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Raith
Seeker
USA
76 Posts |
 Posted - 20 Aug 2009 : 15:43:19
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Hi there all! I was wondering if anybody knew which real-world accents would best be attached to which areas in the Realms. So far I know that Thay is Russian, and I think Sembia is...French? (Help me out especially on this one, it's something thats been driving me nuts)
Anybody know this one? I know its a tall order. Thanks a lot!
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"Power and dominion are taken by the Will. By divine right Hail and Kill!" |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 20 Aug 2009 : 16:03:59
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| The main accent for the Realms seems to be Scottish for the dwarves. Just think Sean Connery. In Balder's Gate, Drizzt sounded like an English public schoolboy so maybe the Menzoberrozanyr sound like Old Etonians, which would explain the whips at least. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 20 Aug 2009 : 16:40:35
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The real world-to-Realms similarities are a bit difficult to pin down and would never be all that accurate. I would suggest just working out the accents that feel best for you personally.
I seem to remember there having been a few threads earlier that took up the subject of similarities between Realms areas and Earth cultures though, so do a quick search. |
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Herkles
Seeker
82 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2009 : 03:29:27
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| I have been wondering how would the non humans accents would sound like. For instance, what of Drow, Sun Elves, gold dwarves, duergar, etc. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 21 Aug 2009 : 10:58:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Herkles
I have been wondering how would the non humans accents would sound like. For instance, what of Drow, Sun Elves, gold dwarves, duergar, etc.
That's one of the reasons I never did the accent thing; either you just do it with a couple of groups(and why do they single themselves out?) or you will drive yourself insane(and either give your players fits of hysteric laughter or get things thrown at you)trying to figure all of them out. |
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Auzoros
Seeker
Australia
97 Posts |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2009 : 11:42:38
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Other than dwarves speaking "scottish" I haven't detected any pattern as to real-world accents being used for various parts of the realms - the halfling henchman in Neverwinter Nights who's from Calimport speaks with a "Movie-cockney"though.
(And if I were to DM a dwarf he'd speak with a german accent - at least if he was there for comic effect). |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2009 : 13:09:21
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quote:
Originally posted by Herkles
I have been wondering how would the non humans accents would sound like. For instance, what of Drow, Sun Elves, gold dwarves, duergar, etc.
They would probably have the same wide variety of accent that humans have. There is no reason to think that drow from the northern Underdark would sound like those from the south. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2009 : 13:12:41
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quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
(And if I were to DM a dwarf he'd speak with a german accent - at least if he was there for comic effect).
And when wouldn't a dwarf be there for comic effect?  After all, they were funny enough for Leo X. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Raith
Seeker
USA
76 Posts |
Posted - 22 Aug 2009 : 19:54:10
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| Thanks Azurous, this link is a big help! |
"Power and dominion are taken by the Will. By divine right Hail and Kill!" |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 24 Aug 2009 : 11:58:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
(And if I were to DM a dwarf he'd speak with a german accent - at least if he was there for comic effect).
And when wouldn't a dwarf be there for comic effect? After all, they were funny enough for Leo X.
Probably at the same time someone speaking Swedish with a German accent isn't there for comic effect - which would be my brother's wedding...
And sorry for further off-topicness, who is Leo X? |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 24 Aug 2009 : 17:16:26
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quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
And sorry for further off-topicness, who is Leo X?
Pope Leo X would be my best guess, but I could be wrong. |
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swifty
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
517 Posts |
Posted - 24 Aug 2009 : 23:22:34
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| being from england where there is a different accent every 20 miles its not hard for me to picture different characters talkin different.it does seem though that every author gives a sailor a west country english accent.think of the capn from the simpsons.aaarrggghhh. |
go back to sleep america.everything is under control.heres american gladiators.watch this.shuttup. BILL HICKS. |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 25 Aug 2009 : 16:36:40
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quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
And sorry for further off-topicness, who is Leo X?
