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Branimir
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
 Posted - 15 Sep 2012 : 05:44:46
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I own a small computer business, and recently a friend of mine who is a talented computer scientist with 15 years of experience expressed interest in partnering with me and branching into game design. The idea of making a FR game hasn't come up, but since I enjoy FR so much I thought I'd inquire abut it here. If it were any other game line then I'd assume not, but FR was not originally a video game franchise, the dozens of FRVG that have been made were produced by various unrelated companies, and its been around long enough for copyrights to expire. I'd like to design a unique story that takes place on Toril and uses D&D 4 rules. Currently the only FRVG that uses D&D4 is Daggerdale which I've seen mostly negative reviews for, and the last FR game aside from it was a NWN2 expansion from years ago. So I think there is a market for a new good FR computer game. Although I'm not sure we would be able to make a Windows version.
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-Branimir Draek
Please check out The Church of Lathander and consider converting today. http://www.facebook.com/TheMorninglord
Contact the church to have your sins absolved today. I can perform legal weddings in the name of Lathander. |
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Captain Grafalcon
Learned Scribe
Brazil
129 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2012 : 16:10:31
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| Branimir, I wish you sucess!A lot of people had the first contact with the Realms in the sofware games, like Baldurīs Gate and Icewind dale. |
"Surely you recognize that armies carrying banners are almost always thievesuntil they win."
Jarlaxle, mercenary leader of Bregan D'aerthe. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4686 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2012 : 19:27:20
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As I recall copyright was extended to last 75 years about 10 years ago. I do believe you will find FR trademarked and copyrighted as well. Right now WotC owns the Trademark except for what TSR licensed out for computer games.
The only one that can really answer your question is WotC. I however would not give you good odds of getting right to do so unless you play at least two companies something. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Artemas Entreri
Great Reader
USA
3131 Posts |
Posted - 15 Sep 2012 : 20:19:45
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| ANYTHING that is associated with the Forgotten Realms logo/name needs to be authorized by WoTC. Please don't try to make a realms game without their permission and consent. |
Some people have a way with words, and other people...oh, uh, not have way. -Steve Martin
Amazon "KindleUnlimited" Free Trial: http://amzn.to/2AJ4yD2
Try Audible and Get 2 Free Audio Books! https://amzn.to/2IgBede |
Edited by - Artemas Entreri on 15 Sep 2012 20:20:17 |
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Branimir
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 16 Sep 2012 : 16:43:33
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| That's what I was asking. In that case I'll contact WotC. |
-Branimir Draek
Please check out The Church of Lathander and consider converting today. http://www.facebook.com/TheMorninglord
Contact the church to have your sins absolved today. I can perform legal weddings in the name of Lathander. |
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Light
Learned Scribe
Australia
231 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 15:28:55
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| Wouldn't it be okay as long as it is entirely non-profit run? |
"A true warrior needs no sword" - Thors (Vinland Saga) |
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Kilvan
Senior Scribe
Canada
894 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 15:41:22
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I would think that anything entirely non-profitable is not subject to copyrights, but I could be wrong.
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4686 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 16:32:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Light
Wouldn't it be okay as long as it is entirely non-profit run?
No it would not be, even if not sold, such infringes of the rights others having the right to sell.
Most people given the choice of a free game as opposed a paid game will choose a free game. A paid game by license holder in part is for profit, but also recovery of costs of having the license in the first place. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Erik Scott de Bie
Forgotten Realms Author
USA
4598 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 16:44:07
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Copyright has nothing to do with sales or profit. Whether you make money from a publication that infringes copyright or not, you're still infringing copyright. A company might be less likely to sue you if you're not making profit, but you're still doing something that's basically illegal. And really, you'd want WotC to protect the Realms IP rather than allow it to be diluted with unsanctioned design. A free game might be even more dangerous to them, if people choose to play that over Baldur's Gate or Neverwinter, for instance--those are lost sales for WotC.
