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mastermustard
Seeker
USA
78 Posts |
 Posted - 29 Jun 2020 : 05:11:15
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I for one am glad that no more Realms novels are being published, and my reasons are political. In the current Cultural Revolution that we're experiencing in the US, no IP is spared. The realms that we knew decades ago is no more -- any novel written in 2020 would undoubtedly have to fill a quota of lecturing the reader about how horrible and racist they are, while toppling the established heirarchies that exist in the Realms in the name of revenge for alleged real-world injustices.
This was my childhood. I'm glad I won't get to see them destroy it. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1288 Posts |
Posted - 29 Jun 2020 : 10:09:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Karsus
-They are what made the world feel alive. Like what was being written or dislike it, but when stuff happened it made the setting feel like a living, breathing place that wasn't static.
I guess I'm like a classic sitcom watcher---I want weird, exciting things to happen and then afterwards I want it to go back to what it was before that I know and am comfortable with. I've long said before I liked the Horde invasion for a RSE, or Threat from the Sea, because it was big and brutal and created heroes and villains, but largely the world goes back to what it was before the threat and nothing is destroyed from the act, just created.
So I guess I want somewhat static Realms, which after ToT we had, until they decided to go blowing up the Realms and murdering Mystra again and advacing timelines and killing the IP like they have now.
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Lord Karsus
Great Reader
USA
3741 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jul 2020 : 22:49:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Seravin
I guess I'm like a classic sitcom watcher---I want weird, exciting things to happen and then afterwards I want it to go back to what it was before that I know and am comfortable with. I've long said before I liked the Horde invasion for a RSE, or Threat from the Sea, because it was big and brutal and created heroes and villains, but largely the world goes back to what it was before the threat and nothing is destroyed from the act, just created.
So I guess I want somewhat static Realms, which after ToT we had, until they decided to go blowing up the Realms and murdering Mystra again and advacing timelines and killing the IP like they have now.
-My favorite books were (for the most part) the ones that didn't contain RSEs. Wasn't really a fan of most of the RSEs that were introduced over the years. I didn't mean so much that I liked seeing how the world could be "blown up" and then stitched back together, but that the events of the novels (and adventures, in some cases) were then later reflected in other novels/adventures/sourcebooks, showing that the world was organic and alive, rather than just a snapshot that we got every couple of months when a new sourcebook was published. |
(A Tri-Partite Arcanist Who Has Forgotten More Than Most Will Ever Know)
Elves of Faerűn
Vol I- The Elves of Faerűn
Vol. III- Spells of the Elves
Vol. VI- Mechanical Compendium |
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Seravin
Master of Realmslore
Canada
1288 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jul 2020 : 23:32:15
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Agree with you Lord Karsus - I think the Harpers series is so good because it is mostly small, personal stories and not RSEs being conquered. None of my fave Realms books involve RSE.
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2020 : 01:40:58
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| I enjoyed both. I liked the big, scoping stories, but I liked the smaller scale ones, as well. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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AliMaClan
Acolyte
Canada
15 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2020 : 12:16:09
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If no more books will be published, is there a known source of “fan fiction”? Or do copyright/Intellectual property laws prohibit this?
I understand that many people will only want canon, but others may just be looking for a ripping yarn or some good ideas for their games.
(Apologies for my ignorance if Candlekeep already houses such a repository - I have not yet had time to peruse all the scrolls.) |
Exiled from the realms for 35 years on a quest for the lost chord. I return empty handed to resume my studies... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2020 : 14:22:49
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quote:
Originally posted by AliMaClan
If no more books will be published, is there a known source of “fan fiction”? Or do copyright/Intellectual property laws prohibit this?
I understand that many people will only want canon, but others may just be looking for a ripping yarn or some good ideas for their games.
(Apologies for my ignorance if Candlekeep already houses such a repository - I have not yet had time to peruse all the scrolls.)
Realms fanfiction exists. Like any fanfiction, there are varying degrees of quality -- some is painful to read, some is well-written, some sticks to canon fairly well, some deviates wildly... And of course, there's a fair amount of fanfiction that is sexual in nature.
