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Portuguese D. Ace
Seeker
Italy
82 Posts |
 Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 17:45:22
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Fellow Scribes,
a player o'mine was looking for info on his favourite God: Kelemvor.
He checked online and hehe found this:
Power Level Greater deity
Alignment Lawful neutral
Symbol Upright skeletal arm holding the golden scales of justice
Dominion Death,
Served By Myrkul Bhaal Bane
The last line left me dazzled...
Served by Myrkul Bhaal & Bane?
Where the hell did they find this info? Is there any official source out there?
Thank you for your help
Ace
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Please, bring back the Realms. I'm really fed up with the Sword Coast.
===== Since English is not my first language, I pre-emptively apologize for any (grammar) mistake that has been made in my post. In order to help me improve my English, please, point out those mistakes (If you could do it politely, it would be even better!). Thanks! ===== |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1271 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:02:01
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| List of Deities is in the Free Basic PDF. All gods in question are listed there. I'd guess he got part of the "served by" by some sort of imperfect process of deduction. Kelemvor is listed as the god of the dead, Myrkul as god of death, and Bhaal as god of murder. All of these are parts of death and dying, so you could construe that they all serve each other, but there's nothing official I'm aware of that says that. Bane confuses me. He's listed as the god of tyranny, so no real connection to Kelemvor or death at all unless you make some assumptions about the war domain. |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
Edited by - Delwa on 10 Mar 2015 18:03:31 |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:07:52
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No official source that I know of. That sounds like "homebrew" to me... somebody likes Kelemvor and wants to put him in charge of other deities.
I'm not an expert on the gods; I've been mostly avoiding the fiction that involves them since the TOT, but I don't think there's any canon support for Kelemvor being served by those three.
Ed Greenwood Presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms describes several deities... including Bane, Bhaal, and Myrkul, but not Kelemvor. Which makes sense, since Kelemvor was not a deity in Ed's original Realms. I haven't seen any official 5e material on Kelemvor yet.
Bane and Myrkul, at least, shouldn't be subservient to anyone in my opinion. 
Edit: woops, forgot about that table. It's also on page 294 of the 5e PH. There are definitely some missing, though. Most but not all of the 3e demipowers: Finder, Garagos, Gargauth, Gwaeron, Hoar, Lurue, Nobanion, Red Knight, Sharess, Shiallia, Siamorphe, Uthgar, Valkur, and Velsharoon. A couple of lesser powers: Shaundakul and Tiamat. And several who didn't really belong on the 3e list anyway, so oh well: Jergal, Ubtao, & Ulutiu. Plus the four elemental gods apparently went poof?
I'm quite happy to see Bhaal, Leira, and Myrkul return, and good riddance to Amaunator... never liked that guy.
Hopefully the missing are coming in a more detailed Realms gods book. I'm crossing my fingers that the misguided efforts to reduce the pantheon are stopping. |
Edited by - xaeyruudh on 10 Mar 2015 18:33:02 |
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Portuguese D. Ace
Seeker
Italy
82 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:20:06
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| So... should I consider it as another cheap shot by the "infamous" FRWikia? |
Please, bring back the Realms. I'm really fed up with the Sword Coast.
===== Since English is not my first language, I pre-emptively apologize for any (grammar) mistake that has been made in my post. In order to help me improve my English, please, point out those mistakes (If you could do it politely, it would be even better!). Thanks! ===== |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1271 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:26:16
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| Possibly. I wouldn't blame the wiki though. Looks like someone edited something without citing a source. I'm not sure how to flag that, but the top of the article on Kelemvor does say the article requires cleanup. The admin of the wiki is in the halls somewhere. Hopefully this catches their eye. |
- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:40:39
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| The FR Wiki's strength also holds a vulnerability... anyone can edit it. If someone puts up faulty information, someone else has to notice it and correct it. Persistent vandals and idiots can keep this cycle going forever if they want to; it's happened repeatedly on wikipedia. |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:49:39
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| Stuff on the wiki that isn't cited properly seems to get taken down or edited pretty quickly. |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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deserk
Learned Scribe
Norway
238 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:51:44
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I'm glad that Myrkul is back. He was definitely an interesting and menacing god. I also wonder what Kelemvor's role will be now with Myrkul's return
Also I think I read somewhere Myrkul was originally from Murghom? Maybe this country could have a strong presence of Myrkulites in the new Realms. Would be nice to have a necromantic themed country, instead of that role being served by Thay, I'd prefer Thay going back to what it originally was. |
Edited by - deserk on 10 Mar 2015 18:53:08 |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 18:53:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Portuguese D. Ace
Where the hell did they find this info? Is there any official source out there?