This is not at all to discourage the OP--far from it! Just do it right. Talk to WotC, show them what you've got, see what you can work out. If it's something simple and has wide appeal (like a Facebook game, for instance), that's probably a good place to start.
Cheers |
Erik Scott de Bie
'Tis easier to destroy than to create.
Author of a number of Realms novels (GHOSTWALKER, DEPTHS OF MADNESS, and the SHADOWBANE series), contributor to the NEVERWINTER CAMPAIGN GUIDE and SHADOWFELL: GLOOMWROUGHT AND BEYOND, Twitch DM of the Dungeon Scrawlers, currently playing "The Westgate Irregulars" |
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Branimir
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 17:03:58
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| Its not intended to be a non-profit game, my idea is for a full length quality game Like Baldur's Gate was in 1998 and NWN2 was in 2008. Which will take years to make. Now that I know there is a current copyright holder for the forgotten realms I will contact them pending on further developments. I may however just make up my own world, also. As a further question, since D&D is not FR, couldn't a nonFR game use D&D rules? I heard a rumor that Dragon Age Origins (not part of FR) used D&D rules but I haven't confirmed it. Who owns the copyrights on D&D, and do they require game designers (like the various developers of the FRVGs) to sign some paperwork with them to use their system? |
-Branimir Draek
Please check out The Church of Lathander and consider converting today. http://www.facebook.com/TheMorninglord
Contact the church to have your sins absolved today. I can perform legal weddings in the name of Lathander. |
Edited by - Branimir on 18 Sep 2012 17:06:33 |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4686 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 17:30:49
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Branimir D&D is also trademarked, some monsters are copyrighted as well. There was some material not protected that can be used, however much of D&D is protected from making a game.
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"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Branimir
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 17:44:03
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Whatever company makes the D&D games is still making them so of course they are still copyright. Some companies that make a product like a rule set don't care if people use their ruleset in video games. I don't even know the companies name though, I suppose I could actually do a google search for that though and then ask the company directly. Well if anyone knowing the info I'm seeking happens to read this feel free to reply and in the mean time I'll hunt down the D&D people and talk to them.
P.S. If I don't go to WotC to use FR then I wont be using any of the monsters or characters related to it. I'll be inventing my own characters and monsters. |
-Branimir Draek
Please check out The Church of Lathander and consider converting today. http://www.facebook.com/TheMorninglord
Contact the church to have your sins absolved today. I can perform legal weddings in the name of Lathander. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4686 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 18:21:39
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In some ways a scorce card is needed.
As I understand it, not having read the contracts., it goes something like this.
TSR sold computer game rights to SSI.
SSI made Pool of Radiance and a few other FR games, as I understand it, the FR brand was licensed.
TSR and SSI both purchased by other companies and in fact might no longer exist as a companies, the assets transferred to other companies.
To make a FR game you would need WotC permission and also the permission of the company that owns the right to make D&D games. Before 4th Edition started WotC did end as many licenses it could, however I have not seen any indication they purchased back the right to make D&D computer games. Bioware I believe owns that right, if company name wrong, I mean company that released Never Winter Nights. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Veritas
Learned Scribe
209 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 18:42:26
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| The shorthand is that WoTC retains all rights to FR and D&D for now and foreseeable decades to come. WoTC does not give a company an unlimited right to make games, they provide a non-transferable license which is subject to renewal. These licenses may be exclusive, so a company currently holding the rights to make FR games with the D&D ruleset may be the only company permitted to do so. There may be the possibility that you can use the compatible ruleset permitted by the OGL or GSL but you'd probably want to take a very careful look at that, discuss it with an appropirate lawyer, and check with WoTC. |
Edited by - Veritas on 18 Sep 2012 18:56:12 |
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Branimir
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 18:43:19
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Hmm, so Atari is the only one allowed to make FRVG and I need WotC permission too? I see... thank you. Though that wouldn't be an issue if Atari published the game and I just developed it. Bioware is a game developer not a publisher. NWN1 was developed by Bioware but published by Infogrames/Atari, and Atari published NWN2 which was developed by Obsidian Entertainment. Atari also published Daggerdale which was developed by Bedlam Games. But Interplay has been publishing games between the Atari releases, so have some other companies like Ubisoft.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Forgotten_Realms_video_games
Order it by Initial Release Date.
