| Author |
 Topic  |
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Aug 2021 : 23:29:05
|
So, as I'm prepping for another 5E game I've come to realize that Star Elves are not represented much since 3e. I remember doing some homebrew stuff for 4E star elves but 5E remains to be unseen. So, here's my attempt at making the Sub-race for them.
Star Elf
As a high elf, you too have keen senses yet often remain aloof. Star elves, or Mithral elves or Ruar-tel-quessir in elven are almost unknown to most other races in Faerûn as they spent nearly two thousand years hidden away in the extraplanar redoubt known as Sildëyuir, before trickling back to Faerûn. They have even been called Eladrin and have some of those physical characteristics too.
Star elves look similar to their moon elf brethren, with light skin and hair of gold, red, or silver. They have violet or gray eyes with occasional gold flecks in them. They are often slightly taller than their kin, being five and a half to six feet in height. They like to wear elaborate tunics, but in neutral tones. Their personality makes them appear cautious, being away from the wider world for so long in isolation, though they tend to get along with other elves.
Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 1.
Musically Inclined. You gain proficiency with one musical instrument of your choice.
Otherworldly Touch. Between sunset and sunrise, you may confer the effects of magic to any melee weapon you wield, treating it as a Moon-Touched weapon (see Xanathar’s Guide to Everything, pg. 138).
Extra-Planar. As a creature that has spent a considerable time in Sildëyuir, you are not considered natural to the prime material plane.
Star Elf Magic. You know the dancing lights cantrip. When you reach 3rd level, you can cast the disguise self spell once per day. When you reach 5th level, you can also cast the moonbeam spell once per day. Charisma is your spellcasting ability for these spells.
Fey Language. You can speak, read, and write Sylvan.
|
Edited by - Diffan on 17 Aug 2021 20:09:38
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11827 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2021 : 21:36:58
|
| On the weapon thing, they had effectively "bestowed ghost touch".... maybe a small bonus to hit incorporeal beings and a bonus to AC versus being attacked by incorporeal beings? Otherwise they're pretty gimped compared to a normal elf (for instance a high elf gets weapon profs and a free cantrip) |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
 |
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2021 : 21:50:04
|
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
On the weapon thing, they had effectively "bestowed ghost touch".... maybe a small bonus to hit incorporeal beings and a bonus to AC versus being attacked by incorporeal beings? Otherwise they're pretty gimped compared to a normal elf (for instance a high elf gets weapon profs and a free cantrip)
They're essentially given what they had, mechanics-wise, in 3.5. Incorporeal creatures have damage resistance to non-magical weapons, no "Miss chance" or any of that. Thus, the Star Elf's ability simply makes the weapon able to hit them (just as 3.5's did). Aside from their lore, there's really nothing about them that's mechanically great.
I guess I could give them some thematic magic like Drow, but what? |
|
|
|
Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36803 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2021 : 23:15:56
|
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
I guess I could give them some thematic magic like Drow, but what?
Maybe something like the Illumination Magic in Kobold Press's Deep Magic?
From page 221 of the 5E version of the book: "Illumination magic concerns both the manipulation of light and observations of the heavens. Its practitioners have been likened to elemental specialists who have an affinity for light instead of fire, earth, air, or water. Naturally, these individuals are anathema to creatures and spellcasters that lurk in places where darkness and shadow hold sway." |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 16 Aug 2021 23:16:15 |
|
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2021 : 23:35:01
|
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
I guess I could give them some thematic magic like Drow, but what?
Maybe something like the Illumination Magic in Kobold Press's Deep Magic?
From page 221 of the 5E version of the book: "Illumination magic concerns both the manipulation of light and observations of the heavens. Its practitioners have been likened to elemental specialists who have an affinity for light instead of fire, earth, air, or water. Naturally, these individuals are anathema to creatures and spellcasters that lurk in places where darkness and shadow hold sway."
Ok, I can work with that. Maybe something akin to the Drow that draws upon the magic that they've been sort of infused with during their time in Sildëyuir.
