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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
 Posted - 15 May 2013 : 01:54:16
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Am now taking bets on 5e gods
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Aldrick
Senior Scribe
909 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 02:31:14
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Unless I'm mistaken, they're striving to make 5E edition neutral. The Realms storyline will still advance, but the source books will be workable for all editions. This is one of the main reasons behind the Sundering - to strive to make everything "compatible" again.
Thus, technically every FR deity could be "alive" or "potentially alive".
I'm 100% certain that we're going to see the return of Mask and Mystra at the very least in the canon storyline. |
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 02:39:16
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| Erick Scott mentioned Helm returning to life, too, I think. |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 02:50:17
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| Neutral? Going to live in a dragon lance moving timeline w |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 06:14:39
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How about not having gods at all? |
Every beginning has an end. |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 06:46:22
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| forgotten realms not having gods is like...roleplaying in eberron :X |
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Plaguescarred
Learned Scribe
Canada
190 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 07:26:13
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| Isn't Mystra returning, after the Rise of the Underdark events ? |
Yan
Playtester |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 07:58:34
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| Mystra has already returned. She came back officially in Elminter Enraged. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 14:51:04
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My take is that they are going to provide a list of deities, past, present, & future, and WE get to decide if those deities are active in OUR Realms.
Basically a hand-wave that "mortals do not know all the deeper secrets of the universe", and that although it is reported that some gods may be dead... take it all with a grain of salt.
So, yeah... no definitive info, except whatever powers make cameos in novels. Ao hits the reset button, and WE get to figure out what that means (for our home campaigns).
However, as long as novels are canon, I don't see that working. But whatever (unless the majority of books are about small, local matters, or set in the past... which I would actually prefer). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 15 May 2013 14:52:08 |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
12020 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 15:48:31
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| Leira's going to come back. I have it on a firm hunch based upon looking at my stool in the toilet this morning and comparing that against the coffee stains in my coffee cup. That and well, they should bring back both her and Mask. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3811 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 15:54:36
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| Mystra, Mask and Helm will probably be back (Mystra already is). I guess they're going to dismiss the rest of previously removed deities with something along the lines of ''do w/e you want with them in your campaign, don't expect to see new stuff about them published'' (which basically is their current status, lol). |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 15 May 2013 15:56:39 |
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Lord Bane
Senior Scribe
Germany
479 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 17:20:47
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| Before they bring Helm back, give us Eilistraee. The drow need more diversity in divine matters. I donīt need Helm, i think Torm does a decent job with his followers as the "pricks" of the good ones when you look at Elturgard. Oh and while we are at it, strip Cyric of his divine powers! |
The driving force in the multiverse is evil, for it forces good to act. |
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Sightless
Senior Scribe
USA
608 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 17:39:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Bane
As much as I like Helm, I strongly agree.
Before they bring Helm back, give us Eilistraee. The drow need more diversity in divine matters. I donīt need Helm, i think Torm does a decent job with his followers as the "pricks" of the good ones when you look at Elturgard. Oh and while we are at it, strip Cyric of his divine powers!
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We choose to live a lie, when we see with, & not through the eye.
Every decision, no matter the evidence, is a leap of faith; if it were not, then it wouldn't be a choice at all. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36877 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 17:44:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Bane
Before they bring Helm back, give us Eilistraee. The drow need more diversity in divine matters. I donīt need Helm, i think Torm does a decent job with his followers as the "pricks" of the good ones when you look at Elturgard. Oh and while we are at it, strip Cyric of his divine powers!
I'm inclined to agree. I couldn't care less about Helm, but I want the drow pantheon restored to its 2E/3E status. Having the drow be "All Lolth, all the time!" is just boring.
I actually want all deities restored to 2E/3E status. They've promised to bring back all the gods, but that's kind of vague considering everything that's been done, with divine deaths, consolidation/merging, etc. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Irennan
Great Reader
Italy
3811 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 18:11:54
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I don't mind Helm, so I'm fine with him being back (and he kinda deserves it, 'cause of the really stupid death they came up with for him). I'd be very happy if Eilistraee and Vhaeraun (both of whom got the short end of the stick too) were reintroduced into the Realms, but to me it looks like WotC took a very strong position against having them (or any other cool alternative for the drow) in the published setting (and this is truly a shame, but w/e..). As for the other deities, ''do what you want in your campaign'' (which is what everyone is already doing, btw) is their new motto, so I think that MarkusTay is right in saying that they'll probably be very vague about this matter (thus changing basically nothing).
