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Jelennet
Learned Scribe
Russia
131 Posts |
 Posted - 03 May 2010 : 07:56:48
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I'm not sure if this is the right place for such a question, but I tried to ask it on other sites and nobody anwsered me. So, please, help me.
Forgoten Realms wikia says that sorcerers have an inborn talent for magic and wizards learn spellcasting from hard studying.
And here is a quote from Elaine Cunningham's "Daughter of the drow":
"Few drow femalesat least in Menzoberranzanhave the sort of innate magical talent needed for wizardry," she responded.
Do wizards need an innate magical talent for spellcasting? But that reminds me about sorcerers... Then what's the difference between a wizard and a sorcerer?
If so, then what kind of talent is it and why it isn't menioned in the wikia?
Or any person with high intellect can become a wizard after special training?
Myself, I'm intelligent.
I had the highest marks between the graduates in my school, also graduted from college with highest marks...
Does that mean that I could be a wizard in Forgotten Realms? And how high my intelligence would be?
Sorry for my poor english, it is not my first language.
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 08:13:26
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Yes, intellect is the major prerequisite, but it is needed to understand the chaotic order of Weave and mechanics of spellbinding to choose the right channel to summon the power of Weave. Then you use the power of your mind (intellect again) with enough concentration to form the arcane rune in your mind, having the spell remembered in your mind. That is very hard process, so not everyone can do it. People without such talents can study the magic for years, not having any results except for cantrips.
The sorcerers have innate ability, that makes them control the Weave with the power of their will, soul (charisma). That is why they do not need the intellect and years of study. The same is for the bards, that use the power of their heart to form the arcane spell.
At least I look like that from the position of 3ed. But the knowledge about wizards (mages) is basic for all editions. My speculation in very possible ways can be false, so please, fellow scribes, correct me on some mistakes. |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 08:15:48
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Theres nothing wrong with your english as far as I can see.
I am not the best person to answer this but until someone else steps in, here I go.
The Daughter of the Drow was written during the days of 2nd. edition Ad&d (which is the system I know best), so the sorcerers where not part of the Realms yet. If the name was used it would just be another word for mage/wizard. Drow are not my thing, but I think it has been said that the females are generally priests and the males wizards, so I think this was just a way of formulating this. I cant remember there being a question of innate talent.
A wizard casts spells by learning them from texts, memorizing the spells and then releasing the magic by various commands when needed. As far as I know sorcerers have innate magic talents, but has a far more limited diversity in spells.
Any member of a race with magical aptitude can be trained as a wizard if he or she is at least of medium intelligent (9 in AD&D), but a teacher is needed. The higher the intelligence the higher the chance of learning a spell and the higher the max spell-level one can learn.
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 08:44:43
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Somehow, I like the 3rd ed more. It makes more sense with making sorcerers with charisma as basic characteristics.
Not everything is written in the wiki. Some information maybe false. It is safer to use manuals and guides to find that. But I don't know which one is better. Little help here? |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Jelennet
Learned Scribe
Russia
131 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 09:01:23
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| Guys, I will be very happy if you'll tell me in which books I can find information about wizards and sorcerors. They are my favorite classes! |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 09:44:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Jelennet
Guys, I will be very happy if you'll tell me in which books I can find information about wizards and sorcerors. They are my favorite classes!
Are we talking gaming products, novels or both? |
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Jelennet
Learned Scribe
Russia
131 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 09:53:28
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| Both. |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 09:58:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Jelennet
Guys, I will be very happy if you'll tell me in which books I can find information about wizards and sorcerors. They are my favorite classes!
Most start from Elminster series, but there are many novels to read. To get the pile of advices, post on the Forgotten Realms Book Club. |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 10:05:11
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I am talking about 2nd edition gaming sources here. Complete book of Wizards (a general book), Forgotten Realms Adventures, Pages from the Mages, and Volo's guide to all things magical are great. All of these can be found used at reasonable prices on the net. Try Noble knight games, the Volo guide is a free download from WotC page (anyone have a link?).
