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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6404 Posts |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
 Posted - 14 Mar 2014 : 22:37:26
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| I don‘t know a lot about Lord Chess, beyond his 2E stat summary ... F3, W3, P3, T3, etc ... he obviously must have incredible ability scores to meet all those dual-classing reqs, but somehow the descriptor makes him seem like a spoiled dabbler and dilettante who isn‘t capable of the focus or disciple to finish whatever he starts. The Manshoon-Chess stories and interactions seem to reinforce my impression that Lord Chess is a bit of a naive patsy whose fate is to serve as nothing more than Manshoon‘s political puppet-appendage. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 14 Mar 2014 : 23:35:21
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BUT, If you recall... Lord Chess fooled them all and was really a servant of Mystra. We saw that at the very end of the Avatar series.
I don't think Manshoon is as great as HE thinks he is. That could be because he is a mere shadow of the man he once was, before all the cloning started to break-down his psyche.
For all we know, it could be a Doctor Doom scenario, and not just because of the iron mask. Remember how we had a DD for the longest time, and everyone thought it was the real Doom, and it turned out Doom was really away for years (in other dimensions, space, etc), and that was really his clone he left in his place? Even the clone didn't know it was just a clone. In fact, IIRC, it was a double-double fake-out. The 'real' Doom was trying to get his kingdom back from the clone, and in the end you find out the 'real' one was just a robot, and the real, real one was away in space... or something.
So maybe someday the 'real' Manshoon will return, and destroy all these 'lesser Manshoons'.
I had a theory once (over on the WotC boards, I think) that got shot-down: That originally he was like 6th or 7th son of a Shoon Emperor, who followed his father around, dressed like him, etc (mini-me style), and people referred to him as "The Boy Shoon". Although he was proud of the nickname, they were mocking him, knowing he would never make it to the throne. Then when the entire Imperial family was killed (this happened several times - take your pick), some retainers escaped with the child into the wilderness. Not out of any sort of loyalty, but rather, they thought it would be a good idea to have their own heir to the throne around, under their thumb. So everyone else thought the entire family perished, and they kept him hidden away for several years... always mocking him and calling him, "The Boy, Shoon". They did, however, train him to fight, and how to lead, and to stay hidden and make clandestine plans...
And on his 16th birthday he walked away from the burning tower, blood splattered, and said, "NO... from this day forth, they will know the MAN, Shoon!"
And that was it. some folks didn't like it, but whatever. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2014 : 01:04:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
I had a theory once (over on the WotC boards, I think) that got shot-down: That originally he was like 6th or 7th son of a Shoon Emperor, who followed his father around, dressed like him, etc (mini-me style), and people referred to him as "The Boy Shoon". Although he was proud of the nickname, they were mocking him, knowing he would never make it to the throne. Then when the entire Imperial family was killed (this happened several times - take your pick), some retainers escaped with the child into the wilderness. Not out of any sort of loyalty, but rather, they thought it would be a good idea to have their own heir to the throne around, under their thumb. So everyone else thought the entire family perished, and they kept him hidden away for several years... always mocking him and calling him, "The Boy, Shoon". They did, however, train him to fight, and how to lead, and to stay hidden and make clandestine plans...
And on his 16th birthday he walked away from the burning tower, blood splattered, and said, "NO... from this day forth, they will know the MAN, Shoon!"
And that was it. some folks didn't like it, but whatever.
LOL! Probably because that has the same depth as a Spiderman villain origin story on that really old Electric Company TV show.
You stole my candy sucker when I was five, so I became the CANDY STRIPER! RAAARRR!!!
  
PS: Please don't take offense. I just thought this was very silly. It's very hard seeing Manshoon saying anything like this - even as an angry teenager.
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"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
--Faraer |
Edited by - Eltheron on 15 Mar 2014 01:51:14 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36910 Posts |
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Eltheron
Senior Scribe
740 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2014 : 14:11:55
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
At least they didn't call him Shunior.
ROFL! Don't do that when I'm drinking coffee.
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"The very best possible post-fourteenth-century Realms lets down those who love the specific, detailed social, political and magical situation, with its thousands of characters, developed over forty years, and want to learn more about it; and those who'd be open to a new one with equal depth, which there just isn't time to re-produce; and those repelled, some past the point of no return, by the bad-taste-and-plausibility gap of things done to the world when its guardianship was less careful."
--Faraer |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 15 Mar 2014 : 18:20:55
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Hmmmphhh... to each his own. I think its golden.
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"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Thauranil
Master of Realmslore
India
1591 Posts |
Posted - 17 Mar 2014 : 11:28:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
At least they didn't call him Shunior.
Damn it Wooly you made me burst out laughing in public. |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6404 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2014 : 15:13:33
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Just came across this quote in Cloak and Dagger for 1370 DR
quote:
Hunters within the Hullack Forest of Cormyr discover a strange sight in a clearing between Knightswood and Dhedluk, the turf has been blasted away down to the bedrock, and around the edges of the crater are two twisted and broken skeletons, their skulls mysteriously missing. The crater is lopsided due to a dead magic zone on its eastern quadrant, and therein lies the torso of a young, handsome, dark haired man, his skeletal legs and hips lying within the blast zone. By month’s end, the Royal Mage, Vangerdahast, identifies the young man as a clone of Manshoon, but notes he is far younger than he has ever seen the black robed mage himself.
Now piecing together the story of Manshoon at the age of 29 in 1258 he was sent on a quest with his brother and rival into the big wide world. At that time he was not a mage but during an encounter with Harpers he acquired a wand (which he traded to have his hand regenerated) and a spell book which resolved him to learn magic.
In 1261 he returns to Zhentil Keep having learned some magic and with a lot of luck (according to the Ruins of Zhentil Keep) he manages to slay Ulsan and become Lord.
Now stasis clone is a level 9 spell, i cant remember at what level you learn level 9 spells but i would imagine it is after attaining the 15th level of experience as a wizard.
Now in 1367 Manshoon is listed as a 19th level wizard and in 1356 he is only a 16th level wizard.
So the question is at what age would you still be considered a young man. I would consider 40 middle aged but that is by todays standards where living into the 80's is the norm.
So a young man might only be into the early 30's which by that time Manshoon should only have been as high as a 8th or 9th level wizard tops and so could not have cast the stasis clone spell (let alone developed it which is one of the claims).
The point i'm getting at is that Manshoon's story has to be different than the one we were told in order for this young Manshoon clone to exist.
Even as head of the Zhentarim with access to longevity potions he would likely be approaching middle age and not a young man. I can't remember what longevity potions do but i dont think they restore youth to you, merely prolong what life you have left (i.e. keep you at the current age for longer by delaying aging).
So again i propose that Manshoon is not actually Manshoon at all, but someone that replaced him at some point during his life (probably while he was off on his quest at the age of 29). |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 01 Apr 2014 : 16:30:43
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| Longevity Potions and Elixirs of Youth do restore years to you. If you are older, they literally make you younger. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Gary Dallison
Great Reader
United Kingdom
6404 Posts |
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Manshoon