It's been a very long time since I looked, but I know that at one point in time, there were a couple major sites -- fanfiction.net and adultfanfiction.net. On the former, I once saw a Forgotten Realms/Sailor Moon crossover. On the latter, DrizztxArtemis and DrizztxJarlaxle pairings seemed to be popular.
This was something like 2004, the last time I looked, so I don't know if either site is still around, or if the preferred pairings on the latter have changed - never really understood the whole appeal of putting characters in non-canon relationships of any kind, really. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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AliMaClan
Acolyte
Canada
15 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2020 : 15:19:54
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| I suppose the difficulty is how to sort the wheat from the chaff. I wonder if there is any way this can be done - fan sites with quality control or “up voting” perhaps? |
Exiled from the realms for 35 years on a quest for the lost chord. I return empty handed to resume my studies... |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2020 : 21:02:13
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quote:
Originally posted by AliMaClan
I suppose the difficulty is how to sort the wheat from the chaff. I wonder if there is any way this can be done - fan sites with quality control or “up voting” perhaps?
It's a good idea, but then you'd still have whatever the dominant user preference is skewing things. For example, a lot of people only know the Realms through one character -- and if they were the voters for a fan site, they'd heavily favor anything featuring that character, his supporting cast, or similar stuff.
Getting a more balanced rating could be tricky. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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ZeshinX
Learned Scribe
Canada
210 Posts |
Posted - 03 Jul 2020 : 02:40:15
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I do miss the novels quite a bit. I could have done without that many RSE's, but I never minded those that had high stakes and large implications for the setting but did not inherently threaten massive, destructive impacts. The Last Mythal trilogy struck me as something like that. Now it's been a long while since I've read it, but I found it had high stakes, but it struck me that its ultimate purpose was to introduce a new antagonistic power group to the Realms (the Dlardrageths and others allied to them). I could be forgetting quite a lot about it and whether or not it was an RSE-level event...but novels that offer stakes like that without an impending 'End of All Things' I tend to enjoy.
The smaller scale novels were also quite excellent, though I admit I read fewer of them (or at least it feels that way). |
"...because despite the best advice of those who know what they are talking about, other people insist on doing the most massively stupid things."
-Galen, technomage |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1625 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2020 : 14:13:23
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| The current Dragon+ Digital Magazine has a question where you can tell WotC that you want more novels again. I would encourage you to do so and spread the, world. |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1625 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2020 : 14:16:05
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| The current Dragon+ Digital Magazine has a question where you can tell WotC that you want more novels again. I would encourage you to do so and spread the, world. |
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Captain Grafalcon
Learned Scribe
Brazil
129 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2020 : 22:19:47
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quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
The current Dragon+ Digital Magazine has a question where you can tell WotC that you want more novels again. I would encourage you to do so and spread the, world.
This idea is interesting ... at least for now I am comforted by the large volume of books already published. It is reassuring to be able to reread several series.I recently had the pleasure of "rediscovering" Elaine Cunningham, Elfsong is a Realms masterpiece. |
"Surely you recognize that armies carrying banners are almost always thieves—until they win."
Jarlaxle, mercenary leader of Bregan D'aerthe. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 31 Jul 2020 : 22:45:03
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| just wondering, since someone mentioned dragon+ …. how many folks actually read this here? Ever since they went to a virtual format, I've just lost track of reading it. If it were still paper, I'd still buy it, if for no other reason than to just have an idea of what the latest trends are or what new products are coming out. I totally get why having stockpiles of old magazines suck mind you (especially when you move). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 01 Aug 2020 : 04:20:16
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
just wondering, since someone mentioned dragon+ …. how many folks actually read this here? Ever since they went to a virtual format, I've just lost track of reading it. If it were still paper, I'd still buy it, if for no other reason than to just have an idea of what the latest trends are or what new products are coming out. I totally get why having stockpiles of old magazines suck mind you (especially when you move).