One of the Medici popes. Notable for being a patron of the arts, a thrower of lavish feasts and fond of dwarves as a source of entertainment. For some reason Martin Luther took exception to him. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 25 Aug 2009 : 16:38:43
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quote:
Originally posted by swifty
being from england where there is a different accent every 20 miles
Although, Estuary English seems to be spreading its horrible sounds everywhere nowadays. I'm from England originally, I live in Germany now where the accents are as varied. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Kajehase
Great Reader
Sweden
2104 Posts |
Posted - 26 Aug 2009 : 14:27:36
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Kajehase
And sorry for further off-topicness, who is Leo X?
Pope Leo X would be my best guess, but I could be wrong.
Ah. I read Leo "eks" rather than Leo the Tenth. |
There is a rumour going around that I have found god. I think is unlikely because I have enough difficulty finding my keys, and there is empirical evidence that they exist.
Terry Pratchett |
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swifty
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
517 Posts |
Posted - 26 Aug 2009 : 22:57:24
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
quote:
Originally posted by swifty
being from england where there is a different accent every 20 miles
Although, Estuary English seems to be spreading its horrible sounds everywhere nowadays. I'm from England originally, I live in Germany now where the accents are as varied.
im from liverpool.no chance we will get it up here. |
go back to sleep america.everything is under control.heres american gladiators.watch this.shuttup. BILL HICKS. |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 27 Aug 2009 : 16:09:47
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quote:
Originally posted by swifty
im from liverpool.no chance we will get it up here.
I'm from the Peak district originally.
You're right, Scouse is an accent that won't get shifted, which is a good thing!  |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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swifty
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
517 Posts |
Posted - 27 Aug 2009 : 23:24:53
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
quote:
Originally posted by swifty
im from liverpool.no chance we will get it up here.
I'm from the Peak district originally.
You're right, Scouse is an accent that won't get shifted, which is a good thing!
i think geordies safe as well. |
go back to sleep america.everything is under control.heres american gladiators.watch this.shuttup. BILL HICKS. |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
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swifty
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
517 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 11:15:02
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| the worst case of an accent being used in the realms was in pools of darkness.one of banes minions says "you gotta get tough with these bums".certain accents work well within the realms but i haave a problem with a member of the nine hells sounding like joe pesci. |
go back to sleep america.everything is under control.heres american gladiators.watch this.shuttup. BILL HICKS. |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 12:16:39
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I would expect a wild variety of accents and dialects within the various human and racial languages of the Realms. Rashemen and the Bloodstone Lands seems to have a Slavic touch, the Moonshae's a Welsh one etc.. Obviously, one should be clear about this here: we are talking about the accent of Common of those people, right? Not the languages themselves. As in deviations from "High Common", like deviations from RP/BBC English, High German et al?!
I for one regard Common as the Lingua Franca of the Realms and people who speak Aglarondan (e.g. Russian) may have no idea what a Rashemi (e.g. Czech) is babbling about, or a Shaaran (e.g. Mongolian) speaker. Likewise with a sun elf who is trying to talk to a wild elf or a drow. Different languages them all, so one has to spend points and time (sic!) learning them. |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gæð a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerûn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 28 Aug 2009 12:18:32 |
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 12:42:01
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Some languages may be related and have a large degree of intelligibility. I think it was Mark Twain who said a language was just a dialect with an army. In Europe, you see dialect continuums, for example Dutch moving through to Bayerisch. Platte Deutsch shares a lot with Dutch (which has its own accents such as Brabants, Limburgs, Gronings). I overheard someone speaking Danish last weekend and I could just about make out what she was saying. From a historical point of view, the Viking invasions of England left little real trace in Danelaw but had a big effect in the Celtic countries. One reason for this was the similarity between Anglo-Saxon and Norse. Apparently, Danes, Swedes and Norwegians can all understand one another (although I don't know for sure.)
