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Starblade
Acolyte
5 Posts |
 Posted - 30 Jan 2006 : 02:17:49
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quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
Welcome to Candlekeep, Starblade! You really read through ALL the posts? All 43 pages of them? Egad. That's got to be some sort of record. :)
How I could I not. It was so fun hearing about little tidbit's about the books and character responses. It's like a director's cut dvd of a favorite movie for a book.
I also managed to pick up City of Splendors and Shadows in Starlight. I was surprised Waterdeep didn't follow Evermeet or Cormyr's story structure.
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Edited by - Starblade on 30 Jan 2006 02:27:48 |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jan 2006 : 03:13:48
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I initially assumed that CoS WOULD take a similar format, but the Powers That Be decreed otherwise. It was decided that CoS would be grouped with the Cities series, rather than the "historical" novels set in Cormyr and Evermeet; therefore, the editor wanted a stand-alone story with mostly new characters.
You mentioned "Shadows in Starlight," which recalls a recent "D'oh!" moment when I realized that I have two vastly different stories with almost identical titles: Starlight & Shadows is the Liriel trilogy, and Shadows in the Starlight is the second book in the Changeling Dectective series. Yikes. I have no idea why I didn't make that connection when book 2 was being named.  |
Edited by - ElaineCunningham on 30 Jan 2006 03:20:21 |
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Vangelor
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2006 : 03:50:57
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Elaine,
I have recently read through (and thoroughly enjoyed) the Song & Shadow series. I am happy to hear we may yet see more of Arilyn and Danilo in the future. If you can also fit in more of Foxfire (my favorite supporting character), I will be delighted beyond words.
My question regards moonblades.
In Dream Spheres, I believe it was, Elaith Craulnober is proven to be a quessir of honor when Arilyn deliberately strikes him with her moonblade to prove this. This is undertaken before a gathering of Waterdeep's elves, as well as the band from Tethir who came to aid Arilyn, to prove Elaith was worthy of serving as an emergency leader for the People. Although there is some duplicity in this instance (the corrupt kiira making Arylin's sword behave erratically), in general, it seems that "a moonblade will not harm an innocent" is a well-known fact true of all such artifacts.
That said, here is the question: A moonfighter has a blade whose history has been one of fighting the drow, through the Shadow Wars and beyond. This is in many ways that moonblade's purpose and destiny. Returning from adventures abroad, he meets an elf of mixed ancestry (the result of a drow assault on a moon elf settlement) who appears to be drow, in terms of coloring. This dark elf is a faithful follower of Eilistraee, however, of good heart and of unblemished honor. If the moonfighter attempts to strike down the half-drow, would the sword follow its "purpose" in ridding Faerūn of drow, or would the enchantments that prevents the harming of an innocent elf recoil on its weilder?
I know what I think, but would love to hear how you would handle this situation.
Thanks!
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2006 : 04:13:59
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Yikes. That dilemna is a bit thornier than it appears at first glance. Forgotten Realms elves do not have 21st century, pc sensibilities, nor do moonblades. The Drizzts, Liriels, and Eilistraees of the world have given us outsiders a rather skewed view of the drow, and we're far more willing to give an individual drow the benefit of the doubt than folk who have reason to know that 99,999 times out of 100,000, you can't go wrong assuming the worse about a drow.
Each moonblade has a distinct, unique history. How this sword responds would have a lot to do with the previous wielders and the powers they lent the sword. I think you could make a case for going either way.
Another sticky issue involves FR elven genetics. According to the game rules, elves are not half this, half that. They take after one parent or another, so if your follower of Eilistraees looks like a drow, by FR rules he or she IS a drow. Of course, you can choose not to follow this convention in your own campaign, and however you choose to handle it, it wouldn't make much impact on the sword's response.
I'm not sure how I'd approach a story of this nature, other than knowing that I'd have to add some sort of ironic twist. :) I'd probably be inclined to go for a difficult ending rather than a feel good, can't-we-all-just-get-along resolution. Too easy. Not enough dramatic tension. An important aspect of tragedy is the sense of inevitability, and the situation you set up suggests a tragedy in the making.
$.02,
ec
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4689 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2006 : 05:52:42
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Well half-Drow half human are premitted, but indeed a moon elf and a dark elf will (per the rules) have a moon or Drow child in most caes (I seem to recall a rule, that might have expired that rare times mixed blood effected skin color) Drow or Moon.
