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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11858 Posts |
 Posted - 31 Mar 2020 : 22:22:08
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Yeah, I've somewhat made the correlation of Thor/Odin combined, but more along the lines of Thor picking up where Odin left off and Ragnarok was wrong, he didn't die. I would not have this being tied to Ruathym at all though. He works for the Metahel. However.... IF ... Kozah were split like Tyche... and maybe he had been CN before.... such that we end up with Thoros (CG) and Talos (CE). That might be too silly though. Anyway, just for discussions sake, below is what I did for the Metahel in Anchorome since we're discussing this one idea of combining Thor and Odin. To note, the blue dragon Raethghul is meant to be a hidden reference to Gargauth and his blue dragon Rathguul, but I never developed it.
Thoros, Lord of Thunder and Lightning, Bringer of Rain, Stepfather of Yuellar, Father of the Thunder Twins and Thoordra - Much like his wife, Thoros' moods are reflected in his beard and hair color, changing from either blonde when he is acting nobly, to red when he is raging. He is seen to have lost his right eye, and he wears an eyepatch of blue dragon hide made from the wingskin torn from a great blue dragon named Raethghul whom he once fought. It is said however that beneath this patch lies the eye of his father, recovered from an ancient place of power after his father's disappearance, and those who claim to have seen it claim to have looked upon a whirling aura of stars, light, and darkness. He also lost his left arm in a fight with one of the great giant jarls of old, whose name seems to change with the telling. Thoros had this limb replaced with a magical arm of cold-forged black iron, which gives him great control of electricity and magnetism. He fights in his right hand with his famed everbleeding battle axe, Jarlsbluud, made of the bones of the first giant lord he ever killed and inlaid with carved deep green pieces of bloodstone flecked with red which are said to be organs of this giant lord. In his left hand Thoros uses his spear, Fangir, which is a piece of the world ash repeatedly lightning struck during a hurricane which threatened the tree when Thoros hung himself bleeding from it with spikes through his flesh for 16 days to uncover the power of runes. Its tip hardened by the resulting fires and engorged with the fury of the storm, Fangir is imbued with the powers of fire, wind, rain, thunder, and lightning. However, his favorite weapon is Mahljniir, a great double headed warhammer forged of the metal of a dead sun and smelted over the funeral pyre of his father, Asagrimmr, and whose second head is actually the fang of Kezris, left behind in his father's body when the great wolf killed him. The warhammer, Mahljniir, is capable of fighting on its own, and is said to possess the wit and wisdom of Asagrimmr. It also refuses to work for anyone which it does not deem worthy of its aid, though how it determines such worthiness seems to be conflicting depending on its mood. It is rumored that long ago, in return for his aid on a quest, Faerthandir blessed Thoros with such virility that when he impregnated his wife Sifya, it also awakened the seed in his former lover Yaernsacsa. Both Sifya and Yaernsacsa gave birth at the same time, and their children (Moedae and Magnaear) were twins. He is noted as having a chariot pulled by a pair of winged rams whose hooves spark and thunder as they pull him across the sky. Thoros is known to have many enemies, primarily amongst giantkind, but he is particularly known as well for having enmity with the demon lords Kostchtchie, Baphomet, and Orcus, as well as as another savage one eye god known to the Metahel people as Grumash. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 31 Mar 2020 : 22:37:59
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Thanks!
I had another thought about the Storm Lord ...
What if the "Lost Eye of Talos" explains the calm in the eye of hurricanes? It means an epic spellcaster who knows how to shape hurricanes can stand untouched in the eye of such storms, rendering Talos helpless to exact his fury.
Technically, Talos also has a lost hand. He holds three staves in his hollow arm. Flavor text indicates that Big T is really, really old, given that the implications behind his staves.
At least as I wrote it up in F&A, he hasn't lost a hand. He has removable hands. With tools inside. Which, in retrospect, is a bit weird.
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
Edited by - ericlboyd on 01 Apr 2020 12:45:25 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36813 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2020 : 15:34:01
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Thanks!
I had another thought about the Storm Lord ...
What if the "Lost Eye of Talos" explains the calm in the eye of hurricanes? It means an epic spellcaster who knows how to shape hurricanes can stand untouched in the eye of such storms, rendering Talos helpless to exact his fury.
Technically, Talos also has a lost hand. He holds three staves in his hollow arm. Flavor text indicates that Big T is really, really old, given that the implications behind his staves.
