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Marco Volo
Learned Scribe
France
204 Posts |
 Posted - 07 Feb 2014 : 14:54:07
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Hi everyone !
I'd like to know if some of you have ever designed a Myrkul's avatar for D&D 3.5 and would like to share it ?
I could do it myself but it will take a lot of my free time so if anyone has done the work, I will appreciate the sharing.
Thanks, feel free to give some ideas too ;)
Volo (the third)
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hashimashadoo
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1152 Posts |
Posted - 07 Feb 2014 : 21:56:06
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| I know it's unimaginative but I always saw Myrkul's avatar as the Grim Reaper - a dread wraith with skeletal features armed with a scythe. |
When life turns it's back on you...sneak attack for extra damage.
Head admin of the FR wiki:
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/ |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 08 Feb 2014 : 20:39:20
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Myrkul‘s scythe-wielding priests could summon a Minor Death, which is indeed traditionally described as a scythe-wielding hooded skeletal “Grim Reaper“.
This appearance is typical of Charon from classical mythology, although I suspect his appearance was not as explicit and the “Grim Reaper“ is something of an innovation from early pastoral Christian peoples. Idols of the pagan Horned God (from parts of Germanic/Slavic/Scythian Europe down to the Middle East and Asia Minor) are also often depicted with a scythe and hooded cloak. |
[/Ayrik] |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1536 Posts |
Posted - 06 Mar 2014 : 16:05:15
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Myrkul's avatar was a four-armed gangrenous cadaver lich thing in black robes with a scythe.
I prefer to keep my avatars on par with 2e, so take it with a pinch of salt, but the half-statted most powerful avatar of Myrkul I have on my HD is a cleric 10, master of shrouds 10, necromancer 26, true necromancer 14, pale master 10.
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hashimashadoo
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1152 Posts |
Posted - 06 Mar 2014 : 16:11:00
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| That avatar is more powerful than most, if not all, of the 3e gods. |
When life turns it's back on you...sneak attack for extra damage.
Head admin of the FR wiki:
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/ |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1536 Posts |
Posted - 07 Mar 2014 : 05:38:05
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My gods tend to be beyond stats, and I use the templates provided in F&P for avatars, except I'm remaking them to better suit their portfolios, IMHO.
But Myrkul's avatar needs 5 HD shaved off anyway, to bring him in line with Bane (Paladin of Tyranny 35, Rogue 10, Oppressor 10, Warlord of Utterdark 10) and Bhaal (Fighter 10, Rogue 10, Assassin 25, Soulreaver 20). Myrkul's new avatar will be a Cleric 8, Necromancer 23, Master of Shrouds 10, Pale Master 10, True Necromancer 14. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 07 Mar 2014 : 06:19:58
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if you're going for some "throw in all the cliche' undead prestige classes" for the "avatar", then drop the cleric by 7, drop the necromancer level by a lot, and throw in a single level of dread necromancer and the ultimate magi prestige class for 10 levels and 5 levels of mystic theurge (using extra arcane spellcaster levels past 20 to beef up dread necromancer until its also at 20). Also, the 10 levels in master of shrouds don't help much at all except to continue rebuke undead ability.
so cleric 3, wizard (necromancer) 3, dread necro 1, true necromancer 14, mystic theurge 7, ultimate magi 10, pale master 10 (giving lvl 22 clerical casting, lvl 26 wizard casting, and lvl 20 dread necro casting). This would of course still be hugely powerful, effectively a level 48 character.... but less than the aforementioned lvl 70. Then comparing this to say other deities listed in Faiths and Pantheons (say Lathander whose combined levels are 45, Lolth whose combined levels are 40, Kossuth 40, Kelemvor 50, Ilmater 40) you'd really want to lessen it for the avatar of a dead power (though if Myrkul were ever to become a greater deity again, this would be an interesting build). Dropping the ultimate magi altogether would lessen the wizard casting to lvl 20 and the dread necro casting to 11 and make the "character" level of the deity 38, and since this is still powerful for a dead deity, you might consider dropping the whole dread necro and pale master pieces and possibly assigning an undead template to him since he's now a "dead" deity of death (this puts his deity level as equivalent to a 27th lvl character + LA for template). In the end, this becomes a simple theurge class (i.e. lvl 22 casting in each of cleric/wizard). Since an effectively "dead deity" shouldn't be able to manifest an avatar, this could be what characters might face. You may want to add on some additional limbs and some kind of effective touch attack (delivered by some kind of magical constructs similar to a spectral hand) to get around the issue of single spellcasting actions (and possibly an additional mouth to enable multiple spellcasting), and naturally any instance of facing Myrkul should include hordes of undead acting as a shield. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1536 Posts |
Posted - 07 Mar 2014 : 06:48:52
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Does he even need all that?