Mystra, Mask and Helm are the ones I feel like betting on atm. |
Mathematics is the art of giving the same name to different things. |
Edited by - Irennan on 15 May 2013 18:18:07 |
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Matt James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
918 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 18:36:40
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| HELM! |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 18:41:36
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| From what am reading currently, it seems the golemn thingy from the cerulean circle may be made into a demi god. |
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 20:18:55
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Helm was boring I never saw the appeal other than to create non evil antagonists.
I doubt they'll name all the gods in print again, there are so many! Unless they release books about the deities again. |
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Mirtek
Senior Scribe
595 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 20:25:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Lord Bane
Oh and while we are at it, strip Cyric of his divine powers!
Since Denning is one of the sundering authors and Malik get's to star in his novel, I have no doubt that Cyric will make it through the Sundering just fine. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 21:12:29
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| I've heard rumors that they're all coming back, but the ones I'd really like to see are Eilistraee, Vhaeraun, and Mask. Aw, heck, just bring 'em all! They're a part of the Realms. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 21:21:46
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| Eilistraee, Helm,Mystra( praise the art she is back), Mask, yondala |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Mirtek
Senior Scribe
595 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 21:33:28
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quote:
Originally posted by sfdragon
Mystra( praise the art she is back)
Unfortunately the wrong one. Mystryl or Mystra the First were OK; but Midnight is wrong for this job. So terribly wrong.
We need a neutral deity of magic who is just as please by an evil mageocraty breeding innocent villagers as guinea pigs for uspeakable magical experiements than with enlightened wizards using their art for the betterment of all.
All of Elminster "I must save the realms / make a better place / etc." nonsense needs to be cut short immediately. His (and all of Mystra's chosen) job should be the conservation of magic without judgement on it's use or users |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 22:01:39
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| my opinion from when I read it, I took it as Mystra was complete as in one goddess formed from the essence of all of them. not midnight mystra.....of whom we all disliked |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 22:25:44
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I am not entirely against being permanently rid of interlopers (the known ones). If we get a Mulan pantheon, I would hope they do something creative with it this time out.
Tyr bored me, but I have grown awfully fond of the few Finnish powers we have. They are not nearly as jarring as those from the commonly well known pantheons (Norse, Egyptian, & Greek). Although I like to imagine that setting deities are all just aspects of archtypes, I also prefer gods to have world-specifc names (like how DL had Takhisis, NOT Tiamet). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 15 May 2013 22:26:46 |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 22:37:21
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OOOOHH I know
Lets bring Azuth Back
and send the 9 lords back from hence they came!!!! |
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MrHedgehog
Senior Scribe
688 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 22:40:23
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| I honestly barely associate Mielikki or Loviatar with real world mythology since I've only heard of them in D&D things. |
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silverwolfer
Senior Scribe
789 Posts |
Posted - 15 May 2013 : 22:50:36
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I don't think anyone brought them up as such Mr. H
What are you trying to say Sir? |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
12020 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2013 : 13:29:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Mirtek
quote:
Originally posted by sfdragon
Mystra( praise the art she is back)
Unfortunately the wrong one. Mystryl or Mystra the First were OK; but Midnight is wrong for this job. So terribly wrong.
We need a neutral deity of magic who is just as please by an evil mageocraty breeding innocent villagers as guinea pigs for uspeakable magical experiements than with enlightened wizards using their art for the betterment of all.
All of Elminster "I must save the realms / make a better place / etc." nonsense needs to be cut short immediately. His (and all of Mystra's chosen) job should be the conservation of magic without judgement on it's use or users
I saw nothing to show that this is Midnight (Mysta II) or the original Mystra I. We know that the original Mystra I was still around according to some short story or maybe it was in a novel (forget the reference, but she was some kind of tortured magical elemental). Hell, it could have been some amalgam of all the Mystra/Mystryl's reformed. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Venger
Learned Scribe
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2013 : 15:10:14
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If Tyr comes back hopefully it'll be in a diminished advisor role, like the one Jergal fills in relation to Kelemvor. I much prefer Torm to be the LG Greater God (My personal hope is for him to be the God of Duty, Honor, and Justice). I never much cared for Tyr. Aside from being incredibly boring, he was also an interloper deity (and a pretty well known one, too. Interlopers aren't bad so long as they're obscure, but Tyr isn't obscure. It certainly didn't help when the Realms lifted the whole Fenris story with him and applied it to Kezef). Torm, on the other hand, is a native and has had some more interesting development than Tyr, and his actions in the Time of Troubles as well as the Cyrinishad incident were pretty noteworthy. He's also the god who Bane hates the most, and going by the timeline, I think both Torm and Bane were mortal around the same time. Given their current enmity and the potential overlap during their mortal lives, I think there's a lot of possibility to be found in that relationship. And more can come from that if they're both Greater Gods than what you'd get out of it if Torm were still a Lesser God in service to Tyr. That doesn't say much about Bane when the god he hates the most is the sidekick for some other god.