At least as I wrote it up in F&A, he hasn't lost a hand. He has removable hands. With tools inside. Which, in retrospect, is a bit weird.
It's less weird than the Native American deity Kokopelli. He had something detachable, but it wasn't his hands... He would drop it in a river, it would go visit a young lady bathing somewhere in that river, and then swim back.
Removable hands are nothing compared to that!  |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6362 Posts |
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ericlboyd
Forgotten Realms Designer
USA
2067 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2020 : 17:04:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison
Having 3 hands could have come about from the merging of the churches of kozah, bhaelros, and talos. Each church had an idea of their god wielding a separate sacred item and to ease the process of merging the churches (forced or voluntary) they decide to depict him as being able to have all 3 at the same time.
This is a great idea. |
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http://www.ericlboyd.com/dnd/ |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6362 Posts |
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Delnyn
Senior Scribe
USA
975 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2020 : 19:18:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Thanks!
I had another thought about the Storm Lord ...
What if the "Lost Eye of Talos" explains the calm in the eye of hurricanes? It means an epic spellcaster who knows how to shape hurricanes can stand untouched in the eye of such storms, rendering Talos helpless to exact his fury.
Technically, Talos also has a lost hand. He holds three staves in his hollow arm. Flavor text indicates that Big T is really, really old, given that the implications behind his staves.
At least as I wrote it up in F&A, he hasn't lost a hand. He has removable hands. With tools inside. Which, in retrospect, is a bit weird.
It's less weird than the Native American deity Kokopelli. He had something detachable, but it wasn't his hands... He would drop it in a river, it would go visit a young lady bathing somewhere in that river, and then swim back.
Removable hands are nothing compared to that!
Osiris got a *ahem* similar deal when Isis and Nephthys raised him from the dead. Go figure. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6669 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2020 : 10:03:04
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison
Having 3 hands could have come about from the merging of the churches of kozah, bhaelros, and talos. Each church had an idea of their god wielding a separate sacred item and to ease the process of merging the churches (forced or voluntary) they decide to depict him as being able to have all 3 at the same time.
This is a great idea.
Yep, agreed. Good job Gary. Bringing it back to the "real world" is always the best way.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11858 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2020 : 19:51:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
It's less weird than the Native American deity Kokopelli. He had something detachable, but it wasn't his hands... He would drop it in a river, it would go visit a young lady bathing somewhere in that river, and then swim back.
Removable hands are nothing compared to that!
Hmmmm, just what WAS Talos doing with that hand when he removed it... |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Delnyn
Senior Scribe
USA
975 Posts |
Posted - 02 Apr 2020 : 20:16:49
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quote:
Originally posted by sleyvas
quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
It's less weird than the Native American deity Kokopelli. He had something detachable, but it wasn't his hands... He would drop it in a river, it would go visit a young lady bathing somewhere in that river, and then swim back.
Removable hands are nothing compared to that!
Hmmmm, just what WAS Talos doing with that hand when he removed it...
Testing his lightning bolts for heft. |
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TBeholder
Great Reader
2434 Posts |
Posted - 07 Apr 2020 : 21:20:04
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
Technically, Talos also has a lost hand. He holds three staves in his hollow arm. Flavor text indicates that Big T is really, really old, given that the implications behind his staves.
Tarrasque goad? Hmm. |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1543 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2020 : 00:12:23
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quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
Technically, Talos also has a lost hand. He holds three staves in his hollow arm. Flavor text indicates that Big T is really, really old, given that the implications behind his staves.
Tarrasque goad? Hmm.
Behind that gruff, murderous facade is a big ol' softie who loves to play fetch with his pet tarrasque, preferably in front of Sune's realm while wearing nothing but a pair of shorts.
The resident celestials of Arborea have given up trying to evict him and have resorted to begging Sune to make him go away. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11858 Posts |
Posted - 09 Apr 2020 : 12:28:26
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
Technically, Talos also has a lost hand. He holds three staves in his hollow arm. Flavor text indicates that Big T is really, really old, given that the implications behind his staves.
Tarrasque goad? Hmm.
Behind that gruff, murderous facade is a big ol' softie who loves to play fetch with his pet tarrasque, preferably in front of Sune's realm while wearing nothing but a pair of shorts.
The resident celestials of Arborea have given up trying to evict him and have resorted to begging Sune to make him go away.
