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Marco Volo
Learned Scribe
France
204 Posts |
 Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 07:46:29
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| Here's another Waterdeep question for Ed if he can : I was wandering the origin of the name of "Dretch Lane" (located south of Castle Ward) ? |
Edited by - Marco Volo on 03 Sep 2012 18:38:01 |
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Arunsun
Acolyte
France
5 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 10:25:48
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| Marco means Dretch (a monster whose name, for some reason, hasn't been translated in any edition), and I second the question! |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 11:55:57
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| Dretch can also mean someone who's being slow in doing a task, like a dawdler or tarrier. |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
Edited by - Kajehase on 03 Sep 2012 12:14:59 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 13:07:59
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| And let's not forget Dretchroyaster, the Monarch Reborn, who sometimes goes by Dretch... |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen!  |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 15:25:08
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quote:
Originally posted by Marco Volo
Here's another Waterdeep question for Ed if he can : I was wandering the origin of the name of "Drecht Lane" (located south of Castle Ward) ?
I'm almost certain Steven Schend addressed this somewhere at Candlekeep.
Let me check my archives. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Marco Volo
Learned Scribe
France
204 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 18:39:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Arunsun
Marco means Dretch (a monster whose name, for some reason, hasn't been translated in any edition), and I second the question!
Corrected !
Ma langue a fourchée, as we say in France.
And the Sage, thanks in advance for searching the answer to my question. |
Edited by - Marco Volo on 03 Sep 2012 18:41:21 |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 20:30:25
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Reading Elfsong ATM (I managed to pick-up a cluster of old Harper novels at Gencon for a great price), and a few things sprang to mind.
First, is there more then one 'layer' to the Lords of waterdeep? It seems to me that there is a 'not so well hidden' layer of lords, that people are supposed to suspect, and then there is a deeper layer. Almost like 'true lords' and 'puppets' (although perhaps not setup in that fashion, this is just how it seems to work out). Also, after reading Waterdeep: A Novel, it appears Elaith Craulnober considers himself a sort 'unofficial' Lord of Waterdeep. Its kind of obvious (from both novels) that the Lords are aware of his activities, but he is more useful then he is troublesome. Does this mean that even they have accepted this psuedo-status? That he is possibly part of that 'deeper layer' that is truly running things?
And this question came to me, although it isn't directly related to anything in the novels. Has anyone ever worshiped a Chosen? Has anyone tried to found a religion around one? (Elminster being the person that springs right to mind). I know that Chosen of other deities often get elevated to demi-power status after death (technically, by RAW, they are demi-powers/exarchs before death), and in the case of some deities, like Lathander, they manage to get quite a few serving them (all those 'saints'). Isn't this what happened with Azuth and Savras? Or did they not receive any sort of adoration/worship until after Mystra elevated them?
I ask this because it seems to me that at their power level, a chosen of Mystra could easily become a demi-god after death, whether they wanted to be or not. Also, since 4e has blurred the lines, if they are already of that status (exarchs), then can they grant spells? For instance, if someone is in trouble and prays to one of the chosen for help, would it be possible they actually receive some sort of 'divine' help (a spell, or whatever)? |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 03 Sep 2012 20:34:30 |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 03 Sep 2012 : 22:52:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Reading Elfsong ATM (I managed to pick-up a cluster of old Harper novels at Gencon for a great price), and a few things sprang to mind.
First, is there more then one 'layer' to the Lords of waterdeep? It seems to me that there is a 'not so well hidden' layer of lords, that people are supposed to suspect, and then there is a deeper layer. Almost like 'true lords' and 'puppets' (although perhaps not setup in that fashion, this is just how it seems to work out). Also, after reading Waterdeep: A Novel, it appears Elaith Craulnober considers himself a sort 'unofficial' Lord of Waterdeep. Its kind of obvious (from both novels) that the Lords are aware of his activities, but he is more useful then he is troublesome. Does this mean that even they have accepted this psuedo-status? That he is possibly part of that 'deeper layer' that is truly running things?
I'm not Ed, but here's my thoughts:
All the Lords are equal, it's just that some of the Lords have more prominent public personas than others. And when you're trying to guess who may or may not be one of the Hidden Lords, the more prominent figures -- especially those known to have connections to Waterdeep's government -- are going to be the obvious ones to suspect.
Elaith is, for the Lords, a necessary evil. He's the devil they know. And though he is a crime lord, it is in his best interest to maintain the status quo in Waterdeep. So while he doesn't have any official connections to the Lords, and any unofficial connections are coincidental at best, he's a known factor that helps keep the lawless elements of the city under control. So long as he doesn't become a threat to Waterdeep's stability, the Lords are content to keep an eye on him and pay more attention to larger concerns. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 02:13:13
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quote:
Originally posted by Marco Volo
quote:
Originally posted by Arunsun
Marco means Dretch (a monster whose name, for some reason, hasn't been translated in any edition), and I second the question!
