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Kitira Gildragon
Learned Scribe
USA
191 Posts |
 Posted - 05 Nov 2002 : 14:15:27
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In one of my FR realms books ("A Grand Tour of the Realms", I think it's called) says that 'grey' and 'silver'are different but appropriate names for moon elves. When I was reading Elaine Cunningham's book Elfshadow it said that grey was a derogatory term. Which is corret?
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-Space for rent- |
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lowtech
Learned Scribe
USA
315 Posts |
Posted - 06 Nov 2002 : 19:49:22
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| I think its considered derogatory if said by another elf, just ignorant if said by a human. |
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Arion Elenim
Senior Scribe
933 Posts |
Posted - 29 Nov 2002 : 05:26:52
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I consider myself fairly well-read on this subject (thank you Elaine Cunningham)....that said...
When any species refers to the Moon Elves as "grays" it is in fact an EXTREME derogatory term that is the equivalent of today's most heinous racial slurs....it is basically a reference to the silverish coloring in moon elf skin - i.e., compared to the fair gold elves, moon elves are grey - as in useless, unnoteworthy, and worst of all, devoid of beauty. There really isn't a worse elven insult than to suggest someone is without beauty.
This is traced back to the animosity that the gold elves (who often refer to themselves as High Elves) began to harbor for the moon elves when the Larethian-forged Moon Blades originally found their ways into more moon elf hands than gold. This was due to the fact that the more courtly (they would say "civilized") gold elves were caught up in a huge court/civil cold war that was threatening to tear Evermeet apart. This is not to say that the moon elves were not caught up politically, but this bestowing of such powerful magic upon the moon elves was seen (the golds would say "misinterpreted") as a sign of Larethian's favor....thus the birth of the hated term "gray".....
Sigh...perhaps that was a bit long-winded.....
Sigh....sue me, I am a bard. |
My latest Realms-based short story, about a bard, a paladin of Lathander and the letter of the law, Debts Repaid. It takes place before the "shattering" and gives the bard Arion a last gasp before he plunges into the present.http://candlekeep.com/campaign/logs/log-debts.htm |
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Lord Rad
Great Reader
United Kingdom
2080 Posts |
Posted - 29 Nov 2002 : 08:42:47
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| Not long-winded at all! thats really interesting ArionElenim! Thanks! Where is this information taken from? Does Evermeet: Island of Elves go into elven culture much? |
Lord Rad
"What? No, I wasn't reading your module. I was just looking at the pictures"
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Arion Elenim
Senior Scribe
933 Posts |
Posted - 30 Nov 2002 : 05:22:49
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I have hence called Elaine Cunningham's Evermeet the Elven Bible....and to this I hold true....
The best way, the ONLY way to get to know the elves of Faerun is to READ THAT BOOK....
But, that's just me....
Yes, Evermeet does indeed give the whole of the elven history...it is a MUST read....
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My latest Realms-based short story, about a bard, a paladin of Lathander and the letter of the law, Debts Repaid. It takes place before the "shattering" and gives the bard Arion a last gasp before he plunges into the present.http://candlekeep.com/campaign/logs/log-debts.htm |
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Lord Rad
Great Reader
United Kingdom
2080 Posts |
Posted - 30 Nov 2002 : 09:56:12
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Even better than the Elves of Evermeet sourcebook?!  I have this novel on my reading list, maybe i need to notch it up a couple of places! |
Lord Rad
"What? No, I wasn't reading your module. I was just looking at the pictures"
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Bookwyrm
Great Reader
USA
4740 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2003 : 09:01:01
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Okay, this is coming probably too late to make any difference, but I want to say this anyway. First, EVERMEET: ISLAND OF ELVES IS AWESOME AND ANYONE READING FORGOTTEN REALMS BOOKS OR DOING ANYTHING FR MUSTMUSTMUST READ IT!!!!!!! *gasp, inhale*
Okay, I've got that out of my system . . . .