Cyric can stand to lose some portfolios while still making room for Leira and Mask. All he really needs are Lies, Murder, and Strife. Deception and Illusion can revert back to Leira and Mask can claim Intrigue.
I really, really hope Myrkul and Bhaal come back, too. I want the Dead Three back in full force (Although naturally Myrkul wouldn't be God of the Dead). I've commented on this before, but I think that Myrkul and Lathander should both come back and split up the duties of a Sun God. Lathander as God of Dawn, Amaunator as God of the Midday Sun, and Myrkul as God of Dusk.
And while I'm not a huge fan of Midnight, I really hate that she's not coming back. The way she was killed off was disgusting, not to mention it came off like a Lifetime movie, with her stalker breaking into her house and killing her. I would've liked to have seen her come back to make Cyric pay for what he did, but sadly that won't happen. Instead Midnight's gone for good, and the last story told about her will have been about her being killed by her stalker. What a crappy end to her character. |
"Beware what you say when you speak of magic, wizard, or you shall see who has the greater power." |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2013 : 15:14:35
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I would prefer some sort of 'original version' Mystra... perhaps even Mystryl. Out of all the Avatar crisis characters-turned-gods, the only one I truly liked was Midnight, so maybe make her some sort of Hecate-like Exarch in 5e. I'd hate to loose her completely. Kelemvor is a snore-fest, and Cyric's an idiot - I can most definitely live without them.
On the other hand, as I said in my first post, I think we are going to get a pick-&-choose style of presentation, and thats just fine by me. I do use Kelemvor (as a 'judge of the dead'), and it makes more sense to give people more choices ('additive' lore vs subtractive).
quote:
Originally posted by MrHedgehog
I honestly barely associate Mielikki or Loviatar with real world mythology since I've only heard of them in D&D things.
Which I'd being willing to wager is how it is for 99% of the FR fans out there.
I only happen to know about them previously because I had the 1e (first print run) Deities & Demigods. It was one of my all-time favorite D&D sources (and I got a funny feeling it was one of Ed's favorites, too). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 16 May 2013 15:16:10 |
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Venger
Learned Scribe
USA
269 Posts |
Posted - 16 May 2013 : 15:57:36
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quote:
and Cyric's an idiot
There's that. I'm just glad the days of Cyric being the end-all and be-all god of evil are long over. It was ridiculous when you had Cyric subsume the powers of, what was it, FOUR gods?!? It's pretty messed up that they brought in Kelemvor as a god, resurrected Bane, and Cyric is still awash in godly portfolios. As I posted above, they could stand to prune a couple more off to make room for other gods without taking away from the essence of what kind of god Cyric is.
quote:
Which I'd being willing to wager is how it is for 99% of the FR fans out there.
Yeah, those're good uses of interloper deities, using unknown gods and/or gods from pantheons nobody's ever heard about (Finnish, Roman, Tuatha de Danann, etc). Tyr, however, people have heard about and he comes from one of the most recognizable pantheons in the real world. He's not on the same level as a Zeus, Hercules, or Thor, but he's definitely on the level right below them. I remember reading about him and Fenris in elementary school. It doesn't help that he's got such a prominent role. He's basically the principle LG god in the Realms. Speaking for myself at least, I'd prefer that role be filled by a native, not such an obvious interloper (Particularly one who doesn't exactly scream LG. I was playing Neverwinter Nights 2 the other day and I saw a statue of Tyr and his whole Viking getup looked so silly for a Lawful Good god). |
"Beware what you say when you speak of magic, wizard, or you shall see who has the greater power." |
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taking bets on 5e gods
