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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
 Posted - 29 Jun 2013 : 18:32:25
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I was reading through Cormyr Royale in Dungeon 198 and noticed that in the year 1407: The year opens with rumors of a complete clearing
of the fabled Haunted Halls of Eveningstar. A dozen adventuring companies are wiped out in the year that follows, leading to a formal proclamation forbidding entry to the halls without an explicit warrant from the Crown.
I'm assuming something really nasty is now resident there. Was the reasoning for its closure ever explained? Just curious since my party of dwarves and gnomes is heading there now and since they been living in a hidden dwarf hold in the Storm Horns since the Devil Dragon war sealed them in, they haven't had contact with Cormyr.
Thinking I might have to have them arrested when they leave by Purple Dragons. Plan on having them setup a trade agreement in Eveningstar, but noone knows they're gonna need 4,000 gold for a weapons selling license.
Which also brings me to another question: Dwarven craftwork. I would imagine the Crown of Cormyr would want to buy all of that work for themselves? And maybe there would be nobles vying for it too? Or would those families disdain anything made by non-human hands?
And here's another question for scribes: Let's say the party of dwarves comes across a party of adventurers with nobles in them, and they are digging around in a dwarven tomb. Would they be smart enough to not do that? And what would the Crown say if the dwarves killed them all for their sacrilege as grave robbers?
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Edited by - Eilserus on 29 Jun 2013 18:37:38
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jun 2013 : 13:18:47
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Over the years, in threads both here and over at WotC, it has been surpmised (from numerous hints spread all over the place) that the Stormhorns Mountain chain is filled with 'buried secrets', One of those is the Haunted Halls, another is The Grotto.
I suspect that many of these 'deep secrets' (which may include at least one lost Giant city, and/or a dwarven city, etc) are connected by tunnels through the Underdark, and investigating any one entrance could you lead you to uncover secrets regarding the others.
So I guess what I am saying is that the crown wouldn't want adventures suddenly finding a 'back-door' to The Grotto (or anything else, for that matter). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 30 Jun 2013 : 20:08:22
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| whats the grotto??( Im going to feel real stupid for asking that) |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jul 2013 : 00:58:00
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quote:
Originally posted by sfdragon
whats the grotto??( Im going to feel real stupid for asking that)
I think Markustay means the "Crystal Grot", which is where the sapphire trove available to the Obarskyrs is located.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jul 2013 : 02:24:06
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quote:
Originally posted by Eilserus
I was reading through Cormyr Royale in Dungeon 198 and noticed that in the year 1407: The year opens with rumors of a complete clearing of the fabled Haunted Halls of Eveningstar. A dozen adventuring companies are wiped out in the year that follows, leading to a formal proclamation forbidding entry to the halls without an explicit warrant from the Crown.
I'm assuming something really nasty is now resident there. Was the reasoning for its closure ever explained?
Nope. This was intentionally left a mystery, to allow individual DMS (both pre-1407 and well into the Spellplague era) to occupy the Halls with whatever horrors they chose.
To clarify/expand what has already appeared in print: properly chartered adventuring companies are made fully aware of the prohibition on entering the Halls both at the time of their charter and at annual renewals, so there's no "pleading ignorance" on that one.
quote:
Just curious since my party of dwarves and gnomes is heading there now and since they been living in a hidden dwarf hold in the Storm Horns since the Devil Dragon war sealed them in, they haven't had contact with Cormyr.
Interesting. Just how long were they sealed off? If they're properly chartered, they're going to owe some back payments. If not, well, won't that be an interesting conversation?
quote:
Thinking I might have to have them arrested when they leave by Purple Dragons. Plan on having them setup a trade agreement in Eveningstar, but noone knows they're gonna need 4,000 gold for a weapons selling license.
A note: don't feel bound by the in-print numbers for these licenses (this number if from Volo's Guide to Cormyr, right?); use whatever number you need to be a significant expenditure. The local lord can always make things smoother (cheaper), more difficult, or add conditions to the grant. Simply having the money isn't enough to get a license.
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Which also brings me to another question: Dwarven craftwork. I would imagine the Crown of Cormyr would want to buy all of that work for themselves? And maybe there would be nobles vying for it too? Or would those families disdain anything made by non-human hands?
