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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
 Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 04:10:23
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Some other discussions have come up about various editions of D&D and the potential for future editions (which remains an unconfirmed rumor as of this point in time). I decided to do a quick and dirty timeline of the different editions so as to compare how long such things have taken in the past. Mind you, this has no specific bearing on future trends, but I did notice a few things. Also, I started in 1978, when all the little white booklets and magazine articles were finally put together into the Player's Handbook, DMG, and Monster Manual and were dubbed Advanced Dungeons and Dragons (around the same time that a boxed set of stripped down entry level rules were created called the D&D basic game).
1978- 1st edition AD&D
(1985- Unearthed Arcana, 1986- Wilderness Survival Guide, Dungeoneer Survival Guide)
Time between editions- 11 years, not counting the D&D formative years
1989- 2nd Edition AD&D
(1995-1996 Player's Options books come out)
Time between editions- 11 years
2000- 3rd Edition D&D
2003- 3.5 Edition D&D
Beyond the various editions and the minimum decade between their release, there is also a trend to put out, around the midway point, a series of books that alters and expands the current rules edition, without itself being a separate edition. Unearthed Arcana, the WSD, and DSG introduced new level limits, classes, races, and weapon and non weapon proficiencies to 1st edition. A TON of stuff was introduced in the Player's Option books for customization, and to clarify some of the rules on kits and the like.
That brings us to third edition. At one point in time, my gut reaction was that 4th edition would come out in 2009. Why? It was a little sooner than the difference between other editions, and it would give time for there to be the "mid edition" big rules changing books, which would be followed by reorganized Core books, and a gentle slide into the next edition, which would likely be announced in 2007, previewed in 2008, and released in 2009, which would be consistant with what happened with other editions.
I have no idea what will actually happen, and the release of 3.5 really threw a monkey wrench into things. If anything, in my opinion, 3.5 would actually push back any plans for a 4th edition, but that is just my opinion. I just wanted to get down, for the record when the editions came out and how much time was between them.
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 04:29:32
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Here's an easy way to look at it.
2000 - 3.0 is released.
Ignore 3.5.
2005-2006 - Player's Handbook II, Dungeon Master's Guide II, Tome of X series, and other supplements looking at expanding the rules. |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 04:36:22
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| That is kind of what I was looking at as the "halfway point," but thank you for pointing them out, as when I did my quick write up I for the life of me could not think of the supplements that made me remember this sort of "mid edition" expansion period. |
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 04:50:19
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| The interesting question is, how FR would evolve with a 4th. A new FRCS, I doubt it... |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 04:59:54
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Well, it all depends on the timeframe we are talking about. If its 2009 when 4th edition comes out (again, I have NO, ZERO, NOTHING to support that as a date, its just a what if statement), then 2010 for a new FRCS wouldn't be that strange.
Old Grey Box- 1987
Forgotten Realms Adventures Hardcover (Sort of an interim campaign setting book for 2nd Edition)- 1990
FRCS 2nd Edition- 1993
FRCS 3rd Edition- 2001
So the longest time we have had between FRCS type material is between 2nd Edition FRCS and the third edition harcover. We had an every three year thing going on for a while, but at least we did get some new good Realmslore out of it. And I still want more of those city summaries like we got in the Forgotten Realms Adventuers book. Those were awesome.
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Skeptic
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1273 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 05:08:47
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Forgotten Realms Adventuers what great yeah, cities, gems and the art object list!
A new FRCS implies reprinting again and again the same stuff... if only they could do lore like history, geography, politics, culture in different books than stats, that could help! |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4694 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 05:30:35
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Well not counting BD&D for the most part, which was palleral for a time.
D&D went from White book (perhaps .5 Edition)
to 1st.
then 1.5 with UA
then 2nd
then 2.5 (black book)
then 3.0 (a major revision and pulling in asepests of BD&D)
then 3.5
The revisions were 3 to 5 years apart, more toward 5 years IIRC the average. There has of course have been minor changes thoughout te years, Dragon articles, kits (and now new classes, feats, etc.) that might require a revised reprint. The problem is when, or if 3rd is considered so proken that a 4th Eddition is required. The web makes it posible to do revising quickly, but that tends to be free. The sale of product is what keeps a company going. However, clearly the product has to be sellable. Major retcons can shatter the existing fan base, unless the replacement is better. Design teams for replacement might be working on what might be profitible right now, I am sure some at least hold in future plans another core DMG, PHB and MM. The bean counters will offer their advice, the design team(s) will offer their ideas and so on. 2010 is as good a guess as 2020 considering the changes of communication, the open gaming liscesne, and other factors of the changing world. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6680 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 06:01:22
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Oh, I hope it's well after 2009 - it'll take me that long just to get a handle on those pesky things called "rules".