As for the Moonblade purpose, if it is set to kill drow alone it certainly will seek to kill any Drow.
If blade is set to kill Evil it will seek to kill all Evil aligned.
These effects can stack with bonus to each attack.
A blade set to damage Evil and Drow will do more damage to an Evil Drow then a good Drow, just as the blade would do less damage to a non Drow Evil Creature.
The moonblade does have a purpose and was awakened for it by the weilder, all the powers of the blade should come into play.
Now if the specfic moonblade had a propety to never harm a good aligned person, the weilder would be in for a surprise when trying to kill a good aligned Drow. The Drow attacked likely would be very surprised as well.
As I understand it abilities are added, not sure if limits are that I propsed but at least appears posible that one weilder might have included healing property into the blade after discovering a good creature was killed by it. A fast healing, cure wounds, or regenitive effect that would negate most if not all effects of a sucessful hit. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Vangelor
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2006 : 08:00:50
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Wow! Thank you for the prompt reply - taht opened up more possibilities than I had seen in this issue.
Only possible twist here is one of setting - Harrowdale environs, where there has been an active temple of Eilistraee in the Velarswood since circa. -310 DR... Then again, the Vhaeraunite occupation of Cormanthor & the Elven Court is likely making those elves who have opted to remain in the area (rather than answering the call to Evermeet) even more paranoid about drow than they otherwise would be. Thorny, indeed!
But for the sake of clarification... The notion of who is an "innocent" is dependent upon the view of the blade, and thus on the life-experience of its various weilders over time, then, rather than a gods-given insight into the nature or history of its target? |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 02 Feb 2006 : 12:45:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Vangelor
But for the sake of clarification... The notion of who is an "innocent" is dependent upon the view of the blade, and thus on the life-experience of its various weilders over time, then, rather than a gods-given insight into the nature or history of its target?
Another thorny issue. The swords possess a sentient, gods-given, that allows them to approve worthy wielders. Doing this requires a deep insight into the heart, mind, and even the future of the elf in question. Does this same process extend to every opponent the wielder faces, to the same extent? I'd have to say no.
"Innocence" is a relative term. The people a warrior faces in battle are not all evil, just because they're on another side or an issue--or more to the point, are obliged to follow a particular leader. A sword that would pick and choose where it would allow you to strike would be worse than useless in a melee. But try to follow stragglers back to their cottages and slaughter them, their families, and their cattle, and you could expect to get zapped.
Moonblades don't translate very well to game terms. My fault entirely--ELFSHADOW was my first book, and I had no idea these things would catch on as they did. I'll say it: They are too powerful. The notion that the gods watch and judge every time a wielder unsheathes a moonblade would make them far more than they were ever intended to be.
Each sword is unique, a product of its wielders. While they cannot be turned to evil purposes, there is room for the wielders to make judgement calls and hard decisions. Moral dilemnas come to all who hold themselves to a high standard of morality. This is the nature of existance, and I believe it is true for the Realms, as well--magic swords and paladins notwithstanding.
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Starblade
Acolyte
5 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2006 : 04:44:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Vangelor
But for the sake of clarification... The notion of who is an "innocent" is dependent upon the view of the blade, and thus on the life-experience of its various weilders over time, then, rather than a gods-given insight into the nature or history of its target?
I thought the sword just used all the weilder's morality. That's why she couldn't attack the elf who beat her up in Elfshadow but later on when she realized he was a bad guy she had no problem attacking him. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 03 Feb 2006 : 18:02:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Starblade
I thought the sword just used all the weilder's morality. That's why she couldn't attack the elf who beat her up in Elfshadow but later on when she realized he was a bad guy she had no problem attacking him.
Possibly. Or that could have been due to the instability of Arilyn's moonblade. |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 03:08:33
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Hi, I was told to search this forum for answers, but honestly I have no time to read 44 pages and I did quickly run trough ten until I gived up and simply ask my question. My question, or rather dilemma comes form fact that I am trying create very unic legacy weapon (according Weapons of Legacy DnD game supplement). I treat in my game table now on as legacy items because it makes someway sense to me at least (and would warrant more often elven characthers to able obtain or heritage moonblades generally).
Anycase dilemma is following; Sword is about 1,500 older than any moonblades crafted, so it was NOT crafted to be a moonblade in first place nor purpose wise.