Those poor celestials that he hurls for the tarrasque to go fetch... |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11858 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2020 : 03:17:41
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| Well, I just came up with an interesting idea for me for mixing Thor and Talos... maybe something that might involve Moander in a "splitting them into two parts" move. So, one of the things we've noted that's different about Talos from Kozah is this eye, and if you lift up the eyepatch you see a darkness with stars and its bad... really bad.... (I forget the whole what it does). So, an idea that Markustay had thrown around here about two years back was the concept of the Queen of Air and Darkness being more like the black diamond itself and "infecting" other beings. He was calling it the "Regalia of Winter", and I noted that she's also tied to darkness and death/undeath so perhaps "Regalia of Darkest Deathly Winters"... willing to hear another better name.... So, such that Auril may have been infected by ONE of the facets of the diamond crafted into some piece of Regalia. But, it doesn't HAVE to be just women infected, and perhaps the "Queen" sometimes works through male gods. So, what if what's behind the eyepatch is a facet of the black diamond, and its split the Thor that was into the Talos and Thoros that are (Thoros not being in the Faerunian Pantheon). Along similar lines, the faerie version of the QoA&D is said to be the "sister" of Titania.... so perhaps Titania is a split off kind of like Tyche/Beshaba. It could also be that this might stretch back even as far as Selune/Shar. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1600 Posts |
Posted - 22 Apr 2020 : 18:22:39
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
(...) the four Gods of Fury are the bad guys. They are unchanging and more powerful than the hero gods.
The good guys are the four hero-gods.
(...)
Very nice.
It got me thinking: in the 1e Moonshae booklet, three of the four Gods of Fury are worshipped by some northmen. However, their main deity is Tempus, worshipped as a storm god (the book says "a stormy aspect of Tempus", IIRC).
What if Tempus defeated Talos, casting him away from the Moonshaes (explaining his absence there, and his desire to regain a foot there), and taking some of his storm powers in the process? Maybe the Eathmother helped him in his rivalry agains Talos (because he would be a lesser menace to the Isles), gaining the later's enmity. And then, Tempus inspires or patrons heroes to fight Talos' lackeys...
EDIT: typos |
"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."
The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood) |
Edited by - Barastir on 22 Apr 2020 18:36:56 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11858 Posts |
Posted - 19 May 2020 : 19:40:39
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The Dawn Cock of Lathander
Someone made a 3d model that I'd thought about doing
https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4373133
so I threw it in paint3d and made a picture
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1Q7WavrSE5QxFLox4Ocrf-jU1AEynGuxP/view?usp=sharing
Whilst Lathander is seen as the sun god, in Ruathen myth, Lathander himself is not seen as an embodiment of the sun, but rather he rides upon "the Dawn Cock" which is seen as a personification of the sun itself. These stories are seen as well amongst the Rus in Rashemen, the northmen of the Utter East, the Arkaiun barbarians of the Shaar. Even the Metahel of Far Anchorome, with their stories of Faerthandir who rides upon his golden furred foxibou, makes reference to the "Dawn Cock", as do Kercpa myths around Rititisk the Clever. In all such myths, "the Dawn Cock" is seen to sit at the top of the world tree and pass insults, threats, and embarrassing propositions through a Kercpa intermediary named Rititisk the Clever, who passes said down to Dendar the Night Serpent who sits at the root of the world tree feeding upon them and passing similar insults, threats, and embarrassing propositions back to the "Dawn Cock". The actual name of the Dawn Cock seems to have variations throughout the world, but the basic story seems to be very similar.
Interestingly, the great tree of Ruathym, Yggdrasil's Child, possesses a mated pair of cockogriffs (as these size small rooster griffins are known), and each year new hatchlings are born. Its rumored that the surrounding woods possess dozens of cockogriff nests, with color variations to match all varieties of chickens and housecats combined. Though they fly awkwardly, the kercpa that live in Yggdrasil's Child are favored of using the cockogriffs as flying mounts, and its said that some kercpa even use their cockogriffs to deliver messages and small packages around the island and to ships at sea nearby. Some Ruathym Sea Mages and captains are also known to have cockogriff pets or familiars, for such creatures are deemed to be lucky. There are those who say that these creatures have more to do with the Aearee of Anchorome that any mythical creature, and in truth there are stories of cockogriffs in Anchorome, some even being of larger sizes (for instance, one Azuposi koyemshis (known to westerners as a "clown") is said to have met Paiyatemu (known also a Trickster and Sun Youth) and been rewarded with a cockogriff mount. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
Edited by - sleyvas on 19 May 2020 19:45:20 |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6362 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jun 2020 : 11:15:19
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After reading the Crystal Shard and exploring the history of Icewind Dale i came across a curious passage or two that suggests that worship of Tempus may have originated from the Ice Hunter tribes that travelled from the north of Kara-Tur across the Great Glacier.
