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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
 Posted - 16 Nov 2021 : 16:02:55
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How does this look for converting a Ha-Naga into 2nd E?
Faerūnian Ha-Naga: THAC0 -3; #AT 3; Dmg 4d6+6 (coil-whip) / 4d8+8 (bite) / 2d8+4 (tail sting: to physical damage add poison save or go into a state of catalepsy that lasts 14 days, at the end of that time, the victim dies unless a neutralize poison or slow poison spell is administered); INT Godlike (21); AC -5; HD 20 + 220; hp 310; MV 15, Fl 42 (A); SA gaze (save vs. spell at -3 or be charmed), coil-whip, constriction (4d6 +12 damage per round vs. H or smaller opponents), spell use (as 21st level wizard, spells: 5 / 5 / 5 / 5 / 5 / 4 / 4 / 4 / 2 with access to Chaos and Evil clerical spheres); SD Nil; SZ G (100 long); AL CE; ML Champion (15); MR Nil; XP 40,000.
I'm thinking it should have some SD immunities to poisons at least, plus magical weapons to hit maybe. Also, I'm thinking MR would make sense. Any thoughts?
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Delnyn
Senior Scribe
USA
958 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2021 : 10:16:25
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If you give a ha-naga access to divine spells, please keep in mind 3ed domains do not work like 2e spheres. My humble recommendation is to allow effective priest levels and you specify which spheres get major access and which spheres get minor access.
Instead of the 20HD +220 hp, could you try 20HD (fixed # of hp), like the solar 22HD (177 hp) or the archfiends? This instantly tells the DM the ha-naga is a boss monster.
All in all, I'm impressed and I'm pleased you respected the ha-naga as the incredibly powerful entity it truly is. |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2021 : 10:54:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
If you give a ha-naga access to divine spells, please keep in mind 3ed domains do not work like 2e spheres. My humble recommendation is to allow effective priest levels and you specify which spheres get major access and which spheres get minor access.
Instead of the 20HD +220 hp, could you try 20HD (fixed # of hp), like the solar 22HD (177 hp) or the archfiends? This instantly tells the DM the ha-naga is a boss monster.
All in all, I'm impressed and I'm pleased you respected the ha-naga as the incredibly powerful entity it truly is.
Any idea what book would tell me which spells were in Evil and Chaos domains? I honestly have no clue, and reading that would make changing into sphere access more clear.
I might just select specific spells.
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Edited by - The Masked Mage on 17 Nov 2021 10:55:41 |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2021 : 11:14:21
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As for HD, If i go that way I will make the HD higher. Reptilian gargantua for example, had 50 HD.
Tarrasque was 300 hp (approx. 70 HD), which would line up well with the AC and THACOs I chose.
Alternately I could go with like the leviathan, that has HD 36 to 72, representing species growth. I sort of like this way. |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2021 : 22:20:25
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quote:
Originally posted by The Masked Mage
quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
If you give a ha-naga access to divine spells, please keep in mind 3ed domains do not work like 2e spheres. My humble recommendation is to allow effective priest levels and you specify which spheres get major access and which spheres get minor access.
Instead of the 20HD +220 hp, could you try 20HD (fixed # of hp), like the solar 22HD (177 hp) or the archfiends? This instantly tells the DM the ha-naga is a boss monster.
All in all, I'm impressed and I'm pleased you respected the ha-naga as the incredibly powerful entity it truly is.
Any idea what book would tell me which spells were in Evil and Chaos domains? I honestly have no clue, and reading that would make changing into sphere access more clear.
I might just select specific spells.
The 2e Priest's Spell Compendium, Vol 3 would have that. Chaos is on page 782 and I didn't see a sphere for Evil (there isn't one for Good either). Maybe use the Necromantic sphere for evil? Reversed versions of spells in the Healing sphere? |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
572 Posts |
Posted - 17 Nov 2021 : 23:35:37
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quote:
Originally posted by The Masked Mage
Any idea what book would tell me which spells were in Evil and Chaos domains? I honestly have no clue, and reading that would make changing into sphere access more clear.
I might just select specific spells.
The 3e Chaos Domain has (the Chaos sphere is VERY different as it is more about chance and randomness than chaos-as-a-force):
Protection From Law (no equivalent in 2e)
Shatter (a wizard spell that is pretty different from the 3e version from what I recall)
Magic Circle Against Law (no equivalent)
Chaos Hammer (no equivalent)
Dispel Law (closest equivalent is Dispel Good/Evil)
Animate Objects (2e equivalent: Animate Object)
Word of Chaos (2e equivalent: Holy/Unholy Word)
Cloak of Chaos (no equivalent)
Summon Monster IX (closest 2e equivalent would be Gate)
The 3e Evil domain has:
Protection From Good (same name spell)
Desecrate (no equivalent)
Magic Circle Against Good (2e equivalent: Protection From Good, 10' Radius)
Unholy Blight (no equivalent)
Dispel Good (same name spell)
Create Undead (no equivalent-powered spell; 2e's Animate Dead creates lesser types than this one)
Blasphemy (2e equivalent: Unholy Word)
Unholy Aura (no equivalent)
Summon Monster IX (closest 2e equivalent would be Gate)
I don't know what a "Ha-Naga" is; where can I find post-2e stats for it? The stats here are what I would consider extremely overpowered, especially the +220 hp (the best that you find are Yugoloths, which get twice their HD in extra hit points (Ultroloths are 13+26 for example). If it is a unique creature, set its hit points and divide by about 4.5 or so to determine the HD. As for spells, either give it some particular powers, or if it is a servant of a specific deity, give it the spheres of a specialty priest of that deity.
