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Aryalómë
Senior Scribe
USA
666 Posts |
 Posted - 07 Dec 2012 : 00:11:42
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I've been toying with Pathguy's Dragon PC generator and found that I don't know a whole lot about dragons in FR of D&D. I attempted to create a Faerie Dragon PC, but when it came to fluff, I was at a loss.
So, what lore can be said about Faerie Dragons? I've been searching extensively for them and have mostly just come up with monster write ups and those things in the various monster books.
My main questions:
-Which language do Faerie Dragons speak? Sylvan or Draconic?
-Assuming they can take humanoid shape, are they able to grow bigger? That is, into a medium sized faerie or elf type? My Faerie Dragon PC is the size of a large-ish dog, so I was wondering (and hope) that I could change into a medium sized humanoid.
-What prestige classes would work with them?
-Are there any organizations that they frequent? Any settlements they are near (like Evermeet or other Fey or Elvish settlements?)?
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Entromancer
Senior Scribe
USA
388 Posts |
Posted - 07 Dec 2012 : 00:45:51
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| In Richard Lee Byers' Year of Rogue Dragons trilogy, there was an avariel bladesinger that partnered with a faerie dragon. |
"...the will is everything. The will to act."--Ra's Al Ghul
"Suffering builds character."--Talia Al Ghul |
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Ayunken-vanzan
Senior Scribe
Germany
657 Posts |
Posted - 07 Dec 2012 : 06:00:20
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| Faerie Dragons are not natural shape changers like other dragons. If they would take another form, they would have to resort to polymorph spells. |
"What mattered our lives now? When our world had been torn from us? Folk wept, or drank, or stood staring out over the land, wondering what new horror each dawn would bring."
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"Anyone can kill deities, cause plagues, or destroy organizations. It takes real skill to make them live on."
Varl
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 07 Dec 2012 : 13:53:37
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From Planewalker.com:
quote:
NATHAIR SGIATHACH
The Floating Jester, The Snitch
Intermediate Power
Symbol: A rainbow with jagged edgesPlane/Layer/Realm: Faerie/wanders
Alignment: Chaotic Good
Portfolio: Mischief, games of chance
Domains: Chaos, Fey, Good, Luck, Scalykind
Favored Weapon: Claw (punch dagger)
Known Proxies: Ko, CG quasi-power (female fairy dragon) Sor 17
The Jester of the Faerie Court, Nathair Sgiathach is a creature of many forms. Each day he assumes a different form, although not to disguise himself (the courtiers recognize him easily), but simply to enjoy the new feeling - he claims never to have taken the same shape twice in a single millennia. Nathair is Titania's jester, amusing her by playing simple yet hardly predictable practical jokes on mortal visitors. He is fairly careful when it comes to offending a member of the court, although he can count on the Queen's protection. When in the Unseelie Court, Nathair's pranks have a vicious sadistic streak, and little else would suffice, of course. He and Oberon have little love for each other. Nathair Sgiathach is also the protector of the various dragons of Faerie, and enjoys secretly meddling in their affairs. Whether or not he is actually worshiped by these dragons is unknown, but as said before, the nature and practices of fey powers often differs from those of the "standard" deities.
I assume most fairy dragons speak both draconic and sylvan (they usually are quite bright creatures). Most would learn to speak sylvan first, as that would be the most prevalent and useful language in faerie dragon habitats. I think the parents pride and spellcasting would provide the reason why faerie wyrmlings quickly learn to speak draconic aswell.
As the fey power Nathair above shows, most faerie dragons love spells that alter the shape or colors of their bodies. For them to change into a medium elf they need only to cast the second level spell alter self, and changing the color of their scales requires a mere cantrip. So most faerie dragons that opt to advance a bit of their natural spellcasting ability with a level in sorcerer can start experimenting moving about in elf form for a about an hour per casting.
All spellcasting related PrC's are viable and desirable for faerie dragon (N)PCs. Some examples (with source):
Spelldancer, Mystic Wanderer (Magic of Faerun), Hidecarved Dragon, Dragonsong Lyrist, Dragon Ascendant (Draconomicom), Master of Many Forms, Fochlucan Lyrist (Complete Adventurer), Exalted Arcanist (Book of Exalted Deeds), Frost Mage (Frostburn) and Wyrm Wizard (Dragon Magic).
