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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
 Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 04:31:21
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Yes, Bruce, a stunningly beautiful cover for Elminster’s Daughter. I’m very pleased with it. I’m glad you liked the sample chapter -- but I should warn you and everyone who reads it not to open the complete book and expect to find more chapters set in Waterdeep therein.
The action shifts east, into another of my favourite Faerunian playgrounds. :}
Hmm interesting
Is Elminsters Daughter going to be the 4th book in the Cormyr saga Ed? (Elminster does mention problems in Cormyr in the Sample chapter) |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 05:40:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Hmm interesting
Is Elminsters Daughter going to be the 4th book in the Cormyr saga Ed? (Elminster does mention problems in Cormyr in the Sample chapter)
Think it would be book 5 of the Elminster books more then book 4 of the Cormyr books...... |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 06:02:10
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quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Hmm interesting
Is Elminsters Daughter going to be the 4th book in the Cormyr saga Ed? (Elminster does mention problems in Cormyr in the Sample chapter)
Think it would be book 5 of the Elminster books more then book 4 of the Cormyr books......
ummmmmm
Cormyr: A novel
Beyond the High road
Death of the Dragon
What am I missing? |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 07:02:58
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Hmm interesting
Is Elminsters Daughter going to be the 4th book in the Cormyr saga Ed? (Elminster does mention problems in Cormyr in the Sample chapter)
Think it would be book 5 of the Elminster books more then book 4 of the Cormyr books......
ummmmmm
Cormyr: A novel
Beyond the High road
Death of the Dragon
What am I missing?
Don't ask me, you asked would it be book 4 of the Cormyr series. I said I think it would be book 5 of the Elminster series more then book 4 of the Cormyr series........ |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 08:16:03
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quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
quote:
Originally posted by kuje31
quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Hmm interesting
Is Elminsters Daughter going to be the 4th book in the Cormyr saga Ed? (Elminster does mention problems in Cormyr in the Sample chapter)
Think it would be book 5 of the Elminster books more then book 4 of the Cormyr books......
ummmmmm
Cormyr: A novel
Beyond the High road
Death of the Dragon
What am I missing?
Don't ask me, you asked would it be book 4 of the Cormyr series. I said I think it would be book 5 of the Elminster series more then book 4 of the Cormyr series........
Im going to blame that on posting before i have my morning cup of coffee  |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 09:27:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Dargoth
Im going to blame that on posting before i have my morning cup of coffee
 Are we clear now? :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 16:05:05
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Hail and well met, assembled scribes. Ye Lady Hooded, of course. Herewith, Ed’s long-promised list of some oaths of Tempus:
At last I’ve found time to craft and pull together from my lore-notes a partial listing of naughty words and phrases in current use among followers of the Wargod. As usual, per the original Realms agreement, these are canon or official until contradicted by in-print TSR (now Wizards of the Coast) products.
I’ll start with a few homilies (temple sayings) that aren’t considered obscene at all, but rather proverbs of the faith:
“A battle-death is a holy ending.” [which is why devout worshippers of Tempus salute corpses, burials, and graves with murmurs of, “Holy ending!”]
“Laws are but words until blood is shed for them.”
“Men fall, but Tempus rises!” [in older times, this saying was always rendered: “Men fall, but Tempus rides on!”]
“Nothing is truth that has not been tested in battle.”
“Peace stands on a sharp sword.”
“The sun rises out of blood and sets into blood, and all the time between belongs to the Lord of Battles.”
Now, a few ‘polite oaths,’ that can be used in front of priests, or by one priest to another, without any rebuke or sin at all:
“Blood of the god!” [also uttered as: “Blood of Tempus!”]
“Hooves!” [a reference to the mounts Tempus rides or stands on, Deiros and Veiros, and therefore to the god at work]
“Steel!” [short for “Thirsty steel!” (this longer form is now very rarely heard), and expresses an eager desire to take part in battle]
“Sword and Stars!” [a saying derived from the belief that stars flash to mark the god’s approval when a favored attack is made or a champion draws his or her sword for purposes of battle]
“Warhorn!” [short for “Warhorn forlorn!” (a line from a temple hymn about aid arriving too late to save the lives of heroes dying heroically in a ‘last stand’ because they upheld their duty rather than departing and so saving their lives), and expresses regret at a battle defeat or at poor tactics that resulted in losses because allies or sword-comrades came too late, or went in the wrong direction, or chose opponents or terrain poorly]
“Zelzing!” [a word from an old, now-lost battle song of Tempus, that poetically described the sound of ringing swords in battle; this is now used triumphantly to mark a blow struck, or battle joined, or a foe struck down]
And now, the “hard swearing” indulged in by believers in Tempus who have lost their tempers and let lapse all guard over their tongues. As usual, I’ve provided modern real-world equivalents in parentheses. Almost all of these words derive from ancient temple cant of the Wargod, now forgotten except for these oaths and a few sacred phrases used in altar prayers.
“Arntarmar!” (“Jesus Christ!”; pronounced “Arn-TAR-mar!” [Arntarmar was a long-ago mortal war-hero who worked wondrous victories in the name of Tempus, and died willingly on a battlefield to allow wounded and children to escape while he singlehandedly held off a vastly more numerous foe in a narrow gorge])
“Caztul!” (“F**k!” [profane shock or disgust] and pronounced “CAZZ-tuhl”)
“Gelkor!” (“Sh*t!”; pronounced with a hard ‘g’: “GEL-kore!”)
“Harcrimmitor!” (akin to shouting: “DIE, motherf**ker!” and pronounced: “Har-CRIM-ih-tor”)
“Kelstyn!” (“Blast!”; pronounced: “KEL-stinn!”)
“Malagard!” (“Well, damn!” [mild surprise or dismay])
“Ralimralar!” (a delighted: “Son of a B*TCH!” and pronounced: “RAL-im-RAL-ar!”)
“Sakros!” (“Holy crap!” [astonishment, not necessarily bad] and pronounced “SACK-roe-sss”)
“Talandor!” (“Bloody hell!”; pronounced: “Tel-an-DOR!”)