Also that the sword was crated to be tool of grand evil ploy, crafted by Malkizid influenced Vyshaanti clan during start of Third Crown War. They gave the sword to their most famous mage marshal, who did not knew that weapon actually was cursed. The weapon literally drains owner's soul after owner dies, storing the life essence to the ploy what Vyshaanti high mages had in mind. The sword's purpose was to seek and draw in a powerfull adventorous inviduals.
But unkwon to the Vyshaanti by the time, the weapon awakened legacy in the hands of mage marshal and becomed far more powerfull weapon than intended. The mage marshal shortly said was very evil mage generall, infamous enough to be told in acient tales as 'Elfbane' because his very effective methods and his bloodlust in the war.
Times pass and AFTER moonblades were created, a corrupt moon elf politician who owned a silver tongue finds the blade, ignorant not discover it's past beyond the power what it started gradually give to him he carried the blade around. He then faced a moonfighter who tried uncover one of his ploys for power, he fighted in duel whit the moonfighter and he was more skilled swordman what he have lefted publicity to believe, he shatters the other moonblade and kills the owner in same go.
Then oddiest even occurs; The evil Vyshaanti legacy item DRAINS the magic essence of the destroyed moonblade into itself! Giving properties of the moonblade (including the Elfshadow ability) and according any divine magic which asks it is a moonblade it registers as one (but whit carefull question directly towards Corellon may reveal that there are only 99 moonblades left, one being destroyed and consumed).
Of course the ancient epic magics had bastardiced the moonblades essence's purpose, only taking the raw power of the essence and forming it into as anew weapon which can be called by divine view only namely as moonblade. But in mortals eyes and most divination magics it registers fully as moonblade and passes as one.
Then the politician's descendants started show around that they have a moonblade and that the item was troughouly scanned and authentication clarified (but not completely carefully, but well enough) the blade was reconized as moonblade (despite slightly different design, these events occured years after craft of Moonblades and all crafters being deceased). Anycase the sword goes dormant until it reawakens in hands of knight of Corellon Larethian who was very valorous elf (pratically complete opposite to earlier wielders).
Anycase the sword accept the new wielder because he is descendant of the cunning moon elf politician (a another odd quality was that ever since the weapon drained the essence of Moonblade it started only work in hands of the politicians bloodline). The new wilder then died and new carrier was found from his daughter, who carried also the sword and used it and she was good also. She died then in phaerim invasion in Evermeet and one of the phaerrims taked the sword whit it.
At moment I plan get the player hints and guide it discover the blade, and after if char survives to epic levels, the sword signals ot the surviving Vyshaan elven clan four heirs that sword is ready to be used to their ploy; Which is to repeat Dark Disaster but this time do it to their ancient enemies of other (ancient elven nations) heirs and much grander scale. By using the swords stored soul energies to power the epic spell, but problem being that it needs the soul of the player characther to be finally 'filled' and they had no longer patience to wait the wielder just die naturally or accidentally like premier wielders.
Anycase I have planned that Vyshaan will sadistically use characthes OWN sword against him, by using telekinesis and when blade draws blood, the ancient text whihc has carved on the sword; 'Only my creator masters me' transforms by bath of blood of the characther; 'Only my trainer masters me' causes the centuries stored sentience of mage marshal awaken in the blade and work as the epic ritual to awaken the epic legacy items powers which are plainly said created to kill the Vyshaanti four remaining sons (one of the abilities pratically makes able to smite elves and causes instant death whit a chance even to a baelorn if sword strikes). You can quess the soul of mage marshal aint happy anyway for centuries of imprisonment from his kinsmen.
My question (hopefully I did not cause boredom by making you read above the background story), is that is the above story plausible according old realm lore whitout stepping too many toes already published materials regarding the nature of moonblades? I want to try create a legacy item which is storngly believed to be a moonblade while it is not (at least completely) and which was created by Vyshaan clan high mages as ploy to create a more bigger and destructive Dark Disaster kind of pheromemon and which had cpatured the mage marshal and earlier wielder's souls into the weapon (and also leaving traces of their heritage in form of magically granted abilities). |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 13:36:42
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Kazzarroth, obviously you can do whatever you like in your home campaign. I would not take a similar approach, because I do think this scenario contradicts some basic, er, "facts" about moonblades.
First, moonblades do not contain souls or memories, per se, so the sword you describe would probably not be able to absorb a moonblade's powers.
Second, the possibility of a sword turning to evil was of great concern to those who fashioned the moonblades. After all, the purpose of these swords was to establish the royal bloodline, and the elves did not want to find themselves saddled with a family of despots. The magical safeguards build into the moonblades would make it extremely difficult, if not impossible, for a sword to be turned to evil purpose of subsumed into an evil artifact.
