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Tyrant
Senior Scribe
USA
586 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Mar 2013 : 14:06:00
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I finished this book a few days ago. I liked the book. It may be among my favorite Drizzt books, then again my favorite thus far is The Pirate King so maybe I am in the minority. I will say that I agree that the end should've been just a bit more clear, but with the next book coming in just a few months I can live with it.
As for the end itself, I don't see the problem with Dhalia's reaction. She hasn't been mentally stable for a while. A few months getting closer to her son isn't going to magically make her sane, or at least not in that short amount of time. When Drizzt gave her a final rebuttal she reacted in the way she has taught herself to react to every other disappointment, with violence. She's a crazy, violent person, a fight like this was bound to happen when Drizzt finally got his act together and rejected her.
I was happy to see most of the bits with Entriri. I especially liked when he tried to explain to Dhalia that Drizzt grew up in what any sane person would equate to hell and managed to escape with his sanity and morals intact and that that is no small feat. I may be reading too much into it but to me that was showing that Entriri admires, or at least respects, that strength of character within Drizzt.
As for Drizzt, I have considered him a bland character for a while and I have mainly read for the other characters. These last few books have somewhat forced him to the front and this one forces him to finally decide where he stands with Dhalia. While I disagree with some of the reasons for his decision (Catti is dead and he will potentially live a few more centuries, for his own sake he needs to be open to other loves, even if he isn't open to this one in particular), I like that he finally chose a position and stuck with it. More importantly, and this is probably why I like the Pirate King, that choice had consequences showing that sometimes the right choice can lead to ruin and that the best intentions can lead to terrible results (that's more a comment on the Pirate King). If Drizzt is going to walk the righteous path, we need to see the downsides of that path for it to feel real and for him to come across as less of a Mary Sue.
Having said those things, I do feel that the bits with Vampwent and Errtu were tacked on. I have the feeling that this book had a different middle and end and changed after talk of the Sundering began. |
Peace is a lie, there is only passion. Through passion, I gain strength. Through strength, I gain power. Through power, I gain victory. Through victory, my chains are broken. The Force shall free me.
-The Sith Code
Teenage Sith zombies, Tulkh thought-how in the moons of Bogden had it all started? Every so often, the universe must just get bored and decide to really cut loose. -Star Wars: Red Harvest |
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Tanthalas
Senior Scribe
Portugal
508 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2013 : 20:32:02
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| One thing about the Errtu part that I found really lame was that he apparently confused Tiago with Drizzt. I found that very hard to believe. |
Sir Markham pointed out, drinking another brandy. "A chap who can point at you and say 'die' has the distinct advantage". |
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Euranna
Learned Scribe
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2013 : 20:37:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Tyrant
[I was happy to see most of the bits with Entriri. I especially liked when he tried to explain to Dhalia that Drizzt grew up in what any sane person would equate to hell and managed to escape with his sanity and morals intact and that that is no small feat. I may be reading too much into it but to me that was showing that Entriri admires, or at least respects, that strength of character within Drizzt.
I think Entreri has always respected Drizzt and in a way admired (I honestly cannot think of a better suited word) him and at times was even envious of him. Remember, Artemis was slowing down and Drizzt was still a youngling.
To be uber geek, it is like Goku and Vegeta in Dragon Ball Z. (Yes, I might have just confused people..I know. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 19 Mar 2013 : 21:18:24
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I love anime (though I mostly read manga), but I couldn't never get into DBZ. The artwork bothered me.
I am holding my breath for all things Sundering now. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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charger_ss24
Learned Scribe
USA
108 Posts |
Posted - 20 Mar 2013 : 00:25:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
quote:
Originally posted by Tyrant
[I was happy to see most of the bits with Entriri. I especially liked when he tried to explain to Dhalia that Drizzt grew up in what any sane person would equate to hell and managed to escape with his sanity and morals intact and that that is no small feat. I may be reading too much into it but to me that was showing that Entriri admires, or at least respects, that strength of character within Drizzt.