Star Elf Magic. You know the dancing lights cantrip. When you reach 3rd level, you can cast the disguise self spell once per day. When you reach 5th level, you can also cast the moonbeam spell once per day. Charisma is your spellcasting ability for these spells. |
|
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 16 Aug 2021 : 23:54:45
|
| Updated version is loaded. If anyone wants a look at the pdf, here it is: Star Elves of Sildëyuir |
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11827 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2021 : 13:17:01
|
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
On the weapon thing, they had effectively "bestowed ghost touch".... maybe a small bonus to hit incorporeal beings and a bonus to AC versus being attacked by incorporeal beings? Otherwise they're pretty gimped compared to a normal elf (for instance a high elf gets weapon profs and a free cantrip)
They're essentially given what they had, mechanics-wise, in 3.5. Incorporeal creatures have damage resistance to non-magical weapons, no "Miss chance" or any of that. Thus, the Star Elf's ability simply makes the weapon able to hit them (just as 3.5's did). Aside from their lore, there's really nothing about them that's mechanically great.
I guess I could give them some thematic magic like Drow, but what?
Well, I always think defensively, and while you look at the star elves ability as adding ghost touch to a weapon primarily, my focus is on they have ghost touch to their armor, and thus "it's harder for ghostly beings to attack them compared to everyone else". Of the two abilities, the defensive is the more powerful, which is why ghost touch put on armor was much more expensive than ghost touch put on weapons. So, in my response above, I'm actually caring less about giving a bonus to hit than I am a bonus to defense. Perhaps when they wear armor as well, they gives off a soft light effect, and this protects them... and just as an additional thing to maybe make them a little different from other elves, giving them proficiency with light armor (so for most classes its a useless extra, but it allows even star elven wizards the ability to protect themselves a little better from incorporeal beings). If you didn't want to go so far as all light armor, you could even make it simply "padded armor proficiency", but personally that might be a little overkill, since nearly every class gives light armor proficiency. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 17 Aug 2021 13:20:45 |
|
|
|
Eldacar
Senior Scribe
438 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2021 : 17:12:14
|
Comments are based on general perception of balance compared with other races and how 5E uses language.
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 1.
Is this intended to be their only ability score boost?
quote:
Musically Inclined. You gain proficiency with one musical instrument of your choice.
This is something that feels more appropriate to a background, not race.
quote:
Otherworldly Touch. Between sunset and sunrise, you confer the effects of magic to any melee weapon you wield, treating it as a Moon-Touched weapon (see Xanathar’s Guide to Everything, pg. 138).
To avoid the problems of this ruining any and all attempts to be stealthy when conducting the player activity known as "murderhoboing" I would suggest that this be "...you can as an action confer..." instead (and also include the ability to turn it off, again as an action). If you want to look at examples of adding magical effects to races, I would recommend the Eberron sourcebook and its Dragonmarked races; they modify the original race as a subrace, in essence.
quote:
Extra-Planar. As a creature that has spent a considerable time in Sildëyuir, you are not considered natural to the prime material plane. In essence, spells such as Banishing Smite, Banishment, and Dispel Good and Evil effectively send you back to Sildëyuir.
You don't need the second sentence for this. It's built into the language for the spells in question, and the second sentence actually mucks it up because it doesn't include "effects" - so technically by 5E it would only be spells that interact with this quality, and no other effects at all.
quote:
Languages. You can speak, read, and write Common, Elven, and Sylvan.
Is more or less whatever, but usually it's two languages from race, plus one or rarely two from background.
I am unsure, however, how "worth it" this race or subrace is, so to speak. It seems to me that the only thing which really would indicate their nature is the Extra-Planar quality, and as I said, the spells in question already include the proper terminology. You just say to your DM "my elf is native to a different plane of existence than the Prime" and that's that.
Other than this, nothing about the Sildeyuir elves cannot be functionally replicated by the normal Elf race, using High Elf subrace, and tacking on the Fey Teleportation (Xanathar's Guide to Everything) followed by Fey Touched (Tasha's Cauldron of Everything) feats at the appropriate ASI levels for whatever class the character is in.
