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Amraz one arm
Acolyte
Netherlands
42 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 01:15:08
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My dear fellow scribes,
As my adventure enfolds, one of my pc's has expressed intrest in buying a couple of slaves. Since he's an orog, and they are in skullport acquisition of a slave shouldn't be that hard. But I was wondering, what would be the price of an slave. Ofcourse some things factor in to this. Race, profession and that like. Luckely he wants to buy a couple of female orcs. And I figure that slavery among orcs is a common thing. So worrying about escaping isn't one of my biggest worries. What I was wondering about is the price one would have to pay for say, a mountain orc or a gray orc or orog over there.
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"You smell human to me." |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 02:45:49
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Really depends on what they are used for, really. Is he planning on having them keep his things? Clean up for him? Love-slaves? It also depends on a going rate for female orcs in Skullport. Supply and Demand could be huge issues for the slaver. If there are few female orcs, well, 500gp or higher? Dime a dozen, 100gp.
Plus, I don't think Orcs generally enslave one another. Usually they just dominate and add to their tribe/following.
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4693 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 03:47:02
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Well he could be buying mates to add to the clan.
Hiowever as already indicated it depends on the vaule of the slave. Unskilled and ugly maybe 50 gold, oh yes age matters as well.
A skilled and ugly could be worth a lot more.
Pretty and unskilled might even fetch a higher price.
Until you set some idea of suppy there is no good way to determine the demand.
Clearly the purchaser of a slave expects at minimun to break even and more likely make a profit. Some things are easy to calculate, average remaining life span, craft or profession ranks (which of course indicate how much income one can get), less cost of maintaining, overseeing and disicpling to get them to work. This type of thing is pure math. Is the price worth the risk of making a profit.
When one goes to buy a pretty one to have on arm or even just to impress others it becomes intangible, you can not cost account for the value. Some would spend 5,000 gold just to show that they can to others, then kill because of trying to create an image of great power, or evil, or just to outbid another. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Vangelor
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 09:24:47
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| Slavery is profitable because it is cheaper over time than paying your labor, especially if you have a breeding population of slaves, who thus become self-replacing. But slaves aren't cheap, and since these are smuggled goods, they are more expensive still. Market prices would fluctuate. I would say you have room to maneuver there. So the real question is how hard do you want to hit the player buying the slaves? Want them to be a casual purchase? Price them within his range. If you think he's sitting on too much gold, go ahead and gouge him. |
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Khaa
Seeker
USA
80 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 13:09:30
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| I agree with Vangelor. Make it depend on the region, looks, skills, what type of slave, and how much money he has. |
Ever want another forum? Well try out www.icewinddale.com |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 14:27:05
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Do not forget supply and demand and the fact that it is smuggled goods. These things could decrease or increase the price substantially.
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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EvilKnight
Learned Scribe
USA
162 Posts |
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Amraz one arm
Acolyte
Netherlands
42 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 17:59:39
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| Well I think supply isn't the principle concern here. Since it is Skullport and it has the biggest slavemarket in Northeastern Faerun. I read the Skullport manual on it extensively. But I get the sense that most of these slaves would be Upworld folk. Since most of these slaves arrive by ship. And ofcourse the profit margin would be highest on those. For who would pay more than 1 gp for a goblin. But ofcourse the seediness of the place will harbor slaves of all kinds. For the drow and the illithids need resources of the more peculiar kind. Not to mention the necromancer frequenting this place. But since my orog wants a gray orc. The price will be steap, since the only way I can think of those being on sail there. Would be the Red Wizard enclave overthere. So maybe he may order one, for an big amount of gold. What are my fellow scribes thought on savage species being on sale there? |
"You smell human to me." |
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Thelonius
Senior Scribe
Spain
730 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 18:20:42
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I don't think that slavering orcs would be so common, thing that the orcs are a tough race, very hard maneveured, so they would do an expensive adquisition. In the other hand, the price would depend, of course in the race, in the age, the origins of the subject (is not the same a common orc than "noble" one...