So saith Ed. My delicate, ladylike ears are still burning (mostly with the effort of trying to pretend to be more of a lady and less of a wanton slut ;}), so I’ll add just this lone example from Realmsplay:
While fighting to defend Shadowdale from one of the innumerable Zhent attacks, a few of we Knights ended up swinging swords alongside a wandering priest of Tempus, a grim and aging man who wore an eyepatch and chainmail adorned all over with welded-on swordtips taken from the weapons of foes he’d slain in battle (embracing him was a rather cutting affair, as I recall :}). When he struck at opponents, he often shouted, “By the bright blood of Thammaera!” or, “By the sweet limbs of Brelindra!” or, “By the proud beauty of Sannandra!”
When we asked him, after the fray, what these phrases meant, he told us he was dedicating this attack or that to lovers he’d had among the clergy of Tempus, who were either dead or now too disabled to fight in the field for the god themselves (Broken Blade), and so could no longer deliver such attacks themselves.
THO
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 20:30:52
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Hello again, gentles. This time, This Hooded Lady brings unto thine eyes Ed’s Stonelands reply to Lord Bakra of the Outlying Thread:
Hi, Bakra. Ah, yes, Mr. Bubblejet. I find that my Mr. Printers all work much better when I threaten them, as necessary, with Mr. Hand. :}
Smokepowder: importing this into Cormyr requires a Crown license and a full explanation (to a senior War Wizard, such as Vangerdahast, Laspeera, or one of the six or so mages a single step down from them, plus Alaphondar or a Court clerk) of what the smokepowder is required FOR, where it will be stored, how and how soon it will be used, and so on.
In the case of someone officially trying to conquer the Stonelands, approval will be automatic so long as the Crown is satisfied the smokepowder will be well-guarded enough that it won’t immediately fall into Zhent hands.
The interview process will be kept as secret as possible (to keep it from the ears of nobles who might be contemplating treason), and the license may come with any conditions you as DM might want to add (can’t take it south of Waymoot, for example, or into Arabel for any reason), and costs 500 gp, which pays for the deployment of two War Wizards (and two Purple Dragon bodyguards/assistants) who become full-time spies watching over the smokepowder in the possession of your PCs.
The precise strength of this ‘watch’ over the smokepowder won’t be shared with the PCs, but they will be warned that selling, giving away, or moving and hiding the smokepowder (particularly if they try to split it up and put small amounts in many places) will result in its confiscation.
What they won’t be warned about is that if this confiscation occurs, it will be done by dozens of War Wizards with Purple Dragon bodyguards, all of them acting with alertness, weapon and spell readiness, and ruthlessness in keeping with full “at war” orders.
As for PCs creating their own: anyone trying to become Baron of the Stonelands is already under covert magical surveillance by War Wizards, and if they report the making of more than about a handkeg’s volume of smokepowder, the PCs will VERY swiftly receive a visit from an unamused Court official (bolstered by all of the above persons) with a demand for purchase of a license and assumption of all the conditions described above.
Unless confiscating, the Crown takes none of the smokepowder. (However, any authorities who discover stored smokepowder whose ownership is uncertain or denied WILL call in War Wizards to remove or destroy it.)
Lantanna-made clockworks of great complexity are known (but on the mainland of Faerun, mainly as rumors). Many nobles have quite complex toys, clocks, and even water clocks. However, clockwork ‘tin soldiers’ are another matter, thanks to the severe weather and the tasks a garrison must perform. If the PCs want “dummy soldiers” who can march along the battlements, or move in very simple formations to block an entry arch, lower pikes, and fire (not aim) loaded crossbows, fine. If PCs want to rig a means of replacing the windlass each crossbow requires with a “mass-cranking” mechanism, also fine. If PCs want (very slow) motive power for simple wagons or handcarts (not steering), or a means of helping them load (cart-mounted cranes and winches), fine again. Everything else is going to be beyond the machining competence or maintenance time (all that oiling!) of a lone Lantanna expert. Mechanicals can’t run on uneven ground/stairs, use the judgement of living warriors (aiming at a visible foe, for example), react with speed to enemy tactics, or anything of the sort. If the intent is to create ‘metal-men’ who ape the movements of a human controller (telefactoring), a lot (years!) of spell research will be necessary, and/or a lot of space (courtyards and large chambers, not confined passages or small rooms) will be needed for a cluster of rod-and-link driven mechanicals to surround the human operator, and move/act as a unit. As a DM, I’m growing an evil grin at the mere thought of PCs getting themselves into all those tin-soldier headaches . . .
Mechanicals that sprout from the faces of doors, now, and carry out repeated movements (“threshing blades,” or “fire arrow after arrow in repeating high-medium-low, high-medium-low spray fire patterns down a passage”), YES, these are quite practical. And deadly. Now my grin is changing.
So saith Ed. And having seen that grin in person, I’m shivering.
THO
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Lashan
Learned Scribe
USA
235 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 21:48:25
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Hello Ed and Hooded One,
I think I am done with questions of Tantras for the momment (but I am sure just this momment :) ). I was curious about some questions about my namesake: Lashan Aumersair. I was a bit curious about hi and his dreams of conquest. I know that Lashan did some adventuring in the Vast during his younger days, but how old was he when he took over the Dale? How did his father pass away? How long did Lashan scheme before he tried to invade? What were his techniques to invade? Any details or free-hand answers are appreciated. |
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fourthmensch
Acolyte
USA
32 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 22:06:52
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Olore once again, Ed. (see what happens when you make all these words with accent marks, now, when we use these newfangled machines? :))
Kuje and I were having a discussion over on the WotC boards regarding a statement you made on the October mailing list, reproduced below:
quote:
The clergy of Siamorphe from time to time conduct "overnight" marriages, allowing one-night stands to be legal and divinely approved, but always publicly renounce this practise when angry kin complain to governing authorities . . . only to quietly resume it again, elsewhen.