Third, elves keeps track of the moonblades. When a sword goes dormant, it must be returned to Evermeet. When it is active, the elves know who's wielding it, and have a pretty good idea where that person is. Elves would find the notion of "lost moonblades," or stories of finding one in a dragon's hoard, very amusing. If they find someone carrying a dormant moonblade, the assumption is that it was taken off a moonfighter's body--very recently, and probably by the killer. Thus, anyone carrying a moonblade can expect to be challenged by the next elf he meets. Elves just don't leave moonblades lying around unclaimed; if a moonfighter falls or goes missing, a quest to find the sword is undergone immediately and carried on until its objective has been met. So your character's story of a long-lost sword that's 1500 years older than a moonblade and of a different design, but still a moonblade, simply wouldn't be believable to any elf. Some people of other races might believe it, but moonblade lore is too well known among the elves. It would be like telling a group of Welsh folklore experts that the walrus bone knife you dug up in Greenland (and that is carbon-dated to about 1000 BC) is really King Arthur's Excaliber.
Fourth, elves are very protective of the moonblade's legacy, because a corrupted blade suggests a corrupted process, and calls into question the legitamacy of the royal family. The elves would have a stern words with any evil elf claiming to wield a moonblade, or anyone spreading stories of evil moonblades. (Ever wonder why we haven't heard from Volo for a while?)
One of the storytelling problems inherent in moonblades is that over the years they've become almost impossible to wield. That's why they are so rare--only about 20 still retain their magic. A sword that's TOO powerful tends to take over the story. |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:05:32
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Ok, so I have to abaddon whole idea of dark past in moonblade (and the epic plot and forget most of the history all together) and treat it as just plain normal moonblade which player (not my characther) has tasked to get back (being his legacy and all) from phaerrim which resides near in Myth Drannor ruins (the campaing resolves around a elven treasurehunters and who have bit Indiana Jones concept to their work looting ancient elven tombs).
Anycase there is no problem that sword takes overthe story because according Weapons of Legacy rules the weapons powers grow along whit the wielder; Henceworth the weapon of legacy is statistically often a +1 item but can increase into +5 in 20 level progression and have alot of other traits.
Anycase so the moonblade does not store memories/souls other premier wielders, so, basically does the soul of the wielder be 'sacraficed' to increase the moonblade powers (add the rune into blade's lenght) and somewhere I recall in the books was mentioned that spirits will be released if certain condittions are met.
Also in Faerun; Lost Empires is mentioned that a moonblade is corrupted, so can corruption remain well hidden if person in question takes precautions to do so and any future drawers also are evil natured or neutral and conceal the nature of themselves and the moonblade (henceworth speaking of a secretly corrupt family who haves enough resources to make a near exclent cover ups).
But then if wielder is good...how corrupt moonblade reacts to that? Will it be purified thanks the wielder is good and fills the 'traditionall' requirements of the moonblade or does the moonblade try corrupt the wielder itself? Of course we would remain in the line that blade serves still elven values, but we speak of a moonblade which would be used by radicall elf which goes 'too far' in name of elven ideology.
So, can it be possible that the radicall elf faction (which name escapes me now but it was fouded by nobles which leaved Myth Drannor after it becomed to open to all races and which hates in extreme all humans and half-elves) could have member who wields a corrupt moonblade and which functions fully otherwise? |
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe
Canada
592 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:09:46
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Here's a question, could it be possible to create a pseudo-moonblade? A sword with many of the properties of a moonblade (increasing power based on the user, designed for a purpose), but designed for alterntive purposes.
This might explain the Starym Moonblade. It was not made to give them a chance at the Evermeet Throne, but more as a loyalty check. Also this might have lead to the corruption of the blade as it didn't have the backing of the gods. (Just an idea for other in there campiagn and for merging realm lore).
Just an idea, curious about your thoughts. |
Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems! |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:31:59
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quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm
Here's a question, could it be possible to create a pseudo-moonblade? A sword with many of the properties of a moonblade (increasing power based on the user, designed for a purpose), but designed for alterntive purposes.
This might explain the Starym Moonblade. It was not made to give them a chance at the Evermeet Throne, but more as a loyalty check. Also this might have lead to the corruption of the blade as it didn't have the backing of the gods. (Just an idea for other in there campiagn and for merging realm lore).
