| Author |
 Topic  |
|
BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
 Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 23:17:45
|
quote:
Originally posted by Baptor
If I had to guess, I would say that the WotC designers got with Bob and Ed back in 2012 to ask them how to fix the Realms, and they told them. I think at that time WotC was eager to revitalize the Realms and produce a new book "full of lore" (as Mike Mearls put it). I think as time went on, Hasbro saw the cost and put a stop to it, believing there would not be a good return on that investment. But that's just a theory.
What if it took a little while longer for WOTC to fully tally up the damage that 4E had caused, and they chose to get that definitively settled before greelighting the massive project of a really good FRCS?
And what if the damage turned out to be that bad?
My understanding is that part of the reason why/how WOTC successfully took over D&D & FR from TSR was because WOTC was more financially conservative and exacting than its competitor/predecessor. That kind of scrutiny of the finances doesn't always yield good news. But it does yield a realistic picture of one's financial standing. This means that one can make future decisions based on solid facts, rather than just conjecture and/or hope--and/or denial.
It sounds like WOTC is tip-toeing extremely carefully right now, threading the needle, avoiding turning over any mini-icebergs in the floe. I'm guessing that it's coasting (brings a whole new meaning to the company's name, huh?) on its few best-selling writers for the time being, in the hopes that there will be a more solid footing upon which to move forward with a FRCS.
Yeah, that's frustrating. But if we have to standby as WOTC pulls the belt a few notches tighter right now to get by, then I for one can do so knowing they have a reputation for making the tough but necessary financial decisions for the greater good. And they have a reputation of saving the property with that financial sense. So I guess for me, the TSR-to-WOTC transition still speaks more loudly than does 4E, and even more loudly than the post-Sundering silence at the present time. |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
 |
|
|
Baptor
Seeker
USA
93 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 23:29:47
|
quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
quote:
Originally posted by Baptor
If I had to guess, I would say that the WotC designers got with Bob and Ed back in 2012 to ask them how to fix the Realms, and they told them. I think at that time WotC was eager to revitalize the Realms and produce a new book "full of lore" (as Mike Mearls put it). I think as time went on, Hasbro saw the cost and put a stop to it, believing there would not be a good return on that investment. But that's just a theory.
What if it took a little while longer for WOTC to fully tally up the damage that 4E had caused, and they chose to get that definitively settled before greelighting the massive project of a really good FRCS?
And what if the damage turned out to be that bad?
My understanding is that part of the reason why/how WOTC successfully took over D&D & FR from TSR was because WOTC was more financially conservative and exacting than its competitor/predecessor. That kind of scrutiny of the finances doesn't always yield good news. But it does yield a realistic picture of one's financial standing. This means that one can make future decisions based on solid facts, rather than just conjecture and/or hope--and/or denial.
It sounds like WOTC is tip-toeing extremely carefully right now, threading the needle, avoiding turning over any mini-icebergs in the floe. I'm guessing that it's coasting (brings a whole new meaning to the company's name, huh?) on its few best-selling writers for the time being, in the hopes that there will be a more solid footing upon which to move forward with a FRCS.
Yeah, that's frustrating. But if we have to standby as WOTC pulls the belt a few notches tighter right now to get by, then I for one can do so knowing they have a reputation for making the tough but necessary financial decisions for the greater good. And they have a reputation of saving the property with that financial sense. So I guess for me, the TSR-to-WOTC transition still speaks more loudly than does 4E, and even more loudly than the post-Sundering silence at the present time.
Agreed. I noticed one of the recent novels, Fire in the Blood, is described as still being "during the Sundering." It looks like even though the official "Sundering" line of books is done, the Sundering event is not. It's probably WotC will have its authors pen a few more novels to flesh this Sundering business out before working on a FRCS.