I was curious about this practice and its connection to Siamorphe; it seems like it might more rightly be in the provenance of Sune or Sharess. Could you explain why the clergy of Siamorphe would want to legitimize one-night stands?
On a semi-related note... I know that sexual mores are considerably more relaxed in Faerun than on earth (quite refreshing, actually, especially in comparison to where I live :)), but I have noticed that in some of the stories mentioned in this thread there are cases of people in serious relationships sowing some serious oats. The example that comes to mind is the Simbul burning out the minds of several Red Wizards by sleeping with them (what a way to go...) while she was involved with Elminster. It seems obvious that she and the old mage love each other. Do the lax mores extend even to "swinging" between committed or married couples? |
I want you to go home and ponder the meaning of the word subversive.
Gully Foyle is my name
And Terra is my nation
Deep space is my dwelling place
The stars my destination. |
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Alathayn
Acolyte
Germany
14 Posts |
Posted - 12 Apr 2004 : 22:09:16
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| Ho, Hooded One, may you plaese deliver our thanks to the Greenwood? And thanks to you as well, be ashured I will ask again ,if im in need of some bits of lore. Till that day comes, farewell! |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 02:38:37
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’Lo, all. Thy Hooded Lady, presenting once more the words of Ed:
Hi, fourthmensch. Certainly I can explain. Sune and Sharess (and therefore, in almost all cases, their churches, too) wouldn’t care about the married or unmarried state of persons indulging in lustful practises. Wherefore performing such short-term marriages wouldn’t be clerical policy for them (except perhaps to indulge wanton faithful desiring the thrill of turning a marriage ceremony into debauchery).
However, the clergy of Siamorphe, representing a deity catering to the nobility, are concerned both with being popular/useful to nobles, AND safeguarding the rights, privileges, and powers of nobles. Bastard children, loss of virginity, and so-called “immoral” behaviour are matters far more important to noble families than to the general populace.
So legitimate but very-short-term marriages allow nobles to ah, enjoy other nobles (or commoners) whilst at the same time protecting the rights, status, and wealth of the participants and their families.
For example, a commoner female (or her family) can’t easily later demand monies or other compensation from a noble male, in return for her lost maidenhead, when she willingly (the clergy will attest to this, for they test for it, with witnesses and spells) participated in a known-to-be-dusk-until-dawn marriage.
In like manner, a noble female can experience the joys of lusty male partners without said partners gaining any claim to becoming part of her family (so she can, er, taste dungsweepers instead of restricting herself to any chinless foolheaded fops who happen to be noble).
And so on. A father can promise his daughter in marriage to anyone who can slay the Dread Beast Barthos or recover the Lost Sacred Silver Apple without blindly binding his family to an evil, grasping lout or sacrificing her future and lifelong happiness -- because she can be shrouded in disease-averting, ironguard, and healing spells for a night and just put up with things for the one night. Elder nobles who don’t want to share their fortunes or sacrifice their freedom can indulge in brief flings without sacrificing respectability (remember, in most places in the Realms no one deity is paramount [Lantan, with Gond, would be one of the exceptions], so the moral code of no one deity can dominate; whereas in our real world North America Christianity dominates and decides what’s “respectable” or not, in the Realms all of the gods have rightful standing, so as ridiculous/insincere/overly convenient as a church-legitimized one-night stand might seem to us, it’s not viewed that way by the majority of Faerunians...individuals who cleave to this god or that may sneer or deride or be scandalized, but would have a much harder time than many of our real-world fanatics do in gathering popular support for their personal views).
I must preface my answer to your second question with a gentle suggestion (please understand I’m not trying to be critical here) that your question to me, as phrased, betrays a North American Christian-dominated viewpoint. You speak of people “in serious relationships sowing some serious oats” as “lax mores.”
Though I agree that in general the Realms does follow rather romanticized courtly love-plus-feminine-equality values (or at least, that’s what I designed it to have), neither I nor the nigh-immortal [not everyone, notice, just the Chosen and other live-for-many-centuries folks, and nobles and royalty who consider themselves ‘above’ laws and social rules, or to be the people who set such laws and rules] fictional Realms characters I’ve created view “sleeping with” people as being incompatible with having deep, committed relationships with someone else. So they don’t see it as “lax” at all (and by the way, neither did a LOT of real-world American people of a certain generation, during the 1960s/Woodstock generation -- making love to Person A was seen as having nothing at all to do with being life-bonded to Person B).
Yes, The Simbul and Elminster DO love each other. Deeply. Yet neither of them would define faithfulness to the other as having anything at all to do with sex. So, yes, “swinging” between committed or married couples isn’t seen as Bad by a lot of Faerunians, in many places and situations (though among most citizens across the Realms, it would be).
[It’s fashionable among some noble classes and a LOT of “wannabe noble” rich, rising merchants, and frowned upon in places with small, stable populations where warfare or monster predations haven’t forced folk into desperate survival measures (telescoping survivors down into a single extended family of multiple husbands and wives, for example).]
I make no apology for this mental separation between love and lust. Outliving lover after lover, family after family, (many of) your own children, realm after realm, and so on will do that to you. You grab physical love when you can, and search for long-term partners with a desperate hunger.
Or at least, that’s how I’ve chosen to define the effects of lonely longevity on persons trying (and usually failing) to remain sane. If I was publishing the “uncensored” Realms, in fiction, most of my liches would be desperate to have physical relations with adventurers, not kill them. Think about it.
I’m well aware that many gamers, reviewers, academics, and persons with only a casual understanding of fantasy roleplaying games have labeled me as some sort of pervert or (at best) immoral “dirty old man” for holding such views (strange, that ‘old’ bit, considering I was examining these issues and settling on this particular viewpoint when I was about fourteen), and of course the shortage of centuries-old real-world people to examine makes the point moot, but I’d like more folks to consider that situation and come up with alternative desires and drives that might dominate such long-lived characters (pure power is one, striving for immortality at the cost of humanity through undeath is another the game rules present to us).