Just an idea, curious about your thoughts.
::sigh:: One of the challenges of writing in a shared world is that sometimes people pick up an idea and run with it unexpected directions. Of course, this is also one of the benefits of writing in a shared world. :)
The Starym moonblade is first mentioned by Volo in his "Guide to All Things Magical," and Volo's lore is not necessarily meant as "canon," but as "DM lore:" that is, things that may or may not be true, and it's up to the DM to decide how he wants to treat it in his campaign. I consider the Starym moonblade to be approcryphal lore, the sort of thing humans might believe, but elves would roll their eyes over. Elaith has some scathing observations about this legend in the story "Games of Chance." In fact, I can easily imagine that in elf taverns, dark jokes about the Starym moonblade are as common as dumb blond jokes are in our world--and by this I mean short stories dependant upon an understood concept of dimwitted credulity. |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:32:56
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Hmmm, I am intrested to hear also this answer. I am trying to create a somesort surprise to my player in plotwise whit the moonblade which background told to him has been very sketchy and not many elven loremasters could fully tell waht properties it had and what past it haves. Reasong being that this sword is peculiar because it ended very often missing and disappear for good and it had powers negate any scrying on the wielder and the where abouts where blade resided, making searching near impossible.
So it has been only the 'lucky coincidences' when blade has been found again by the descendants of earlier wielder. Anycase surprise msut be a someway dramatic and create a epic plot to stop evil, my player's char is CG and he aims for Bladesinger career, so I want give him a good, epic, evil foe to fight and fight whit reason and the reason must be connected to moonblade alone (so that the epic fight or conflict is somewaht directly concerned and related to the characther itself but it threats rest of the world also). |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:34:28
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| Oh, I see my reply comed bit too late :P. |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:39:49
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Hmmm, anycase thsi does not remove me the stress for sketching th history of the moonblade, because I cannot create the swords abilities at all whitout a some diea how the history of the my player's characther moonblade is connected to the epic evilfoe. I have toughted house Dlargareth, Vyshaan etc. basically I want some ancient elf related evil creep up because campaing resolves around ancient past of the elves and their artifacts, so I want the epic 'ending' to be related to that subject.
So first idea was around a Vyshaanti crafted disguised weapon which drained wielders souls for a epic spell and which is disguised as moonblade. But that diea was disrecarded now it seems and now I am stressed figure this out because player is soon getting the blade from phaerrim nest :P. |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:52:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Kazzaroth
Ok, so I have to abaddon whole idea of dark past in moonblade (and the epic plot and forget most of the history all together) and treat it as just plain normal moonblade...
You don't HAVE to change your story idea at all. If you want moonblades to behave this way in your campaign (or story), then there's no reason why they can't. People do variations on the Realms all the time.
quote:
Anycase so the moonblade does not store memories/souls other premier wielders, so, basically does the soul of the wielder be 'sacraficed' to increase the moonblade powers (add the rune into blade's lenght) and somewhere I recall in the books was mentioned that spirits will be released if certain condittions are met.
I consider this a fairly complicated metaphysical question. What is soul, what is spirit, what is the nature of the afterlife? Are the "souls" of former moonfighters sitting around in some tiny parallel dimension created by an individual moonblade, playing cards and waiting for the last person in their line to die so they can go to Arvandor? Absolutely not. To my way of thinking, something of a former wielder lingers in the moonblade--an energy, a bit of magic--that is deeply personal and powerful enough to add a new ability to the moonblade's magic. In some cases, the moonblade's magic can provide a Gate through which a manifestation of the spirit of former moonfighter can pass. This manifestation is most likely to take the form of dreams or visions, but in a few cases, a ghostlike entity that can interact with the physical world.
quote:
Also in Faerun; Lost Empires is mentioned that a moonblade is corrupted, so can corruption remain well hidden if person in question takes precautions to do so and any future drawers also are evil natured or neutral and conceal the nature of themselves and the moonblade (henceworth speaking of a secretly corrupt family who haves enough resources to make a near exclent cover ups).
But then if wielder is good...how corrupt moonblade reacts to that? Will it be purified thanks the wielder is good and fills the 'traditionall' requirements of the moonblade or does the moonblade try corrupt the wielder itself? Of course we would remain in the line that blade serves still elven values, but we speak of a moonblade which would be used by radicall elf which goes 'too far' in name of elven ideology.