Dwarven does not always necessarily mean superior. However, with that said, the Crown's not much into monopolies of that sort. Certain dwarven crafts (especially armor and axes) might come into fashion, and be favored for a season or two by certain groups of nobles, who would certainly vie for the ability to call a certain smith "theirs," but those are individual transactions, not all-dwarf-smiths-are-better-than-any-human-we-can-find kind of things.
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And here's another question for scribes: Let's say the party of dwarves comes across a party of adventurers with nobles in them, and they are digging around in a dwarven tomb. Would they be smart enough to not do that? And what would the Crown say if the dwarves killed them all for their sacrilege as grave robbers?
No one gets to kill anyone for grave robbing inside of Cormyr unless it's Purple Dragons... unless the dwarves can produce proper title of ownership for the lands in question. The dwarves are likely to be in a bit of trouble... which, of course, they can avoid by slinking back into the mountains. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 01 Jul 2013 : 03:14:57
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
quote:
Originally posted by sfdragon
whats the grotto??( Im going to feel real stupid for asking that)
I think Markustay means the "Crystal Grot", which is where the sapphire trove available to the Obarskyrs is located.
-- George Krashos
Yeah, thats what I meant.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2013 : 06:11:07
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Q:
Interesting. Just how long were they sealed off? If they're properly chartered, they're going to owe some back payments. If not, well, won't that be an interesting conversation?
A:
We're starting in 1479 DR, so they've been shut off from the surface for a little over a century. After the war and the fall of the dwarven valley, the dwarves used deep and little traveled tunnels to trade with Ironfist Hold (the hidden dwarfhold mentioned by THO in the Storm Horns). This arrangement worked out somewhat well until orcs finally found and laid siege to the Deep Gates and cut off their only avenue of trade. They beat back the orcs, but their secret trade route was sundered and collapsed during the worst of the fighting.
I have this idea that the orc war happened something like 30 years ago and now this isolation has the clans at each others throats. Bickering, infighting, the forges are silent because they have no trade to conduct etc. The Deep King has his hands full keeping the Iron Council on track as they argue over how best to handle the situation, some voting for keeping with isolation and others to seek deeper trade routes or even try for the surface again.
And in come the PC's who the king secretly charges with carving a path through the orcs and other vile monsters in the ancient dwarven valley to restore trade with Cormyr.
I'm going to be using a modified Kingmaker type setting for this. As the PC's gain treasure and what not they'll be able to send some back to the halls and requisition soldiers to patrol the lands they've cleared and to help resettle old destroyed surface forts, mines, etc.
One thing I do want to do is stick some humans in the southern portion of this valley who have showed up in the last decade in Cormyr's frontier mountains. On Mike Schley's excellent Cormyr map, right at the spot labeled The Warm Waterfall I'm going to put a place called The Hidden Grottos, which is the old secret trade route through the mountain the dwarves carved and previously used (which a Cormyrean noble discovered). And of course this Cormyrean noble is going to be sponsoring contraband and other illegal caravans (slaves, stolen goods, etc) through the dwarven valley to Zhent contacts on the northern Stonelands side.
Q: No one gets to kill anyone for grave robbing inside of Cormyr unless it's Purple Dragons... unless the dwarves can produce proper title of ownership for the lands in question. The dwarves are likely to be in a bit of trouble... which, of course, they can avoid by slinking back into the mountains.
A: It would be on dwarven lands. Granted there's no telling if they would kill all the humans, but if they did, I was thinking it'd be a great way of stirring up the chamberpot so to speak, though I wouldn't want any of the PCs killed for it. Would the human grave robbers suffer any sort of penalty if the dwarves marched them down into Cormyr and turned them into the Purple Dragons, provided they had proof of course? |
Edited by - Eilserus on 02 Jul 2013 06:14:57 |
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Garen Thal
Master of Realmslore
USA
1105 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2013 : 06:43:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Eilserus
Q: No one gets to kill anyone for grave robbing inside of Cormyr unless it's Purple Dragons... unless the dwarves can produce proper title of ownership for the lands in question. The dwarves are likely to be in a bit of trouble... which, of course, they can avoid by slinking back into the mountains.