Interesting, yes? The Realms has many such ‘deep waters’ places, awaiting those who question deeply enough.
So saith Ed. Whew.
THO
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fourthmensch
Acolyte
USA
32 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 06:22:06
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Thanks for the explanation, Ed. I'm aware that the question comes from a North-American/Christian viewpoint (and certainly am not offended by you pointing that out :)). To be perfectly frank, I like that sex in the Realms is treated differently than on earth. But (to me, youngling that I am who missed the sixties by a good twenty years) it is an alien code of morals that I would like to understand better so that I can do it justice in games. Your explanation helps a lot; simply stating that many Faerunians see sex and love as being unrelated (or at least, sex with person A not changing love for person B) crystallizes it nicely.
So thanks for the answer. I think its a little funny (funny in that ironic, wry way, although I'm sure that you get tired of it :))that people consider you a pervert for creating a world with different morals. No one seems to believe that other game designers as racist for portraying racial strife between elves and orcs, or that Frank Herbert believed that murder was justifiable in the pursuit of political power, or or or... there are any number of other examples from literature. Especially considering that a fairly large number of people openly practiced these sexual mores not so long ago (ie, free love and whatnot). I for one, think I understand your intent, and I'll bet that most of the people who have been hounding you on this forum do as well. :) |
I want you to go home and ponder the meaning of the word subversive.
Gully Foyle is my name
And Terra is my nation
Deep space is my dwelling place
The stars my destination. |
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RevJest
Learned Scribe
USA
115 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 06:31:56
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One of the great things about this thread is that, if I wait long enough, questions I'm curious about will eventually be asked and answered.
The question just replied to certainly falls in to that category. I was thinking, "Do I really want to ask THAT question here?" And lo and behold, someone did it for me. :)
Here's a quasi-related question for Ed,
What is the nature of Dove and Florin's relationship? Mielikki ordered Florin to marry Dove. So we know why he proposed. But why did she agree? And how did Florin feel about having to ask? What did he feel for her at the time, and now?
Very curious,
Simon
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"Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter."
- Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr.
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 08:15:25
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Hey Ed that would make an interesting article
Morality of the different faithes what each of the religions think of Pre Martial sex, Drug use etc
You could also throw in a couple of fantasy morality issues like what the different faithes views of Undeath etc or what they think of cross breeding ie what the church of Correllion thinks of elves who have human lovers and have Half elven children etc or views of mortals breeding with Outsiders like fiends or Celestials.
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“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
Edited by - Dargoth on 13 Apr 2004 08:19:29 |
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Josh Davids
Seeker
57 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 10:45:19
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Fourthmench just wanted to add one thing about your above post. I have seen other authors be described as racist for writing about drow or other topics by people who actually RP in the game system. Saw that on the WoTC board about not only Ed Greenwood, but Gary Gygax and other early creators in the D&D universe. I believe that no matter what there will people who will believe what they want about the game, for the longest time it was demon worshipping in fact nearly got beaten to death in NC because of that false belief, now it has moved the sexism and racism belief, what has triggered that criticism I don’t know. But it has been going on for some time, and I believe a long time before hand as well but lately it has been gaining strength I guess because of the net, dunno but something people will have to confront and beat down just like they did with the demon worshipping myth though education and talking about it.
This is more of a personal question to Greenwood himself, because I recalled a while back him talking about editors as well as Hooded One mention that and other authors too. I have talked about my epilepsy and brain surgery before, and this deals with it and editors. Before I had my surgery I had slight problems with grammar in my writing just due to the medicine I was on and some brain damage from the seizures themselves. When I had the surgery it got worse, though with each story I do I get a little better it seems this will be a problem I will have with me till the day I die(no matter how much i try to overcome it), generally speaking would editors understand that if I lay it out to them?
Believe me I edit my stuff but even doing it twenty times I still miss little things just because of the damage up there and that does affect the writing, just a little bit but enough to give some publishers pause I would imagine when reading the manuscript. Though when I do get published the editor will get all the praise from me, unending basking praise and thanks for having patience with me.
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe
USA
804 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 17:59:19
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Have to agree with Ed here. My parents were drug-using, partner-swapping Woodstock swingers (back THEN, before AIDS and deciding to get real careers and money to eat, so they could, well, afford ME). It's not an unbelieveable moral code. After all, we're talking an imaginary world where spells actually work.
I mean, think of the last six or seven White House administrations, and how different ALL of them would have been if the public had and could cast truth-reading spells on politicians at press conferences. I'm not taking a political stand here, I'm just pointing out how one little use of magic can force BIG changes. If we have gods walking around doing things directly, we're going to have a very different society, no? |
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Faraer
Great Reader
3308 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 18:35:57
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Most people don't understand very well, at least consciously, the relationship of art and life. Everyone thinks they do, but it's not the simple question it might appear.
Josh,
If you're submitting direct to publishers and hoping to get chosen from the slush pile, imperfect spelling and grammar are liable to get the MS discarded unless the reader is drawn by the writing very quickly -- simply because there's such a volume to go through, and the person will be looking for ways to narrow the pile down. Getting a friend to check will be more efficient than doing multiple passes yourself. Since I don't see much wrong with your posts here, I think you'd be better off not mentioning the epilepsy in case it sounds defensive.
But you're better off trying to get an agent first. |
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thom
Seeker
USA
69 Posts |
Posted - 13 Apr 2004 : 18:50:37
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Well! The recent postings on sex, drugs & mores gave me the fodder for another question!
Well met again, Ed! I know you helped with the development of some of the drugs in the Lords of Darkness book. Are there any other practical (that is, useful within-the-game-rules when used by NPCS or PCs, vs pure 'roleplaying') drugs that have seen common use in the "home" realms? If so, could you give any generic stats on what they do and any side effects?
For that matter, Oh Hooded Lady, have the Knights ever run across or broken up any home realms "drug cartels"?
