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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
 Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 00:47:16
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When did this happen?
I know it was in 1385 DR, but what date? I certainly don't think it was the very first day of the year (not that it can't be... thats just too 'tidy').
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"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Diffan
Great Reader
USA
4441 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 02:22:43
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Probably around Nightal I'd assume. WotC has a penchant for dismissing employees just before the Yuletide season  
Jokes aside, I'm not entirely sure. It's not mentioned, specifically, which month or day in the FRCG and I don't have my GHotR book handy at the moment. |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 03:06:47
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IIRC the date was given in Book 2 of the Thay series. 15 Marpenoth. Dennis probably knows... |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
Edited by - Brimstone on 19 Dec 2012 03:07:39 |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 03:12:32
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Its not in the GHotR (which I found odd - just that it happened that year).
Hopefully someone who has the Thay series will be along with an answer - thanks guys. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 19 Dec 2012 03:12:53 |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 03:30:38
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| Looking thru my copy it happened sometime between 16-29 Tarsakh. Those are the dates given for that chapter. I am assuming more towards 29 Tarsakh. Which now sounds about right. Richard Lee Byers might be able to answer this question better. |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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Brian R. James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
1098 Posts |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 12:54:39
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quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
IIRC the date was given in Book 2 of the Thay series. 15 Marpenoth. Dennis probably knows...
Hehe. You and Brian beat me to it. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 14:43:40
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Ah, okay, so it happened toward the end of the first third of the year... gotcha. plenty of time for... things.
Thanks guys.  |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 19 Dec 2012 : 16:25:27
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I thought you loathe the Spellplague? Why the recent interest in it? Has something changed? |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 20 Dec 2012 : 01:00:28
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5e.
The Spellplague happened. Now I need to know what else could have happened (so I can tweak things the way I want). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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thenightgaunt
Acolyte
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - 05 May 2013 : 23:55:27
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It's an interesting concept. Not the spellplague, I think that was a rather dumb marketing attempt. No I mean undoing the event. It's the most cataclysmic event since Karsus' Folly and the most destructive in the setting's history.
The question that pops up though is why wouldn't anyone try to stop/undo it? Take chronomancers for example. They could easily pass back in time to the point before it was going to happen and set up attempts to try to stop it (I ran a campaign about just that last year).
And if undone, what would happen to the timeline of the realms? |
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Lord Bane
Senior Scribe
Germany
479 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 08:53:37
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I think you would open a can of worms with that. If you go chronomancing and changing events in the past you change the whole future with all it´s fallout that comes with it. Chronomancy is a dangerous thing and can lead to even greater damage than the one you tried to prevent.
From a company stanpoint i don´t see such an approach as it would mean every event ever done can be reverse and then you have people wanting to prevent the Time of Troubles, others want to stop the shades from returning and a third might wish to paint someone a funny face while he is asleep somewhere. The idea at first is interesting, the outcome though is what should keep people at distance from it. |
The driving force in the multiverse is evil, for it forces good to act. |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 12:54:46
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With the death of Mystra (who regulated time travel/chronomancy), it’s possible that chronomancy itself stopped as well, or, if attempted, would have led to catastrophic ends, not only to the caster, but to those around him as well.