Edit:
Thank you Veritas that explains a lot. So if Atari does have an exclusive contract atm which is what Kentinal was trying to say I think, then I wouldn't be able to get a contract from WotC to publish. I don't have the capital to publish it anyway, so using Atari as a publisher could work out that way. However, I still might not use FR. Atari may have an exclusive contract to publish FR games, but if its not FR then it doesn't matter. You're saying WotC also owns D&D? I was under the impression that a separate company did, though I forgot the name. *googles* I must have been thinking of TSR, but they seem to be owned by WotC now, so WotC does indeed own D&D. So perhaps WotC could allow me to publish a D&D4 game that is unrelated to FR, without having to worry about Atari at all. I'm sure I'll have to sign a contract or something though. |
-Branimir Draek
Please check out The Church of Lathander and consider converting today. http://www.facebook.com/TheMorninglord
Contact the church to have your sins absolved today. I can perform legal weddings in the name of Lathander. |
Edited by - Branimir on 18 Sep 2012 18:52:43 |
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Veritas
Learned Scribe
209 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 18:59:44
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| If there is an exclusive license, it may not encompass all of FR but may consist of a region or set of regions. E.G. one company may be permitted to publish a game set in the Dalelands while another can tackle the Sword Coast. WoTC, which I believe is still owned by Habsro, may be the only company with details of the issued licenses. If you want to proceed with an FR game, your first step would be to contact them. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4686 Posts |
Posted - 18 Sep 2012 : 19:22:07
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| I would advise contact WotC, rather then Hasbro. While it is correct Hasbro now owns fully, or at least control WotC. WotC has the TSR rights and thus the best first place to start. WotC likely was considered big enough not to dissolve because of more diverse gaming line. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Tyranthraxus
Senior Scribe
Netherlands
423 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2012 : 05:49:11
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Like others have said, there are issues with copyright and IP. The good news is Baldur's Gate Enhanced Edition is going to be released soon, and Obsidian is working on Project Eternity.
Also, I'm working on a RPG game with a few friends (we're all indie game design students) for Android devices. We're currently in the prototype phase and we hope to finish the alpha version by the end of the year. |
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Branimir
Acolyte
USA
27 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2012 : 16:20:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Tyranthraxus
Also, I'm working on a RPG game with a few friends (we're all indie game design students) for Android devices. We're currently in the prototype phase and we hope to finish the alpha version by the end of the year.
A FR game? Well if you're ever interested in having it ported to iOS let me know, we may be able to work something out. |
-Branimir Draek
Please check out The Church of Lathander and consider converting today. http://www.facebook.com/TheMorninglord
Contact the church to have your sins absolved today. I can perform legal weddings in the name of Lathander. |
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Tyranthraxus
Senior Scribe
Netherlands
423 Posts |
Posted - 19 Sep 2012 : 17:33:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Branimir
quote:
Originally posted by Tyranthraxus
Also, I'm working on a RPG game with a few friends (we're all indie game design students) for Android devices. We're currently in the prototype phase and we hope to finish the alpha version by the end of the year.
A FR game? Well if you're ever interested in having it ported to iOS let me know, we may be able to work something out.
We want to avoid any legal issues with WotC/Atari, so it's going to be our own IP. The working title atm is Legends of Bokafold, and I've finished writing the first draft for the mechanics. It's harder then you might think, especially for incorporating touch screen gestures.
Porting to iOS shouldn't be much of a problem for us, but because we are all full-time students we want to focus on Android for now. But if we do need help I'll let you know. |
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Can anyone make a FR video game?