Sounds like wishful thinking. |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
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Portuguese D. Ace
Seeker
Italy
82 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 19:05:55
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[Fanboy mode On]
Let's suppose this info is true... did already happen, for a greater god, to have other greater powers as underlings? |
Please, bring back the Realms. I'm really fed up with the Sword Coast.
===== Since English is not my first language, I pre-emptively apologize for any (grammar) mistake that has been made in my post. In order to help me improve my English, please, point out those mistakes (If you could do it politely, it would be even better!). Thanks! ===== |
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hashimashadoo
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1152 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 19:28:14
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I'm here, the issue is noted and will be sorted by midnight (my time).
In 5e Kelemvor is noted as being one of the primary faiths of the city of Phlan in the Adventurer's League Expeditions and Valhingen Graveyard is the city's primary source of divine spellcasting services since the temple of Bane got burned down. Kelemvor's faithful also have a major presence in the city of Neverwinter's Neverdeath Graveyard. |
When life turns it's back on you...sneak attack for extra damage.
Head admin of the FR wiki:
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/ |
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Delwa
Master of Realmslore
USA
1271 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 19:44:31
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quote:
Originally posted by hashimashadoo
I'm here, the issue is noted and will be sorted by midnight (my time).
In 5e Kelemvor is noted as being one of the primary faiths of the city of Phlan in the Adventurer's League Expeditions and Valhingen Graveyard is the city's primary source of divine spellcasting services since the temple of Bane got burned down. Kelemvor's faithful also have a major presence in the city of Neverwinter's Neverdeath Graveyard.
Good to know.  I commented on the talk page, I hope that's proper procedure. I couldn't figure out how to add a "Needs Citation" to the segment in question or I'd have done so.
quote:
Originally posted by Portuguese D. Ace
[Fanboy mode On]
Let's suppose this info is true... did already happen, for a greater god, to have other greater powers as underlings?
I could see them being answerable to each other, but not subservient. If someone were top dog, there would be constant bickering for position, imo.
But, it's your home Realms, so anything goes if you're the DM.
I'd probably put Kelemvor as the "Lord Chief Justice" of death, Myrkul would be kind of an advisor, as would Jergal, with duties pertaining to their domains/portfolios technically granted them by Kelemvor (outsourced, if you will,) meaning he can take them back at any time. Bane would not really even be subservient, I just can't see it. He has little to do with the Realm of the Dead, tyranny is more of a living thing, in my mind. Bhaal would serve Kelemvor in that he sends as many "new subjects" to Kel's realm as he can, but I don't see why the Lord of Murder would care after the person has been murdered, unless he's in the business of murdering souls that have passed. In which case, that would put Kelemvor at odds with Bhaal, to my thinking.
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- Delwa Aunglor
I am off to slay yon refrigerator and spoil it's horde. Go for the cheese, Boo!
"The Realms change; seldom at the speed desired of those who strive, but far too quickly for those who resist." - The Simbul, taken from the Forgotten Realms Campaign Conspectus |
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Aldrick
Senior Scribe
909 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 21:03:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Portuguese D. Ace
[Fanboy mode On]
Let's suppose this info is true... did already happen, for a greater god, to have other greater powers as underlings?
The only thing that would make immediate sense to me would be if it was all a plot by Jergal, using Kelemvor as a dupe. Basically, Jergal would be plotting to consume Kel and the Dead Three and return to his former glory--gaining back all those lost portfolios which they have divided among them.
Kelemvor himself would seem normally hostile to Myrkul (since he is so pro-undeath), and he may be indifferent to Bhaal and Bane in so far as they do not screw things up. The only way any of it would make sense is if Jergal were pulling the strings... in which case, I'd just fast forward and say they were all doomed. |
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Shadowsoul
Senior Scribe
Ireland
705 Posts |
Posted - 10 Mar 2015 : 21:11:27
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| Does anyone know where in the time line we see the ascension of the Dark Three? |
“Fantasy is escapist, and that is its glory. If a soldier is imprisioned by the enemy, don't we consider it his duty to escape?. . .If we value the freedom of mind and soul, if we're partisans of liberty, then it's our plain duty to escape, and to take as many people with us as we can!”
#8213; J.R.R. Tolkien
*I endorse everything Dark Wizard says*. |
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Kelemvor... 5E?