So, can it be possible that the radicall elf faction (which name escapes me now but it was fouded by nobles which leaved Myth Drannor after it becomed to open to all races and which hates in extreme all humans and half-elves) could have member who wields a corrupt moonblade and which functions fully otherwise?
I can't answer this, as I haven't read this particular game supplement and had no idea it dealt with moonblades. I'm very, VERY glad you mentioned it. The moonblades, a concept created for my novel Elfshadow, form a pivotal theme in an ongoing series of novels. Note the term "ongoing." I planned to develop moonblade lore in the next Songs & Swords book. If I have to rework my story, it's better to find out now, rather than lose months of work because the rug of moonblade lore has been pulled out from under the plot.
You don't have to follow the published lore in your campaign, but I DO. So trust me, I feel your pain.
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Foxhelm
Senior Scribe
Canada
592 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:53:33
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To Kazzaroth
Just because it can't use a moonblade doesn't mean that it can't be a powerful elven blade. The Elfblades of Myth Drannor were powerful swords with epic powers. In 2ed, the Crownblade had the power to make you a Elven High Mage. (Now it grants a +10 on Knowledge(Arcana) and Spellcraft.)
It's possible that the ancient elves could have build powerful swords to rival Moonblades. It's possible that these swords, along with other items, could have been lost. Plenty of things from Myth Drannor are missing and that was just a thousand years ago.
With the Weapon of Legacy it becomes easier to create weapons that increase in power with more users like the Moonblades. But when in doubt, just make it an Artifact. The Moonblades themselves are minor artifact. While there are more then one, they are not as common as +1 swords. Or even +6 swords. If tehre is just one of them, they can even be major artifacts.
Off point...
If the Starym Moonbalde is myth, I wonder if a member of the Victorous Blade of the People (Is that right?) might try to create a magical sword based on that myth as a rallying point? Or some other purpose? Perhaps minor "Starym" blades with Human and Half-elf bane properties? Might be an interesting plot hook in there somewhere. |
Ed Greenwood! The Solution... and Cause of all the Realms Problems! |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 14:58:03
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Well, I try the follow the generall lore of the moonblades because I respect the work what authors have writed and I want to try stick 'real as possible'. Anycase I recall that some moonblade was corrupted thanks Moander, the god of plaque by bringing the sword into ruins of Moander's temple in Cormanthor (do not recall the timeline but it was in Cormanthor section). Also name of the guy was mentioned but I do not recall it :P.
Ok, so I stick somewhat to the story what I had in mind, but I thank you for the replies and also I am glad that I could be some help :). |
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ElaineCunningham
Forgotten Realms Author
2396 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 15:19:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Foxhelm
Just because it can't use a moonblade doesn't mean that it can't be a powerful elven blade.
I couldn't agree more. A magical sword is a compelling fantasy trope, and creating a unique history for a sword can be a particularly enjoyable bit of worldbuilding.
Moonblades are a complicated and admittedly brutal version of King Arthur's Excaliber. They were intended to choose a king or queen. That is their intended function, period. No one who is NOT capable of ruling, no matter what their alignment or character might be, can wield a moonblade. There are very few active swords, and every wielder is considered a possible heir to Evermeet's throne, in the event that the Moonflower family should die out. Trust me, the elves keep track of the moonblades and their wielders. These swords have a very specific purpose, and the elves do not take kindly to the notion that they can be shoehorned into other uses.
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If the Starym Moonbalde is myth, I wonder if a member of the Victorous Blade of the People (Is that right?) might try to create a magical sword based on that myth as a rallying point? Or some other purpose? Perhaps minor "Starym" blades with Human and Half-elf bane properties?
It's an interesting theory.
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Might be an interesting plot hook in there somewhere.
A story that establishes the Starym Moonblade as a myth... Hmmm....
This is an intriguing notion. How about a cross-genre story, one that brings Jack Bauer to the Realms to "question" Volo about his sources?
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Edited by - ElaineCunningham on 08 Feb 2006 15:30:02 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 17:25:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Kazzaroth
Well, I try the follow the generall lore of the moonblades because I respect the work what authors have writed and I want to try stick 'real as possible'. Anycase I recall that some moonblade was corrupted thanks Moander, the god of plaque by bringing the sword into ruins of Moander's temple in Cormanthor (do not recall the timeline but it was in Cormanthor section). Also name of the guy was mentioned but I do not recall it :P.
Ok, so I stick somewhat to the story what I had in mind, but I thank you for the replies and also I am glad that I could be some help :).