BTW, thanks to *both* of you for your *wonderful* advice ; I've already got my "next generation" of young players haring after several minor mysteries & shouting proper oaths at the top of their lungs! The boys are even talking about using some of the lesser oaths at school as their secret language!!
thom
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2004 : 17:01:46
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Well met, everyone. The Hooded One here again, with Ed’s replies:
Hello. A lot of collective replies this time:
First, to TheHermit: yes, I’ve been basically a D&D/fantasy roleplayer down the years, but I’ve also played in Cthulhu campaigns, Shadowrun, Top Secret, Metamorphosis Alpha, Gamma World, various steampunk settings, Featherstone-style “map-moving and playing the parts of generals, with tabletop miniature battles whenever armies meet” campaigns in both real-world historical settings and fictitious rapier-and-blunderbuss European kingdoms -- and of course scores of TSR-related playtests, and even more boardgame “campaigns.”
SiriusBlack, the cover can be viewed at:
http://images.epilogue.net/users/vengince/ELminsterD.JPG
and is part of a “gallery” on display there. What you can glean from that is as much as I know about the artist. :}
The book provides a “passing look at” Alusair and the overarching politics of Cormyr, “checking in” as it were, rather than being a full-blown Cormyr book (as Dargoth was hinting/hoping). As for relieving stress [bats eyelashes in feminine manner] why, whatever do you mean? [More serious answer: you’ll see at least one interesting scene showing something of how Alusair has grown and changed thanks to the demands of the job, but not so much of her traditional stress-relief techniques. :} Oh, wait, there IS one scene at a hunting-lodge . . .
[But wait, there’s more! Keep reading what directly follows, SiriusBlack :}]
Dargoth, as aforementioned (and as kuje31 conjectured), ELMINSTER’S DAUGHTER is the fifth Elminster book, but designed to be a quick cross-check with unfolding events in Cormyr. I think Peter Archer and Phil Athans might rightfully go berserk if I mess up their series lists and charts any more than I have already. :}
But yes, if I was running Wizards, the book would officially be both. Draws more of an audience, pleases fans of Cormyr who must be wondering by now when they’ll get fiction set in their kingdom that doesn’t half-destroy the place, and so on.
I can say that you’ll get to see something of Vangerdahast’s retirement, an update on a character last seen in one of the flashbacks in ELMINSTER IN HELL, something draconic (being as Richard Lee Byers is bringing us some great dragon-wild books, right now!), a little more about the Lady Lord of Arabel, a wild chase scene involving not-so-secret agent Rhauligan, Alusair and Caladnei and Filfaeril (!) in battle, and two engagingly bumbling villains I hope we can all meet again.
ELMINSTER’S DAUGHTER is straightforward chronological storytelling (though we do, of course, jump from one setting and character to another), is crafted to be a bit of a romp, is a catch-up-with-some-neglected-characters book, and also introduces some new characters for Realms writers, DMs, and game designers to play with. And all this for the price of dinner for one at a decent restaurant. :}
As for your article suggestion on morality of the different faiths, yes it could make for a very useful overview, with two caveats:
-- any survey of religious beliefs must necessarily be a ‘snapshot’ of a moving target: church policies are always subtly changing, and sometimes (post-Time of Troubles is a very good example) dramatically altering
-- this entire field of discourse has been rejected by DRAGON editors and TSR editors more times down the years than I can count, no matter how politely and obliquely I promised to word things (and of course, the more vague and euphemistic the prose, the less useful the end result can be), so I don’t think it’ll ever happen. I once discussed the idea very briefly with Lorraine Williams, head of TSR at the time (doing “adult” material, in the same way that Disney can put movies on screens via Touchstone Pictures that didn’t reflect on the “wholesome animation for kids” Disney was then, pre-Pixar, known for), and she was very much afraid that ‘the public would find out’ and it would reflect poorly on TSR. There were later plans for an adult line, but it was cancelled. (Please understand here that “adult” doesn’t only mean ‘more sex or at least more skin and sizzle’ . . . it meant the brutal gunslinging, drug use, other vices, and so on covered by d20 Modern right now.)
So saith Ed. Who is busybusybusy in various Waterdhavian locations rights now.
THO
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2004 : 17:39:57
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
I can say that you’ll get to see something of Vangerdahast’s retirement, an update on a character last seen in one of the flashbacks in ELMINSTER IN HELL, something draconic (being as Richard Lee Byers is bringing us some great dragon-wild books, right now!), a little more about the Lady Lord of Arabel, a wild chase scene involving not-so-secret agent Rhauligan, Alusair and Caladnei and Filfaeril (!) in battle, and two engagingly bumbling villains I hope we can all meet again.
My fave turret top salesman will be back! Yay!
Actually, if nothing else did, this blurb would be enough to interest me in the book.  |
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Bruce Donohue
Learned Scribe
Canada
131 Posts |
Posted - 14 Apr 2004 : 23:55:06
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Well I am sure that there is one particular mystery we would all like to know more about since Bane came back to play in the Realmsian Sandbox. There have been intrigues flying left right and centre with these two characters, yet no sittings, no hints and rumors spred by wonderful Bards.
So where or where is my little Sememmon gone? Then we also can't forget the beautiful Ashemi that is no doubt with her lover. I wonder if he got any of his things back from Darkhold, and he must be tickled pink to hear that Tilverton was flattened and that the once former thorn in his side King Azound has past away. |
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Karth
Seeker
USA
81 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2004 : 02:12:42
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quote:
I’m well aware that many gamers, reviewers, academics, and persons with only a casual understanding of fantasy roleplaying games have labeled me as some sort of pervert or (at best) immoral “dirty old man” for holding such views (strange, that ‘old’ bit, considering I was examining these issues and settling on this particular viewpoint when I was about fourteen), and of course the shortage of centuries-old real-world people to examine makes the point moot, but I’d like more folks to consider that situation and come up with alternative desires and drives that might dominate such long-lived characters (pure power is one, striving for immortality at the cost of humanity through undeath is another the game rules present to us).
Interesting, yes? The Realms has many such ‘deep waters’ places, awaiting those who question deeply enough.