As most Fey do Faerie Dragons fear and loath most settlements. They are very quick learners though, so you could find exeptionally curious ones in a city such as Waterdeep on a bright and shiny day. Most would dwell near their lair in a glade that holds a path to faerie (albeit a faerie road starting at a toadstool ring, a seasonal portal such as a lake teeming with life, or a mystical connection of planar origin in a mountain forrest).
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My campaign sketches
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Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 07 Dec 2012 : 17:46:16
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Newt was a faerie dragon in the original Moonshaes trilogy.
Faerie Dragons were numerous in Myrloch Vale
"Faerie dragons were numerous in the vale and buzzed about like bees among the wild flowers and woods." |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2012 : 00:23:46
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Ah!! Finally one of my favorite draconic types gets some love! I used to use these critters fairly frequently in my games, to the mixed feelings of my players. On one hand, everyone loved finding out just what kind of pranks they were apt to pull next, and on the other hand, those pranks were often directed at them, so they sometimes got a little bit annoyed... I blame my own fey side.
On the topic at hand- two things:
1. Bladewind, a fairy dragon would need a more powerful spell than Alter Self to change into a medium-sized ANYTHING, as the spell only allows for small changes in size or shape. He/She would need to use a Polymorph spell for what you suggested.
2. As for the YoRD series, yes, there was indeed a fairie dragon in that series, named Jivex, and in fact, he helped take down a pair of greens in one of the books! Small as they are, these little guys can be quite powerful in their own right. Also, they seem to work well with the Harpers, given their natural curiosity and chaotic good alignment. They are noted as sometimes befriending elves or gnomes in particular, due mostly to similar habitats and alignments, one would assume. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2012 : 09:30:39
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| they still breathe euphoria gas don't they? I just recall one of my players getting off on that.... he actually wanted the faerie dragon to breathe on him. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2012 : 15:07:32
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Aye, you're right Alystra Polymorph is needed to make Aryalome's wish of changin into an elf possible. The alter self spell does allow for changing shape within one step of its original form (which I wrongfully assumed was small*), though. The real crux for the alter self spell is that it is limited to your orinal category racial type, limiting faerie dragons to changing into pseudodragons and the like.
*Fairy dragons grow in size with age, don't they? So perhaps adult and older fairy dragons might be able to use the spell to appear as a medium sized human. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2012 : 16:29:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Bladewind
*Fairy dragons grow in size with age, don't they? So perhaps adult and older fairy dragons might be able to use the spell to appear as a medium sized human.
Well in 2nd Edtion they do grow older, however no indication they grow larger. I could not find them in 3.5 SRD so not sure if they grow larger with age in that or other Editions with age. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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rjfras
Learned Scribe
261 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2012 : 17:15:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Originally posted by Bladewind
*Fairy dragons grow in size with age, don't they? So perhaps adult and older fairy dragons might be able to use the spell to appear as a medium sized human.
Well in 2nd Edtion they do grow older, however no indication they grow larger. I could not find them in 3.5 SRD so not sure if they grow larger with age in that or other Editions with age.
Check page 158 of the 3.5 version of Draconomicon.
Faerie Dragon Advancement: 9 HD (Small); 10–13 HD (Medium); 14–19 HD (Large); 20–24 HD (Huge) |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 09 Dec 2012 : 17:20:46
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| Well I did come across some web content, thought it was fan based that indicated that these small little creatures can grow to Colossal size. This is totally inane however if that edition is being used alter self clearly can work at certain ages to become human, though growing too old polymorth would need to be used. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2012 : 04:22:49
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| I'm sorry, but I just can't picture a Huge faerie dragon. Faerie dragons are supposed to be small! |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2012 : 17:30:42
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I feel the same way, but I can picture one the size of a butterfly-winged horse. Large size could be because of a racial variant, such a jungle faerie dragon from a exeptionally bountiful glade.
