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Originally posted by rangerstranger

Maybe even assisting in the start of Shar's Shadow Weave.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

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Originally posted by rangerstranger

Maybe even assisting in the start of Shar's Shadow Weave.

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FYI, the Shadow Weave has been around for quite some time -- likely longer than Xvim. We don't have a date for its creation, that I'm aware of, but the 3E FRCS (page 57) says: "Over the millennia some mortals, mainly her servants, have been allowed to discover the Shadow Weave or have stumbled across it in their researches."

And page 7 of Magic of Faerûn adds to that: "While the Shadow Weave has existed for quite some time, only recently has its use begun to spread rapidly and its power become known to many."

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On a separate note, if you've not seen it elsewhere in our halls, I've a theory that Xvim did not die, and that he's using his father's name to get more worshippers -- the whole return of Bane thing was an elaborate ruse. I can share my admittedly inconclusive evidence, if you're interested and haven't already seen it.

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Originally posted by rangerstranger

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert


On a separate note, if you've not seen it elsewhere in our halls, I've a theory that Xvim did not die, and that he's using his father's name to get more worshippers -- the whole return of Bane thing was an elaborate ruse. I can share my admittedly inconclusive evidence, if you're interested and haven't already seen it.

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Yes, I have seen bits of the theory, but not all of your ideas in their entirety. I may not have been the first but I did point out to you that passage in Empires of the Shining Sea about Xvim pretending to be Bane when he told Teldorn Darkhope to conquer Mintar. As far as sharing your evidence on Xvim, I would not mind at all. Feel free to PM me.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

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Originally posted by rangerstranger

Maybe even assisting in the start of Shar's Shadow Weave.

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FYI, the Shadow Weave has been around for quite some time -- likely longer than Xvim. We don't have a date for its creation, that I'm aware of, but the 3E FRCS (page 57) says: "Over the millennia some mortals, mainly her servants, have been allowed to discover the Shadow Weave or have stumbled across it in their researches."

And page 7 of Magic of Faerûn adds to that: "While the Shadow Weave has existed for quite some time, only recently has its use begun to spread rapidly and its power become known to many."

On a separate note, if you've not seen it elsewhere in our halls, I've a theory that Xvim did not die, and that he's using his father's name to get more worshippers -- the whole return of Bane thing was an elaborate ruse. I can share my admittedly inconclusive evidence, if you're interested and haven't already seen it.

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Originally posted by nblanton

It's implied, but not explicit, that on Mirtul 11th, 1370 DR, the Tyrantfog destroys all remaining baneliches in the Realms. That's from Cloak & Dagger.

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Originally posted by Gary Dallison

My personal view is that not all Baneliches are gone, as Masked Mage pointed out the tyrantfog only covered a limited area, i forget what that area was exactly but i think it was the lands around the Sea of Fallen Stars.

From what we know of Bane's church it is entirely possible there are a few in the Western Heartlands, and perhaps even Calimshan.


If i remember correctly not all Baneliches involved Bane, some people stole the process of their creation and so Bane put a stop to it (which i take to mean that his church spent a lot of time hunting down anyone with knowledge of the process of creating baneliches and destroyed all evidence).

Its kind of implicit that creating BAneliches involves using the essence of Bane, so Xvim absorbing their power would make him more bane like and more likely to become Bane (which may have been Bane's plan all along, he had them created and figured in the event of his death that someone would try and destroy them to prevent his return, but killing them releases that power highlander style and absorbing enough of it makes the slayer Bane 2.0).

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Originally posted by ericlboyd

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Originally posted by Gary Dallison

My personal view is that not all Baneliches are gone, as Masked Mage pointed out the tyrantfog only covered a limited area, i forget what that area was exactly but i think it was the lands around the Sea of Fallen Stars.

From what we know of Bane's church it is entirely possible there are a few in the Western Heartlands, and perhaps even Calimshan.


If i remember correctly not all Baneliches involved Bane, some people stole the process of their creation and so Bane put a stop to it (which i take to mean that his church spent a lot of time hunting down anyone with knowledge of the process of creating baneliches and destroyed all evidence).

Its kind of implicit that creating BAneliches involves using the essence of Bane, so Xvim absorbing their power would make him more bane like and more likely to become Bane (which may have been Bane's plan all along, he had them created and figured in the event of his death that someone would try and destroy them to prevent his return, but killing them releases that power highlander style and absorbing enough of it makes the slayer Bane 2.0).

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George and I put a bit on the background of baneliches in the Jergal write-up.

--Eric

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Originally posted by Mi-Go


I believe the first mention of Xvim in the first FR Campaign Setting had him set up as a very powerful wandering NPC who was his fathers spy and assassin. By the Time of Troubles Bane had him indeed imprisoned beneath the Zhentil Keep and when Cyric destoyed the Keep in a fit of rage he accidentally released Xvim who then took hold of what was left of Banes cults. He never got too far though and died within 5 years or less of his release. In relation to this topic, waiting for roughly 5 years is no task at all for a lich and I could easily imagine a cabal of Baneliches doing whatever it takes to appease Xvim and put up with him for that period of time.