Ed, there have been several occasions that I have pointedly pinged you on one list or another about Heinlein. Most of the time you have apparently just as pointedly ignored the reference. *rueful chuckle* But the point you are making in this post again reminds me strongly of certain aspects of his work, especially the later, future history stuff involving the extended Long family. Time Enough For Love comes to mind, in particular.
So my question is: what is your general opinion/position on R.A.H.? Do you see a similarity between the attitudes and actions of your near-immortal Faerunians and the "Howard Methuselahs"?
-Karth
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Dargoth
Great Reader
Australia
4607 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2004 : 02:26:35
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quote:
Originally posted by The Hooded One
Well met, everyone. The Hooded One here again, with Ed’s replies:
Hello. A lot of collective replies this time:
Dargoth, as aforementioned (and as kuje31 conjectured), ELMINSTER’S DAUGHTER is the fifth Elminster book, but designed to be a quick cross-check with unfolding events in Cormyr. I think Peter Archer and Phil Athans might rightfully go berserk if I mess up their series lists and charts any more than I have already. :}
But yes, if I was running Wizards, the book would officially be both. Draws more of an audience, pleases fans of Cormyr who must be wondering by now when they’ll get fiction set in their kingdom that doesn’t half-destroy the place, and so on.
I can say that you’ll get to see something of Vangerdahast’s retirement, an update on a character last seen in one of the flashbacks in ELMINSTER IN HELL, something draconic (being as Richard Lee Byers is bringing us some great dragon-wild books, right now!), a little more about the Lady Lord of Arabel, a wild chase scene involving not-so-secret agent Rhauligan, Alusair and Caladnei and Filfaeril (!) in battle, and two engagingly bumbling villains I hope we can all meet again.
ELMINSTER’S DAUGHTER is straightforward chronological storytelling (though we do, of course, jump from one setting and character to another), is crafted to be a bit of a romp, is a catch-up-with-some-neglected-characters book, and also introduces some new characters for Realms writers, DMs, and game designers to play with. And all this for the price of dinner for one at a decent restaurant. :}
As for your article suggestion on morality of the different faiths, yes it could make for a very useful overview, with two caveats:
-- any survey of religious beliefs must necessarily be a ‘snapshot’ of a moving target: church policies are always subtly changing, and sometimes (post-Time of Troubles is a very good example) dramatically altering
-- this entire field of discourse has been rejected by DRAGON editors and TSR editors more times down the years than I can count, no matter how politely and obliquely I promised to word things (and of course, the more vague and euphemistic the prose, the less useful the end result can be), so I don’t think it’ll ever happen. I once discussed the idea very briefly with Lorraine Williams, head of TSR at the time (doing “adult” material, in the same way that Disney can put movies on screens via Touchstone Pictures that didn’t reflect on the “wholesome animation for kids” Disney was then, pre-Pixar, known for), and she was very much afraid that ‘the public would find out’ and it would reflect poorly on TSR. There were later plans for an adult line, but it was cancelled. (Please understand here that “adult” doesn’t only mean ‘more sex or at least more skin and sizzle’ . . . it meant the brutal gunslinging, drug use, other vices, and so on covered by d20 Modern right now.)
So saith Ed. Who is busybusybusy in various Waterdhavian locations rights now.
THO
Regarding Elminsters Daughter
Interesting, and Im glad to see it will visit a few loose ends.
"pleases fans of Cormyr who must be wondering by now when they’ll get fiction set in their kingdom that doesn’t half-destroy the place,"
*chuckle*
Ive given Troy "Death Star" Denning a nicknmae or though perhaps calling him Talos might be more suitable given the setting
Regarding the Article
hmm theres are probably sects and a like that will disagree with the mainstream.
One way of doing it might be to rate the issue on a quasi 1-5 scale
For example Embraces it Encourage it, Neutral to it, Discourage it, Persecute it.
An example the issue of Undeath using 3 gods: Lathander, Velsharoon and Corellon Larethian
Lathander: Persecutes
Velsharoon: Embraces
Corellon Larethian: Discourages
Undead are a bet peeze for lathander so his clergy would persecute it
Velsharoon is of cause the god of Undeath and Necromancy so he'd embrace it
Corellon Larethian, while most elves despise undeath some elves have taken Undead form in order to Preserve elven culture and history ie Baelnorns so Corellons position would be he discourages but sees the occassional (read very rare) need for it
I imagine youve probably got a better chance of getting such an article published these days at WOTC, after all they did the Book of vile Darkness a couple of years ago (and they apparently werent that concerned about the Lichloved feat causing bad PR)
Speaking of future FR products what do you think of doing a Leather bound updated/revised FRC for the FRs 20th Birthday in 2006?
A few suggestions and coments around found here
http://www.candlekeep.com./forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2188 |
“I am the King of Rome, and above grammar”
Emperor Sigismund
"Its good to be the King!"
Mel Brooks |
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SiriusBlack
Great Reader
USA
5517 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2004 : 06:04:02
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Thank you THO and Ed Greenwood for the link and information regarding Elminster's Daughter. I hope this books starts to reach distributors a bit early as previous month's FR books have, as the more I hear of the tale, the more I'm looking forward to the read.
Thank you once again.
SB |
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Lady Kazandra
Senior Scribe
Australia
921 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2004 : 06:13:32
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I have a question for the Great Sage -
When did Elminster first start smoking with his Eversmoking Pipe?.
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"Once upon a time the plural of 'wizard' was 'war'." -- The Last Continent, by Terry Pratchett |
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Krafus
Learned Scribe
246 Posts |
Posted - 15 Apr 2004 : 20:38:17
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Well met, The Hooded One and Ed. My thanks to you both for taking time to answer our questions.
