign. I may have to steal that idea!
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2020 : 16:12:21
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I actually have an adventure idea around the Ondonti:
A monastery of Eldathan monks (Disciples of the Yielding Way--I have developed them based on the water philosophy of Aikido) was established in Daggerdale to help bring peace to the region. They get a mission from the Church to rescue as many Ondonti from the Citadel of the Raven as possible. Since the monastery was established through a campaign, they call on their PC friends to help them (so that a balanced party can be used for the adventure). If successful, I could see the released ondonti either staying at the monastery or if too many were freed, a new settlement created for them somewhere (perhaps in the Snakewood, under the protection of Duskwood Dell). |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2020 : 22:15:45
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Senior Scribe TheIriaeban,
My apologies in advance: I am stealing that though like the Chosen of Mask.
sorry, but not sorry, haha
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 22 Nov 2020 : 23:18:47
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If you want more information on the monastery, I can put that here. It's history, location, and other bits. For example, here are the level titles (I used the revised monk class as presented in Dragon #53) for the different monk ranks at the Monastery of the Three Streams:
Level Title
1 Novice
2 Initiate of the Rudiments
3 Initiate of the Elements
4 Initiate of the Principles
5 Brother
6 Disciple
7 Disciple of Secrets
8 Disciple of Mysteries
9 Immaculate
10 Master
11 Superior Master
12 Master of Mist
13 Master of Rain
14 Master of Snow
15 Master of Hail
16 Master of Springs
17 Master of Streams
18 Master of Rivers
19 Master of Lakes
20 Master of Oceans
21 Grand Master of the Waters
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"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 23 Nov 2020 : 00:25:28
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Senior Scribe TheIriaeban,
That is awesome! Thank you for sharing that. Though, I did notice something odd, and I was wondering if you may have an answer to it:
Why do you think the 12th title would be "Master of Mist", when that seems more Leiran? I mean, yeah, I get it: Eldath, water, etc. It just seems a little....comingled.
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 23 Nov 2020 : 05:51:55
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| Master of Mist sounds better than Master of Drizzle or Master of Sprinkle. Monks are supposed to not have an ego but I couldn't really see subjecting someone with that much skill (a level 12 monk) with a title that even the Monks of the Yellow Rose would make fun of. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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The ondonti