I think Entreri has always respected Drizzt and in a way admired (I honestly cannot think of a better suited word) him and at times was even envious of him.
Entreri stated as much in Charon's Claw:
"I have forever envied you, Drizzt Do'Urden," Entreri cried out quickly, knowing that he had but a heartbeat left. "Envied you, and not for your skill with your blades!" Chapter 25, pg. 332. |
Edited by - charger_ss24 on 20 Mar 2013 00:26:40 |
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piratebbbb
Acolyte
USA
8 Posts |
Posted - 21 Mar 2013 : 07:35:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
quote:
Originally posted by Tyrant
[I was happy to see most of the bits with Entriri. I especially liked when he tried to explain to Dhalia that Drizzt grew up in what any sane person would equate to hell and managed to escape with his sanity and morals intact and that that is no small feat. I may be reading too much into it but to me that was showing that Entriri admires, or at least respects, that strength of character within Drizzt.
I think Entreri has always respected Drizzt and in a way admired (I honestly cannot think of a better suited word) him and at times was even envious of him. Remember, Artemis was slowing down and Drizzt was still a youngling.
To be uber geek, it is like Goku and Vegeta in Dragon Ball Z. (Yes, I might have just confused people..I know.
Side note involving this quote. Drizzt/Entreri and Kakarot/Vegeta are my two favorite relationships of anything I've read, seen, or heard about. Hatred, murderous revenge, grudging admiration, respect, and finally something akin to friendship. I have not read the manga, but the anime Dragon Ball Z and the Salvatore's Drizzt series was my childhood. I'm glad to see someone else has seen the similarities. |
Edited by - piratebbbb on 21 Mar 2013 07:36:56 |
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Euranna
Learned Scribe
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - 22 Mar 2013 : 02:03:14
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quote:
Originally posted by piratebbbb
Side note involving this quote. Drizzt/Entreri and Kakarot/Vegeta are my two favorite relationships of anything I've read, seen, or heard about. Hatred, murderous revenge, grudging admiration, respect, and finally something akin to friendship. I have not read the manga, but the anime Dragon Ball Z and the Salvatore's Drizzt series was my childhood. I'm glad to see someone else has seen the similarities.
 I am glad someone else got it
@Corellondevote: me too. I am trying to decide if I want to pre-order the book from Amazon, or wait for the e-signing from RAS's website.
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 23 Mar 2013 : 04:23:25
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| I have already pre-ordered it from Amazon. I use that site all the time. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2013 : 19:16:18
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Well, my first reaction was a little confusion at the end. Not sure how he died or why he died. Or was this some sort of jesus thing where he ascended? But either way, this whole novel had the feeling that its direction was changed in the middle of writing. But that being said I did enjoy the novel. I think the knowledge that this became a set up novel for the Sundering made me be less critical and just enjoyed the ride.
Oddly enough, my favorite part of the whole novel was the sequence where Bob transitions the timeline from 1466 to 1484. It had a very poetic feel to it even though it was a hacky attempt to resolve the brewing gigantic conflict and bring Drizzt in line with the upcoming events.
But as far as Drizzt being dead? Come on people. This is fantasy fiction. Death is merely a mutable state of being in fantasy fiction. Except maybe in a George R. R. Martin novel. |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 26 Mar 2013 : 22:59:02
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| Which is one of the reasons I've been hesitant to read his novels. He kills off characters all the time, I've heard. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 01:01:17
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Maybe instead of asking, "Is he; isn't he?" readers would get more out of the book by asking, "How does Drizzt feel about it?"
Did the ending, or anything else in the book, signal a change in Drizzt's personality versus what he's been demonstrating in the rest of "The Neverwinter Saga"? |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
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Euranna
Learned Scribe
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 01:25:23
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quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
Maybe instead of asking, "Is he; isn't he?" readers would get more out of the book by asking, "How does Drizzt feel about it?"
Did the ending, or anything else in the book, signal a change in Drizzt's personality versus wat he's been demonstrating in the rest of "The Neverwinter Saga"?
I think he started to "wake up" and begin to "think clearly".