From page 115 of Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (formerly a suppressed work  ):
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With the aid of Moander, god of corruption, Illitran secretly employed special magics to eliminate the character-test powers of the moonblade,causing them to become inactive in the instant after drawing the blade but before the sword could judge his character. The Starym moonblade's magic was altered to deliver a powerful electrical jolt to any wielder not of pure elven lineage, but to accept any pure-blooded elf wielder regardless of character.
The book is available for free on the Wizards downloads page.
I'm at work, so I don't have LEoF handy. However, I am of the opinion that a powerful deity could, if he/she chose, alter/corrupt a moonblade the way Moander corrupted the Starym moonblade. Other than that, I totally agree with what Elaine has already said. |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 08 Feb 2006 17:27:01 |
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Vangelor
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 19:20:34
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quote:
Originally posted by ElaineCunningham
No one who is NOT capable of ruling, no matter what their alignment or character might be, can wield a moonblade. There are very few active swords, and every wielder is considered a possible heir to Evermeet's throne, in the event that the Moonflower family should die out.
This really casts Arilyn, and half-elves, in a more thought-provoking light. As a moonfighter, she is a potential ruler (however little interest she may have in that role, and that disinterest seems to have been shared by Thasitalia, who weilded it at the time of the Kingblade's aclaim of Zaor Moonflower, and Arilyn's mother, Amnestria).
The idea that a half-elf might rule, in an age when elves are in their twilight, and must depend upon good relations with humanity (the dominant race of the age) makes a good deal of sense, but must be a bitter pill for the elves to swallow.
And I have to say that Amlaruil's reluctance to acknowledge her own grand-daughter and grant her the freedom of Evermeet (and damn the noble houses who object) really makes Amlauril much less sympathetic in my eyes. The blade proves Arylin's worth, as have her deeds. It would be nice to see the Queen of Evermeet finally acknowedge Arilyn, officially.
Call it a wish for the future novel(s).
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Edited by - Vangelor on 08 Feb 2006 19:23:25 |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 19:23:52
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Intresting, if another deity can corrupt a moonblade, can a demon lord lore based epic spell do same trick? Vyshaanti after all did not deal at all directly whit fiends overall but they taked alot lore and guidance from Malkizid. So if they had created so calledly a 'soulreaver' sword, which purpose was to drain soul of the wielders, would had gone even so far that it could drain/mimic some moonblade essence when it struck on the moonblade (henceworth shattering it) and then so calledly 'copy' some of it's powers while not being a moonblade.
The process would be a somewhat a agicall version how greater doppleganger asumes a identity, so that it is perfect all ways almost and the greater doppleganger cannot mimic the greater arcane spells and only minimal amount of divine spells whit not associated domains at all. At least this way I planned how the sword becomed to be in some point in it's history in the plot what I plan to run. I know it is agaisnt some basic lores of the moonblade, but if there is official source saying that a god can corrut a moonblade, then a sword imbued by powerfull epic fiendish sorcery could do the same and we do not speak even corrupting the exchisting moonblade but rather sword starts mimic it's ARCANE pattern by it's own potent power. The evil sword would be unable mimic any divine related abilities or the unic divine connection what moonblades have.
I just toughted that if the sword would mimic arcane pattern of the moonblade, then any arcane divine spell would say it is a moonblade while any divine divination wold reveal it is not. This would explain why the player's characther's family believes it is a moonblade.
Sorry for the rant, I quit now :P. Just typed what I myself thinked about the subject and it's posibillities. |
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Vangelor
Learned Scribe
USA
183 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 19:38:29
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| I'd again call attention to the fact that Volo is not a reliable source. Since moonblades are what they are - a device for assuring the best possible rulership for the elves - I would say that any other deity's tampering with one would attract the attention of the Seldarine, as it imperils all elves. I can't see Corellon ignoring this or letting it slide... |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 19:59:25
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| Well, Moander was banished from the Faerun more than once already and first time likely occured in Cormanthor and it is said that altough he is twinkling god, he still ahves a divine spark left so it is half-dead god. So Moander have received it's punishment but another god cannot undo what other god have doned, and even that case not directly but rather by hands one of Corellon's children and Corellon publicly saying a moon elf tainted a moonblade can be quite bitter thing to swallow and accept. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 20:15:17
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quote:
Originally posted by Vangelor
I'd again call attention to the fact that Volo is not a reliable source.
Yeah, but Elminster is. And the intro plainly states that Elminster went back behind Volo and fixed much of what the book contained.