I would also suggest the possibility of, rather than inventing a new sub-race or a High Elf with particular feats, utilising the Custom Lineage from Tasha's, so in this case:
Creature type: Humanoid of elf-y persuasion.
Size: Medium.
Speed: 30 ft. base walking speed.
ASI: +2 CHA.
Feat: Fey Touched (+1 INT/WIS/CHA [pick one], learns misty step and one 1st level spell of own choice from divination or enchantment school, can cast each without expending a spell slot blah blah; I recommend animal friendship, speak with animals, or comprehend languages, namely for the sylvan understanding thing).
Variable trait: Darkvision 60 ft. (OR you could swap this for your extraplanar thing if you want to houserule, but I don't think it's necessary because see below).
Languages: Common +1 other, so Elvish.
Take that Custom Lineage and then add the Far Traveler Background from Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide:
Skill Proficiency: Insight + Perception.
Tool Proficiency: Any one musical instrument or gaming set of your choice, likely something native to your homeland (so you pick your musical instrument here).
Languages: Any one of your choice (so you pick Sylvan here).
Equipment: Your stuff.
Feature: All Eyes On You.
As a Far Traveler you pick from where you've come, so you say you come from Sildeyuir and that solves the rest.
quote:
I guess I could give them some thematic magic like Drow, but what?
Note that in exchange for their magic and the extra 60 feet of darkvision, drow take a hefty penalty (disadvantage on all attack rolls and Perception checks relying on sight when in direct sunlight, which amounts to a -5 and in 5E terms that is huge because of bounded accuracy, especially because it can even cost you a natural 20).
Drow magic is also limited to dancing lights, faerie fire 1/day on reaching 3rd level, and darkness 1/day on reaching 5th level. The "higher order" drow spells come through the application of a racial feat, Drow High Magic (detect magic at will, levitate 1/long rest, and dispel magic 1/long rest). |
"The Wild Mages I have met exhibit a startling disregard for common sense, and are often meddling with powers far beyond their own control." ~Volo
"Not unlike a certain travelogue author with whom I am unfortunately acquainted." ~Elminster |
|
|
|
Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 17 Aug 2021 : 20:02:16
|
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
Comments are based on general perception of balance compared with other races and how 5E uses language.
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
Ability Score Increase. Your Charisma score increases by 1.
Is this intended to be their only ability score boost?
As a sub-race of Elves, they gain the standard aspects all Elves receive. This means they also get a +2 Dex, Darkvision, Keen Senses, Fey Ancestry, etc. like High Elves and Wood Elves.
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
Musically Inclined. You gain proficiency with one musical instrument of your choice.
This is something that feels more appropriate to a background, not race.
This is there primarily because Bard was their "Favored Class" back in 3.5, which I surmised as having a natural affinity towards music/performance. Since 5e has no such 'Favored classes' element, I felt this was appropriate, and a nod to that idea. But I guess maybe having proficency in Performance is similar to other races skill Proficiencies, like the Half-Orc being Menacing. Either way, it's designed to show off their natural knack for the Arts.
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
Otherworldly Touch. Between sunset and sunrise, you confer the effects of magic to any melee weapon you wield, treating it as a Moon-Touched weapon (see Xanathar’s Guide to Everything, pg. 138).
To avoid the problems of this ruining any and all attempts to be stealthy when conducting the player activity known as "murderhoboing" I would suggest that this be "...you can as an action confer..." instead (and also include the ability to turn it off, again as an action). If you want to look at examples of adding magical effects to races, I would recommend the Eberron sourcebook and its Dragonmarked races; they modify the original race as a subrace, in essence.
Maybe just saying 'you may confer the effects', as being an option anytime you want during those hours. I'd read that and think it's an option at-will, during that time.
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
Extra-Planar. As a creature that has spent a considerable time in Sildëyuir, you are not considered natural to the prime material plane. In essence, spells such as Banishing Smite, Banishment, and Dispel Good and Evil effectively send you back to Sildëyuir.