If you travel south from Paris, you'll encounter (or did) Occitan, Catalan then Spanish. The languages have enough to make them sound different but certainly written down they all look to have had a shared ancestor. Swifty mentioned Geordie, which is nigh on unintelligible to most English speakers, yet over the border the speakers of Scots understand them fairly well.
So to return to the Realms, it could well be that what we see as separate languages could have reasonable degrees of intelligibility. I'd have to look at the books, of course, (and I'm sure these has already been debated and I'll proven wrong).
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Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 15:33:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
Apparently, Danes, Swedes and Norwegians can all understand one another (although I don't know for sure.)
To a degree. But the dialects (especially in Sweden and Norway) are so varied that it can be a problem of understanding each other within each country.
The Norwegian situation is one with two (in addition to the various Sami languages) written languages no one really speaks and numerous dialects that are spoken, but not written.
Ok, sorry for going of-topic.
But to bring it back to the Realms. Where did the idea that the people of Rashemen where Slavonic come from? Its not in the Grey box and it is not in the Dreams of the Red Wizards book. |
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Bluenose
Learned Scribe
United Kingdom
134 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 19:29:45
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quote:
Originally posted by Herkles
I have been wondering how would the non humans accents would sound like. For instance, what of Drow, Sun Elves, gold dwarves, duergar, etc.
Drow have clearly got to have an Australian accent.
They come from a land down under, where men are cowed and women thunder.
Giant poisonous spiders everywhere.
You've even got an equivalent to Steve Irwin in Drizzt, everyone else thinks Australians are like that while the Australians/Drow would rather forget him.
And to quote a New Zealander, all Australians are spider-worshippers governed by religious she-zealots. |
These, in the day when heaven was falling,
The hour when earth's foundations fled,
Followed their mercenary calling
And took their wages and are dead.
Their shoulders held the sky suspended;
They stood, and earth's foundations stay;
What God abandoned, these defended,
And saved the sum of things for pay. |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36804 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 19:33:49
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluenose
Drow have clearly got to have an Australian accent.
They come from a land down under, where men are cowed and women thunder.
Giant poisonous spiders everywhere.
You've even got an equivalent to Steve Irwin in Drizzt, everyone else thinks Australians are like that while the Australians/Drow would rather forget him.
And to quote a New Zealander, all Australians are spider-worshippers governed by religious she-zealots.
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Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Kiaransalyn
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
762 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 19:34:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
Apparently, Danes, Swedes and Norwegians can all understand one another (although I don't know for sure.)
To a degree. But the dialects (especially in Sweden and Norway) are so varied that it can be a problem of understanding each other within each country.
The Norwegian situation is one with two (in addition to the various Sami languages) written languages no one really speaks and numerous dialects that are spoken, but not written.
I was thinking of you when I wrote that. Nynorsk and Bokmal aren't they?
I don't think we're going too far off-topic talking about real-world examples - so long as we're doing so with the intention of trying to understand how things might work in the Realms. |
Death is Life
Love is Hate
Revenge is Forgiveness
Ken: You from the States?
Jimmy: Yeah. But don't hold it against me.
Ken: I'll try not to... Just try not to say anything too loud or crass. |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 28 Aug 2009 : 20:47:03
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quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
quote:
Originally posted by Kiaransalyn
Apparently, Danes, Swedes and Norwegians can all understand one another (although I don't know for sure.)
To a degree. But the dialects (especially in Sweden and Norway) are so varied that it can be a problem of understanding each other within each country.
The Norwegian situation is one with two (in addition to the various Sami languages) written languages no one really speaks and numerous dialects that are spoken, but not written.
I was thinking of you when I wrote that. Nynorsk and Bokmal aren't they?
Yup, that's it. I am starting to get bad memories from the university here. Language is a favourite topic for political arguments in Norway, at times bordering on the ridiculous.
