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dannyfu
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
 Posted - 27 Mar 2006 : 05:07:38
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here's the prologue and first chapter: "www.o-love.net/realms/sam_las.html"
I'm not going to read the 1st chapter until the book comes out (this is my favorite series and i don't want to spoil it), but i read the prologue and i loved it!
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Edited by - dannyfu on 27 Mar 2006 15:12:05
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Beezy
Learned Scribe
USA
280 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2006 : 07:35:44
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| I have heard a great many things about the series. I own the first two but I put off reading them until the third one is nearly out because I have a tendancy to forget very important plot points and such. |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5696 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2006 : 08:35:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Beezy
I have heard a great many things about the series. I own the first two but I put off reading them until the third one is nearly out because I have a tendancy to forget very important plot points and such.
Well met
Indeed, this is something I hear often from Realms novel readers. In fact, I wish WotC would adopt something that I glimpsed in an Eberron novel recently (namely, The Grieving Tree), where 3 pages or so are spent on a complete recap of the previous book in the trilogy. I'm not sure whether this was the choice of the author or instruction from WotC, but with trilogy novels being released a year apart, it would certainly be a welcome addition. |
Alaundo
Candlekeep Forums Head Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
An Introduction to Candlekeep - by Ed Greenwood
The Candlekeep Compendium - Tomes of Realmslore penned by Scribes of Candlekeep
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Winterfox
Senior Scribe
895 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2006 : 08:38:31
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Er, that link? Broken. Try this.
The prologue actually has content this time; the one in The Farthest Reaches struck me as a repetition of the one in the first book. The tone is horribly melodramatic, though. But oh well; I've come to expect that in a certain sort of fantasy where the author can't quite strike the right note, mistaking graaand proclamations for tragedy.
The first chapter rudely greets me with, as usual, a description of Araevin's appearance and equipment. What joy. It's not like that hasn't happened in the first chapter of the last two books. I wish Richard Baker would find a way to integrate descriptions gracefully into the narrative rather than dump details in one-two paragraphs all at once. And he has to use "orbs" to describe eyes, too. Contrary to what many fantasy authors apparently believe, the orb-ness of eyes isn't visible. Eyeballs are spherical, sure, but I'm pretty damn sure you can't see the three-dimensional shape unless they're, y'know, hanging out of their sockets. The Simpsons-style eyes, maybe.
Araevin's coming across as impatient and most of the Evermeet (does anyone else find "Evermeetian" a godawfully cumbersome adjective?) High Mages as conservative to the point of being obstinate. I like it that they distrust him and don't just melt into puddles of goo in sheer awe of him. On the other hand, they seem to be portrayed as old-fashioned, slow-thinking people. I'm hoping Araevin's impatience wil return to bite him in the arse at some point and prove them right to some extent.
The chapter ends on an interesting enough note, but I'm hoping it won't lead to one more artifact chase. Haven't we have enough of those "gather components to assemble TEH ULTIMATE WEPONZ" plots in fantasy? (Or, for that matter, video games. Heh.) |
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dannyfu
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2006 : 15:15:05
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| hey everyone, i fixed the link. thanks to winterfox for pointing out that the link was broken, but you can click on it and it works just fine now. |
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The Blue Sorceress
Learned Scribe
107 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2006 : 23:20:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Winterfox
The first chapter rudely greets me with, as usual, a description of Araevin's appearance and equipment. What joy. It's not like that hasn't happened in the first chapter of the last two books. I wish Richard Baker would find a way to integrate descriptions gracefully into the narrative rather than dump details in one-two paragraphs all at once. And he has to use "orbs" to describe eyes, too. Contrary to what many fantasy authors apparently believe, the orb-ness of eyes isn't visible. Eyeballs are spherical, sure, but I'm pretty damn sure you can't see the three-dimensional shape unless they're, y'know, hanging out of their sockets. The Simpsons-style eyes, maybe.
Do you really expect that much out of FR fiction? It's based on a DnD campaign setting, for goodness' sake. It's perfectly acceptable writing for what it is, but if you want something truly literary you're going to have to look elsewhere, I'm afraid, because you're never going to get it in a FR novel or in any gaming-related novel period. It's a fool's errand to begin reading gaming fiction expecting anything more than entertainment. Baker's done a better job working within the limits imposed on him than many other authors. As far as I'm concerned, unless an FR novel...