Corrected !
Ma langue a fourchée, as we say in France.
And the Sage, thanks in advance for searching the answer to my question.
Aye.
It appears I was slightly in error. Steven did address the query, back in 2005, but he also suggested Ed might be the more appropriate person to ask.  |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Arunsun
Acolyte
France
5 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 09:27:33
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quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Marco Volo
quote:
Originally posted by Arunsun
Marco means Dretch (a monster whose name, for some reason, hasn't been translated in any edition), and I second the question!
Corrected !
Ma langue a fourchée, as we say in France.
And the Sage, thanks in advance for searching the answer to my question.
Aye.
It appears I was slightly in error. Steven did address the query, back in 2005, but he also suggested Ed might be the more appropriate person to ask.
If you mean Steven's answer in January 2005 (to a more general question about the price of rentals in Waterdeep), it only covers the exact location of Carolya's and Lara's Rowhouse in Dretch Lane, not the origin or meaning of the street's name.
So unless you're thinking of another answer (I just read through the whole 2005 thread) I don't think Steven actually addressed that particular query. |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 14:07:16
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Roughly how many noble houses exist(ed) in the Vast in about 1370 DR?
Any chance Ed could mention a few of the most influential ones?
And to what extent would a Vast noble be a "city-noble" rather than "landed gentry"? |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 14:08:54
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| And continuing on the Vast, what's the typical naming convention for settlements outside the cities? (For the settlements themselves, that is, not the people living in them, i.e. what kinds of things are settlements in the Vast named for?) |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Barastir
Master of Realmslore
Brazil
1600 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 18:10:35
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quote:
Originally posted by Arunsun
Marco means Dretch (a monster whose name, for some reason, hasn't been translated in any edition), and I second the question!
Is tht the Dretch that is a demon (tanar'ri) or devil (baatezu) in 2e? |
"Goodness is not a natural state, but must be
fought for to be attained and maintained.
Lead by example.
Let your deeds speak your intentions.
Goodness radiated from the heart."
The Paladin's Virtues, excerpt from the "Quentin's Monograph"
(by Ed Greenwood) |
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Blueblade
Senior Scribe
USA
804 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 18:11:47
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I think Ed's Polyhedron articles on the Vast included origins for all or almost all of the place names in the Vast. And the CITY OF RAVENS BLUFF sourcebook he did described a dozen or more noble families. I don't think that lore has been reprinted anywhere since, though.
BB |
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The Hooded One
Lady Herald of Realmslore
5056 Posts |
Posted - 04 Sep 2012 : 18:19:45
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Indeed. And all the nobles of the Vast have "city mansions" AND country estates (large working farms from which they derive most of their dependable ongoing wealth, their investments in shipping being more speculative).
Ed tells me Dretch Lane is named for a long-ago slaughter of nine dretch (the diabolical creatures) that were released there when a wagon containing them (as imprisoned cargo, secretly bound for a noble villa in the city) overturned. Several citizens got involved in the fight/butchery, and the incident became briefly famous in city lore and the laneway was named for it.
love to all,
THO |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 02:34:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Arunsun
quote:
Originally posted by The Sage
quote:
Originally posted by Marco Volo
quote:
Originally posted by Arunsun
Marco means Dretch (a monster whose name, for some reason, hasn't been translated in any edition), and I second the question!
Corrected !
Ma langue a fourchée, as we say in France.
And the Sage, thanks in advance for searching the answer to my question.
Aye.
It appears I was slightly in error. Steven did address the query, back in 2005, but he also suggested Ed might be the more appropriate person to ask.
If you mean Steven's answer in January 2005 (to a more general question about the price of rentals in Waterdeep), it only covers the exact location of Carolya's and Lara's Rowhouse in Dretch Lane, not the origin or meaning of the street's name.
So unless you're thinking of another answer (I just read through the whole 2005 thread) I don't think Steven actually addressed that particular query.
Yeah, I compiled that particular lot of Steven's replies, which was among the first lot of sources that I checked.
As it turns out, it was actually on the REALMS-L that I found the original query for Steven about Dretch Lane. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 04:09:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
quote:
Originally posted by Eilserus
quote:
Originally posted by Hoondatha
So you could have Elaine writing about Liriel and the Elves Three, you writing adventures of a young Mirt and Durnan, Bob finally getting to show Josidiah's quest for the Warblade, all while Erin Evans continues her 4e-era works, and someone else who wanted could write "picking up the pieces after the Spellplague." Or the Return of Bane. Or Romeo and Juliette as reimagined in the Crown Wars. Or whatever. And since novels are only supposed to have local consequences, as opposed to major across-the-Realms changes, all of these series could co-exist in peace.