I wasn't before, but now I think I am content to wait. |
Jesus said, "I am the Ressurection and the Life. Anyone who believes in Me will live even if he dies, and those who live and believe in Me will never die. Do you believe this?" |
|
|
|
BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 23:31:51
|
quote:
Originally posted by Swordsage
Call me cynical - many do - but's my take is that Salvatore's "fix" for the Realms extended only as far as agitating for a situation (i.e. the Sundering) where he could re-establish his cast of novel characters. "The Companions" is an entertaining novel - I enjoyed it more than the recent Neverwinter stuff that I laboured through. But it was so palpably self-serving that it did nothing to generate any excitement in me for the 5E Realms. If he was being truly honest, he might put an "*" after his "save the Realms" spiel and state sotto voce, "Of course, I'm talking about the Realms in a fiction sense. You roleplaying gamers are on your own."
I don't think he was only interested in saving his characters. But, obviously, he was interested in that.
I think he was also primarily interested in helping to clear the tears out of Ed's eyes after the infamous 4E "marching orders" meeting with WOTC. The concept of the Sundering was probably intended to help Ed to see a glimmer of hope, during the darkness of the early onset of the Spellplague. I doubt Bob ever presumed to do the recreating of the world for the next edition. He's much happier when Ed gets to do that. Just let Ed build the world, giving it a sense of richness and fullness, and Bob is free to continue his Drizzt Saga over in the corner, without having to worry about the underlying foundation and structure of the world. |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
|
|
|
BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2015 : 23:44:55
|
quote:
Originally posted by Baptor
Crap. You know, now I think about it. You are probably right. I've never known Bob to care about the game itself except where it affected his novels.
That's really harsh.
Bob prefers D&D 1E. He likes the nostalgia, and the relative simplicity of it all.
He attempts to write to the current rules in order to appease his editors, but he's not passionate about the rules of later editions.
And that's really not all that different from the way fans pick and choose which aspects of the game or lore they will use in their home campaigns. Some outright ignore later stuff; others begrudgingly accept bits of the newer stuff, but integrate them with what they love most about the older edition(s).
That kind of piecemeal approach does not hurt the game--not as a fan, and not as a writer, either. It only goes to show that the property is perfectly healthy even with people picking and choosing various elements, buffet style.
Therefore, it's really a non-sequitur to think that Bob's having been less-than-passionate about more-recent rules in any way has a bearing on--well--anything. |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
|
|
|
BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 00:29:59
|
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
I'm going to express doubts, as a habitual advocatus diaboli and vocal un-fan of Salvatore's 
While you have a good point and sequel capacity is an advantage...
In itself isn't even an unquestionable boon, especially when the writer in question knows much better than most how he may end up with "an albatross", having to churn out sequels not just until the premise is sucked dry, but ad nauseam and beyond.
Go back and watch <that interview> that Baptor linked to, from the 9:30 mark onward. RAS says:
"I've said many times I'm gonna write this character until I'm not having any fun or nobody wants to read about him. And I'm still having fun."
"But I also love writing about him. It's a good--"
"But it works out, because I really love writing the character, and the characters around him. So, so far, so good. Who knows?"
"It's not just making them [fans] happy. It's reaching them."
I suppose one could read "albatross" somewhere into all of that, much like some presume that Ed is the supreme apologist for RAS's involvement in the Realms for all these years.
But I could swear that Bob's voice seems to quiver and crack a little in there when he talks about how much of a privilege it is to be able to keep writing a character that touches loyal readers like Drizzt does. I don't see any eye-rolling or sighing or slouching or other signs of resignation and apathy.
And as far as ad nauseam goes, I guess one person's nausea is another's nirvana.  |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
|
|
|
Baptor
Seeker
USA
93 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 00:44:38
|
quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
quote:
Originally posted by Baptor
Crap. You know, now I think about it. You are probably right. I've never known Bob to care about the game itself except where it affected his novels.
That's really harsh.
Bob prefers D&D 1E. He likes the nostalgia, and the relative simplicity of it all.
He attempts to write to the current rules in order to appease his editors, but he's not passionate about the rules of later editions.
And that's really not all that different from the way fans pick and choose which aspects of the game or lore they will use in their home campaigns. Some outright ignore later stuff; others begrudgingly accept bits of the newer stuff, but integrate them with what they love most about the older edition(s).
