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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
 Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 03:47:29
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Ok I've been researching some stuff, specifically what happend to Karsus when he turned to stone and fell to the ground after casting Karsus' Avatar spell, and have come to a startling discovery.
According to some arcanists and fanatics, that still give me creeps, over at the WOTC Faerun forum (a place I loathe going to more than any of the lower planes... ok that's actually true... a place I loathe more than any of the celestial kingdoms...better )
anyways they stated some very intresting things... That the Heart of Karsus still exists and continually pumps out heavy magic....
Now then since Heavy magic is in theory banned by Mystra and now Midnight, this leaves one theory that the Heart of Karsus and the resulting heavy magic, is a key to gainin access to the forbiden spells. The Spells higher than level Nine...... and more importantly... The ONLY level twelve spell (and the only spell that really matter  ) Karsus' Avatar!!!
Well What's people's thoughts on this? What say you of Candlekeep? Shall we go on a great Crusade to recover the Heart of Karsus and Knock Mignight off that undeserving perch she's on?! MWA HA HA HA HA HA!!
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It has to be Certain, the Gods Hate Me. For whatever irrevokable Fate, I have been made the walking Joke. Either that, or Beshaba is overlyfond Of Me.
-Unknown |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 06:14:03
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I have also read some of the 'theories' from the posters over on the forums of WotC, and you are right, they provoke some interesting ideas.
I talked about using a similar idea in my campaign with some of the players, but given the current state of the Heart of Karsus in my FR campaign, I do not think I can incorporate any of the ideas presented even if I wanted to.
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 06:19:55
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The Current state of the Heart I assume is that it is lost, aye?
Other than that I have no real information on the Heart of Karsus or of Karsus in general, only what I've learned. And I learn that he is the BEST being EVER. Who totally should be the New god of magic!!! Heck.. The Supreme all powerful, eternal God of Faerun.... But gotta start small... baby steps and all that... at least that's what my shrink tells me...   
OR... if your using another campaign you metioned then Karsus has yet to be born... (I'm not sure how many games you got going... must be nice  ) |
It has to be Certain, the Gods Hate Me. For whatever irrevokable Fate, I have been made the walking Joke. Either that, or Beshaba is overlyfond Of Me.
-Unknown |
Edited by - The Cardinal on 13 Nov 2003 06:22:05 |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 06:30:52
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I currently have three main-weekly games running - a combined FR/PS campaign, a DL campaign, and my nearing completion Ravenloft campaign. Aside from this I have two on-and-off semi-weekly games, one of which is based in my homebrew world of Amasaria, and the other is based in my hybrid Orion's Arm/Star*Drive universe.
The current state of the Heart of Karsus in my FR campaign is that it is currently located in the Negative Energy Plane, in a temple to Mystra, on the surface of the Realmspace world of Anadia. After the end of a series of FR/SJ adventures last year, the entire planet of Anadia was transported to the Negative Energy Plane - which the Heart of Karsus was indirectly responsible for. Now all that exists in Anadia's orbit is a 'Ghost' version of the world.
So basically, the Heart of Karsus could have very little effect on my FR campaign.
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Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
Scribe for the Candlekeep Compendium -- Volume IX now available (Oct 2007)
"So Saith Ed" -- the collected Candlekeep replies of Ed Greenwood
Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Lolth slayer
Acolyte
United Kingdom
39 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 11:08:15
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In my eyes, the whole Karsus thing should technically never have happened, as Mystryl was not only the goddess of magic, but also the goddess of time, therefore her foresight would have prevented karsus even researching the spell, never mind casting it. Also her control over the weave would have instantly blocked the spell if it was going to have the consequences it did.
Theres a few things about FR that bug me, like the Godswar. What sort of all powerful being like Ao would not only allow a bunch of underlings like Bane and Myrkul to steal the tablets of faith, but also inflict strife (which ironically was bane's portfolio) on the mortal population because of the actions of a couple of greedy gods.
The other inconsistency is that even after the fall of netheril, 10th level magic was still possible, but now in the modern realms it is barred,
And one of the most powerful gods, Mystra hasn't made any effort to repair the weave fully, yet shar manages to create a whole new weave in the meantime and still retain (even gain) divine power.
Why was Myth Drannor never reclaimed after the Fall? Its now 100 times more difficult to win the city back, I thought it would be common sense to reclaim the city given the amount of powerful artefacts scattered in its halls (the nether scrolls included).