You could also have a look at the Netheril box set (which I really dislike) and several products from later editions, but I am of little help there. Sorry. |
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Elfinblade
Senior Scribe
Norway
377 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 10:11:04
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| As for 3rd edition if you're playing that, Magic of Faerūn is a great book for most of the spellhurler classes. As for novels, in addition to the Elminster books mentioned above, i daresay the Blackstaff books by Steven Schend is a must. Blackstaff and Blackstaff Tower to be more precise. |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 10:39:30
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| By the way, Jelennet, I am glad that there is someone who is interested in D&D in such country. The wish to gain knowledge on original language is a worthy quest. Try to download something with filestube. |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Edited by - Sill Alias on 03 May 2010 10:43:52 |
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Jelennet
Learned Scribe
Russia
131 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 10:44:03
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| Oh? Why? And what's wrong with Russia? |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 10:49:41
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I started to read the novels about Drizzt on russian. Then I read on English. After that I started to despise the translators that cripple the names and sense of D&D. They even started destroying the original texts after translating! That is why it is so hard for me to find the novels.
I would type it in russian if the site would support the language. |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Jelennet
Learned Scribe
Russia
131 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 11:01:01
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In my opinion Jarlaxle sounds better and more interesting than Jarlaxe (that's how they translated his name into russian).
You said that the traslators even started to destroy the original texts after translating... I've never heard about it! What does it mean? Why did they do it? |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 03 May 2010 : 11:07:19
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GREED
Or so I think. Most population reads on russian after all. But let us forget an off topic matter. There are nice posts, forgotten deep in the site. Try to use the search function of site or page them manually. And I don't think your english is poor. |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31799 Posts |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36891 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2010 : 00:03:11
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
the Volo guide is a free download from WotC page (anyone have a link?).
I do, I do! 
Oh, you actually want me to share it, don't you? 
the Wizards downloads page |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
Edited by - Wooly Rupert on 04 May 2010 00:03:30 |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 04 May 2010 : 16:41:33
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quote:
Originally posted by Wooly Rupert
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
the Volo guide is a free download from WotC page (anyone have a link?).
I do, I do!
Oh, you actually want me to share it, don't you?
the Wizards downloads page
Yes; unless its missing of course.
Ouf, that's probably the worst joke ever in any forum. I think I will ask The Hooded one to punish me for that one. |
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Nicolai Withander
Master of Realmslore
Denmark
1093 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2010 : 21:58:15
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Even thou wizards lean from training and studying, They still need to have magical talent. Its like with harry potter. Not everyone is born wizard or witch! Most can learn bot only some are good at it.
Its kind of hard to explain.
What I mean is that if our hero; a fighter with 20 intelligence read a spell from my spellbook, it would not make him cast the spell. He would need years of training tapping into the weave and controling the energies in spell casting. The power and training needed to create s fireball is massive. And even a very smart person can not just make fire from nothing. So in short any spell caster has to have some sort of innate magical talent!
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3248 Posts |
Posted - 06 May 2010 : 22:02:07
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quote:
Originally posted by Nicolai Withander
Even thou wizards lean from training and studying, They still need to have magical talent. Its like with harry potter. Not everyone is born wizard or witch! Most can learn bot only some are good at it.
Its kind of hard to explain.
What I mean is that if our hero; a fighter with 20 intelligence read a spell from my spellbook, it would not make him cast the spell. He would need years of training tapping into the weave and controling the energies in spell casting. The power and training needed to create s fireball is massive. And even a very smart person can not just make fire from nothing. So in short any spell caster has to have some sort of innate magical talent!
Years or training or (3E) to go up one level and take Wizard or (4E) taking a feat to cast rituals. |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Alystra Illianniis
Great Reader
USA
3750 Posts |
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Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2010 : 06:40:56
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Pwent definitely won't cast anything! |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 07 May 2010 : 16:36:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Alystra Illianniis
Yeah, I'd have to say one would need some sort of talent to cast spells regardless. Otherwise every half-intelligent character in the Realms would be using magic. I don't see someone like Bruenor using it, even if he is smart enough. He just doesn't have the talent. (Sorry, he was the first one that came to mind.)
That's like saying it takes a special talent to fly a plane or else everyone would fly their own jet-planes. With years of training and high cost, yes most people could, but how many wants to make the sacrifices?
Bruenor was of course never meant to cast spells. He is a Ad&d dwarf and couldn't cast a spell if his beard depended on it |
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A noob's question about the nature of wizards