Starting to at least. |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3567 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 02:13:04
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quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Which is one of the reasons I've been hesitant to read his novels. He kills off characters all the time, I've heard.
i got over that with Martin, what keeps me away now is his apparent inability to get the series wrapped up |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Lilianviaten
Senior Scribe
489 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 03:32:40
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quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Which is one of the reasons I've been hesitant to read his novels. He kills off characters all the time, I've heard.
To me, that's the beauty of his work. Nobody is "safe". Sure we all have our favorite characters that we want to have a happy ending, but there is something to be said for the element of surprise. I'm a big fan of mystery/suspense films and novels, so I love being kept on my toes. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36968 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 03:41:04
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quote:
Originally posted by BEAST
Maybe instead of asking, "Is he; isn't he?" readers would get more out of the book by asking, "How does Drizzt feel about it?"
If he's dead, asking how he feels about it is kind of a moot point!  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36968 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 03:44:06
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quote:
Originally posted by CorellonsDevout
Which is one of the reasons I've been hesitant to read his novels. He kills off characters all the time, I've heard.
Most of them he doesn't just kill off, he makes you want to hurt someone for the way the character died. Good books, but rather much more than I'm used to. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 27 Mar 2013 : 07:15:56
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I think the thing that has frustrated me with the way Bob writes Drizzt is that he still writes him as if he is emotionally immature and hasn't yet found his big boy pants. All the talk of Drizzt learning to handle his long Elvin life and yet here at 200 yo he is still struggling with it. I thought all of the introspection and dealing with inner demons was finally going to lead to him accepting the loss of his prior family and loved ones and move on rejuvenated. But at the end he makes a 180 saying that he will never get over her. His "death" to me seemed like Drizzt giving into his grief and Mielikki taking pity on him and ascending him to the heavens.
But again, I'm sure that this all plays a part in the over-arching story. So I'll roll with it. |
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Euranna
Learned Scribe
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 03:02:03
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RAS posted on a similiar thread on his forum just a bit ago. He stated that the pro/epilogue take place before The Last Threshold. This ends that possibility.
I can post a link to the post if anyone wants to see it.
Is it August yet? |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 07:15:14
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quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
RAS posted on a similiar thread on his forum just a bit ago. He stated that the pro/epilogue take place before The Last Threshold. This ends that possibility.
I can post a link to the post if anyone wants to see it.
Is it August yet?
I'm not sure I'm following that. Could you provide a link? |
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BEAST
Master of Realmslore
USA
1714 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 11:50:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Caolin
quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
RAS posted on a similiar thread on his forum just a bit ago. He stated that the pro/epilogue take place before The Last Threshold. This ends that possibility.
I can post a link to the post if anyone wants to see it.
Is it August yet?
I'm not sure I'm following that. Could you provide a link?
<Here> ya go:
quote:
Originally posted by RASalvatore
[...]
Oh, and PS., just to clear something up. Nowhere in The Orc King prelude and epilogue is a date actually given. I know, I know, I said 100 years or "a century" a couple of times, and I admit that I had to do some retconning here because of the unexpectedly FAST Realms changes. Drizzt's visit to the Silver Marches predates The Last Threshold - it's mentioned going forward in upcoming books. Sometimes when you play in a shared world, you have to make allowances, which is why I try to be as vague as possible, as often as possible!
If we allow for the fact that the two era change time jumps kinda threw a wrench in the works, this formulation ought to work out. Perhaps Drizzt took his trip to the Silver Marches some time during the ten-year time jump in Gauntlgrym, after the eruption? He had just parted ways with Bruenor in 1452 DR when the volcano went off. He was riding solo (well, with Guen), at that point. |
"'You don't know my history,' he said dryly."
--Drizzt Do'Urden (The Pirate King, Part 1: Chapter 2)
<"Comprehensive Chronology of R.A. Salvatore Forgotten Realms Works"> |
Edited by - BEAST on 28 Mar 2013 11:54:28 |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 17:31:13
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| Oh, so he was talking about the prelude and epilogue of the Orc King. Maybe I jumped into an ongoing conversation that I wasn't aware of. lol |
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Euranna
Learned Scribe
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 18:49:32
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Thank you Beast. I agree. I think that is avery likely timeframe.