Anyway i've always been against slavering, I've spent the most part of my time in Morrowind ( ) freeing slaves... |
"If you are to truly understand, then you will need the contrast, not adherence to a single ideal." - Kreia
"I THINK I JUST HAD ANOTHER NEAR-RINCEWIND EXPERIENCE"- Discworld's Death frustrated after Rincewind scapes his grasp... again.
"I am death, come for thee" - Nimbul, from Baldur's Gate I just before being badly spanked
Sapientia sola libertas est |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4693 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 18:49:22
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Well transport would add cost, unless one(or more) enterprising slave trader has set up a breeding program near by (I consider this unlikely).
Age should be a factor as well, the younger they are the more they will cost as adults. One can expect more years of work out of them. The is also the question of what skills the orc will have. Prices should always be highest value that can be expected. Fertile females also tend to be worth more, for the ability to provide more slaves.
If I had to set a price now transport 1,000 gold plus 1/2 of income protential over life span + 100 times eatimated years of fertility (female only).
Price for a male grey orc Com1 age 20, unskilled labor 1,000 + .5*40*36
Price for a female grey orc Com1 age 20, unskilled labor 1,000 + .5*40*36 + 100*10
Price for a male grey orc Com1 age 20, skilled labor (4 ranks in craft or Profession) 1,000 + .5*40*350
Price for a female grey orc Com1 age 20, skilled labor (4 ranks in craft or Profession) 1,000 + .5*40*350 + 100*10
Now if buying a spell caster or other specilist, their vaule of course would be higher because they can either earn more or save the need of highing outside free help. Though it would tend to be risky to have a spell casting slave of greater or equal power as owner and/or overseers.
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"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
12022 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 22:39:51
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| I don't see why orc slaves would be uncommon in Skullport. They are a race that lacks the cohesive units to defend themselves as a society.... so a tribe could go missing and noone really care. Have a caravan of humans, or a village, get ransacked and other humans tend to not only notice.... but also investigate. I'd put kobolds and goblins/hobgoblins as the most common slave races, but orcs aren't far behind. In fact, orcs make very good heavy laborers due to their strength. They are plentiful in the north, so they wouldn't really need to be shipped in from far away (i.e. a coastal boat could bring them in from Luskan, or other nearby shore inlets (doesn't have to be a great port... so long as a boat can land nearby and shoreboats can land). I can definitely see some Uthgardt raiders who would be willing to turn over captured orcs for supplies (yes, it might be frowned upon by some uthgardt... but I'm sure some would do it). I can also see duergar capturing orcs and selling them in skullport (keeping the best for themselves mind you). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4693 Posts |
Posted - 08 Dec 2005 : 23:37:34
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
I don't see why orc slaves would be uncommon in Skullport. They are a race that lacks the cohesive units to defend themselves as a society.... so a tribe could go missing and noone really care.
From: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/ex/20030301a
quote:
Gray Orc
Regions: Damara, Moonsea, Orc, Rashemen, Thesk, Vaasa, or The Vast.
Racial Feats: Daylight Adaptation, Headlong Rush.
Racial Prestige Class: Orc warlord. Level Adjustment: +1.
The orcs of the eastern lands are concentrated in the Moonsea and Endless Wastes today, with a much smaller number scattered through the various lands that lie between. Gray orcs look less bestial than their more savage northern kin, but are still obviously nonhuman. They are somewhat hairy, with long manes of bristly hair on their heads, shoulders, and backs. Their faces are less porcine than the mountain orcs, with the exception of their tusks. They have yellow, orange, or red eyes, lupine ears, and black or gray hair. Gray orcs are more apt to wear "civilized" clothing than mountain orcs, and prefer varying shades of brown, black, blue, and other dark colors. Skin tones are usually gray with mottled patches of lighter or darker gray on the chest and flanks.
Gray orc characters have the starting age, life expectancy, and height and weight characteristics of half-orcs. See Chapter 6 of the Player's Handbook.
