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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
 Posted - 28 May 2012 : 02:27:48
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I've been searching as best as I can, but I can't find much information on Cedarspoke.
Does anyone have a date that the place was founded or any other information about the place?
Many thanks!
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The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 02:37:28
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Craps...I should have known to look better in the Grand History of the Realms!
circa 200 DR Cedarspoke is founded. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:51:34
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| I would still appreciate any information on the Gulthmere Forest...it is scantily "clad" in lore it seems. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6680 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 06:56:59
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I think the "Vilhon Reach" accessory has some information as does (peripherally) Ed's Turmish columns in Polyhedron a long, long time ago.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 08:48:42
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quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I think the "Vilhon Reach" accessory has some information as does (peripherally) Ed's Turmish columns in Polyhedron a long, long time ago.
-- George Krashos
Do you happen to perhaps remember an approximate issue(s) of the Polyhedron? I don't have the whole collection, and I don't recall reading that particular bit.
Reading through my copy of the Vilhon even now however... |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 08:49:33
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
See Nobanion's entries in the relevant deity books as well, and Pirates of the Fallen Stars.
Ahhh...Nobanion...I didn't think to read his entry at all! Thanks Sage! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 09:14:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
quote:
Originally posted by George Krashos
I think the "Vilhon Reach" accessory has some information as does (peripherally) Ed's Turmish columns in Polyhedron a long, long time ago.
-- George Krashos
Do you happen to perhaps remember an approximate issue(s) of the Polyhedron? I don't have the whole collection, and I don't recall reading that particular bit.
Reading through my copy of the Vilhon even now however...
The POLYHEDRON columns Krash refers to above, were featured in issues #96, 98, 101, 103–108. |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 09:20:03
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
The POLYHEDRON columns Krash refers to above, were featured in issues #96, 98, 101, 103–108.
[/quote]
Hmmm...not sure I have all those. Will look about... |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 14:55:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
The POLYHEDRON columns Krash refers to above, were featured in issues #96, 98, 101, 103–108.
Hmmm...not sure I have all those. Will look about...
If not, you can usually find neatly priced used copies on sites like nobleknight.com. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 28 May 2012 : 15:57:19
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
If not, you can usually find neatly priced used copies on sites like nobleknight.com.
About $4 U.S. or near that for each...
I did read in one of them that I had that the "Purple Staff" wished to create a Holy Kingdom in the area...may have to work that into the Five Shires write-up I'm working on.
I did find this map:
http://dl.dropbox.com/u/10166328/Map%20of%20Turmish.bmp
I'm also, by reading the couple of Polyhedrons I have about Turmish in the Everwinking Eye articles learning that the land is much more "woodsy" than I had previously thought (though not always so apparently). I can use this to my advantage I think. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 08:05:59
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And then there is THIS.
You have my curiosity piqued now - I'm tinkering with the map as I type this. Had to both rotate and flip it to make a good fit. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 14:18:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
And then there is THIS.
You have my curiosity piqued now - I'm tinkering with the map as I type this. Had to both rotate and flip it to make a good fit.
MT, I had hoped to "lure you in" with the idea. 
Let me know how it goes (dalor_darden@yahoo.com) and I'll be more than happy to compensate your time in some way! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 14:58:34
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| Well, according to THO, Nobanion came to the Gulthmere Forest area between 940 to 960 Dale Reckoning! Many thanks again to THO and Ed! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 16:40:57
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Just finishing off a practice-project, then I'll have something for you - I was up to 5AM tinkering in GIMP.
And for all those folks on the internet who say "GIMP is just as good as Photoshop..."
You're delusional. 
Its like going from a nuclear reactor to a book of matches. 
EDIT: I have re-done the coastline already - its slow-going without all the terrain textures I built. I really had to play with it to get it just so (and match the scale - I want it to be as close to the real Five Shires as possible).
Had to move Cedarspoke and Starsmantle just a bit - they actually look much better now....
It also gave me room for Doom Keep. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 29 May 2012 16:45:31 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 17:01:49
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What in the Nine Hells happened anyway MT? Why the map changing eh?
You put in Doom Keep??? Now THAT gives me some ideas! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 21:37:24
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Huh? I'm not sure which you are referring to - the altering of the conversion map, or my lost archives.
If its the former, then its simple - the way I am changing things doesn't affect any canon - in fact, I think it enhances it!