So the Glacier of the White Worm and the Reghed Glacier both have groups of nomadic barbarians that are distantly related to one another (according to the Bloodstone Lands sourcebook the SCAG).and both of whom worship Tempus in one guise or another, as do the Nar (those of Suren origin). All these three groups are isolationist enough to be little influenced by outside peoples and thus resist the Faerunian pantheon, but they all follow a similar deity.
Could it be possible that the worship of Tempus as a lord of battles was actually created by the merging of the myths and legends of Illuskan and Ice Hunter peoples.
The proto Ice Hunter tribes travelled from northern Kara-Tur across the Great Glacier and left behind groups that formed the Suren, the Ulutiuns, the barbarians of the White Worm, and the Reghedmen and Ice Hunters of the Sword Coast.
The Ice Hunters were chased out of the Sword Coast by the barbarians who likely worshipped some horrific storm coupled with a bloodthirsty monster like humanisation that brought out the worst in people and caused untold suffering. This idea merged somewhat with the Ice Hunters veneration of ancient ancestors (one in particular being Kerpos a great horse nomad general like figure - white horse and black horse). The northmen create the idea of Tempos as a bloodthirsty warrior, who over time becomes the being worshipped in the Moonshae Isles.
On mainland Faerun, the Illuskans gradually mutate this worship to Tempus the Lord of Battles and it spreads across Faerun with the Netherese and Jhaamdath diaspora.
In the Great Glacier the Ulutiuns abandon Kerpos after the Keryjak Wars, viewing warfare as an unnecessary and unaffordable waste of resources.
The barbarians of the White Worm still worship a derivative of the original Ice Hunter deity (give him a localised name), but which any Faerunian recognises as Tempus.
The Suren Nar were of course exposed to the Shou of Kara-Tur and perhaps should have a a representation of Tempus that is perhaps closest to the original (as a particularly powerful ancestor spirit that all the tribes recognise - with a black and white horse).
Just a thought regarding the Ruathen Pantheon and the possible origin of Tempus
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deserk
Learned Scribe
Norway
238 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jan 2021 : 15:33:28
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
No, the four Gods of Fury are the bad guys. They are unchanging and more powerful than the hero gods.
The good guys are the four hero-gods. The current incarnations of the hero gods are Gwaeron (Hunter), Shaundakul (Wanderer), Uthgar (Warrior), and Valkur (Sailor).
The hero gods die occasionally, because they are weaker than the Gods of Fury.
Previous incarnations of the hero gods include: Skadi the Stalker (Hunter), Ruathane the Reaver (sailor), Magnur the Hamfariggen (warrior), and Ulutiu (Wanderer).
There were other incarnations of the hero gods as well.
Basically every time a hero god dies (at the hands of the Gods of Fury), a new mortal rises to take his or her place.
--Eric
Forgive me from resurrecting this thread, but I think these ideas on the Ruathen are quite intriguing.
I wonder if not the previous incarnations of these hero deities exist still as aspects of the current hero deity? Perhaps unlike the Illuskans of mainland Faerun, the Northlanders of the isles still revere many of these old hero god incarnations rather than the new ones, since there are no indications that deities like Shaundakul, Gwaeron Windstrom and Uthgar are being worshipped in the Northland isles in published Realms material. Though Valkur seems to have become a significant deity for the Northlanders in 5e (according to SCAG). Going by what Powers and Pantheons has said about Uthgar, it seems very unlikely any cultures outside of the Uthgardt would worship him, despite the fact he is a very significant figure in Ruathym's history.
Ruathane would be fitting as an aspect worshipped by the more rough-minded and war-like Ruathen sailors, bandits and reavers whom still cling strongly to the old ways of their forefathers, while Valkur would be worshipped by the more honest-dealing, progressive and adventurous sailors. Magnar the Hamfriggan would be quite fitting as an aspect worshipped in the settlements like Holgerstead (from the Tangled Webs book), where there exists a tradition of shapeshifting berserkers. Skadi could be venerated on islands like Tuern, Norland and Gnarhelm, islands where there are forestlands. She could make an interesting contrast given the Northlanders seem to generally dislike and avoid the forestlands (perhaps due to suspicions about malevolent fey and spirits within them?).