Next, I want to answer the question actually made in this thread. Elaine Cunningham is very specific in many places about the origin of "grey" as an insult to moon elves, and it is due the the fact that no one actually mentioned that I'm actually writing this. It's got nothing to do with moonblades or anything. (That's part of the ANIMOSITY, but not the origin of the term.)
It's simple: the word for "grey" in Elvish sounds almost exactly the same as the word for "dross" -- implying that the moon elves were just what was left over after the creation of the "pure" gold elf race.
There's your answer. Sorry if it's too late and you already got it someplace else, but I thought I'd say it anyway, in case someone else came alonge with the same question. |
Hell hath no fury like all of Candlekeep rising in defense of one of its own.
Download the brickfilm masterpiece by Leftfield Studios! See this page for more. |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 24 Sep 2018 : 17:27:08
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Learned Scribe Gildragon,
I suppose it depends on who calls it appropriate. After all, I am certain that if you ask a Thayan, and then an Aglarondian, what they think of, and in fact call, their respective counterpart, you may have a different outlook on what is "appropriate", haha.
That being said, Senior Scribe Elenim couldn't be more correct, in my view, when taken with that being the application of a field of study, where the theory is the text, (all considered as is done in industry and application, respectively) in this case, "Elves of Evermeet." In fact, I quote from that book right now:
quote:
I also learned during my stay on Evermeet that the term Gray elf, often applied to the Teu-Tel#146;Quessir,
is considered somewhat pejorative and should be avoided. p19,
I hope that helps...sixteen years later, haha.
Best regards,
quote:
Originally posted by Kitira Gildragon
In one of my FR realms books ("A Grand Tour of the Realms", I think it's called) says that 'grey' and 'silver'are different but appropriate names for moon elves. When I was reading Elaine Cunningham's book Elfshadow it said that grey was a derogatory term. Which is corret?
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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TBeholder
Great Reader
2428 Posts |
Posted - 26 Sep 2018 : 04:35:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Rad
Not long-winded at all! thats really interesting ArionElenim! Thanks! Where is this information taken from? Does Evermeet: Island of Elves go into elven culture much?
Yes. And «was a primary source for» the novel, in case that's not obvious.
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Rad
Even better than the Elves of Evermeet sourcebook?! I have this novel on my reading list, maybe i need to notch it up a couple of places!
It's certainly very good. I'm afraid Senior Scribe Elenim here indulged in trusting in lore a little, however. 
So «keep in mind that the book is told from a human's point of view, with all the limitations that suggests».
Which is good, in that as a rule you get more from the text when taking it in context.
Won't it be fun to notice which important parts relevant to the stories we know from other lore, but the elves omit them, or even repeatedly avoid to refer in any way?  |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
Edited by - TBeholder on 26 Sep 2018 04:39:59 |
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cpthero2
Great Reader
USA
2286 Posts |
Posted - 27 Sep 2018 : 12:10:29
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Master TBeholder,
Impressive citations, especially the ones from (13) years ago! Pulling them out like pocket change! haha
Best regards,
quote:
Originally posted by TBeholder
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Rad
Not long-winded at all! thats really interesting ArionElenim! Thanks! Where is this information taken from? Does Evermeet: Island of Elves go into elven culture much?
Yes. And «was a primary source for» the novel, in case that's not obvious.
quote:
Originally posted by Lord Rad
Even better than the Elves of Evermeet sourcebook?! I have this novel on my reading list, maybe i need to notch it up a couple of places!
It's certainly very good. I'm afraid Senior Scribe Elenim here indulged in trusting in lore a little, however.
So «keep in mind that the book is told from a human's point of view, with all the limitations that suggests».
Which is good, in that as a rule you get more from the text when taking it in context.
Won't it be fun to notice which important parts relevant to the stories we know from other lore, but the elves omit them, or even repeatedly avoid to refer in any way?
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Higher Atlar
Spirit Soaring |
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Moon elf names