1.) Fails to entertain me
2.) Is so poorly written that I throw it across the room in frustration and rage
or
3.) Is such utter drivel that it's not worth the two or three hours it usually takes me to read such a book
...I don't find it worth while to get up in arms about the quality.
quote:
Araevin's coming across as impatient and most of the Evermeet (does anyone else find "Evermeetian" a godawfully cumbersome adjective?) High Mages as conservative to the point of being obstinate. I like it that they distrust him and don't just melt into puddles of goo in sheer awe of him. On the other hand, they seem to be portrayed as old-fashioned, slow-thinking people. I'm hoping Araevin's impatience wil return to bite him in the arse at some point and prove them right to some extent.
Evermeetian is a clunker. It made me wince a little. But then what adjective would you have chosen? It's no better than if he'd written "the High Mages of Evermeet" over and over again.
quote:
The chapter ends on an interesting enough note, but I'm hoping it won't lead to one more artifact chase. Haven't we have enough of those "gather components to assemble TEH ULTIMATE WEPONZ" plots in fantasy? (Or, for that matter, video games. Heh.)
Of course I have, but the main audience for this novel -which, let's face it, probably isn't highly intelligent, well-read, college-educated adults with literary interests- probably can't get enough of it.
-Blue |
Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely.
I see your walrus and raise you a carpenter |
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dannyfu
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 01:46:28
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| I actually was an English major in college and I do consider myself well read. Although I am not expecting Paradise Lostquality when I read a Realms novel, and I do disagree with Winterfox as far as his opinion of Rich Baker's work, I agree with Winterfox in that there is a level of quality to be expected in the writings of a FR novel and that that statement was entirely condescending. Will FR novels go down as literary classics?- no. However to say that the audience of these books "probably isn't highly intelligent, well-read, college-educated adults with literary interests" is a crock. In fact, several gamers and D&D enthusiasts I went to highschool and college with were at the top of my class, two of my good friends in particular are finishing med school before this year is out. We all enjoy Forgotten Realms novels and it would be entirely false saying that we aren't "well read", "college educated" or "intelligent". I don't know who you game with Blue, but I don't think it's fair to make such a generalized statement like that. |
Edited by - dannyfu on 28 Mar 2006 01:51:09 |
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At your Behest
Acolyte
Germany
46 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 01:48:26
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Considering that from the code of conduct...
2. Be polite when reviewing any novels or products. If you didn't like the novel, then fine, let the author know with constructive criticism, not by a barrage of abuse or slating the whole book in an aggressive manner. On the other hand, if you liked the book, then please say so, I'm sure the author would love to hear that his work was appreciated by you
... there surely will be either some editing to be done or an inevitable end will come to that brief "discussion"....
Farewell,
AYB who has not yet read anything of the trilogy as I do not
yet have book three |
Beware the beast man, for he is the Devil's pawn.
Alone among God's primates, he kills for sport or lust or greed. Yeah, he will murder his brother to possess his brother's land.
Let him not breed in great numbers, for he will make a desert of his home and yours. Shun him, for he is the harbinger of death. |
Edited by - At your Behest on 28 Mar 2006 01:54:21 |
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The Blue Sorceress
Learned Scribe
107 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 01:55:19
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Gaming novels (and poor-quality fantasy novels in general) are an escapist endeavour, and the repetative plot elements are a part of that. The reader slip more easily into imagining himself as the main character because the plot is familiar. The character desciptions are bland because the reader places himself in the position of the characters, trying on the role of each in turn in order to have the sort of wish-fullfilment experience he was looking for when he picked up the book in the first place. The less there is to grab a reader who doesn't seek that sort of experience, the more there is to appeal to the reader that does, so long as all the character cues are there to tell him what sort of role he's imagining himself into.
-Blue |
Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely.