I think most faerie dragons are stilted in their growth, staying at tiny wyrmling size till adolesence, reaching mature adulthood when grown to small size. Old and ancient faerie dragons would then be medium with only wyrms and great wyrms able to grow to large size. Extreme ages could lead to even collosal fearie dragons but I'd limit them to planar encounters, such as a gargantuan black mothwinged fearie dragon found in the deepest and most dark and ancient parts of the Fey realms. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2012 : 20:56:34
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IIRC, fairie dragons only reach a maximum length of 2 1/2 ft (according to the 2nd ed MM and 3.5 MM entries), which is still considered tiny. So a "huge" fairy dragon is still, well, tiny. In other words, about the size of a large house cat. They also change colors through the spectrum as they age, from yellow at wyrmling stage through to violet at wyrm age and finally black at great wyrm age category. In this case, size is relative to the HD of the fairie dragon, NOT the standard size of So a great wyrm fairie dragon would be iridescent black, but still only as large as a cat!
With that in mind, even a great wyrm fairie dragon could only use the Alter Self spell to change into a small creature, but still must be of the same general shape, ie, it could appear as a cat, a small dog, a skunk, a pseudodragon, or even a tressym (winged cat), al-mir'aj (unicorn-horned rabbit), carbuncle (horned armadillo with a gem in its head), osquip, or feystag (small rabbit/cat/deer mix). However, to become anything of humanoid shape (ie- a brownie, grig, or elf, human, gnome, etc), it would still require the Polymorph spell.
As I mentioned before, I've used these little buggers in many of my games, both for humorous encounters, and as wizard familiars. They DO indeed breathe a euphoric gas as their breath weapon, have invisibility at will as an SLA, and they often use the spells forget, unseen servant, suggestion, animal growth, ventriloquism, distant distortion, obscurement, or animate rock, as per the 2n ed MM entry. They also can use hallucinatory terrain, limited wish, water breathing, and legend lore. They also speak the languages of both dragons and fey such as pixies, sprites, grigs, and their own language, which is probably a mix between the two. In addition, many speak elvish and/or the language of birds and animals that live in their area. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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sleyvas
Skilled Spell Strategist
USA
11829 Posts |
Posted - 10 Dec 2012 : 21:00:00
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| yeah, I remember a dungeon module where goblins or kobolds had captured one and were using it to get high. |
Alavairthae, may your skill prevail
Phillip aka Sleyvas |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Bladewind
Master of Realmslore
Netherlands
1280 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2012 : 20:00:05
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Guess my initial feeling was right. The Draconomicon has the size of a faerie dragon listed at small (up to 9 HD), medium (10 to 13 HD), large (14 to 19 HD) and huge (bigger than 20 HD).
It also mentiones that they speak both draconic and sylvan, and are able to speak with animals at will. Faerie dragons don't seem to posses any innate ability to shapechange besides from being good bases for entering the sorcerer and wizard class.
Its odd, but the Draconomicon version is an exceptionnal swimmer in addition to being able to fly with much more ease than most dragons. |
My campaign sketches
Druidic Groves
Creature Feature: Giant Spiders |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2012 : 22:44:19
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That is true of the earlier ones, as well, IIRC. They love water and swimming, which is odd for a creature with butterfly wings. (Water tends to ruin the wings of real butterflies...) Thier flight being better is mainly due to small size and greater flexibility than most dragons. Since they are so small, they don't have to maneuver so much heavy bulk when flying, unlike the standard dragon types, most of which are far less agile.
However, I noticed that the entry in 3.5 Draconomicon shows a farie dragon's space/reach as only 5 ft/5 ft, manking even the "huge" ones very small. Which is consistant with the stats I mentioned earlier. The size categories in that entry are somewhat misleading, methinks. And given the fact that they are allies of such small fey as sprites and pixies, that entry should probably read fine, diminuative, tiny, and small, regardless of the HD they have. Ift hey really did get large enough to be classified as medium, large, or huge creatures, they would clearly have more than a CR 6 and a LA of +2, as the entry states. Does anyone know if there is an errata entry for this? |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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rjfras
Learned Scribe
261 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2012 : 22:57:52
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CR6 if for the base creature. If they go up in HD, which also affects their size, then their CR would also go up.
