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Light
Learned Scribe
Australia
233 Posts |
 Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 07:34:02
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In just over 350 years Karsus managed to become a level 41 mage. Only, to my knowledge, one (and arguably two) others have managed to become this powerful. Ioulam over the course of a few thousand years and Srinshee, if one is to take Ed's word on it is something like level 56 (which is absolutely ludicrous and therefore should be refuted), who is at least two thousand years old.
Pg. 194, FRCS (3e..I think): "Halurrans receive public schooling until at least the age of thirteen. Screening for magical aptitude occurs at age five, and magic-capable students often master cantrips by the time they are fifteen."
Obviously any normal mage is hard pressed to advance past fourth or fifth level, but I don't care about them. How long would it take for someone like Elminster, who seems to be a fairly talented mage at the end of the day, or Khelben or someone of similar potential to become a mage level 5, 10, 20? Would they be able to become an epic level mage within a normal lifespan? Would they be old and feeble by the time they could cast an eighth level spell?
Karsus created an enclave at age 22, presuming Proctiv's Move Mountain is a level 10, he must have been level 20 or higher. Besides him the best age to level ratio I could find was Manshoon, who is something like 150 years old before the spellplague, with 25 levels under his belt.
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"A true warrior needs no sword" - Thors (Vinland Saga) |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 07:42:23
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Learning time might be extremely mutable Light; very hard to tell.
If a wizard spent most of his time devoted to adventure and the acquisition of raw power and didn't worry much about running organizations and such, he might advance far faster than someone with "things to care about" like many you have mentioned.
I've played characters who were played for roughly fifteen years in game time and never got to 9th level...and other characters who were played for five game years and reached twice that level.
From my own reading of Realms Material, there seems to be no set pattern even then. Someone who spends their whole life fighting off orcs and goblins on the edge of the Stonelands might never see 9th level; while his brother might obtain twice that in a life of adventure.
Remember one crucial point though: it isn't the talent, but the experience that determines how quickly they advance. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Light
Learned Scribe
Australia
233 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 07:53:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
Remember one crucial point though: it isn't the talent, but the experience that determines how quickly they advance.
You see this is what I don't agree with. I never/rarely think in these terms. Killing someone isn't going to magically make you stronger, someone who may have simply been unlucky etc. What if, for whatever reason, Demogorgan was to stand still, just waiting to die, while a level 1 fighter was to cut off his head. He would jump up a fair few levels I'm sure.
I always see experience gained by defeating an opponent as a tool used in-game as it would be much too difficult to implement a level development feature in any other way. I understand what you're saying, it's a reason I've heard people use when referring to why Drizzt is only level 16, because he rarely kills anything bigger than an orc. Perhaps I'm alone in seeing the realms this way but it's probably come about from primarily reading the books and other literature as opposed to actually playing it. |
"A true warrior needs no sword" - Thors (Vinland Saga) |
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Dalor Darden
Great Reader
USA
4211 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 07:55:04
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I wasn't talking about experience POINTS mate...but life experience.
Someone can have scads of talent...but if it isn't put to use and developed, they are just going to have talent and not skill. |
The Old Grey Box and AD&D for me! |
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Ayrik
Great Reader
Canada
7989 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 07:55:41
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| Whether you consider art or science, some people are more prolific than others. Not more brilliant nor talented, just more driven. |
[/Ayrik] |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 07:58:54
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| I think it's both- and something a little more. Drive. A mage who is driven to discover more, to learn and do more, and to try new things or try old things in new ways would probably advance a lot faster than one who is content just to lob the same old fireball every time there is a battle. Karsus and others like him (and Srinshee really IS that powerful- read El in Myth Drannor, and tell me she ain't!) got to those levels because they have that spark of genius- some might call it madness- that separates them from other spell-casters. They are able to think outside the box, precisely because they are driven to do what others have never done. They want to achieve more than other mages, to be REMEMBERED. |
The Goddess is alive, and magic is afoot.
