| Author |
 Topic  |
|
Ionik Knight
Learned Scribe
USA
222 Posts |
 Posted - 12 Sep 2010 : 10:29:53
|
"War is cruelty. There's no use trying to reform it, the crueler it is the
sooner it will be over."
-William Tecumseh Sherman |
Fools to right of them,
Jesters to left of them,
Clowns in front of them
Pun'd and parody'd. |
 |
|
|
bladeinAmn
Learned Scribe
199 Posts |
Posted - 12 Sep 2010 : 18:46:33
|
Alright I got it now! Silly I didn't get it the 1st time. Thanx ppl!
Edit: Kinda funny its two ppl w/the Thayvian Red Wizard Edwin Odessiron's avatar writing the two last posts! LOL! |
Edited by - bladeinAmn on 12 Sep 2010 18:48:57 |
|
|
|
Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2010 : 05:48:28
|
I do not agree with you Icelander. If you mean to win fast before something bad will happen, its okay. BUT, if you mean to win at all cost with every kind magic thrown on the field...I read Avatars and I am completely against it. Throwing magic without thinking about consequences is the worst case scenario. What will happen if you try to smash the ultimate attacking spell with ultimate defensive spell? They both crush as in the legend about the sword and shield, but with BIG, not good aftereffects. Magic is not an all around instrument.
Desolate dessert, Wild magic or wild cataclysm zones where only elemental fury can survive. Any other examples? Maybe rift to the primordials plane? Gate to the Abyss? |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
|
|
|
|
Icelander
Master of Realmslore
1864 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2010 : 06:56:40
|
In a war, something bad is always happening. People are dying, land is lying fallow, women are being raped, commerce is interrupted, etc.
There is no end to the misery that warfare causes. So if you possibly can, avoid it.
Yes, catastrophe is not only a possible result of all-out magic use by both sides in a war, it is likely. Does that mean you shouldn't use the strongest magic you can to end a war faster? No, it doesn't. The only thing worse than the terrible cost of winning a war is the cost of losing one.
What it does mean is that the decision to resort to violence to pursue political objectives should be weighted extremely carefully. In a world of magic that can summon massive tsumanis which sink nations and create killing storms that despoil lands forever*, the horrors of war are even greater than in our world.
Ideally, the risk of these spells being used against their lands and population will make sane leaders abhor war as anything other than the last resort. In a perfect world, perhaps someone could then arrange to have sane leaders become the norm.
*Yes, those things are usually done by elves. Elves have traditionally not valued the life of other species particularly highly and thought little of killing thousands and millions if it served their purposes. Come to think of it, they don't seem to value elven life too higly either, as long as it is not someone they know. |
Za uspiekh nashevo beznadiozhnovo diela!
Forgotten Realms fans, please sign a petition to re-release the FR Interactive Atlas
|
|
|
|
Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2010 : 07:14:34
|
| Still, that s not good decision about using armageddon spells to dispatch the enemy forces or something. And I am not that idealistic to think that all will be in peace, but mass usage of the high lv magic in war is unacceptable. You need at least wisdom 18 before casting the 5th or higher lv spells to prevent someone's idiocy from destroying the world you wanna to save. Accidental destruction of legendary powerful magical artifact for example. |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
|
|
|
|
idilippy
Senior Scribe
USA
417 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2010 : 07:40:03
|
I have to side with Icelander on this, not being willing to use the magic you have on hand to end the hostilities as quickly as possible is an insult to the soldiers dying on both sides. This is especially true in a world where the most destructive of spells attainable by men are not world shattering in scope. A 6th-9th level spell isn't going to have enough of an impact on the world to justify not using it if the option is there. As an example, say your kingdom is being overrun by an orc horde. The horde has 30,000 troops to your 1,000-2,000 active troops and 5,000 militia, but is also home to an archmage with the ability to cast Meteor Swarm or Incendiary Cloud. Is he supposed to restrict himself to fireballs and lightning bolts out of some misguided form of mercy(and are these spells any better to cast than high level ones)? If so, why?
What appreciable difference is there between his use of Meteor Swarm and Incendiary Cloud and a Fireball or Cloudkill spell? What about Summoning an Elemental or Casting Dominate Monster and converting a dragon to your cause? Is casting sleep and slitting the throats of those who fall amoral, if so what makes this better than attacking from ambush or using the terrain to your advantage. In short, magic is just a tool and its use in war, just like the use of any other tactic, technological device, or weapon, should be utilized as effectively as possible to bring the fighting to a close. Not using the most effective magic available against the orc horde in my example would be like dismantling your armored cavalry because the orcs only use infantry, or refusing to attack from ambush or slay their leader through stealth to break up the horde. |
|
|
|
Sill Alias
Senior Scribe
Kazakhstan
588 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2010 : 07:45:59
|
| I could care less about attackers ilk, they can die as you see fit. No mercy to attackers, they summoned it to themselves. What I say is, you should use magic that will not make the land you live in a parody on hell, which could be worse than after attack of the orcs. Maybe that sounds druidish of me, but be good with nature. Please? |
You can hear many tales from many mouths. The most difficult is to know which of them are not lies. - Sill Alias
"May your harp be unstrung, your dreams die and all your songs be unsung." - curse of the harper, The Code of the Harpers 2 ed.
|
|
|
|
idilippy
Senior Scribe
USA
417 Posts |
Posted - 13 Sep 2010 : 08:12:53
|
| Heh, pretty selective ethics if any magic is ok against the attackers, in war it gets pretty murky and hard to tell who is the attacker or "at fault". |
|
|
|
Topic |
|
|
|
The Ethics of Magic in War