Jeff |
My 2nd Edition blog: http://blog.aulddragon.com/
My streamed AD&D Spelljamer sessions: https://www.youtube.com/user/aulddragon/playlists?flow=grid&shelf_id=18&view=50
"That sums it up in a nutshell, AuldDragon. You make a more convincing argument. But he's right and you're not." |
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
572 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2021 : 00:31:22
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Okay, I found it in Serpent Kingdoms.
It's not unique, so it wouldn't get fixed hit points. Comparing some other monster CRs in the 3.5e Monster Manual, it puts the Tarrasque as a lower CR, which...without looking at the stats itself feels like a massive depowering if balors, titans, and great wyrm dragons are higher CRs (or a tremendous power boosting of those other creatures). Ignore any comparison to the 2e Tarrasque in such a case; it is the most powerful monster in 2e bar none (even beating out gammaroids and other massive Spelljammer monsters).
So I would start by looking at dragons and powerful planar creatures. I'd give it a flat 20 HD at the most, THAC0 of 5, and drop the plusses to the damage, but those dice are probably fine. The AC seems a bit too low; I'd probably go -2 at best, although that's a judgement call. I'd go with MV 12, Fl 24; not sure about the Maneuverability Class. For spellcasting, I'd either drop priestly access or just let them cast as both classes, probably dropping their levels compared to where they would be as a single-class. Level 21 spellcasting would probably be a bit too powerful IMO. Spell Resistance is the 3e equivalent of Magic Resistance, so it should have some, but I don't know what the equivalents would be. Something around 25% might be decent. Not sure about magic weapons to hit (dragons don't have that, and this feels like a "naga dragon" equivalent rather than an extraplanar or actual magical creature). XP seems too high; use the charts in Monstrous Compendium Annual 2 to get a better number.
Jeff |
My 2nd Edition blog: http://blog.aulddragon.com/
My streamed AD&D Spelljamer sessions: https://www.youtube.com/user/aulddragon/playlists?flow=grid&shelf_id=18&view=50
"That sums it up in a nutshell, AuldDragon. You make a more convincing argument. But he's right and you're not." |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2021 : 11:35:23
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quote:
Originally posted by AuldDragon
quote:
Originally posted by The Masked Mage
Any idea what book would tell me which spells were in Evil and Chaos domains? I honestly have no clue, and reading that would make changing into sphere access more clear.
I might just select specific spells.
The 3e Chaos Domain has (the Chaos sphere is VERY different as it is more about chance and randomness than chaos-as-a-force):
Protection From Law (no equivalent in 2e)
Shatter (a wizard spell that is pretty different from the 3e version from what I recall)
Magic Circle Against Law (no equivalent)
Chaos Hammer (no equivalent)
Dispel Law (closest equivalent is Dispel Good/Evil)
Animate Objects (2e equivalent: Animate Object)
Word of Chaos (2e equivalent: Holy/Unholy Word)
Cloak of Chaos (no equivalent)
Summon Monster IX (closest 2e equivalent would be Gate)
The 3e Evil domain has:
Protection From Good (same name spell)
Desecrate (no equivalent)
Magic Circle Against Good (2e equivalent: Protection From Good, 10' Radius)
Unholy Blight (no equivalent)
Dispel Good (same name spell)
Create Undead (no equivalent-powered spell; 2e's Animate Dead creates lesser types than this one)
Blasphemy (2e equivalent: Unholy Word)
Unholy Aura (no equivalent)
Summon Monster IX (closest 2e equivalent would be Gate)
I don't know what a "Ha-Naga" is; where can I find post-2e stats for it? The stats here are what I would consider extremely overpowered, especially the +220 hp (the best that you find are Yugoloths, which get twice their HD in extra hit points (Ultroloths are 13+26 for example). If it is a unique creature, set its hit points and divide by about 4.5 or so to determine the HD. As for spells, either give it some particular powers, or if it is a servant of a specific deity, give it the spheres of a specialty priest of that deity.
Jeff
Given those spells, I don't even see a reason to include them if I stay with 21st level. Every effect there is easily created by a mage, aside from maybe unholy word. And even there a limited wish, wish or alter reality would easily cover it.
I do seem to recall some law / chaos spells near the end of 2nd edition... probably in Planescape since that's where it would have come into play the most. |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2021 : 11:42:41
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quote:
Originally posted by AuldDragon
Okay, I found it in Serpent Kingdoms.
this feels like a "naga dragon" equivalent rather than an extraplanar or actual magical creature).
Jeff
This pointed me in the direction I think I'm going to go. I will refer to the more powerful Linnorm Dragons from the first Annual Appendix and steal from them :)
I am also going to integrate the age/power system used for dragons so it gets bigger and stronger as it ages - stretching out the age categories of a dragon from 1200 to 2500 since these things are elder serpents that made civilizations fall. This way AC / Hit Dice / Spells Available all scales with age. Makes good sense to me. |
Edited by - The Masked Mage on 18 Nov 2021 12:22:54 |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 18 Nov 2021 : 12:59:00
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| By the way, thank you for the input guys. Very helpful. |
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AuldDragon
Senior Scribe
USA
572 Posts |
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Ha-Naga 2nd E Conversion