A: It would be on dwarven lands. Granted there's no telling if they would kill all the humans, but if they did, I was thinking it'd be a great way of stirring up the chamberpot so to speak, though I wouldn't want any of the PCs killed for it. Would the human grave robbers suffer any sort of penalty if the dwarves marched them down into Cormyr and turned them into the Purple Dragons, provided they had proof of course?
Oh, yes, but not death. Return of property, and direct recompense of some multiple (probably between three to five times) of the value of what the Crown believes was stolen. When you say "on dwarven lands," just remember that as far as Cormyr is concerned there are no "dwarven lands" in Cormyr, just as there are no "elven lands;" it's all Cormyr, and it's all Cormyrean. Unless the dwarves established--in the eyes of the Crown--title to the land in the past, at best they're arguing "this is where we bury our dead; they are not some ancient ruins to be dug up by bored nobles."
Cormyr's authorities would be more deferential to the nobles, because they are Cormyrean nobles operating in Cormyr. That's not to say that they're in the right, of course, but they do have the expectation that no one may kill them in Cormyr except in self-defense or on order of the Crown. |
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Eilserus
Master of Realmslore
USA
1446 Posts |
Posted - 02 Jul 2013 : 07:26:15
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quote:
Originally posted by Garen Thal
quote:
Originally posted by Eilserus
Q: No one gets to kill anyone for grave robbing inside of Cormyr unless it's Purple Dragons... unless the dwarves can produce proper title of ownership for the lands in question. The dwarves are likely to be in a bit of trouble... which, of course, they can avoid by slinking back into the mountains.
A: It would be on dwarven lands. Granted there's no telling if they would kill all the humans, but if they did, I was thinking it'd be a great way of stirring up the chamberpot so to speak, though I wouldn't want any of the PCs killed for it. Would the human grave robbers suffer any sort of penalty if the dwarves marched them down into Cormyr and turned them into the Purple Dragons, provided they had proof of course?
Oh, yes, but not death. Return of property, and direct recompense of some multiple (probably between three to five times) of the value of what the Crown believes was stolen. When you say "on dwarven lands," just remember that as far as Cormyr is concerned there are no "dwarven lands" in Cormyr, just as there are no "elven lands;" it's all Cormyr, and it's all Cormyrean. Unless the dwarves established--in the eyes of the Crown--title to the land in the past, at best they're arguing "this is where we bury our dead; they are not some ancient ruins to be dug up by bored nobles."
Cormyr's authorities would be more deferential to the nobles, because they are Cormyrean nobles operating in Cormyr. That's not to say that they're in the right, of course, but they do have the expectation that no one may kill them in Cormyr except in self-defense or on order of the Crown.
Awesome, thank you sir. :)
If I may pose a few more questions: How would the Crown view a dwarven settlement in the Storm Horns? Would they require some sort of tax on mines or an agreement?
Tethyamar was supposedly founded by dwarves who lived in the Storm Horns and I was thinking this dwarven hold would be one of the last dwindling remnants of that group, which means they've been there since at least -149 DR. Any suggestions on how to handle the sovereignty between the dwarves and the Crown?
I plan on sticking a relatively new and small human village up in this mountain valley and I imagine the dwarves would be squaring off against a legion of Purple Dragons if they decided to kick the humans out of "their" valley.
Does that independent dryad realm of Aloushe in the King's Forest, ruled by queen Radanathe have some similar agreement? Or is that more due to neither dryads or humans treading on each others toes and everybody saves face? |
Edited by - Eilserus on 02 Jul 2013 07:40:14 |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 12 Feb 2018 : 21:51:02
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So this thread is pretty old but I don't think my question warrents a new thread.
Did they [WotC] or someone homebrew a Revision of the Haunted Halls of Eveningstar for 3rd Edition? I'm running a Cormyr campaign set in 1372 DR and I'm thinking about converting the AD&D 2e adventure to 3.5 but if someone's already done the time, I'd just as easily use that instead. |
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The Masked Mage
Great Reader
USA
2420 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2018 : 02:45:21
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| Not that I know of. Though in those years we did have Ed novels about the Knights there. |
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4438 Posts |
Posted - 13 Feb 2018 : 13:47:56
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quote:
Originally posted by The Masked Mage
Not that I know of. Though in those years we did have Ed novels about the Knights there.
Yes, Knights of Myth Drannor I believe. I read the first one and started to read the second. |
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Haunted Halls of Eveningstar