A dragon's CR increases by 1 for every 2 HD or class levels so by the time it got the HD to be Huge (+12 HD) it would be a CR12 faerie dragon and its Space/Reach would be 15'/10'. |
Edited by - rjfras on 15 Dec 2012 22:59:32 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2012 : 23:11:57
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| Alystra , If WotC ever posted a fix it appears not supported by their website. The archives appear to only include 4th Edition references. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 15 Dec 2012 : 23:47:25
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That CR increase is for the standard dragon races, and would not apply to a fairie dragon which is an offshoot of the pseudodragon races, not a "true" dragon at all. In fact, even the creature type in the 3.5 entry calls it a "small dragon"! The space/reach makes no mention of size, nor does it state that it is the "base", and neither do the CR or LA stats. These are usually indicated, when applicable to HD levels. Also, all the prior lore states their length as only 1-1 & 1/2 ft. (I had the exact length a little off in my earlier post, but they are actually SMALLER than I originally remembered!) There IS no "huge" fairie dragon, becuase they have never suddenly begun growing larger at any time in the various editions. In spite of what the entry seems to imply, they are actually VERY small. HD does NOT = actual size!!! That is simply a meausre of "power" of the creature relative to its own kind. A 24 HD fairie dragon is STILL only about half the length of a human's arm! (Tail included.)
To quote the original MM entry from 2nd ed: "A chaotic offshoot of the pseudodragon, the faerie dragon lives in peaceful, tangled forests and thrives on pranks, mischief, and practical jokes.
Fairie dragons resemble MINIATURE(emphasis mine) dragons with thin bodies, long, prehensile tails, gossamer butterfly wings, and huge smiles. Their colors range through the spectrum, changing as they age, from the read of a hatchling (I had that part backwards, it starts with read instead of yellow) to the black of a great wyrm. The hides of females have a golden tinge that sparkles in sunlight; males have a silver tinge."
Also, the 3.5 version lists their breath weapon as a 20 ft cloud, which is still within the limits of a very small creature, versus a standard dragon's much larger AOE. Even this is somewhat inconsistant, however, as the original MM entry states that the breath weapon is a cloud only 2 ft in diameter! There has been some tweaking to make them more powerful or challenging, apparently, but this does NOT explain how they could go from a "small" creature in 3.5 (According to the PHB, this is the size of goblins, halflings, or gnomes, at the top end) to something the size of a gaint! Previously, they had been listed (again in the 2nd ed MM entry) as tiny. Faerie dragons are simply listed as "small" dragons in the creature type- which, going from the sizes in that same book (for standard dragons) would make a "huge" faerie dragon 55 ft long! That is simply impossible, from all the descriptions given. Simply put, the size listings in the HD advancement is WRONG. They CANNOT become huge, large, or even medium-sized. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
Edited by - Alystra Illianniis on 15 Dec 2012 23:49:14 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 00:37:49
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Well HD sometimes indicates size change, however not always. Many monsters can have very different HD and the same size. Clearly true dragons grow in size, that is a trait of true Dragons as they age. A true purest would argue that no matter how many monsters Dragon kills (gaining experience points to increase HD)that instead the Dragon grows in size based on years lived that HD is not a true factor.
The over all result of a large Dragon with HD of a medium one is that it would not live long because size attracts greater effort to kill. *G*
Edit: Corrected spelling. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
Edited by - Kentinal on 16 Dec 2012 00:39:34 |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 00:44:24
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| That is true. An ogre with 12 HD would be the same size as one with 9 HD, but have more HP, higher BAB, etc. However, I will mention that neither the original 2nd ed entry nor the 3.5 version mentions anything about a size change for faerie dragons, unlike true dragons, which all have tables listing HD, size(in feet), AND other increases for each age category. Faerie dragons do not. So apparently, a wyrmling faerie dragon is about as large as it will ever be, no matter how many HD it later gains. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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rjfras
Learned Scribe
261 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 05:52:04
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If we are talking 3.5 mechanics, an ogre wouldn't get bigger because it's advancement is by character class not by additional HD.
A faerie dragon is a dragon in 3.5 so is a pseudodragon. A base pseudodragon is a tiny dragon but does not advance to a bigger size. A base faerie dragon is small but can get bigger as it advances.
Draconicom 2.0 (the FR version) does not say that they are not dragons, it says they are falsely thought to be a form of pseudodragon:
quote:
(Some apologists for the Club have attempted to add these missing species to the overall structure. According to these worthies, faerie dragons are highly developed offshoots of pseudodragons (the reason for this rather doubtful conclusion seems to be the faerie dragons#146; small size).