I see your walrus and raise you a carpenter |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 02:03:47
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Blue Sorceress,
I have to ask you to tone down your insulting replies and if you continue, they will be edited or removed. Yes, your posts are really condescending and insulting. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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The Blue Sorceress
Learned Scribe
107 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 04:44:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
Blue Sorceress,
I have to ask you to tone down your insulting replies and if you continue, they will be edited or removed. Yes, your posts are really condescending and insulting.
I wasn't aware that I was being insulting, but if that's the perception, I apologize.
-Blue |
Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely.
I see your walrus and raise you a carpenter |
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The Blue Sorceress
Learned Scribe
107 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 06:39:19
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quote:
Originally posted by dannyfu
I actually was an English major in college and I do consider myself well read. Although I am not expecting Paradise Lostquality when I read a Realms novel, and I do disagree with Winterfox as far as his opinion of Rich Baker's work, I agree with Winterfox in that there is a level of quality to be expected in the writings of a FR novel and that that statement was entirely condescending. Will FR novels go down as literary classics?- no. However to say that the audience of these books "probably isn't highly intelligent, well-read, college-educated adults with literary interests" is a crock. In fact, several gamers and D&D enthusiasts I went to highschool and college with were at the top of my class, two of my good friends in particular are finishing med school before this year is out. We all enjoy Forgotten Realms novels and it would be entirely false saying that we aren't "well read", "college educated" or "intelligent". I don't know who you game with Blue, but I don't think it's fair to make such a generalized statement like that.
I'm not saying that I think that the one who actually buy the books are lacking intellect, but that my impression is that the marketing gurus do. I apologize if I wasn't entirely clear in my meaning. I know that a lot of intelligent, well-educated people game and by gaming related fiction, and now and again I pick up an FR novel too. Nor am I saying that you have to be uneducated to enjoy gaming fiction. I've wiled away many an hour with an FR novel in my hands, turning pages just as eagerly as the next person. What I am saying is that part of the enjoyment comes from not expecting more from the novel than it can give me. They're fun, like an action movie you go to see precisely because it's got the right combination of explosions, classy, quotable one-liners, and attractive heroes.
quote:
And considering that from the code of conduct...
2. Be polite when reviewing any novels or products. If you didn't like the novel, then fine, let the author know with constructive criticism, not by a barrage of abuse or slating the whole book in an aggressive manner. On the other hand, if you liked the book, then please say so, I'm sure the author would love to hear that his work was appreciated by you
Actually, I'm not in any way attacking the novels. I've enjoyed the Last Mythal books and some other FR fiction.
-Blue |
Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely.
I see your walrus and raise you a carpenter |
Edited by - The Blue Sorceress on 28 Mar 2006 07:08:46 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36886 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 07:20:46
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| ...And maybe we could get back to discussing the preview of the third book? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 07:54:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
...And maybe we could get back to discussing the preview of the third book?
I thought that I asked this same thing, earlier. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Alaundo
Head Moderator
United Kingdom
5696 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 08:37:41
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Well met
As my fellow moderators stated, let us cease breaches of the Code of Conduct and get back to any discussions of this novel.
Winterfox, Blue Sorceress, if ye wish to discuss particular aspects further which irked ye to such a great point, then please take it to Private Messages. Thank ye  |
Alaundo
Candlekeep Forums Head Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
An Introduction to Candlekeep - by Ed Greenwood
The Candlekeep Compendium - Tomes of Realmslore penned by Scribes of Candlekeep
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 16:22:24
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I for one agree with Dannyfu and will wait until the 3rd book is released.
I have truly enjoyed the first 2 novels and want to see how the whole story plays out with the elves potentially returning from evermeet and reclaiming a couple of lost realms. Fflar has intrigued me and I am continually interested in Seiveril's leadership abilities/ hardships/ etc. |
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Aginor37
Acolyte
20 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 19:37:26
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I have to say, I really enjoyed the prologue. I always love seeing events from sourceboks written in literary form, and this was one that I always wanted to see more on.