Do you think this is at all possible, once the Sundering RSE is over? And is there anyone we could lobby to make it more likely?
This type of stuff would be really nice to see. I'd even say it'd be nice to do these in short story, novelet, and novella format. Take Science Fiction & Fantasy, a little 160 page book that costs $4.50 and has about half a dozen of these types of stories put out every two months I believe. Wizards could release this in ebook format for a small fee or tie it into DDI or whatever. It'd be a good option for stories that may not support an entire novel's length and maybe even for younger readers due to lower page count and story length. It would also be a good space for Wizards to seek out new talented authors and characters for the Realms. I for one would love to be able to download a little book of Realms centered short stories onto my iPad every couple months.
From what was said at the seminars, and most especially at the Candlekeep meet-up, this is the direction that the authors/designers want the Realms to go in (and bear in mind that Ed now has more official 'say' then ever before). The Forgotten Realms is about interesting stories, not what year they are set in.
On the other hand, WotC has the final say in what we see, even if they aren't taking a direct approach in the steering of the Realms (which is being left up to Ed and others). James Wyatt, however, made it abundantly clear that WE, the fans are actually deciding what we will see, by our purchasing habits between now and the release of 5e.
So if you see something you like in the product line-up, don't just buy it. Get your friends to buy it, buy it for folks as X-mas presents, line your bird-cages with it (Richard Byers actually said something along these lines). We have to let them know what we want, and then we will see more of it. This means spending money, not just complaining on the internet.
For the first time ever, more then ever, we are literally 'voting with our wallets'. Let your voice be heard.
{interlude over}
And now its question time: Has Ed ever considered writing a sequel to his original (Zirta) story? Someone brought-up the notion of a 'serialized' story being put on the WotC site, perhaps in comic format, in order to bring-in more people to the site itself. Something along the lines of Order of the Stick, but with better art and FR-specific. I think that would be a great vehicle for an extended Zirta tale (and we'd finally get to uncover more of Filfaeril's secrets).
But we cannot buy anything until the novels and other products are acutally out, so how will they know what we like beforehand, other than what is posted on the Internet? |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 08:22:18
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| *rereads last statement* so between now and 5e counts ey? Do we have to purchase items from a specific place, or just anywhere? ex: Amazon or Barnes and Noble. |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 08:42:27
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Hint: Buy Ed Greenwood presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms. Buy copies for your friends. Buy a copy for your dog. Buy copies as X-mas presents for your great aunt Petunia.
That sends the message "Yes! This! THIS is what we want! Give us moooooore!"
And now I got this odd picture of me hunched-over in a bookstore stroking a copy, and whispering, "my precious..."
Except I look more like an Ogre then some sort of goblin (I get compared to Shrek a lot... by my own kids... tell me again why we have those?) |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 06 Sep 2012 07:41:48 |
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TBeholder
Great Reader
2428 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 12:22:43
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quote:
Originally posted by Barastir
Is tht the Dretch that is a demon (tanar'ri) or devil (baatezu) in 2e?
Dretch is a Least Tanar'ri.
Though equating one to (another) is wrong. That is a classification by the Clueless sages and this is a race (of course, they vary wildly, but still have common traits). E.g. quasit and bebilith are Chaotic Evil fiends and retriever is a Chaotic Evil fiendish living construct, but neither of them is a Tanar'ri. Conversely, about 1/5 of Alu-fiends are said to be non-evil, and theoretically one can be born and raised wholly on the Prime, but she would still be a Lesser Tanar'ri.
quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
And now I got this odd picture of me hunched-over in a bookstore stroking a copy, and whispering, "my precious..."
Except I look more like an Ogre then a some sort of goblin (I get compared to Shrek a lot... by my own kids... tell me again why we have those?)
IIRC, originally this guy ate goblins when he could catch them, right? So maybe he was gaunt, but big enough.