I also in general would love to see much more regional aspects, heresies and deities in the various countries and regions of Faerun. It helps to add more colour and richness to the world. |
Edited by - deserk on 12 Jan 2021 15:38:06 |
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Returnip
Learned Scribe
222 Posts |
Posted - 16 Jan 2021 : 10:56:30
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quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Here are some thoughts on the Ruathen Pantheon.
By the gods, my viking heart beats so hard right now. Those are just beautiful and a very nice take on the "hero legends". I really like how Faerûnian you've made it all, and how well it fits together. Likewise the bad-guy-gods as symbols of forces of nature is excellent, and how larger than life mortals can rise up and overcome them.
quote:
Originally posted by Gary Dallison
I will await your version with bated breath, especially to see what monster you use (a kraken perhaps).
Isn't there already a huge world snake feeding on fears and waiting to consume the world to signal the end of times or something? I recall reading about it in some 3.5 ed book.
There is also some huge wolf thingamajig established as well iirc so the basis for Ragnarök is all there. 
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
You'll note in Spellbound, they use two spellings Magnar and Magnur. The latter appears to be a typo, but ...
In ancient Norse the same runes would be pronounced differently in different parts of the lands. It's just dialectal differences. For examle "mothir" (the word for mother) has a rune that can be pronounced as o or a depending on where you're from, so as to have "mathir" and "mothir" mean the same and be written with the same runes. Not far fetched to decide that the different pronounciations of Magnar/Magnur are from different accounts from different people.
If you could only get a fertility/harvest/circle-of-life entity in there as well. Perhaps a hermaphrodite god? Male and female contained in one entity? Or at least having two sides or shapes or something.
I have a related question. How much published material on the Ruathem is there and in what books predominantly? And have you, ericlboyd, published anything else, perhaps here on Candlekeep? I'd like to read all there is to date.
quote:
Originally posted by ericlboyd
Thanks!
I had another thought about the Storm Lord ...
What if the "Lost Eye of Talos" explains the calm in the eye of hurricanes? It means an epic spellcaster who knows how to shape hurricanes can stand untouched in the eye of such storms, rendering Talos helpless to exact his fury.
That's an amazing idea.
I forgot to add earlier that the whole "hero legend" play makes for excellent plot ideas for players who want to be that mortal that rise up and overcome the forces of nature. Or in some way coexist. Standing in the eye of the storm for example. |
On the other hand you have different fingers. |
Edited by - Returnip on 16 Jan 2021 11:05:09 |
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Returnip
Learned Scribe
222 Posts |
Posted - 17 Jan 2021 : 22:30:55
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| Sorry. I didn't read all the replies properly. George Krashos and anyone else working on material regarding Ruathym, same question. Have you published anything else somewhere that I can read? |
On the other hand you have different fingers. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6669 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jan 2021 : 10:48:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Returnip
Sorry. I didn't read all the replies properly. George Krashos and anyone else working on material regarding Ruathym, same question. Have you published anything else somewhere that I can read?
I've published some stuff at the DMs Guild: https://www.dmsguild.com
Do a search for my name and they will come up. A fair amount of mine are free or "pay what you want" (which in my experience for 99% of people is "free" too).
Eric hasn't published anything at the DMs Guild. Yet.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Returnip
Learned Scribe
222 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jan 2021 : 15:35:13
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
quote:
Originally posted by Returnip
Sorry. I didn't read all the replies properly. George Krashos and anyone else working on material regarding Ruathym, same question. Have you published anything else somewhere that I can read?
I've published some stuff at the DMs Guild: https://www.dmsguild.com
Do a search for my name and they will come up. A fair amount of mine are free or "pay what you want" (which in my experience for 99% of people is "free" too).
Eric hasn't published anything at the DMs Guild. Yet.
-- George Krashos
Found you! Which of them is about Ruathym? |
On the other hand you have different fingers. |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6669 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2021 : 02:39:54
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Absolutely none of them. Eric and I haven't published our Ruathym work yet. Likely won't for a while.
-- George Krashos |
"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Returnip
Learned Scribe
222 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jan 2021 : 14:03:37
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
Absolutely none of them. Eric and I haven't published our Ruathym work yet. Likely won't for a while.
-- George Krashos
Oh, sorry. I musunderstood then. Alright. I'll just wait patiently for when you do. |
On the other hand you have different fingers. |
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Ruathen Pantheon