That kind of piecemeal approach does not hurt the game--not as a fan, and not as a writer, either. It only goes to show that the property is perfectly healthy even with people picking and choosing various elements, buffet style.
Therefore, it's really a non-sequitur to think that Bob's having been less-than-passionate about more-recent rules in any way has a bearing on--well--anything.
You're reading malicious intent into a sentence meant only to convey a fact. A fact you actually agree with. What Bob does with his novels and his characters is jus business. My point was that if Bob had a hand in restoring the realms his concern would be focused on repairing it for the novels and not the game since he is, you know, a writer.
I've actually met Bob. He's a great guy and likeable enough, but like you say, he's not that into the new d&d games so a realms book for use in the game is not tally important to him. It makes sense, and I don't think less of him for it.
I've got a friend who has never played d&d. He just reads the novels. I wouldn't expect him to care about a FRCS either. |
Jesus said, "I am the Ressurection and the Life. Anyone who believes in Me will live even if he dies, and those who live and believe in Me will never die. Do you believe this?" |
|
|
|
Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3822 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 02:12:11
|
quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
What if it took a little while longer for WOTC to fully tally up the damage that 4E had caused, and they chose to get that definitively settled before greelighting the massive project of a really good FRCS?
Well, that sounds a bit weird. Now, I'm not a designer, so I don't have any experience in that, but -in my humble opinion- laying down the concepts to introduce given changes in a make-believe world doesn't seem to be a multiple years-spanning undertaking. Writing down lore to expand said concepts would be way more time/resource-consuming, but if they were waiting for that to be completed before greenlighting anything, it wouldn't make much sense, as creating said lore would be the same as actually already writing a FRCS.
|
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 09 Feb 2015 02:13:44 |
|
|
|
Old Man Harpell
Senior Scribe
USA
498 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 10:42:26
|
The impression I get, from replies from THO to various questions posed to her to pose to Ed, is that Ed is basically shackled to his keyboard, daily routine notwithstanding. It could very well be that he's taking his time to insure that what's given to us is just so, whether it's Ed's own new concepts, the updating of past lore, collating and editing input from others, trying out his ideas on his gaming group
*wrestles down a look of extreme envy*,
or what have you.
That's the outlook I'm taking. I'm choosing to say that WotC is going to elevate the FRCG to the level that D&D 5th achieved, and that we'll have the FR guide to define all FR guides when the clerks at the game store punch the buttons on the register and hand us our purchases. From all accounts, Ed is really stoked about what we'll be seeing - so I'll wait for however long it takes to see what Ed has in store for us.
- OMH |
Edited by - Old Man Harpell on 09 Feb 2015 10:42:45 |
|
|
|
Baptor
Seeker
USA
93 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2015 : 21:22:53
|
I got an answer back from Ed Greenwood. A very encouraging one.
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
To Baptor, Ed says this:
Oh, do I sympathize with you. I understand how much you want clear answers to these questions you've posed, and I ache to give them. However, every single question you ask runs head-on into NDAs. That exist for very good reasons.
So let me say just this much:
Just a day ago I had a back-and-forth e-mail with a Wizards staffer about a future project, that involved discussion of specific Realmslore details. Two days before that I was providing extensive Realmslore (photo references, text, explanations) for a future fiction-and-game project. And last week I had a fun, if briefer than usual, phone call with many in-house and freelance Realms creatives, about several related upcoming products. (And the word "usual" is chosen deliberately.)
My specific level of involvement with the gaming side of the Realms changes constantly. And always has done, since the very beginning of the published Realms. That's part of the very nature of gaming publishing, it seems to me.
The problem with saying more is that anything I say will fuel speculation, which may be harmful to everyone and go in directions that are utterly or partly off-base. And directions and decisions for the publishing of the Realms and of D&D itself change over time, so that something said firmly and definitely by someone in a position to "know for sure" can be complete truth when said - - and then not happen, or change markedly before it does happen. That's just the nature of the beast.
Right now, I am chest-deep in the Realms. Because this is one of the Saturdays I have off from my library day job (I usually work alternate Saturdays), I spent about ten hours at the keyboard today, pounding out Realms stuff. Honest. But that's about as much as I can say. Besides, peeking behind the curtain beforehand DOES ruin the fun.