If all the battle-capable evil humanoids (orcs, goblins, gnolls, trolls, ogres) and giants in the North were to muster, what kind of numbers would we be talking about for each race? I seem to recall Ed mentioning "mile upon mile of grunting goblinkin" in a novel, and there's been a few references of orc hordes exceeding 100,000 in a few products. In particular and recently in FR history, Obould Many-Arrows' horde of 40,000 orcs was besieged by one of 140,000 at the Citadel of Many-Arrows. And if those huge numbers are correct, how can so many sustain themselves?
Oh, and what happened to Sundabar for its population to go from 36,000 in the Guide to the North to 14,259 as mentioned in the FRCS? I mean, I know it probably wasn't your decision, but even so I was wondering how you would explain such a major loss of population. Maybe a lot of the inhabitants moved to Silverymoon (which has had a major population increase since the GttN)? |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 16 Apr 2004 : 00:44:44
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Fair greeting, scribes! Thy Hooded Lady riding in once more, with the latest from Ed:
Lashan, I’m still at work on your last few Tantras requests, and I will get to the oaths of Tyr, etc. in due time (meaning: when my taxes are in [April 30 deadline up here in Canada] and the first draft of Waterdeep is done).
Wooly Rupert, glad you’re a Glarasteer Rhauligan fan. I’ve lots more to delve into, if I get the chance, regarding the man who’s my favourite turret top salesman, too. For one thing, I’ve GOT to do a trade fair scene wherein discerning nobles and glitterpockets (merchants burning to spend their coins) inspect the exhibits of various salesmen of turret tops, drawbridges, scented-flush garderobes, roll-apart circular beds with secret treasure compartments, animated statues, and similar luxuries. Somewhere, somewhen . . .
Bruce, Sememmon and Ashemi are characters I should say no more about, just now, other than to agree that we’ve neglected them in print, yes. (My, I’m such a subtle hinter . . . :})
Dargoth, now be NICE. :} Phil Athans plotted Tilverton’s downfall, not Troy. Troy did kill off The Lords Who Sleep, a lot of Obarskyrs, and a lot more nobles and Purple Dragons, but I got called in to help him do it, so my hands are bloodstained too. At least we avoided a long-ago internal TSR plan to smash Cormyr because it was considered way too happy and King Arthur-ish a place, and there should be no such tranquil refuges in the Realms. I’m still chuckling over that one, and recall that as I handed in STORMLIGHT, I asked the Books people to hand a copy of the MS to the designer (no, I’m NOT going to reveal who it was) who described the Forest Kingdom as a “tranquil refuge,” and force him to read it. Tranquil my left buttock.
As for the article: perhaps the chance is better now. We’ll see. :}
I hope you’ll enjoy ELMINSTER’S DAUGHTER. As I said, it’s romp time again. The usual critics will no doubt have the usual cavils about my writing, but hey, relax and enjoy the FUN. I often think the problem with reactions to many Realms novels is akin to folks watching a James Bond flick and saying, “Tsk, tsk: there wasn’t much slow, subtle character interaction or development.”
I think a Leather Bound Wonderproduct would be just DANDY for 2006: could you please suggest to the presidents of Wizards of the Coast AND Hasbro, right away? :}
Rather than update the FRCS, I’d like to collect everything we couldn’t fit into the FRCS, including web columns (e.g. my Realmslore pieces) and the various web enhancements, all suitably updated to 3.5, and add a nice deep layer of yummy icing in the form of some new Volo Guide material. However, I’m not holding my breath that we’ll see any such thing. I WILL say that I’d love to be a part of anything we do to mark the longevity of the Realms, though for me it started in 1967, and for TSR it first appeared in 1979 in DRAGON, so a 25th anniversary is something of a ‘moveable feast.’
SiriusBlack, if real-world issues like time and money and agents and publishing schedules didn’t combine to hamper things, I’d be perfectly happy if Wizards of the Coast paid me a living wage for the rest of my life to just go on churning out Realms novels, about one every six months, for the rest of my life (and of course I hope that life is a long one, not a few months of emptying my brains onto pages and then expiring :}). I’d like every Realms fan to be eagerly awaiting the next book, because then I could spend all my mental time ‘in the Realms,’ checking in on this or that character. Even after all these years, there’s SO much I haven’t been able to even mention about the Realms yet. (And NPCs are starting to have kids and I’m another generation behind! Aaaaargh!)
Lady Kazandra, well met! An honour! I believe Elminster experimented with smoking in his youth, but took it up in earnest when consorting with dwarves and halflings in Myth Drannor. I'm not sure exactly when he gained the Eversmoking Pipe. It was some centuries later (after the events recounted in THE TEMPTATION OF ELMINSTER, I believe), but I'll have to look into this in depth. Perhaps in a short story. :}
Krafus, I've no idea what a full muster of humanoids would be in the Sword Coast North at any given time, even if such a thing were possible. Millions, certainly. The whole point of orc hordes is that they CAN'T sustain themselves: orcs are fecund, overpopulation leads to overcrowding in the northern mountain caverns and starvation, and charismatic leaders arise to lead a pillaging and foraging army south to GET food.
What happened to Sundabar? Several hordes stopped by, plus severe winters and disease, plus some of the strife recounted in various Realms novels and game products -- all of these caused deaths and migrations to "friendlier" Silverymoon and warmer, more southerly locations.
So saith Ed. Who'll have more to say very soon.
THO |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 16 Apr 2004 : 00:46:18
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Well met again, all. Thy Hooded Lady, with Ed's latest:
Karth, I enjoy the early, seminal short-story Heinlein (The Roads Must Roll, Misfit, etc.), the juvenile-novels Heinlein (Red Planet, Farmer In The Sky, Tunnel In The Sky, etc.), the all-too-often forgotten fantasy Heinlein (Glory Road), the brilliant Heinlein (Orphans of the Stars), and the later, self-indulgent Heinlein (Friday, The Number of the Beast, The Cat Who Walks Through Walls, To Sail Beyond The Sunset). I must say that the Long family books are among my least favourites, because I’m completely disinterested in interpersonal power games played along American military discipline lines or gender lines, but I enjoy examining RAH’s various ‘takes’ on altered people, characters with increased longevity, and so on. (BTW, following on the heels of the publication of Heinlein’s “lost” first novel, Spider Robinson will be completing an unfinished early Heinlein from notes and an outline).
