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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
 Posted - 13 Jul 2005 : 10:31:54
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I have a small dilema... I want to play an oldschool murder-mystery with my players... But i find it very difficult to create such elaborate playing in form of clues, victims, killers and riddles. My plea to you is that if you have any experience in this, please post your experiences on the area.
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"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2005 : 11:08:15
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First you have to select NPC killed.
Then come up a couple of reasons somebody might want to do a killing, perferible rumors will point to more then one person, decide which reason the killing was done (and rumors true and false might not actually point to the person that did the killing).
Rumors can point to thieves guild for not paying protection or perhaps just a failed robbery. A former and/or current lover. A cult killing. A political killing (perhaps to stop a wedding).
Once these are decided you then should set up the scene of the murder and add clues. A robbery might point to the thieves guild, a mark of a cult point to the cult. A political marking point to a rivil power. Some things can be planted. Then you need real evidence perhaps hair to eliminate some suspects, perhaps a murder weapon might give clues (one adventure I read had murder by rope, some tar on rope pointed to the shipyards) as well.
Then you need to know where each suspect claimed to be, some stories weaker then others. One of the biggest problem you will have to deal with is magic (speak with dead, other divination) depending on level of the PCs and location of the murder.
I might be able to help more if I know the setting, power groups and so on. The one thing that will be required is develping a lot of NPCs. There might even be an eye wittness but hiding or not normally considered trust worthy. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Snotlord
Senior Scribe
Norway
476 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2005 : 11:53:38
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Repare a timeline of the day of the murder, noting who is where when. Start out simple, because this could get complicated very fast. Don't worry about making the mystery "to easy", if the players solve it quickly they will be pleased of their own cleverness.
Be prepared to change the story. The players will discuss the mystery and throw lots of ideas at you. Make sure you know the core story very well, and be ready to add to it, because you're gonna need to.
Good luck!
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Edited by - Snotlord on 13 Jul 2005 11:55:49 |
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Asgetrion
Master of Realmslore
Finland
1564 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2005 : 12:29:43
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There are many murder mysteries in Dungeon magazine issues,I think. There is also one in 'Four from Cormyr'-module, which could be tailored to suit your needs.
I also suggest reading literature on this issue, such as Hercule Poirot, Sherlock Holmes, anthologies/collections of short stories, etc. |
"What am I doing today? Ask me tomorrow - I can be sure of giving you the right answer then."
-- Askarran of Selgaunt, Master Sage, speaking to a curious merchant, Year of the Helm |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2005 : 13:13:40
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The plot will most likely be situated in the north... Perhaps even Waterdeep. The group have made allis with Khelben and have played for a long time along the sword coast... I have tried to develope the plot, but when i read it afterwards i find it rather simple and to basic... I want to throw them into a genuine murdering plot, with conspiracies, killers, hidden alliances and all sorts of hidden plots and NPC´s... Any help is welcomed...
Thank you Kentinal for the many great ideas... Any help is welcomed. If you need any help yourself then post it and i will help you... I have been a DM for a long time, and have played all sorts of adventures... |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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tauster
Senior Scribe
Germany
399 Posts |
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KnightErrantJR
Great Reader
USA
5402 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jul 2005 : 15:41:37
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Farmicos, one of the best things you can do is have a victim that many people have a very good reason to want to kill in cold blood, but then have the actual murderer be someone that did it as an accident or in self defense, or perhaps didn't even realize they did the act (they threw something out the window that landed on the victim, they didn't tie up their horse cart and the horses trampled the victim, etc.)
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 00:15:36
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Ah, Hastings . . . use the leetal grey cells. 
This is something I'm looking into myself, because the novel I'm trying to write is a fantasy/mystery combination. Poirot and Holmes have a slight disadvantage as a basis for a D&D mystery because they don't use magic. It's relatively easy to adapt, so long as you have a good grasp of what magic can do. Alignment detection, detect thoughts, etc., can all end it a little too quick, so you have to set things up to get around that.
For one thing, you can remember that just because someone is good-aligned doesn't mean he didn't do it, and if another is evil that doesn't mean he's done anything wrong. Magical evidence can be limited if the local laws require more in the way of mundane results to convict someone.
A good series to look at for magic in the use of investigation is the Thraxas series, published in the UK and now being (too slowly) released in the US. There's a lot less magic in it than in the typical D&D game, but it helps.
I'm not going to give you any of my plots, of course. I will tell you that twists and turns keep people on their seats. Perhaps it doesn't start off as a murder mystery. Perhaps it was a missing persons case, and the party was hired to find him/her. Then the subject turns up dead, and the party may have to prove their own innocence.
Or, a relative (wife, perhaps) wants the killer found, and the city watch is dragging their feet for some reason. Is she impatient? Or has the watch been paid off, or is political pressure preventing them from doing their jobs?
Is the suspect known, but no one can prove it? A noble's son, perhaps? Has the person planned the perfect crime, and does everything but confess the details in his arrogance?
Was the killing just a small part of the case? Did the person witness something he shouldn't have? Does the party uncover a plot that leads them into international intrigue as they try to bring a case against an enemy country's ambassador, being held back by their own nation which isn't ready for anything that might cause a spark? Is the ambassador actually innocent, despite the evidence, and was framed by someone who wants a war? Or is the suspect the local mob boss instead, an Al Capone who, when he finds out why the party is pursuing him, says "What, that low-life? Why are you so upset over some sailor dying in an alley?"