I would have read Dragon+ -- if it had been pdfs or something I could copy to Word. I tried copying something out of one of the first "issues" to Word, and the formatting was so wonky I gave up. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 01 Aug 2020 : 17:24:46
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
just wondering, since someone mentioned dragon+ …. how many folks actually read this here? Ever since they went to a virtual format, I've just lost track of reading it. If it were still paper, I'd still buy it, if for no other reason than to just have an idea of what the latest trends are or what new products are coming out. I totally get why having stockpiles of old magazines suck mind you (especially when you move).
I would have read Dragon+ -- if it had been pdfs or something I could copy to Word. I tried copying something out of one of the first "issues" to Word, and the formatting was so wonky I gave up.
Before you paste into Word, paste it into Notepad and then copy and paste from there. That will remove the formatting. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 01 Aug 2020 : 17:53:22
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quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
just wondering, since someone mentioned dragon+ …. how many folks actually read this here? Ever since they went to a virtual format, I've just lost track of reading it. If it were still paper, I'd still buy it, if for no other reason than to just have an idea of what the latest trends are or what new products are coming out. I totally get why having stockpiles of old magazines suck mind you (especially when you move).
I would have read Dragon+ -- if it had been pdfs or something I could copy to Word. I tried copying something out of one of the first "issues" to Word, and the formatting was so wonky I gave up.
Before you paste into Word, paste it into Notepad and then copy and paste from there. That will remove the formatting.
It removes stuff like italics and such -- but that's not the problem (besides, Word also has a function to remove formatting).
The problem is that text gets moved around and such -- you'll have two columns of text, and instead of going from top to bottom in one column and then starting at the top of the next, it treats both of them as one column and thus mixes up all the text. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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TheIriaeban
Master of Realmslore
USA
1289 Posts |
Posted - 01 Aug 2020 : 19:16:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by TheIriaeban
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
I would have read Dragon+ -- if it had been pdfs or something I could copy to Word. I tried copying something out of one of the first "issues" to Word, and the formatting was so wonky I gave up.
Before you paste into Word, paste it into Notepad and then copy and paste from there. That will remove the formatting.
It removes stuff like italics and such -- but that's not the problem (besides, Word also has a function to remove formatting).
The problem is that text gets moved around and such -- you'll have two columns of text, and instead of going from top to bottom in one column and then starting at the top of the next, it treats both of them as one column and thus mixes up all the text.
That is just as bad an a non-OCR'd document (well, almost, at least you can still search it). I haven't looked in a while. Maybe someone has something out there to handle that. I looked a few years back and couldn't find one so I wrote a quick and dirty console app that OCRs text in a screenshot. I would think that someone would have written something full-featured by now. |
"Iriaebor is a fine city. So what if you can have violence between merchant groups break out at any moment. Not every city can offer dinner AND a show."
My FR writeups - http://www.mediafire.com/folder/um3liz6tqsf5n/Documents
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 06 Aug 2020 : 18:53:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Gyor
The current Dragon+ Digital Magazine has a question where you can tell WotC that you want more novels again. I would encourage you to do so and spread the, world.
Is a subscription required? Do you have a link? |
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astolfo
Acolyte
USA
5 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2020 : 16:04:07
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| Wow, been out of the loop for awhile. This is so sad. |
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KraziJoe
Acolyte
USA
17 Posts |
Posted - 02 Oct 2020 : 15:27:30
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| I think Hasbro is missing the boat on this one. I started reading the Realms back in the 80's when I was a teen. Here I am pushing 50 with a ton more money than I had back then and would love to buy more, and yet, I cannot. I am sure there are a bunch more old farts that want to buy the books. Are there Millions? No, but if you market it correctly you can sell to us old farts, who would probably buy it regardless of the marketing, and you can bring in the new folks. And don't forget us old farts are becoming grand parents now and we love to pass on our likes to them just to annoy their parents. Missed opportunity and short sightedness on Hasbro's part. |
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Asjo
Acolyte
Denmark
2 Posts |
Posted - 12 Oct 2020 : 20:22:43
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When I was younger, not as many fantasy set in the Dungeons & Dragons universe had come out. I read what I could find in the library. I read the Dragon Lance series and no more than a few books with the Forgotten Realms setting. I read comic books based on the Drizzt universe, and I remember it intrigued me, particular since I'm very fascinated with strong and dominant women.