Even with the return of Mystra, it’s still not a guarantee that undoing or fixing the past by going to the past would have solved the problems in the present. It could worsen them. Not FR, but I believe Pug (or was it Macros the Black?) once explained (when they both did time travel in the City of Forever) the danger of visiting the past and changing things from it to “fix” the present. Besides, where’s the fun if one or two people can change and fix things so easily? One crucial element of a good fiction (fantasy, especially) is how a conflict is presented and how the solutions are achieved. A problem that can be solved in a blink of an eye is, to put simply, quite boring. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11830 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 15:44:40
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| One strong defining thing of the chronomancy campaign is that "time tries to repair itself such that the definining end still happens". So, lets say SOMEHOW the players go back and stop Cyric. Well, then perhaps Mask, or Shar, or Velsharoon, or Leira works to destroy Mystra (because TIME can extend backwards and simply correct actions to bring Leira back to life or even make her death an illusion). In the end, the chronomancers could go back to the future and find things essentially the same (Mystra died, the worlds merged, etc....). |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 16:07:53
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So, it is like fixing something that cannot be fixed, changing something that cannot be changed, preventing something that cannot be prevented? In short, useless? |
Every beginning has an end. |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11830 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2013 : 20:54:13
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| not necessarily. For instance, one of the defining characteristics that I had for Sleyvas was that his life was modified when his wife died at the hands of a paladin. It was then that he turned to magic to seek his revenge. Years later, he'd studied time magic and he found an object which could send someone back in time (I think that's how he did it, its been like 12-15 years since I wrote it up). He wasn't a chronomancer, but he'd read enough of chronomancy theory in the lore he'd discovered that he thought of time as a sentient beast that you'd have to trick to make nothing change. So, he sent someone else back in the past to fake the death of his wife, so that Sleyvas himself in the past would still think that his wife had died. That person then pulled the wife from the timestream and brought her to the future. Once she was in the future, Sleyvas had his wife again. Ultimately, his enemies turned on him and planned to use his wife as a hostage against him. Ultimately Sleyvas saw this as time working against him to make her die because she and he were not meant to be together again (or that's what he told himself). For her safety, he decided that he would put her fate in the hands of a chosen of the goddess of Time (i.e. Elminster), and he negotiated his service to Elminster against the red wizards of Thay if Elminster would hide his wife and keep her safe even from him. There was a bunch of other stuff that happened (including Sleyvas being labeled a traitor to Thay), but that was the gist. Ultimately, he was still alone, but at least he knew that she was alive and he could forgive himself. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 08 May 2013 : 15:26:25
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| Mystra is the Jean Grey of the Realms. Kill her and watch her come back badder than ever... |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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xaeyruudh
Master of Realmslore
USA
1853 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2013 : 06:42:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Mystra is the Jean Grey of the Realms. Kill her and watch her come back badder than ever...
Signature-worthy. |
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lordsknight185
Learned Scribe
USA
102 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2013 : 06:58:30
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Wibbly Wobbly Timey Wimey...
I like to think of time travel more-so like Dragonball did it (I'm sorry, i'm sure noone understands that)
But anyway the "canon" timeline is set in stone, but if a chronomancer did go in time and undid the spellplague, it would not change the Canon timeline, it would simple create a second alternate-reality time line that simply plays differently then the prime Canon timeline (I like to imagine every home-campaign as separate alternate realities, this way noones home realms is "wrong" they are all simply alternate derivatives of the prime timeline) |
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Joebing
Learned Scribe
USA
202 Posts |
Posted - 09 Jun 2013 : 13:28:55
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quote:
Originally posted by lordsknight185
(I like to imagine every home-campaign as separate alternate realities, this way noones home realms is "wrong" they are all simply alternate derivatives of the prime timeline)
I think the same way, I am sure many of us do. My campaign is still running in 1372, but Menzoberranzan is controlled by worshippers of Kiaranselee, who took control when Lolth fell silent. I have already planned to avoid both Kiaranselee's death and Mystra's death, as well as the Spellplague; I just held simultaneous campaigns to build up some epic characters who could prevent these from occurring. Now my timeline is starting to move forward. Any Spellplague-related canon is ignored in my house. |
Now plugging away on mass conversion to 5e, as well as my imprint J. Halk Games.
http://www.facebook.com/JHalkGames
First adventure on DM Guild: Lair of Elaacrimalicros |
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hashimashadoo
Master of Realmslore
United Kingdom
1152 Posts |
Posted - 12 Jun 2013 : 11:31:52
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quote:
Originally posted by lordsknight185
But anyway the "canon" timeline is set in stone, but if a chronomancer did go in time and undid the spellplague, it would not change the Canon timeline, it would simple create a second alternate-reality time line that simply plays differently then the prime Canon timeline.
I've been wondering about this...
With Mystra's death and the destruction of the Weave, would chronomancy still be possible?