"Where Science ends, Magic begins" -Spiral, Uncanny X-Men #491
"You idiots! You've captured their STUNT doubles!" -Spaceballs
Lothir's character background/stats: http://forum.candlekeep.com/pop_profile.asp?mode=display&id=5469
My stories:
http://z3.invisionfree.com/Mickeys_Comic_Tavern/index.php?showforum=188
Lothir, courtesy of Sylinde (Deviant Art)/Luaxena (Chosen of Eilistraee)
http://sylinde.deviantart.com/#/d2z6e4u |
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Light
Learned Scribe
Australia
233 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 08:10:30
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalor Darden
I wasn't talking about experience POINTS mate...but life experience.
Someone can have scads of talent...but if it isn't put to use and developed, they are just going to have talent and not skill.
 Sorry for misinterpreting
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis and a bunch of other people
It's about drive.
I knew this would crop up somewhere. Okay how about this. How long would it take for someone who is talented, doing crazy stuff a.k.a adventuring and driven as all hell to tear through those levels.
quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
...and Srinshee really IS that powerful- read El in Myth Drannor, and tell me she ain't!
Literature can be deceiving. Remember Drizzt? Yeah I'm talking about that guy who's constantly referred to as one of the best fighters in the realms. Guess what, he's only level 16 in a sea of level 20+ fighters.
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"A true warrior needs no sword" - Thors (Vinland Saga) |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Light
Learned Scribe
Australia
233 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 09:38:48
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| I find that level 35 (which is the official stats or maybe it's just 30) is quite powerful enough. |
"A true warrior needs no sword" - Thors (Vinland Saga) |
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Portella
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
247 Posts |
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Firestorm
Senior Scribe
Canada
826 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 19:30:19
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quote:
Originally posted by Light
In just over 350 years Karsus managed to become a level 41 mage. Only, to my knowledge, one (and arguably two) others have managed to become this powerful. Ioulam over the course of a few thousand years and Srinshee, if one is to take Ed's word on it is something like level 56 (which is absolutely ludicrous and therefore should be refuted), who is at least two thousand years old.
Pg. 194, FRCS (3e..I think): "Halurrans receive public schooling until at least the age of thirteen. Screening for magical aptitude occurs at age five, and magic-capable students often master cantrips by the time they are fifteen."
Obviously any normal mage is hard pressed to advance past fourth or fifth level, but I don't care about them. How long would it take for someone like Elminster, who seems to be a fairly talented mage at the end of the day, or Khelben or someone of similar potential to become a mage level 5, 10, 20? Would they be able to become an epic level mage within a normal lifespan? Would they be old and feeble by the time they could cast an eighth level spell?
Karsus created an enclave at age 22, presuming Proctiv's Move Mountain is a level 10, he must have been level 20 or higher. Besides him the best age to level ratio I could find was Manshoon, who is something like 150 years old before the spellplague, with 25 levels under his belt.
One has to wonder how Szass Tam became Epic level CR31 by age 270. |
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Kentinal
Great Reader
4688 Posts |
Posted - 13 Mar 2011 : 20:56:29
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Apples and Oranges.
Rules for NPCs are different then PCs.
It also depends of version.
In First magic-users earned experience points for crafting a magical item.
In third that Wizards lost experience points for doing the same thing.
Game mechanic uses a simple matrix or how people gain levels in all Editions. Killing 20,000 Orcs does not make a character better at fire building, farming or other professions or skills that improve with level. It is inferred the the mage is trying to learn how to cast a new spell and finally does it when reaching the next level. |
"Small beings can have small wisdom," the dragon said. "And small wise beings are better than small fools. Listen: Wisdom is caring for afterwards."
"Caring for afterwards ...? Ker repeated this without understanding.
"After action, afterwards," the dragon said. "Choose the afterwards first, then the action. Fools choose action first."
"Judgement" copyright 2003 by Elizabeth Moon |
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Learning time for a talented mage