Although it’s considered fashionable in many quarters to sneer at Heinlein, these days, I consider his early short stories and some of his early novels to be enduring classics of the field, and almost every one of them increased the horizons of what sf was at the time. His juveniles (YA or teen novels, they’d be termed today) were vitally important in ‘hooking’ an entire generation of readers into sf, many of whom became important sf writers. His later books (particularly those before his brain surgery) became increasingly long and rambling, but all of them have both fun moments and intriguing examinations of social ideas (whereas the early short stories more often examined scientific cutting-edge ideas).
Heinlein likes to show us his near-immortals in family situations, so he can compare and contrast his characters, and we can watch them bouncing off each other. By the time he was writing books about Lazarus Long and the rest, he had more or less complete freedom in what he wrote about (only light editorial hands were going to touch his work).
I’ve never yet really had that freedom of style, length, and topic -- and in my Realms fiction, I haven’t had the opportunity to examine the Seven Sisters as a ‘family,’ or really go into much depth about their attitudes -- beyond here-and-right-now problems and their current romances. I’ve managed to sneak in a lot of Elminster’s philosophy, in the form of little quotations and bon mots down the years, but SILVERFALL and a few moments in this year’s Spin A Yarn tale (Only a Woman . . .) are about the extent of Sister-to-Sister interaction.
I’d love to delve into this more, but on the other hand, the more I “paint in” about the Chosen, the harder it is for other writers to use them (and believe me, some writers ARE hard at work right now on some uses of those characters. So I guess the best way to sum it all up is that: I don’t personally agree with some of the attitudes expressed by Heinlein’s “Methuselahs,” I’m not sure we readers can be sure all of them were always telling the truth at every moment in his fiction -- and I haven’t yet had the chance to properly lay out the attitudes and actions of my various near-immortals enough for us to compare them properly.
Here we come to an important difference between RAH and Ed Greenwood [yes, besides a vast difference in literary quality :}]: RAH is writing finished fiction, that (in his mind as he’s writing it) is never going to have to serve as an unfolding, flexible roleplaying game setting. (Yes, I know there was a Crossroads solitaire game book based on Glory Road, but let’s leave that aside.) I have to keep in mind that for the Realms to stay ‘alive,’ I have to keep some mysteries clinging to the major characters, and allow them to change, grow, and us to continue having revelations about them as the years (and game products, and play sessions in your campaigns) pass. So I tend to want to reveal more slowly, to keep things interesting (in the same way that the old art of burlesque striptease can be far more compelling than a person quickly and unglamorously shucking off their clothes, even if in the end you see more).
I can say that a lot of RAH’s characters seem to value their personal freedoms above everything else (including love, stable relationships, etc.), whereas I usually see “true love” as transcending all else, and folks not only dying for a loved one, but devoting their lives to the happiness of someone else over their own (one of the best definitions of love I know). RAH was all too apt to construct situations in which Character X can most love Character Y by ‘opening the eyes’ of beloved Y to see and do things Character X’s way, because it’s right. I’ve never been so confident of what “right” is.
So saith Ed. BTW, thanks to Number of the Beast, my nickname was Gay Deceiver for a time (and no, Heinlein wasn't using "Gay" in the modern sexual-preference sense). Sorry, fellow gals.
THO |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 16 Apr 2004 : 03:47:00
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’Lo, everyone. The Hooded One once more, with more of Ed’s words to inquiring scribes:
simontrinity, I’d love to say a lot about Dove and Florin's relationship, but that’s another topic that saying too much about may well hamper/damage a future Realms project. So let me just tiptoe through some abbreviated answers, okay?
Florin had rescued Dove twice before receiving his orders from Mielikki, so they did know each other, and were well on the road to becoming very friendly. (Florin knew she was a Harper agent, and had willingly undergone degradation and Zhent captivity to learn things -- and respected her for it.) Yet at the time Florin was reluctant to marry anyone. Obviously, Dove accepted because Mystra ordered her to (suggesting an as-yet-unrevealed destiny for their offspring, and a mysterious agreement between the two goddesses).
I can say that Mielikki’s avatar personally made love to Florin while giving him his orders, and this rapturous experience augmented his knowledge and changed him forever, turning him from reluctant to marry, to eager to become Dove’s partner.
I think Dove saw Florin as a handsome, desirable, noble-of-character man she’d love to become intimate with and to befriend (knowing she’d see him get killed or grow old and die, leaving her lonely again) before Mystra spoke with her -- and then saw him as someone marked (changed) by the gods as she is, and so a fitting mate.
The two of them have teleport rings that allow them to “jump” to or from Evermeet whenever desired, and they (and their child) have the ‘liberty’ of that realm: they are free to visit and depart as they see fit [a status VERY few humans enjoy]. Dove spent much time on Evermeet giving birth and raising their infant child, but rarely visits there now (her duties as a Chosen keep her very busy).
They have a happy marriage, and love each other deeply, but are neither given to public displays of affection nor are inseparable: both spend long periods of time apart, ‘doing their own thing.’ Both are Harpers, and both enjoy some sort of limited mental link (like back and forth sending spells, but becoming a true telepathic link only on occasions of great pain or emotion) while on the same plane.
So saith Ed. I believe he’ll have more to say soon. For my part, from Realmsplay experiences in the ‘home’ Realms campaign, I can add this much: Dove and Florin ‘think alike’ enough to work as a seamless team in battle and in certain playacting negotiations (e.g. with Zhents, Cormyrean officials, Waterdeep City Watchmen, and so on), and take delight in entertaining each other with mimicry of others (in private only; they’d never dream of doing so in front of witnesses who weren’t fellow Harpers, Chosen, or Knights of Myth Drannor -- and NO, I’m NOT saying Florin is himself a Chosen of Mystra, okay?).
THO
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Questions for Ed Greenwood (2004)
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