What you should keep in mind is never, ever let things be predictable. Twists and turns everywhere. Nothing is what it seems. Have lots of details ready for the party to use, but don't give them up easily. A mystery is a cerebral activity; make your players use their brains, whatever their character's Intelligence scores are. Of course, everything has to be filtered through their characters, but with a mystery, a half-orc barbarian might actually see the simplicity in what others see as a complex problem; don't let someone be penalized by their character's limitations. You have to work to make certain everyone participates. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 01:03:04
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| Faramicos, you could also borrow some ideas from Realms of Mystery. There's quite a few good murder mysteries in that book. |
"Trust in the shadows, for the bright way makes you an easy target." -Mask |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 15:46:34
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quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
I have a small dilema... I want to play an oldschool murder-mystery with my players... But i find it very difficult to create such elaborate playing in form of clues, victims, killers and riddles. My plea to you is that if you have any experience in this, please post your experiences on the area.
Ever see the movie Gosford Park? Depending upon what type of setting you wish to run this game in, that movie could be a wonderful inspiration. |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 16:09:22
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| I actually have the Realms of Mystery, but have never come to read it... And i have never seen Gosford Park. So there is a movie to see and a book to read... Great. Something to do for the summer. |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 16:17:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
I actually have the Realms of Mystery, but have never come to read it... And i have never seen Gosford Park. So there is a movie to see and a book to read... Great. Something to do for the summer.
Well, you mentioned Waterdeep. Thus, if you wanted something involving nobility in Waterdeep, the movie would be a wonderful source. |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 16:35:16
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| Good idea... The group have some loose links to Khelben and other persons in Waterdeep. So it should be possible. |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 16:38:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
Good idea... The group have some loose links to Khelben and other persons in Waterdeep. So it should be possible.
Even better...one of Gosford Park's biggest strengths was the rich background each character had. Thus, important figures like Khelben and others in Waterdeep would be an ideal fit if you used anything from the movie. |
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Forge
Learned Scribe
USA
218 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 16:54:10
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Best advise I can give you here is to KNOW YOUR SPELLBOOKS!! As mentioned before, magic can make short work of your standard whodunit. I would advise you to check over your PC's spellbooks to make sure they can't perpitrate a fast-solve.
Also, if you get into a tight spot, remember, people lie. Detect Thoughts isn't a lie detector, and someone can always tell the truth and still be guilty. (ie: "Well he was alive when I saw him last." is correct even if the person in question was the one who killed the victim IF the victim was unconcious and slowly dying of poison, blood loss, etc...) |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 16:57:54
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| True... I have 2 wizards in the group. Better check up on their spellbooks... |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36805 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 17:27:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
True... I have 2 wizards in the group. Better check up on their spellbooks...
That is essential -- it would be quite frustrating to craft this carefully thought-out and intricate mystery, only to have one of the wizards suddenly recall his Summon Sherlock Holmes and Angela Lansbury spell. 
The same goes for scrolls, potions, and magic items.
You do want their spells to come in handy, but not to solve the mystery.
Oh, and keep in mind that there are magical goodies that will spoof things like Detect Lie or Detect Evil.
Oh, and I'd make a point of throwing in a couple of false clues, as well, and/or something that makes them think one guy is hiding something about the murder, when in reality he's hiding something totally different. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 14 Jul 2005 17:30:25 |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 18:37:07
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| good thought... I will remember it. I think there is a great basis for a cool murder mystery... Keep throwing in your ideas. I am very grateful. |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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DDH_101
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1272 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 21:13:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
I actually have the Realms of Mystery, but have never come to read it... And i have never seen Gosford Park. So there is a movie to see and a book to read... Great. Something to do for the summer.
Oh, there's quite a few good mysteries in there. My favourite has to be "H" though. Use that into your campaign and have your PCs freak out about a murderous hand! Lol. |
"Trust in the shadows, for the bright way makes you an easy target." -Mask |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 14 Jul 2005 : 21:20:19
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| I will do that... Sounds like i have underestimated the book. I bought all of the "Realms of ......" Books but have never realy read any of them. Only a few stories here and there. Perhaps i should... |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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Xysma
Master of Realmslore
USA
1089 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jul 2005 : 20:17:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Faramicos
I will do that... Sounds like i have underestimated the book. I bought all of the "Realms of ......" Books but have never realy read any of them. Only a few stories here and there. Perhaps i should...
Some of my favorite Realms stories have come from these anthologies. Some of the other scribes may confirm/disconfirm, as I have not read them, but Murder in Cormyr and Murder in Halruaa may provide some ideas. A friend of mine read my copy of Murder in Cormyr and he said it was a pretty good read. Also remember that there are many magical items that the murderer could use to protect his identity/thoughts.
One thing that I did that worked well for me was to create a list of information by DC for each NPC.
Matilda
DC 5 Matilda came from Selgaunt
DC 10 Matilda comes from a wealthy merchant family
DC 15 Her father is a business rival of the murdered man
DC 20 Her family's business is in trouble
DC 25 She was having an affair with the murdered man
DC 30 She was seen in the "bad" part of town buying poison the day of the murder
I'm just throwing out examples, but imagine a list like this for every suspect. As the PC's investigate, they can get bits and pieces of information from people they question. This lets them to make use of their gather information skill to piece together clues. There's a lot of work involved to provide clues that they can piece together, but it's worth it to see the players working together to figure out what's going on. |
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Faramicos
Senior Scribe
Denmark
468 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jul 2005 : 11:06:23
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| Fine to throw excamples at me. Keep on doing it... All help is welcomed. Fine to get help from all of you. Acolytes to all the great sages of this great site. |
"When dragons make war, worlds can only tremble in the shadow of angry wings" |
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Murder Mystery