Which would also makes sense from artifact transformation PoV: the only "proper wearer" for the One Ring is Sauron himself, and he looked rather impressive, so it stretched the little guy as much as it could. If those goblinses were a little more sstupid and consequently Gollum could eat better, he would probably look more like a half-ogre-ling, yesss, he would.  |
People never wonder How the world goes round -Helloween
And even I make no pretense Of having more than common sense -R.W.Wood
It's not good, Eric. It's a gazebo. -Ed Whitchurch |
Edited by - TBeholder on 05 Sep 2012 14:57:32 |
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Hoondatha
Great Reader
USA
2449 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 14:49:52
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| If it comes from the Abyss, it's a tanar'ri. Period. "Demon" isn't a proper term for D&D monsters; it's a Judeo-Christian import. I don't care what 3e says, Planescape got this right. So yes, a dretch is a tanar'ri. |
Doggedly converting 3e back to what D&D should be...
Sigh... And now 4e as well. |
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Marco Volo
Learned Scribe
France
204 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 16:19:20
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Tanar'ri rules !
And thanks again to Ed and THO for the answer, great trail to an adventure :) |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 16:41:25
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quote:
Originally posted by Hoondatha
If it comes from the Abyss, it's a tanar'ri. Period. "Demon" isn't a proper term for D&D monsters; it's a Judeo-Christian import. I don't care what 3e says, Planescape got this right. So yes, a dretch is a tanar'ri.
I know that changing the terms to tanar'ri and baatezu was a way to dodge real-world religious groups getting upset, but I quite like the change. I think the names are much more interesting and certainly more distinctive. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 18:53:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Hint: Buy Ed Greenwood presents Elminster's Forgotten Realms. Buy copies for your friends. Buy a copy for your dog. Buy copies as X-mas presents for your great aunt Petunia.
That sends the message "Yes! This! THIS is what we want! Give us moooooore!"
And now I got this odd picture of me hunched-over in a bookstore stroking a copy, and whispering, "my precious..."
Except I look more like an Ogre then a some sort of goblin (I get compared to Shrek a lot... by my own kids... tell me again why we have those?)
Okay, I pre-ordered it on Amazon. If I like I'll buy it for my friends as an x-mas gift :) |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 19:57:51
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Got Elminster Enraged today.
30 pages in and the Chosen of Mystra that El meets is very interesting...
Symrustar Auglamyr
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"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
Edited by - Brimstone on 05 Sep 2012 20:00:29 |
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The Red Walker
Great Reader
USA
3567 Posts |
Posted - 05 Sep 2012 : 20:09:20
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quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Got Elminster Enraged today.
30 pages in and the Chosen of Mystra that El meets is very interesting...
Symrustar Auglamyr
Ah drats...I didn't expect to stumble on a spoiler here!.....now I have to resist urge to highlight until I start this book!
Double Drats!! I didn't realize when you quote , the hidden stuff is revealed!! Arrghhh (pulling hair emoticon please) |
A little nonsense now and then, relished by the wisest men - Willy Wonka
"We need men who can dream of things that never were." -
John F. Kennedy, speech in Dublin, Ireland, June 28, 1963
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Edited by - The Red Walker on 05 Sep 2012 20:11:35 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
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CorellonsDevout
Great Reader
USA
2708 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2012 : 05:42:11
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| Question regarding the Sundering: from what I understand based on reading Erik Scott de Bie's site, the Sundering well take place around 1486 (correct me if I'm wrong). Most (but not all) of the post-Spellpague books have been taken place 1470 or 80, and in the case of the latest Drizzt novel, 1471. Curiously, Dawnbringer extended to 1500. But anyway, since there will be six novels on the Sundering, does this mean those books will be jumping ahead some years? Since there are current events unfolding around the characters, I am not sure how we can jumped ahead to 1486 without it leaving the current events unfinished, so to speak. How exactly do you (Ed and the other authors) plan to go about this? |
Sweet water and light laughter |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2012 : 07:50:31
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Now I have like four books I have to go out and pick-up tomorrow. I was only going to get Shadowbane (because I want to read the new Shadowbane novel), and now I have to get the next two Elminster books as well (I think I have recovered from depression from the first one).
I was hoping someone would notice my idea for Alusair and Tanalasta clones... {grumble grumble}.
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
Got Elminster Enraged today.
That sounds like a death-wish. 
And before I get into trouble - did Mystryl have any Chosen, and if so, could you name any (or at least, where they were from)? Did any of them ever ascend to godhood? (this ties into my previous question). |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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George Krashos
Master of Realmslore
Australia
6666 Posts |
Posted - 06 Sep 2012 : 08:28:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
And before I get into trouble - did Mystryl have any Chosen, and if so, could you name any (or at least, where they were from)? Did any of them ever ascend to godhood? (this ties into my previous question).
Ed NDA-ed this question a while back. I doubt you'll get an answer. For the moment.
-- George Krashos
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"Because only we, contrary to the barbarians, never count the enemy in battle." -- Aeschylus |
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Questions for Ed Greenwood (2012)
Topic Locked