Plus, Volo had nothing to do with LEoF. I'll have to check it for myself, but it's already been stated that that tome also says a moonblade can be corrupted.
quote:
Originally posted by Vangelor
Since moonblades are what they are - a device for assuring the best possible rulership for the elves - I would say that any other deity's tampering with one would attract the attention of the Seldarine, as it imperils all elves. I can't see Corellon ignoring this or letting it slide...
The blades were made by mortal hands. Unless Corellon was specifically and personally tracking each blade, 24/7, it could easily be corrupted without his knowledge. Besides, this is Moander we're talking about -- the deity that managed to corrupt another deity. If Tyche -- a major goddess! -- became corrupted without noticing, what's going to ping Corellon's attention to a single blade, one of many, made by one of his followers? |
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Kazzaroth
Learned Scribe
Finland
104 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 20:50:39
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| I agree that mortals do mistakes and blades were blessed by Corellon, COrellon had ordered them to be created but he did not himself do them. I think corrupted moonblade loses the divine spark what Corellon gives to them, so only the enchaments in the blade would remain and some characther picking ones would be corrupted. Also if we think about the universal rule about balance; Where is good there must be evil somewhere. So there could be a ONE corrupted moonblade (like there are corrupt and fallen paladins and even solars are not immune to this law so why would a mortal crafted item would be). |
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Kuje
Great Reader
USA
7915 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2006 : 23:22:12
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quote:
Originally posted by Vangelor
I'd again call attention to the fact that Volo is not a reliable source. Since moonblades are what they are - a device for assuring the best possible rulership for the elves - I would say that any other deity's tampering with one would attract the attention of the Seldarine, as it imperils all elves. I can't see Corellon ignoring this or letting it slide...
And as I said in the other thread, Cloak & Dagger also mentions this blade and Eric chimed in and he said that it was/is a moonblade. :) |
For some of us, books are as important as almost anything else on earth. What a miracle it is that out of these small, flat, rigid squares of paper unfolds world after world, worlds that sing to you, comfort and quiet and excite you... Books are full of the things that you don't get in real life - wonderful, lyrical language, for instance, right off the bat. - Anne Lamott, Bird by Bird
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 09 Feb 2006 : 00:06:55
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Lost Empires of Faerūn, page 128:
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523 Year of Trials Arcane
Younger members of the Starym clan return to Myth Drannor, claiming lordship of the clan and its moonblade. After a secret trek to Moander's ruined temple, Lord Illitran Starym corrupts the Starym moonblade and manages to wield it in a false show of loyalty to Myth Drannor.
Cloak & Dagger, page 62:
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The Starym Moonblade (CE longsword +3, +5 vs. humans and half-elves, Int 17, Ego 22): A weapon borne by the founding member of the Eldreth Veluuthra known as the Scourge, the Starym Moonblade is currently lost, but may yet attempt to return to the Eldreth as the embodiment of the Victorious Blade of the People. If so, it will dominate a member of the Vel'Nikelyma who is both a moon elf and a member of House Starym. Corrupted by the power of Moander, the Starym Moonblade can teleport without error itself and its current wielder, detect the direction and distance of gems and precious metals within 100 yards, expand its sentience and powers every time it is inherited by a full-blooded elven scion of House Starym, and create a mythal ghost that can utter a wail of the banshee once per day. Full details on this artifact may be found in Volo's Guide to All Things Magical (TSR #9535).
So, with no disrespect intended to anyone, I think the existence of the Starym moonblade must be accepted as established, canonical Realmslore. You are certainly free to do as you will within your own campaign, but the blade does exist.
You know... It's not entirely out of the question that another blade could have been corrupted. What about one corrupted by a team of drow mages? They could give it to a drow who has been transformed into a moon elf, and let the "moonfighter" act as their agent within elven communities. Better, they could do something like what Kymil Nimesin did -- use their magic to twist the powers of the blade to their own purposes. First they find the blade, they alter it, and then they make sure it makes it back into moon elven hands...
Or what about a moonblade that has gained sentience, learned that a ruler of Evermeet has been selected, and thus refuses to be wielded? It'd be a bit tricky to work out, but it could be fun. Imagine the elven PC who finally recovers his family moonblade, lost 200 years previously... only to discover that it has its own agenda, and it has nothing to do with the would-be moonfighter! |
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Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 09 Feb 2006 00:08:33 |
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Questions for Elaine Cunningham
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