Many years later, I did borrow a few more books to read at the library. However, it was only once I started to get into audiobooks a few years ago that I really got into the Forgotten Realms universe. First, I listened through everything from R.A. Salvatore, only remembering later that I actually knew some of the stories already, having read a book or two. And now I've been going through everything I can find related to Forgotten Realms. I listen to some audiobooks on my laptop as I go to sleep, and others on my MP3 player as I take the bus and other transport. Sometimes I bring my laptop into my living room and put on the audiobooks, if I'm cleaning my apartment, making dinner or doing other stuff where I'm not staring at a screen.
Just now, I realized that I only had around 20 series left to listen to before the well had run dry. Given how quickly you go through the audiobooks, I realized that I would have to take a closer look at what new stuff had come out. When I realized that the books had stopped, I looked into it, and ended up here.
It feels terrible how something as meaningless as commercial interest threatens the continuation of the Forgotten Realms setting. Forgotten Realms, the world that many people have built and brought to life, feels like the main vein of the fantasy genre. Granted, there are other fantasy world, but fantasy mainly has its offset in Dungeons & Dragons, and Forgotten Realms has served to enrich this genre of fantasy, giving it not only purpose, but an actual body and history. The shared effort to keep a continual world, where everything was interconnected, gives us a shared way of exploring the different themes that Dungeons & Dragons offers. Even with great upheaval and seemingly arbitrary changes to this universe, like The Sundering, my interesting didn't wane. I want to see the drow female gain power in world above, I want see orc hordes driven away, see the Zhentarim reduced, I want to see nations expanding or fighting rebellion. When history is recorded and put into a great context, it always feels like it has meaning.
So, that's what I fear we're losing. A universe so vast, with a base in lore and shared histories so rich that almost any aspect can be explored to great length. I realize that some of the books I've read have been written out of the Forgotten Realm history, which feels terrible, but I also appreciate the fact that WotC have worked to maintain the integrity of this universe, even when it has come at a great cost to creative freedom. While others might try to fill the hole left by their current refusal to feed the universe they've birthed, I don't we're likely to experience the same cohesion in the story that we try to share. We've built something, and so many have been willing to contribute, but in the end, the entire basis for the Forgotten Realms universe and for people maintaining the wiki, discussing the lore and discovering new aspects, is that the universe was alive. If the stories stop, I think many of us will consider it dead. I will no doubt continue the listen to the remaining audiobooks within Forgotten Realms, but it certainly won't be with the same luster. |
Edited by - Asjo on 12 Oct 2020 23:29:13 |
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mastermustard
Seeker
USA
78 Posts |
Posted - 14 Oct 2020 : 09:29:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Asjo
When I was younger, not as many fantasy set in the Dungeons & Dragons universe had come out. I read what I could find in the library. I read the Dragon Lance series and no more than a few books with the Forgotten Realms setting. I read comic books based on the Drizzt universe, and I remember it intrigued me, particular since I'm very fascinated with strong and dominant women.
Many years later, I did borrow a few more books to read at the library. However, it was only once I started to get into audiobooks a few years ago that I really got into the Forgotten Realms universe. First, I listened through everything from R.A. Salvatore, only remembering later that I actually knew some of the stories already, having read a book or two. And now I've been going through everything I can find related to Forgotten Realms. I listen to some audiobooks on my laptop as I go to sleep, and others on my MP3 player as I take the bus and other transport. Sometimes I bring my laptop into my living room and put on the audiobooks, if I'm cleaning my apartment, making dinner or doing other stuff where I'm not staring at a screen.
Just now, I realized that I only had around 20 series left to listen to before the well had run dry. Given how quickly you go through the audiobooks, I realized that I would have to take a closer look at what new stuff had come out. When I realized that the books had stopped, I looked into it, and ended up here.