And so saith Ed. Sharing as much as he can. I suspect a lot of the future is hidden even from in-house Wizards staffers these days, just because plans change and the nature of publishing means things CAN change faster than they could in the days of booking printing time and ordering paper two years in advance, which is the way things were when I started working in publishing.
Be of good cheer, Realms fans. No matter what happens, Ed will be here for us as long as he's alive. And there are SO many other great folks who love the Realms, from Jeff Grubb and Steven Schend to Eric Boyd and George Krashos to Brian Cortijo and the James brothers to Bob and Erin and Troy and Susan Morris and Phil Athans and Chris Perkins and . . . and . . . every time Markustay draws a new map, and Ed peers at it and smiles, the Realms grows a little stronger. So the Realms, in the end, is as strong and happy-making a setting as YOU make it!
love to all,
THO
Very encouraging if you know how to read between the lines. I am now hopeful we'll get a FRCS. I still think it will be sometime in 2016, though. It sounds like they have much work to do yet. |
Jesus said, "I am the Ressurection and the Life. Anyone who believes in Me will live even if he dies, and those who live and believe in Me will never die. Do you believe this?" |
|
|
|
Old Man Harpell
Senior Scribe
USA
498 Posts |
Posted - 10 Feb 2015 : 05:36:24
|
quote:
Originally posted by Baptor
I got an answer back from Ed Greenwood. A very encouraging one.
quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
To Baptor, Ed says this:
Oh, do I sympathize with you. I understand how much you want clear answers to these questions you've posed, and I ache to give them. However, every single question you ask runs head-on into NDAs. That exist for very good reasons.
So let me say just this much:
Just a day ago I had a back-and-forth e-mail with a Wizards staffer about a future project, that involved discussion of specific Realmslore details. Two days before that I was providing extensive Realmslore (photo references, text, explanations) for a future fiction-and-game project. And last week I had a fun, if briefer than usual, phone call with many in-house and freelance Realms creatives, about several related upcoming products. (And the word "usual" is chosen deliberately.)
My specific level of involvement with the gaming side of the Realms changes constantly. And always has done, since the very beginning of the published Realms. That's part of the very nature of gaming publishing, it seems to me.
The problem with saying more is that anything I say will fuel speculation, which may be harmful to everyone and go in directions that are utterly or partly off-base. And directions and decisions for the publishing of the Realms and of D&D itself change over time, so that something said firmly and definitely by someone in a position to "know for sure" can be complete truth when said - - and then not happen, or change markedly before it does happen. That's just the nature of the beast.
Right now, I am chest-deep in the Realms. Because this is one of the Saturdays I have off from my library day job (I usually work alternate Saturdays), I spent about ten hours at the keyboard today, pounding out Realms stuff. Honest. But that's about as much as I can say. Besides, peeking behind the curtain beforehand DOES ruin the fun.
And so saith Ed. Sharing as much as he can. I suspect a lot of the future is hidden even from in-house Wizards staffers these days, just because plans change and the nature of publishing means things CAN change faster than they could in the days of booking printing time and ordering paper two years in advance, which is the way things were when I started working in publishing.
Be of good cheer, Realms fans. No matter what happens, Ed will be here for us as long as he's alive. And there are SO many other great folks who love the Realms, from Jeff Grubb and Steven Schend to Eric Boyd and George Krashos to Brian Cortijo and the James brothers to Bob and Erin and Troy and Susan Morris and Phil Athans and Chris Perkins and . . . and . . . every time Markustay draws a new map, and Ed peers at it and smiles, the Realms grows a little stronger. So the Realms, in the end, is as strong and happy-making a setting as YOU make it!
love to all,
THO
Very encouraging if you know how to read between the lines. I am now hopeful we'll get a FRCS. I still think it will be sometime in 2016, though. It sounds like they have much work to do yet.
Awesome. Thanks for sharing. 
- OMH |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
I honestly think it's crazy having to wait so long