I am also very interested in seeing if and how the prologue applies to the rest of the story. It could be that the most exciting event in the series has yet to shake the Realms. |
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dannyfu
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2006 : 23:04:00
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Like scererar has mentioned, Fflar and Severil's characters have interested me and I actually enjoy them most out of the cast of characters from this series. In many other posts I have been a huge supporter of the resurrection of Captian Fflar and I think he would make a wonderful addition to future FR novels joining the ranks of other epic level characters in the realms. He has a wonderful backstory and I would love to see other authors dealing with his life, post crusade and how he is coaping with life on a Faerun that is quite new to him. He isn't even that old. I believe Rich said he looked to be no older than 160 years(phew, so much potential to grow as a leader of the Returned elves) Plus he is wielding a baneblade and I don't know about the rest of you, but I love my magic swords! Anyway, let's just hope that he makes it out of Final Gate alive. It would really be a waste if he didn't. I can see Severil possibly dying, he has carried a "last ride" feel throughout the series and a noble battlefield death wouldn't surprise me. |
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Ioulaum
Acolyte
USA
18 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2006 : 00:59:02
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| Considering the prologue is about the Shinsree disappearing form Myth Dannar with the rulers blade. I get a feeling we will see the Rulers Blade and the Shinsree before the story ends. This is the part i been waiting for, for a long time. The return of the Shinsree and the reclaiming of Myth Dannar. |
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Bocklin
Learned Scribe
Germany
151 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2006 : 13:22:51
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Hi,
Not to restart the debate here above, but I feel that I have to clarify this before I give my impression on the preview (just to cover myself): I think that R. Baker is one of the most interesting FR authors out there (definitely in my top three) and I really like his writing, I have enjoyed the Last Mythal trilogy very much and I can't wait to read the third book in full.
That being said... the first chapter has left me with a bad impression.
Don't get me wrong, I am not the kind of person who judges on first sight, so I'll read the book and see where it goes. But I have a problem with this "let's piece the Gatekeeper's Crystal" together story.
We already had the situation of the heroes questing around to gather all the pieces of selukiira and I would not be so keen on now reading how they run around to gather the pieces of the Gatekeeper's Crystal. Twice the same schema in a trilogy would be a bit too much for me.
Let's trust that Rich has thought of something better and this will be resolved otherwise.
Bocklin |
Edited by - Bocklin on 29 Mar 2006 13:23:54 |
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Vainelus
Seeker
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2006 : 16:43:39
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| I have found the political strife between the Crusade and Evermeet to be one of the more interesting aspects of the story. If the Crusade does settle again on Faerun it will be interesting to see if they still acknowledge Queen Amlaruil as their ruler. As already stated by Ioulaum, the prologue hints at the return of the Shinsree and the rulers blade. If the Shinsree presents the blade to an elf that is a member of the Crusade, or keeps it herself how would the Coronal of Cormanthyr stack up against the ruler of Evermeet? Even if Myth Drannor remains controlled by fiends and the elves settle elsewhere the bearer of the ruler blade would be given great respect among the elven people and probably considerable influence. |
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dannyfu
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2006 : 05:54:15
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| where can i find more material on the srinshee? |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2006 : 05:59:47
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quote:
Originally posted by dannyfu
where can i find more material on the srinshee?
Elminster in Myth Drannor
Realms of the Elves in the Tears so White short story
Elminster in Hell (she has a appereance)
Cormanthyr Empire of the Elves
The Fall of Myth Drannor
Lost Empires of Faerun
Ed's comments, which are linked in my sig. Do a search through the indexes. |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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dannyfu
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2006 : 06:03:46
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| Kuje, thanks so much! I've got to say folks, the response time for specific inquiries of source materials on this site is nothing short of astounding! |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2006 : 06:16:57
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quote:
Originally posted by dannyfu
Kuje, thanks so much! I've got to say folks, the response time for specific inquiries of source materials on this site is nothing short of astounding!
El in Hell isn't really worth it, but I added it for a complete list. She's only in like a small chapter and that's near near the end. Of course, that novel is worth it, if you want to see more of Elminster and his memories. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
Edited by - Kuje on 30 Mar 2006 08:07:19 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36886 Posts |
Posted - 30 Mar 2006 : 07:40:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Kuje
quote:
Originally posted by dannyfu
where can i find more material on the srinshee?
Cormanthyr Empire of the Elves
The Fall of Myth Drannor
These two are available for free on the Wizards downloads page. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Final Gate preview