Thematically, Myrkul is heavily associated with incorporeal undead, and his avatar is meant to depict him at the height of his power. Pale Master is a nod to his avatar being a decrepit, rotting corpse in F&P. I'm also borrowing a lot of his powers from F&A and the Crown of Horns. Cleric because I can't see him as the hyper-focused dread necromancer, and because Charisma as his casting stat just rubs me wrong. If anyone has Ultimate Magus, it would be Mystra 2.
Mostly, he, Bane and Bhaal are meant to represent the holy trinity of tabletop gaming (warrior, thief, caster), so there's that.
I'd honestly give Kiaransalee Dread Necromancer levels.
In F&P, many deities get a gigantic boost from their free Outsider HD, but this means their class levels suffer. Any cleric of Lathander with 1/3 his god's HD is already a better spellcaster than his god. |
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Madpig
Learned Scribe
Finland
148 Posts |
Posted - 07 Mar 2014 : 07:59:59
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quote:
Originally posted by LordofBones
Does he even need all that?
In F&P, many deities get a gigantic boost from their free Outsider HD, but this means their class levels suffer. Any cleric of Lathander with 1/3 his god's HD is already a better spellcaster than his god.
This is rather interesting point. But we must remember that gods stats are not done using powerbuilds. And salient divine abilities and domainpowers make deities much more powerful than mortals.
Just thinking, has any FR deity Divine Splendor salient divine ability? Because that would end every debate could mortal best that deity. (For those that dont know, Divine Splendor instantly slays anything without divine rank. And that does not allow save.) |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1536 Posts |
Posted - 07 Mar 2014 : 08:12:24
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Something just doesn't feel right about building deities using templates. I think that every god's manifestation should be unique, like Shar's song and Bhaal's "your bones belong to us".
Anyone directly confronting a god without divine backing is just asking for trouble, I agree. |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 07 Mar 2014 : 22:44:45
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“Thematically, Myrkul is heavily associated with incorporeal undead“ ?
My understanding is that Myrkul was slain during the transition from 1E to 2E. If so, then “the height of his power“ would‘ve technically predated 2E, although retro-1E stats for Myrkul‘s priests were provided in 2E. Myrkul was a Greater Power of Death (and Undeath), Decay, and Bones. I would suggest that “thematically“ he be associated with disgustingly corporeal dead and undead: zombies, ghouls, liches, not ghosts, not spectres, etc.
Of course my understanding might be much outdated if Myrkul rose again in 3E ... |
[/Ayrik] |
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LordofBones
Master of Realmslore
1536 Posts |
Posted - 08 Mar 2014 : 05:15:11
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Myrkul's portfolio was the dead, wasting, decay, parasites, old age and the dusk, and his primary servants essentially amounted to wraiths with scythes.
I think Master of Shrounds and Pale Master both make sense; MoS refers to his dominion over the dead, while Pale Master is a nod to the fact that his avatar is a rotting corpse. |
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Marco Volo
Learned Scribe
France
204 Posts |
Posted - 18 Mar 2014 : 07:12:23
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Thank you all for those replies !  |
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The Arcanamach
Master of Realmslore
1847 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2014 : 16:51:09
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quote:
so cleric 3, wizard (necromancer) 3, dread necro 1, true necromancer 14, mystic theurge 7, ultimate magi 10, pale master 10 (giving lvl 22 clerical casting, lvl 26 wizard casting, and lvl 20 dread necro casting). This would of course still be hugely powerful, effectively a level 48 character.... but less than the aforementioned lvl 70. Then comparing this to say other deities listed in Faiths and Pantheons (say Lathander whose combined levels are 45, Lolth whose combined levels are 40, Kossuth 40, Kelemvor 50, Ilmater 40) you'd really want to lessen it for the avatar of a dead power (though if Myrkul were ever to become a greater deity again, this would be an interesting build). Dropping the ultimate magi altogether would lessen the wizard casting to lvl 20 and the dread necro casting to 11 and make the "character" level of the deity 38, and since this is still powerful for a dead deity, you might consider dropping the whole dread necro and pale master pieces and possibly assigning an undead template to him since he's now a "dead" deity of death (this puts his deity level as equivalent to a 27th lvl character + LA for template). In the end, this becomes a simple theurge class (i.e. lvl 22 casting in each of cleric/wizard). Since an effectively "dead deity" shouldn't be able to manifest an avatar, this could be what characters might face. You may want to add on some additional limbs and some kind of effective touch attack (delivered by some kind of magical constructs similar to a spectral hand) to get around the issue of single spellcasting actions (and possibly an additional mouth to enable multiple spellcasting), and naturally any instance of facing Myrkul should include hordes of undead acting as a shield.
Heh, this is why I'm no longer playing 3e...the class builds are just too complex and if you get a diehard powergamer on your hands they will do crazy builds.
To the OP. I know 'building' a deity is an interesting excerise but why bother? IMO, no DM should even bother bringing PCs against a deity anyway (unless they are a very minor deity...and then only sparingly if at all). I simply assume that avatar of a god is beyond any mortal to defeat (let along the deity themselves). |
I have a dream that one day, all game worlds will exist as one. |
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Myrkul's avatar