You don't need the second sentence for this. It's built into the language for the spells in question, and the second sentence actually mucks it up because it doesn't include "effects" - so technically by 5E it would only be spells that interact with this quality, and no other effects at all.
What other 5e effects, besides such spells, interact with any other forceful Banishment?
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
Languages. You can speak, read, and write Common, Elven, and Sylvan.
Is more or less whatever, but usually it's two languages from race, plus one or rarely two from background.
There are some that get more, High Elves get Common, Elven, and one free one. Half-elves get two free ones. Humans get a free one other than Common too. I could word it as such:
Fey Language. You can speak, read, and write Sylvan.
Because it's redundant to include Common and Elven that all Elves get.
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
I am unsure, however, how "worth it" this race or subrace is, so to speak. It seems to me that the only thing which really would indicate their nature is the Extra-Planar quality, and as I said, the spells in question already include the proper terminology. You just say to your DM "my elf is native to a different plane of existence than the Prime" and that's that.
Other than this, nothing about the Sildeyuir elves cannot be functionally replicated by the normal Elf race, using High Elf subrace, and tacking on the Fey Teleportation (Xanathar's Guide to Everything) followed by Fey Touched (Tasha's Cauldron of Everything) feats at the appropriate ASI levels for whatever class the character is in.
I would also suggest the possibility of, rather than inventing a new sub-race or a High Elf with particular feats, utilising the Custom Lineage from Tasha's, so in this case:
Creature type: Humanoid of elf-y persuasion.
Size: Medium.
Speed: 30 ft. base walking speed.
ASI: +2 CHA.
Feat: Fey Touched (+1 INT/WIS/CHA [pick one], learns misty step and one 1st level spell of own choice from divination or enchantment school, can cast each without expending a spell slot blah blah; I recommend animal friendship, speak with animals, or comprehend languages, namely for the sylvan understanding thing).
Variable trait: Darkvision 60 ft. (OR you could swap this for your extraplanar thing if you want to houserule, but I don't think it's necessary because see below).
Languages: Common +1 other, so Elvish.
Take that Custom Lineage and then add the Far Traveler Background from Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide:
Skill Proficiency: Insight + Perception.
Tool Proficiency: Any one musical instrument or gaming set of your choice, likely something native to your homeland (so you pick your musical instrument here).
Languages: Any one of your choice (so you pick Sylvan here).
Equipment: Your stuff.
Feature: All Eyes On You.
As a Far Traveler you pick from where you've come, so you say you come from Sildeyuir and that solves the rest.
You can do as you please in your games.
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
quote:
I guess I could give them some thematic magic like Drow, but what?
Note that in exchange for their magic and the extra 60 feet of darkvision, drow take a hefty penalty (disadvantage on all attack rolls and Perception checks relying on sight when in direct sunlight, which amounts to a -5 and in 5E terms that is huge because of bounded accuracy, especially because it can even cost you a natural 20).
Drow magic is also limited to dancing lights, faerie fire 1/day on reaching 3rd level, and darkness 1/day on reaching 5th level.
Their penalty isn't just because they can get some magic. Tieflings receive similar spells and have no significant drawbacks whatsoever. Accept the fact that 5e isn't balanced to a fine point. Drow should have Magical Resistance too, like Pure-blood Yuan-ti in Volo's Guide to make up for their impairment (and what I do in my games).
quote:
Originally posted by Eldacar
The "higher order" drow spells come through the application of a racial feat, Drow High Magic (detect magic at will, levitate 1/long rest, and dispel magic 1/long rest).
I have the book. Star Elves have no lore to suggest this is something they possess that I'm aware of. |
Edited by - Diffan on 17 Aug 2021 20:07:46 |
|
|
|
Eldacar
Senior Scribe
438 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2021 : 00:39:48
|
quote:
Originally posted by Diffan
As a sub-race of Elves, they gain the standard aspects all Elves receive. This means they also get a +2 Dex, Darkvision, Keen Senses, Fey Ancestry, etc. like High Elves and Wood Elves.