If its the later, well... lets just say fire and RPG books don't go together very well. Throw in about 7000 comics and what-not, and you have a very pretty mini-solar flare (or you get to see what hell must look like - take your pick). Whats even more fun is when you are five states away, and get to see it on the news. 
As for Doom Keep - you wanted the Black Barony, didn't you? I even managed to keep the swamps intact. At first I was just going to say Westgate could be the Black Barony, ut then i got to thinking... even Westgate wouldn't tolerate a bunch of SOB's like that... so they all moved next door. 
Now they hassle trade between Westgate, Starmantle, and the Five Shires. If you want a more Realmsian spin, just place the realm of Maerantide there. Personally, I'd just keep both. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 29 May 2012 21:39:38 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 29 May 2012 : 22:41:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Huh? I'm not sure which you are referring to - the altering of the conversion map, or my lost archives.
If its the former, then its simple - the way I am changing things doesn't affect any canon - in fact, I think it enhances it!
If its the later, well... lets just say fire and RPG books don't go together very well. Throw in about 7000 comics and what-not, and you have a very pretty mini-solar flare (or you get to see what hell must look like - take your pick). Whats even more fun is when you are five states away, and get to see it on the news.
As for Doom Keep - you wanted the Black Barony, didn't you? I even managed to keep the swamps intact. At first I was just going to say Westgate could be the Black Barony, ut then i got to thinking... even Westgate wouldn't tolerate a bunch of SOB's like that... so they all moved next door.
Now they hassle trade between Westgate, Starmantle, and the Five Shires. If you want a more Realmsian spin, just place the realm of Maerantide there. Personally, I'd just keep both.
Hey man...if you squeeze the Black Eagle Barony in there, all the better! Then I can bring my second favorite evil wizard into the game too: Bargle!
But you gotta quit teasing and show me what you have so far on the map!
I'm interested to see how you have decided to go with the map of the "New" Gulthmere Forest and environs. Is Tothmeer now on the east end with Rollstone Keep on the west to guard against the Black Eagle?
As for what I was talking about...I didn't have any idea you had a fire!
You and Wooly are cursed! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
Edited by - Dalor Darden on 29 May 2012 22:42:26 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36910 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 00:36:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
As for what I was talking about...I didn't have any idea you had a fire!
You and Wooly are cursed!
Actually, I got off lucky, compared to Markus. While both of us lost things we will never be able to replace, in my case, it was all in a storage unit. I lost 90-95% of everything I owned, but not everything. I still had all my clothes, all but three of my DVDs, all but a couple of CDs, my computer, some books and figures, and most importantly, my home. |
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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skychrome
Senior Scribe
713 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 01:36:29
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| Dalor, not that it provides explicitly lots of historical lore, but book 1 of the Erevis Cale Trilogy has quite a part in Gulthmere Forest. Just in case. |
"You make an intriguing offer, one that is very tempting. It would seem that I have little alternative than to answer thusly: DISINTEGRATE!" Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick 625 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 04:15:12
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Dang Wooly...that still sucks!
@skychrome: I had no idea on the Erevis Cale Trilogy...I've honestly not read those novels. Anything in particular that would be related to pre-1358 DR? |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 05:17:04
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The only thing new (from Everis Cale) is the Lightless Lake. I never liked its placement before, and its much better on the altered map (and closer to Starmanttle, as it should be).
WIP
Assume the entire area between the two lakes is the Black Barony - all the surrounding waters (lake, river, and sea) have tiny fishing villages that answer to the baron (and yes, I read the text of each and every locale before I place it on one of my maps).
I accidentally included a couple of non-halfling settlements (they were on the Five Shires map!), but I left them after chacking the supplement. Turmish makes an excellent substitute for Darokin (just as Cormyr makes a great substitute for Karmeikos). Assume the city of Athenos was an old Turmite town that has since grown into a citystate, and is only under nominal control from Turmish-proper. Mar is a gnome village now, which is neither part of the Five Shires or Turmish (but winds up protected by both).
Cederspoke remains Cedarspoke (it just moved south), and Starmantle is still a port - I made the river navigable (and its also on the lake now). I also managed to get all the islands in - I am going to move the canon towns of Amry and Telpir offshore (so the two large islands will have the same names as the vilages on them).
That means any NPCs from Karameiks and Darokin can be attributed to Cormyr and Turmish, respectively, and I figure the Thyatian Ambassador for a Red Wizard (he wants to set up an enclave) - I think he even wears a red robe! (I know someone does... thats what I get for speed-reading).