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Originally posted by Gary Dallison

I could be wrong here as I'm going from memory but Fzoul worshipped, Bane, then was forced to submit to Cyric but I wouldnt say ever really worshipped him. Then he turned to Xvim. Then Bane (although whether anything actually changed at this point is up for debate.

Interestingly Xvim was summoned to the Moonshar Isles where he got beat down pretty bad and used magic it escape.

Next we know he is imprisoned beneath Zhentil Keep. He manages to get a cult going among former Banite zealots and they do some awesome ritual to elevate him to true godhood (he was a demi power in the moonshaes and while beneath Zhentil Keep). The ritual involved sacrificing a lot of people and I presume was orchestrated by Fzoul since he becomes the head of Xvims church once he ascends.

My own personal thought is that Xvim used some ancient magic or magic item belonging to Bane to escape his near death in the Moonshaes, but it was actually an ancient trap setup by Myrkul to eliminate Bane should the two ever come to blows (Myrkul gives Bane a magic item to save him in the event of near death but it actually traps him so Myrkul can finish him off).

That led me to the thought that the stonejump spell was also old magic of Myrkuls that they used during their travels around Netherils fall and it could be used to trace their steps back to significant sites to the Dark Three.
So wherever Fzoul went with that Stonetell could be assumed to be a place the Dark Three visited when they were alive. Maybe Fzoul was trying to find more of Bane and Myrkuls magic, and instead he found powerful allies (and a means to create the tyrantfog).

Just my thoughts.

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The ritual involved sacrificing a lot of people and I presume was orchestrated by Fzoul since he becomes the head of Xvims church once he ascends.

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Originally posted by Wooly Rupert

I don't think he was worshipping Mask, he was just willing to accept his help.

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Originally posted by George Krashos

I found this information in my notes re baneliches from Ed. It's from his 2004 thread: http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1901&whichpage=69

-- George Krashos

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Originally posted by sleyvas

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Originally posted by George Krashos

I found this information in my notes re baneliches from Ed. It's from his 2004 thread: http://forum.candlekeep.com/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=1901&whichpage=69

-- George Krashos

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Just reprinting that info so make it easier to keep this thread easier for people following me... then some notes...

From the Hooded OneHello, all. Ed makes another reply:


Torkwaret, Steven’s already dealt admirably with your first question; of COURSE you can still have baneliches around if you’d like to use them in your campaign.

Here are some banelich names from my notes: Clarth Hornhaeld, Khorvan Jaeleth, Harlrhys Moksoun, Haursar Rhallowglas, and Laumbur Yuthlekh.

As for burnbones, to quote the rules: “The early days of the Banedeath did not go well for Cyric, the (then) new god of the dead, and many of his fledgling clerics were slaughtered at the hands of powerful Banites. Cyric soon after empowered select members of his clerical faithful with a portion of his power -- so much power, in fact, that these clerics’ mortal forms dissolved into nothing more than mere bones and the fiery power of the Dark Sun. These new undead, burnbones, are similar to the blazing bones found in the ruins of Myth Drannor in appearance, but that is where the similarity ends. Burnbones tend to wear the symbol of Cyric on themselves (as a holy symbol, for instance) as a sign of their devotion.”

In other words, they’re paranoid, fanatical worshippers of Cyric who appear as walking skeletons sheathed in everburning flames. They do fiery damage by their touch, and heat damage to all creatures within ten feet (the flames never consume their bones, and they’re a lot more powerful than skeletons). They retain the spellcasting abilities (but no actual casting needed; they just point a finger and the spell issues forth) they had in life (as priests of Cyric of 12th or greater level). Cast spells return in 24 hours, spells can’t be interrupted, and they can cast a spell with one hand and attack with the other in any given round. Curing spells harm them. Burnbones are detailed in the 2nd Edition D&D Realms boxed set TSR1120 Ruins of Zhentil Keep (the cover of the box shows three adventurers confronting a burnbones).

Cyric controls them personally if he desires, so there’s no need to hunt down these rules; make their specifics whatever you want them to be, and blame the result on Cyric’s presence.


Just curious, anything ever done with burnbones to any significant degree. I'm not incredibly fond of Cyric and would prefer him to be a god of the insane, paranoid, and chaotic, but it might be fun to speculate at what some burnbones might have done after the spelplague when their god became imprisoned. For instance, would Lathander and Tyr have freed these beings from their "unjust enforced servitude to a mad god" and might they have been given a chance to serve a new deity while continuing to hold a bit of Cyric's power (visually, I could see them serving Amaunator, Kossuth, Velsharoon, etc...).

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I dont remember burnbones in anything other than Ruins of Zhentil Keep

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