I'll presume that "yes" is the answer!
quote:
But I guess maybe having proficency in Performance is similar to other races skill Proficiencies, like the Half-Orc being Menacing.
A skill proficiency - such as Performance, yes - would in this case function more efficiently for your intent than a tool proficiency, I think. You could do what Eberron has done with Dragonmarked race skills and have "add +1d4 to the results of a Performance check" if a full proficiency feels like too much (the +1d4 would also obviously stack with an actual proficiency, in that case).
quote:
Maybe just saying 'you may confer the effects', as being an option anytime you want during those hours. I'd read that and think it's an option at-will, during that time.
I would still include a specified action cost, be it action, bonus action, or whatever (e.g. the Boots of Speed specify a bonus action cost to activate, or a Cloak of Invisibility by denoting an action to pull up or pull down the hood). This is mainly for instances where you are operating on initiative count or where action costs are otherwise relevant. And a deactivation (again, the Boots of Speed are a useful example of language for this sort of thing), otherwise you will be able to confer the effects but not remove them. You should probably also include a "the effect ends at dawn" or something as well for sheer common sense, lest the prospective elf become a glowstick production factory.
You may also, thinking about it, want to consider whether you want to specify whether this ability makes weapon attacks explicitly count as magical for the purposes of attacks and damage or if it's only the light effect you want. That will be relevant for the various monsters that take half damage/immunity against nonmagical weapons and their like, since if it counts as magical then it is a distinct change. Spells call this sort of thing out in their text when providing "magic weapons", such as Shadow Blade or Shillelagh, so you won't be unique in doing so for this effect.
quote:
What other 5e effects, besides such spells, interact with any other forceful Banishment?
Traps, regional effects, legendary or lair actions, or generic instances in an adventure (e.g. "players walk into room X, there is a magical effect in this room, players must make a Wisdom save against DC 20 or be banished to plane Y") can all incorporate banishment effects without utilising specific spell text, among other things. It's a blanket term for any effect that is not specifically a spell, and you will find it is also used in the language for spells like mind blank (with respect to "effects that affect the mind" there, among other things), or magic resistance on some creatures/blessings/features. This is versus something like the Mantle of Spell Resistance (which, rightly for its name, only grants advantage on saving throws against spells, so any other magical effect that is not a spell goes right on through and does not trigger the advantage).
quote:
There are some that get more, High Elves get Common, Elven, and one free one. Half-elves get two free ones. Humans get a free one other than Common too. I could word it as such:
Fey Language. You can speak, read, and write Sylvan.
Yes, usually was what I said. Humans get 1+1 so two. Wording it as "fey language" would work.
quote:
You can do as you please in your games.
I do indeed. I'm quite sure you aren't capable of breaking down my door over it!
quote:
Their penalty isn't just because they can get some magic.
"Note that in exchange for their magic and the extra 60 feet of darkvision..."
I said that, yes. Tiefling spells, coming from their subrace as they do, are quite variable; some are distinctly better than others (some are distinctly worse), and some are better suited to some classes than others. The winged variant has no spells at all. Drow spells are okay to very good more or less across the board, and combined with their darkvision they pay for them. |
"The Wild Mages I have met exhibit a startling disregard for common sense, and are often meddling with powers far beyond their own control." ~Volo
"Not unlike a certain travelogue author with whom I am unfortunately acquainted." ~Elminster |
Edited by - Eldacar on 18 Aug 2021 00:43:36 |
|
|
|
sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11827 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2021 : 01:09:31
|
Hmm, I'd agree on that part about replacing the musical instrument with a skill proficiency like performance. Much more flexible. That being said, it wouldn't be unbalancing to do both the performance skill and skill with a musical instrument, and it would seem to fit them.
On the ghost touch thing, the more I think on it, rather than giving them extra light spells, maybe they can activate an effect that gives off a moonlight glow that gives incorporeal beings disadvantage with touch spells, spell-like abilities, and melee attacks for several rounds. It becomes a very simple rule, and its very effective and useful (especially against their "enemies" the nilshai). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
|
|
| |
Topic |
|
|
|
Star Elves of 5th Edition