Sorry to moan but it just doesn't make sense! |
I demand a recount! my contestant is a dope fiend!-
-Ahfera Derunadel, Gold elf mage after losing a magedual against a Red Wizard-
We can't stop here! This is Bat country!
-Raul Duke- |
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Cyric
Senior Scribe
Norway
388 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 16:27:50
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| yhea thats true lets just say that the goddess is stupid and she deserved to die and that Cyric is mouch better and am down on a great Crusade to recover the Heart of Karsus and Knock Mignight off that undeserving perch she's on?! MWA HA HA HA HA HA!! whahahhaahhahah |
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Mumadar Ibn Huzal
Master of Realmslore
1338 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 20:11:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Cardinal Deimos
The Current state of the Heart I assume is that it is lost, aye?
<snipped>
IIRC the heart of Karsus is one of the central items in the Return of the Archwizards series. It's current whereabouts are in the the newly formed lake in Aunaroch under the city of Shade... Courtesy of Shar. |
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The Cardinal
Senior Scribe
Canada
647 Posts |
Posted - 13 Nov 2003 : 22:22:00
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I disagree Lolth Slayer. Gods in effect allowed it to happen because like many dragons they tend to be arrogant to the ability of mortals. I feel it was right for Karsus to attempt to achieve power by any means. If beings (mortal, dragon, and power alike) continue to under estimate the power of others then tis only fair that they get knocked down if they are not wise enough to perpare for the eventual time when someone wiser or more powerful/resourceful shows up.
As for the tablets of fate. I believe Ao allowed this to happen for the simple reason to reorginize the faerunian pantheon. After all, as one Lezard Valeth has said that the Gods are static. When you live for millenia or longer, what effect can time truely have on you?
Thus making the deities mortal also had a benifical effect of forcing them to adapt. Ao needed the tablets stolen, thus he knew they were to be stolen by whom. The tablets were worthless, it was what he needed to show the gods that was important. That the people make up their true power.
The barring of 10 level magic I simply write of as Midnight's fault... (after all I figure everything can be her fault ). As for Shar's shadow weave...I belive that she has been working on it for as long as the idenity of a Goddess of magic has existed.
But my main point is really of very odd ideas. We'll take Savras. The deity of divination. Now some say he is weaker than he was before he was imprisoned and the let loose than he would have been if he had simply challenged Azuth right off. Perhaps, but then as divinations are his specialty even before imprisonment, He could have forseen a worse end (eventual neglect or something to that effect) and come up with a plan of sustained existence. Now we look at Mystryl and had Karsus just failed or even avoided the spell, the problem with the Phaerimm was getting worse, and would have eventually defeated the Netherese perhaps snuffed out magic all together. Thus we would be stuck with Gond and his inventions now. But no, the path diverged and Magic remained. The Phaerimm vanished, and they all lived happily ever after... well kinda. Still the fact was that at the time magic was vanishing and the mighty archmages were almost powerless to prevent it. Karsus did as he had to as did Mystryl. The players did their parts and quietly exited the stage to allow the grand play to roll on.
Just my humble thoughts on why things happen. The Play rolls much to the dismay or illogic of it all but then to whom does the play itself really have to answer to, eh? |
It has to be Certain, the Gods Hate Me. For whatever irrevokable Fate, I have been made the walking Joke. Either that, or Beshaba is overlyfond Of Me.
-Unknown |
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Dracandos the Spellsage
Senior Scribe
466 Posts |
Posted - 14 Nov 2003 : 02:33:48
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Hmmm...I find the idea of Karsus's heart still being in existance intriguing. Does any1 know how it was salvaged from the stone his body was transformed in2?
And as 4 Lolth Slayer, u seem 2 have raised some very good ?s and they have some good points as well...it does seem odd that Lord Ao would allow the Tablets 2 be stolen, but perhaps as Cardinal Deimos said, he may have been allowing it 2 send a message 2 the gods |
Death strips away the masks men don to hide their true nature - The Slayer's Guide to Undead
The Lord of Murder shall perish, but in his doom he shall spawn a score of mortal progeny. Chaos shall be sown from their passage - So Sayeth the Wise Alaundo
Whenever magic one doth weave, 'tis never ever wise to deceive - Elminster
Strength and power come from knowing and controlling what others do not, but never reveal all that you know - Vecna
I have been known to cast a blue mage spell now and again - Dracandos the Spellsage |
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The 'Holy Grail' of Faerun