It feels terrible how something as meaningless as commercial interest threatens the continuation of the Forgotten Realms setting. Forgotten Realms, the world that many people have built and brought to life, feels like the main vein of the fantasy genre. Granted, there are other fantasy world, but fantasy mainly has its offset in Dungeons & Dragons, and Forgotten Realms has served to enrich this genre of fantasy, giving it not only purpose, but an actual body and history. The shared effort to keep a continual world, where everything was interconnected, gives us a shared way of exploring the different themes that Dungeons & Dragons offers. Even with great upheaval and seemingly arbitrary changes to this universe, like The Sundering, my interesting didn't wane. I want to see the drow female gain power in world above, I want see orc hordes driven away, see the Zhentarim reduced, I want to see nations expanding or fighting rebellion. When history is recorded and put into a great context, it always feels like it has meaning.
So, that's what I fear we're losing. A universe so vast, with a base in lore and shared histories so rich that almost any aspect can be explored to great length. I realize that some of the books I've read have been written out of the Forgotten Realm history, which feels terrible, but I also appreciate the fact that WotC have worked to maintain the integrity of this universe, even when it has come at a great cost to creative freedom. While others might try to fill the hole left by their current refusal to feed the universe they've birthed, I don't we're likely to experience the same cohesion in the story that we try to share. We've built something, and so many have been willing to contribute, but in the end, the entire basis for the Forgotten Realms universe and for people maintaining the wiki, discussing the lore and discovering new aspects, is that the universe was alive. If the stories stop, I think many of us will consider it dead. I will no doubt continue the listen to the remaining audiobooks within Forgotten Realms, but it certainly won't be with the same luster.
I agree with all of this. I can feel your passion and love for the Realms. It was a lot more than just a fantasy setting for many of us who grew up reading and playing and living it. It definitely felt real, and alive, like the novels were historical texts depicting actual events transpiring in a far away time and place, with characters whose destinies and fates you felt intimately connected with.
And yes, the Realms now feels dead to me. To preserve my composure I've recorded it in my headcanon that Szass Tam succeeded in creating his dread rings and annihilated Toril towards the end of 4e. Everything written since then has been the dreams of a mad lich. |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2020 : 23:42:36
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Acolyte Drumheller,
I would imagine that there is a strategic marketing reason (think product development, not advertisement here) behind this decision. The amount of lore that goes into the novels, accessories, is of course enormous. The cross-section of people that a command of that material with the skill set to translate that into a novel makes that a pretty niche group of people. As that lorebase develops over time, that could lead to those authors to command more pay, etc. Companies, unless the amount of money they are making is preposterous, don't like to get pigeonholed into that situation. Now, admittedly, I have no idea what their margins were for those novels, but to develop that product line in a way where you can tell investors it is solid for an investment takes a lot of work, and I wonder if they just didn't feel comfortable doing it for that lack of control.
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2020 : 09:21:44
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Acolyte Drumheller,
As a consequence of recent news, it very well may be related to allegations included within court filings submitted by Margaret Weis LLC and Tracy Hickman in their suit against WotC: https://www.scribd.com/document/480694976/Weis-and-Hickman-v-WoTC
Best regards,
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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Richard Lee Byers
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
1814 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2020 : 14:33:06
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| The decision to kill the Forgotten Realms novel line predates the Hickman/Weis lawsuit by more than a decade, so I don't think that can have anything to do with the initial decision. It may have something to do with quelling any enthusiasm anybody at the company had for revisiting the decision. |
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Delnyn
Senior Scribe
USA
958 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2020 : 15:07:45
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All legal squabbles aside, did WoTC say anything offical to the effect of: "We are the the game business, not the novel business." ? If that is the case, then either independent business must take over the market niche, or people like we do. Not that the latter two groups are mutually exclusive.  |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 21 Nov 2020 : 15:38:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Delnyn
All legal squabbles aside, did WoTC say anything offical to the effect of: "We are the the game business, not the novel business." ? If that is the case, then either independent business must take over the market niche, or people like we do. Not that the latter two groups are mutually exclusive.
I don't believe it was ever officially stated, it was more the way their leadership ran things. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Why no more FR novels?