Mystra always made sure that chronomancers wouldn't be able to change past events to affect the future but if chronomancy does exist post-spellplague, would those 'fixes' to the timeline still be made without her influence or COULD you mess with the Realms' history? Would a past version of Mystra prevent you from making changes even if your point of origin was after her death? |
When life turns it's back on you...sneak attack for extra damage.
Head admin of the FR wiki:
https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/ |
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Dennis
Great Reader
9933 Posts |
Posted - 13 Jun 2013 : 11:39:57
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I think it was stated somewhere that it was ultimately Ao, not Mystra, who restricts chronomancy, or at least some aspects of it, because of the possible disastrous effects it entails. |
Every beginning has an end. |
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Veritas
Learned Scribe
209 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2013 : 02:53:19
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| I think its worth noting that Ed Greenwood himself suggested chronomancy may be restricted by Ao himself in the 2013 Ask Ed Greenwood scroll (sometime around early January). |
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jerrod
Learned Scribe
157 Posts |
Posted - 09 Aug 2013 : 04:32:27
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| Even with mystra dead labelas would still be there to defend the continuum from tampering.his cleric watch out for that type of meddling.or else some enemy of the elves would cause them to go through what the leshey suffered. |
I haven't been here in years but I used to be DARKFLAME MILLITHOR(DROW ARCHMAGE of wildmagic |
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Learned Scribe
Acolyte
35 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2013 : 06:25:27
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
5e.
The Spellplague happened. Now I need to know what else could have happened (so I can tweak things the way I want).
Lookee' there! It only to Markster five years to catch on! |
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D-brane
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
140 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2013 : 06:37:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Learned Scribe
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
5e.
The Spellplague happened. Now I need to know what else could have happened (so I can tweak things the way I want).
Lookee' there! It only to Markster five years to catch on!
We can all only hope it will take you a far shorter time to realise that your disruptive ways contribute nothing to worthwhile discussions here, and that your presence really is nothing more than an annoying distraction. |
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence." |
Edited by - D-brane on 10 Aug 2013 06:38:21 |
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Learned Scribe
Acolyte
35 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2013 : 06:56:20
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Maybe you could post something besides a responses to me, D-Turd!
Lmao!
quote:
Originally posted by D-brane
quote:
Originally posted by Learned Scribe
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
5e.
The Spellplague happened. Now I need to know what else could have happened (so I can tweak things the way I want).
Lookee' there! It only to Markster five years to catch on!
We can all only hope it will take you a far shorter time to realise that your disruptive ways contribute nothing to worthwhile discussions here, and that your presence really is nothing more than an annoying distraction.
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D-brane
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
140 Posts |
Posted - 10 Aug 2013 : 06:58:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Learned Scribe
Maybe you could post something besides a responses to me, D-Turd!
Lmao!
quote:
Originally posted by D-brane
quote:
Originally posted by Learned Scribe
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
5e.
The Spellplague happened. Now I need to know what else could have happened (so I can tweak things the way I want).
Lookee' there! It only to Markster five years to catch on!
We can all only hope it will take you a far shorter time to realise that your disruptive ways contribute nothing to worthwhile discussions here, and that your presence really is nothing more than an annoying distraction.
When you post something that positively contributes to a discussion, rather than just pointless drivel, I will. |
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence." |
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thenightgaunt
Acolyte
USA
41 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2013 : 19:58:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Veritas
I think its worth noting that Ed Greenwood himself suggested chronomancy may be restricted by Ao himself in the 2013 Ask Ed Greenwood scroll (sometime around early January).
Which is an interesting question and I wonder what the consensus would be on it. What would AO's opinion of the Spellplague be? Would he/it care? Its gods fighting gods which tends to be where AO gets involved, and the direct result of Mystra's death was the utter disruption of the whole system. Is there a thread on this topic already up?
As for Chronomancy, the god issue can be gotten around by moving laterally. A chronomance can move to other time streams/timelines/alternate realities/whatever. Find one that fits the right criteria and drag what you need back and forth between the two. All takes is time, knowledge and power. Time it right and either AO or Mystra will be too distracted to stop you. It was a VERY easily abusable supplement when you got down to it. |
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Spellplague/Death of Mystra