And this has inspired a good background story for my homebrew village of Hinville up in the Tunlands (which appears on my Stonelands maps here at the 'keep). It has no direct connection to the Five Shires (and only an ancient one to Luiren) - its a place where the 'bad apples' go (note the proximity to Darkhold).
I still have a lot of work left on this, but I need to finish up something else right now. I'm not sure if I should add all that Turmish stuff onto the map as well (its no big deal - I Copy & pasted from my other map - Turmish is the only place I didn't tweak when I did my corrected campaign map, so it still fits perfectly onto the canon map). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 30 May 2012 05:17:31 |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 05:33:31
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MT...I can see that this is going to work PERFECTLY for the campaign I'm planning!
I'm going to go ahead and dive back into the history and make a few minor changes now that your map shows me where some few things can be in relation to others.
The only thing I'm going to have trouble reconciling is how the Orcs interact with Cedarspoke. I can't find reference to the orcs ever venturing into the Gulthmere in Canon material.
This is going to work really nicely though.
I was thinking...do you prefer Photoshop over GIMP? Perhaps I could send ya a copy? |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 08:30:04
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Photoshop rocks, Gimp... does not rock. 
I think giving me a copy of PS is a bit extreme - I do this just out of love for the Realms (and you've inspired me to look into other lesser-known regions before). I've managed to find work-arounds for a lot of the PS tools I am missing (you can't do anything cool with text, dammit), so I'm good for now. Sooner or later the Ins. co. will have to cough up the money (its been over a year now) and I'll get everything I need.
In the meantime, I've gotten the money for the house, and managed to buy a much better home with what I got, and I still have the old property to sell, so I'm not hurting (and the new house is everything I ever wanted). I figure lots of people will get some mileage out of a map like this, so that's payment enough.
The only thing I can't fix is the name of at least two of the shires - East and South - they've been inverted. oh well, can win 'em all. Maybe halflings do that on purpose to confuse 'big folk'.
As for the Orcs, the Gulthmere has tribes of gnolls - those are in the Everis Cale novel. These aren't your garden-variety feral monsters - they are more like the ones in the UE book; they are even allowed in Starmantle (at least one merc. co.) They are still mean and ugly, but they are also pretty damn clever.
I figure the Five-Shire border ends where the forest ends, and there are probably Orcs in those mountains as well. I know Urml is a Bullywug town (at least I think it is... something weird like that... its been awhile). Between all the known creatures in the area, and the age and size (and mysteriousness) of the Orsraun Mountains, I would say you should be able to find anything there - where there are Mountains, there are orcs. Its part of their religion. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 13:47:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
The only thing I can't fix is the name of at least two of the shires - East and South - they've been inverted. oh well, can win 'em all. Maybe halflings do that on purpose to confuse 'big folk'.
As for the Orcs, the Gulthmere has tribes of gnolls - those are in the Everis Cale novel. These aren't your garden-variety feral monsters - they are more like the ones in the UE book; they are even allowed in Starmantle (at least one merc. co.) They are still mean and ugly, but they are also pretty damn clever.
I figure the Five-Shire border ends where the forest ends, and there are probably Orcs in those mountains as well. I know Urml is a Bullywug town (at least I think it is... something weird like that... its been awhile). Between all the known creatures in the area, and the age and size (and mysteriousness) of the Orsraun Mountains, I would say you should be able to find anything there - where there are Mountains, there are orcs. Its part of their religion.
Continuing the conversation on this over at:
http://forum.candlekeep.com/post.asp?method=Reply&TOPIC_ID=16585&FORUM_ID=11
Feel like we are getting too far away from talking about Cedarspoke and the Gulthmere... |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4216 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 13:50:14
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| As for the Photoshop...if it is free to me, it really isn't extreme! |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 30 May 2012 : 16:53:07
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You know my moto...
If its for free, then its for me!" |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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skychrome
Senior Scribe
713 Posts |
Posted - 31 May 2012 : 03:19:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
@skychrome: I had no idea on the Erevis Cale Trilogy...I've honestly not read those novels. Anything in particular that would be related to pre-1358 DR?
Hi Dalor, no it is not pre-1358 sorry, it is 1373. Love this trilogy...  |
"You make an intriguing offer, one that is very tempting. It would seem that I have little alternative than to answer thusly: DISINTEGRATE!" Vaarsuvius, Order of the Stick 625 |
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Cedarspoke and Gulthmere Forest