There will likrly be transportation costs for this kind of Orc to the Western lands. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Amraz one arm
Acolyte
Netherlands
42 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2005 : 10:03:48
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Well my thanks, that's a good solution. My orog Pc wants to start his own tribe and he'll have to pay for it if he wants an orog/gray orc one  That mathematical equation seems to fit te bill allright. Just wondering how the rest of the party is going to react when in 8 months time the first offspring sees the light. Which will slow the party to there great frustration  And starting to see the fun is this |
"You smell human to me." |
Edited by - Amraz one arm on 09 Dec 2005 11:48:23 |
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EvilKnight
Learned Scribe
USA
162 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2005 : 15:37:14
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Please remember. Orcs tend to be militeristic and tribal. One doesn't lightly take a slaver group into orc infested lands to round them up for sale.
Another thing. Tribal leaders tend to be in charge mostly because of their ability to wipe out or beat others in the tribe. Maybe he should look into taking over a tribe. Join, challenge leader, then fight to stay on top. Potential for intrigue, revenge and staying the leader taking on all comers. Plus he has to keep on top of tribal traditions and still convince the tribe to follow him in more than lip service.
That sounds more plausible than buying a group and creating a tribe. He would probably die of old age before it was a significant tribe going the way of buying slaves. No tribal history or pride to keep them together. Not to mention, infighting or rivalry because the slaves may have came from competing tribes previously.
EvilKnight |
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Amraz one arm
Acolyte
Netherlands
42 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2005 : 21:54:50
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Yeah he just wants to start young, and he's an incredible strong orog even as orogs go. So taking over an tribe wont be that hard a feat in latter levels. But since he's just a 3rd level now, hey wants a female for fornication an cooking his meals. So I decided to let him. He ones he bought here, where can she go? She'll probably will even be greatfull for not being indentured to anymore to a non-orc. And I'm not giving him a tribe untill way later in the campaign. I have to write such things into it. And it's just not viable now. And if its not to his liking he can always kill her. Hahahaha and if I dont like it, well there will be hell to pay  |
"You smell human to me." |
Edited by - Amraz one arm on 09 Dec 2005 21:57:53 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4693 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2005 : 22:42:29
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Well perhaps in 8 months, the orog might establish enough of a friendship with female and have a strong house to leave her and child behind someplace. Though the slave price I offered would tend to be out of reach for most 3rd level charater.
I do not see much problem with slavers picking up a few orcs. Hold person being one way, perhaps getting them young by killing all the adults and taking the children and so on. Of course taking children would tend to be trained to increase thier value (thus resulting price) and also could break up tribal concerpt. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2005 : 00:43:12
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Wow, Kent, you charge an arm and a leg for a slave. Do you use the same prices over in Thay or are they reduced since there is a larger market in that country?
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4693 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2005 : 02:50:14
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quote:
Originally posted by CrennenFaerieBane
Wow, Kent, you charge an arm and a leg for a slave. Do you use the same prices over in Thay or are they reduced since there is a larger market in that country?
C-Fb
Well I would knock off transport fee (which might include training) because of supply. Also that culture I believe has a reduced life expectancy. As they are many, kill a damaged one. Other then that I would tend to go with one half of expected income during life of slaves, also likely reduce breeding factor cost. As slaves become cheeper children of slaves certainly not as important as well. It was a quick proposal for pricing that could be applied as to how much a slaver could get paid for a slave. A more detailed and/or regional pricing scheme could be developed. I did not choose to take that route. Fitting slave trde into FR works as well as wheat worth 1 cp per pound just harvested and still costs the same price when transported 1,000 miles and could be a year old.
FR economy is broken so trying to price anything in the economy will be broken one way or another. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
Edited by - Kentinal on 10 Dec 2005 10:57:58 |
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Crennen FaerieBane
Master of Realmslore
USA
1378 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2005 : 03:31:47
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True, I guess the whole slave trade system would be completely relative. In Thay, Orcs probably go for 10gp, in Skullport it might be like 1000gp. I guess until there is a proper exchange system, it's going to be broken!!
C-Fb |
Still rockin' the Fey'ri style. |
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On the subject of slavery