I still hold that I wished it was Aug. The more I think about the Neverwinter series, their is some interesting possibilities going on. But, I still cannot wait to see what happens in The Companions. I have my hopes and my "concerns", but I think it will be epically awesome regardless. 
Caolin, we have been trying to figure out when the pro/epilogues fit in to the whole story, especially considering the end of TLT. |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 20:20:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
Thank you Beast. I agree. I think that is avery likely timeframe.
I still hold that I wished it was Aug. The more I think about the Neverwinter series, their is some interesting possibilities going on. But, I still cannot wait to see what happens in The Companions. I have my hopes and my "concerns", but I think it will be epically awesome regardless.
Caolin, we have been trying to figure out when the pro/epilogues fit in to the whole story, especially considering the end of TLT.
Are you talking about Drizzt's journal entries? Or the pro/epilogues from the Last Threshold? |
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Madpig
Learned Scribe
Finland
148 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 21:36:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Caolin
quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
Thank you Beast. I agree. I think that is avery likely timeframe.
I still hold that I wished it was Aug. The more I think about the Neverwinter series, their is some interesting possibilities going on. But, I still cannot wait to see what happens in The Companions. I have my hopes and my "concerns", but I think it will be epically awesome regardless.
Caolin, we have been trying to figure out when the pro/epilogues fit in to the whole story, especially considering the end of TLT.
Are you talking about Drizzt's journal entries? Or the pro/epilogues from the Last Threshold?
Actually they were talking pro- and epilogue of Orc King. |
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Caolin
Senior Scribe
769 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 21:51:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Madpig
quote:
Originally posted by Caolin
quote:
Originally posted by Euranna
Thank you Beast. I agree. I think that is avery likely timeframe.
I still hold that I wished it was Aug. The more I think about the Neverwinter series, their is some interesting possibilities going on. But, I still cannot wait to see what happens in The Companions. I have my hopes and my "concerns", but I think it will be epically awesome regardless.
Caolin, we have been trying to figure out when the pro/epilogues fit in to the whole story, especially considering the end of TLT.
Are you talking about Drizzt's journal entries? Or the pro/epilogues from the Last Threshold?
Actually they were talking pro- and epilogue of Orc King.
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 22:53:05
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| I just read on a post by RAS on his site that the pro/epilogue in TOK predates TLT. He admits he had to do some retcoing because of the sudden changes in the Realms. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Euranna
Learned Scribe
USA
219 Posts |
Posted - 28 Mar 2013 : 23:34:01
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That is the post I mentioned before. He regrets not going to that island. LOL
I read an interview this morning that said ".....The Companions. The only thing I can say about that book is that, for me, it's the payoff of 25 years with this character I hold so dear"
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2013 : 03:17:58
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| Oh lol, well I just saw the post today. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Gyor
Master of Realmslore
1632 Posts |
Posted - 29 Mar 2013 : 21:20:54
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| The Sundering Series sounds seriously epic, I can wait. |
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Count Roland
Acolyte
9 Posts |
Posted - 08 Apr 2013 : 12:35:46
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Hey guys read the comics so I are why the batylerahet toe in was done...wow never pictu EF it but dahalia looks like a complete freak ... I guess I elvayef her wosd and braid thing with my idea of her lust worthy beauty that made goody dritzzx compromise like that...t worked with thelast nine or so men she sexed and slayed.....
Sorrry on crazy deviece mobile so pardons on strange wrong gram,mated respelled werds
Spoiler on Ryld Argith .... war of the spider queen book below....
As to Rtld Argith my favorite Draw of all time .... reminds me of me when I was a stealth high level fighter in the USMC yeah I would be happy to see go to the planes and rescue him ad he ascends to goody godhood ala Elminnnister the overpowered chosen of ownaggeness!.... but I do not see that happening |
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The Last Threshold (Spoilers BeWare)