MONSTERS BY TYPE (AND SUBTYPE)
(Monster Manual) Dragon: dragons, dragon turtle, pseudodragon , wyvern
(Draconicom) Dragon: battle dragon, chaos dragon, dragonnel, elemental drakes, ethereal dragon, faerie dragon, half-dragon, howling dragon, landwyrms, Oceanus dragon, pyroclastic dragon, radiant dragon, rust dragon, shadow dragon, spiked felldrake, storm drake, Styx dragon, Tarterian dragon.
For a faerie dragon, by 3.5 mechanics, gets bigger as it's HD go up. If the advancement shows a size increase by HD, then it does get bigger. If the creature does not show size increases in the Advancement entry, it does not.
From the 3.5 Monster Manual:
quote:
SIZE INCREASES
A creature may become larger when its Hit Dice are increased (the new size is noted parenthetically in the monster’s Advancement entry).
A size increase affects any special ability the creature has that is affected by size, such as improved grab. Increased size also affects a creature’s ability scores, AC, attack bonuses, and damage values as indicated on Tables 4–2 and 4–3.
quote:
Increased Hit Dice: Intelligent creatures that are not humanoid in shape, and nonintelligent monsters, can advance by increasing their Hit Dice. Creatures with increased Hit Dice are usually superior specimens of their race, bigger and more powerful than their run-of-the-mill fellows.
In Dragons of Faerun, there is an advanced faerie dragon listed in the Roll Call of Dragons
quote:
Tyssaklera / CR15 / Living / Female advanced 24 HD faerie / Evermeet
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 12:02:03
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rjfras Well 3rd Edition did make many changes, Kobolds becoming Dragon-kin instead of being dog-like hominids, so indeed faerie dragon could have moved from Dragon-like to true Dragon.
For me that splat book would have pages banned from local game.
I will also note that Tyssaklera having 24 HD and only a CR15 does not strike me as the same as a true Dragon CR. *shrugs* It is so written, however in the end the DM decides what goes into a game. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 13:51:36
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If thats the case with monster-types, then why is the Fairy dragon god considered a fey deity and not a draconic one? 
And this is a very un-PC thread... they prefer the term "gender-challenged psuedo-reptiles". |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Ayunken-vanzan
Senior Scribe
Germany
657 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 17:21:28
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| AFAIK, kobolds have always been dragon-kin. The 2nd edition monstrous manual already describes them as possessing a scaly hide and two horns. Their smell (like wet dogs) and their language which sounds like yapping dogs may have supported the misconception of kobolds being dog-like hominids. |
"What mattered our lives now? When our world had been torn from us? Folk wept, or drank, or stood staring out over the land, wondering what new horror each dawn would bring."
Elender Stormfall of Suzail
"Anyone can kill deities, cause plagues, or destroy organizations. It takes real skill to make them live on."
Varl
FR/D&D-Links • 2ed Downloads |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 17:38:31
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quote:
Kobolds are a cowardly, sadistic race of short humanoids
Copyright 1996 TSR, Inc.
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"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 17:46:32
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| If you go by folklore, they are very much like mean little gnomes. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Ayunken-vanzan
Senior Scribe
Germany
657 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 20:43:05
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quote:
Originally posted by Kentinal
quote:
Kobolds are a cowardly, sadistic race of short humanoids
Copyright 1996 TSR, Inc.
Yes, humanoids. But obviously of draconic origin:
quote:
TSR continues:... kobolds have scaly hides that range from dark, rusty brown to a rusty black. They smell of damp dogs and stagnant water. Their eyes glow like a bright red spark and they have two small horns ranging from tan to white.
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"What mattered our lives now? When our world had been torn from us? Folk wept, or drank, or stood staring out over the land, wondering what new horror each dawn would bring."
Elender Stormfall of Suzail
"Anyone can kill deities, cause plagues, or destroy organizations. It takes real skill to make them live on."
Varl
FR/D&D-Links • 2ed Downloads |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 16 Dec 2012 : 21:20:32
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A duck-billed platypus has a bill but that doesn't make it a duck.
What is obvious to me is that they are humanoids that look a little reptilian, and have horns.
Tieflings have horns... perhaps in 5e we will find out they were really half-dragons all along?
Obviously I am not a fan of the lore that states they are related to dragons in any way. Then again, I avoid nearly any splat with the word 'dragon' in it (except in the logo... D&D... lol). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 16 Dec 2012 21:21:32 |
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Faerie Dragons