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36906 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 06:03:55
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| I don't know if you could call the Player's Option stuff a real half-edition... It was all optional, and didn't really change things if you ignored it -- unlike 3.5. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 10:39:39
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Oh, I hope it's well after 2009 - it'll take me that long just to get a handle on those pesky things called "rules".
-- George Krashos
Well, I'm here to help... |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2006 : 11:02:52
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| I know Wooly, I'm just saying there was a sort of re release of all the rulebooks centered around showcasing the Player's Option books around the "mid-point" of 2nd edition, but yes, those rules were never showcased the same way that, say, the rules changes and expansions in UA, WSD and DSG were. |
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2006 : 04:35:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I don't know if you could call the Player's Option stuff a real half-edition... It was all optional, and didn't really change things if you ignored it -- unlike 3.5.
I remember this time period as quite a change, in my opinion. I called it at that point 2.5 edition, new "updated" core books and quite a few options type source books too. I remember a couple of new players to my campaign and they both bought the new versions of the 2e rule books, kind of threw off the game and created more house rules to cover it up.
anyways, my 2 cents |
Edited by - scererar on 20 Jan 2006 04:38:41 |
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silverwizard
Seeker
Greece
76 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2006 : 14:02:55
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| Are you referring to the Player's Option books? If not, I was under the impression that the core rules were merely reprinted, not changed. I do not have an opinion, however; the revised 2nd edition PHB was my very first RPG book. |
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scererar
Master of Realmslore
USA
1618 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2006 : 17:24:08
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quote:
Originally posted by silverwizard
Are you referring to the Player's Option books? If not, I was under the impression that the core rules were merely reprinted, not changed. I do not have an opinion, however; the revised 2nd edition PHB was my very first RPG book.
there were some minor changes to the "re-printed" 2E core rules, I can not quote them now, it has been years I do remember however, 2 newer players came into the group, with these fine new books. At that time I was able to quote pretty much any page of major rule info. It could have been a lay out change only, but in my hazy recollect, I am remembering some rules changes also. Additionally, this was about the time that several sourcebooks came out for added flavor, high level play and such. I don't think the 2.5 idea was picked up much though, correct me if I am wrong fellow scribes |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36906 Posts |
Posted - 11 Mar 2006 : 18:02:29
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quote:
Originally posted by scererar
I don't think the 2.5 idea was picked up much though, correct me if I am wrong fellow scribes
Yeah, the Player's Option stuff came out, but then just kinda sat there... It was all optional, so pretty much all of the later stuff ignored the Player's Option stuff. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Mace Hammerhand
Great Reader
Germany
2296 Posts |
Posted - 12 Mar 2006 : 03:04:39
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Oh, I hope it's well after 2009 - it'll take me that long just to get a handle on those pesky things called "rules".
-- George Krashos
I quite agree. It took me years to switch from 2nd ed to 3.5 and I still need to wrap my head around it all. Plus I am used to winging most of it. Now most of it is handled by the rules...so now I really got to learn them.
The positive side to all of that is, my players are as eager to learn as I am  |
Mace's not so gentle gamer's journal My rants were harmless compared to this, beware! |
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Lysander
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2006 : 16:32:19
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| The PO (and one DM:O) books merit only about a 0.25ths of an edition (making them 2.25 edition ;) ) THere is exactly ONE module that was put out with PO in mind, and even then it was rather ignored. What PO did was change up some of the flavor rules rather than structural - e.g. spell points to cast spells versus spell level slots, or rangers without spells, and so forth. The combat and (mostly) spell systems were (for the greater part) untouched. |
Lysander
Defender of the Second Edition
Moderator, Project Gemengan, Worlds of D&D |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2006 : 17:06:23
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I'd also view the Player's/DM Option stuff as a sidetrack rather than part of the main lineage.
And the use of decimals like '3.5' is surely a rather crude propaganda to inculcate the idea that editions of D&D are, like versions of computer programs, part of some natural and inevitable improvement and 'evolution'.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36906 Posts |
Posted - 11 Apr 2006 : 17:14:11
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| And there was a Campaign Option book, as well, but it was a repackaged boxed set (Council of Wyrms). |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Dungeons and Dragons Various Edition Timelines