There is an old satiric newspaper illustration of an old Russian looking at a barricade with fighting Norwegian rebels. The text under says(more or less): Russian:"How is the revolution going here in this country?" Rebel: "Revolution? We are just now trying to decide how to spell it" |
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The Sage
Procrastinator Most High
Australia
31774 Posts |
Posted - 29 Aug 2009 : 00:21:16
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quote:
Originally posted by Bluenose
quote:
Originally posted by Herkles
I have been wondering how would the non humans accents would sound like. For instance, what of Drow, Sun Elves, gold dwarves, duergar, etc.
Drow have clearly got to have an Australian accent.
They come from a land down under, where men are cowed and women thunder.
Giant poisonous spiders everywhere.
You've even got an equivalent to Steve Irwin in Drizzt, everyone else thinks Australians are like that while the Australians/Drow would rather forget him.
And to quote a New Zealander, all Australians are spider-worshippers governed by religious she-zealots.
Hey, at least we're not from Osse. |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
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Zhoth'ilam Folio -- The Electronic Misadventures of a Rambling Sage |
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Zanan
Senior Scribe
Germany
942 Posts |
Posted - 29 Aug 2009 : 10:49:38
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quote:
Originally posted by Jorkens
But to bring it back to the Realms. Where did the idea that the people of Rashemen where Slavonic come from? Its not in the Grey box and it is not in the Dreams of the Red Wizards book.
Mostly names. Have a look into the Spellbound - Box or Elaine's books, Unapproachable East, the monsters that hang about there. Fjodor, huts on one leg, rusalka monsters etc..
I would assume that speaking about real world language issues and developement will not cause the admins to intervene, as it may give a broader perspective about languages in the Realms may "work".
Speaking of which, English, German (and all accents and dialects thereof), and Dutch all come from the Western branch of Germanic, whereas Norwegian, Danish and Swedish developed from the Northern branch. To the Southern branch belonged - amongst others - Goth/ic, though that more or less died out ages ago. What differentiates English from German are the sound shift and tons of loans from Norman-French and early medieval Danish/Norwegian. The more to the North you come in Germany, the more "English" (pronunciation-/word-wise) it gets, and it is no real wonder that Northern Germans (speaking Platt or Low German) have not that much difficulty to understand the Dutch.
On another sidenote, the more to the North you come in Britain, the less the sound change becomes apparent (compared to German, for example). That's because the northern realms of Britain were mainly settled by the Angles, whereas the southern counties belonged to the (West-)Saxons. Anglish was the prominent language of Britain when the Danes started to occupy large parts of central England (their language easily mixed with the then even closer, similar tongues) and Anglish declined somewhat in status. The English (i.e. Saxon) kings of the south (e.g. Wessex - "Western Saxony", as opposed to Essex - "East Saxony") started to push the Danes out of Britain and once that was done, Western Saxon became the dominant every-day language of England, essentially the base of most Englishes that we speak today.
The Northern part (i.e. Southern Scotland and Northern England (Northumbria, Cumbria, Westmorland, Cumberland et al)) remained in "Anglish" hands though and from that developed "Scots", which is not "British (i.e. West Saxon) English with a Scottish Accent", but essentially a language of its own. It features Scots Gaelic, Norwegian and Danish loans and its own Northern British (sort of Anglish) pronunciation. Since Anglish and Saxon were very close to begin with, Scots and English were/are too. "Scottish English" developed from an amalgamation of Scots and English and pushed back Scots as an everyday language over the centuries. A look at Wikipedia or google'ing Scots or e.g. Ulster Scots will give you further clues.
This all above shows you how quickly a single language can change or develop, start creating accents et al. And now remember that the Realms' history stretches far longer than the 500 years I draw your attention upon above. And they not only have regional languages, but those of races too.
NB: If you want a sample of Scots, have a look into John Barbour - The Bruce, written in the 14th century. Which will also tell you that William Wallace and Robert the Bruce were not exactly the Gaelic speaking Highlanders of Braveheart, fighting for their freedom, but to a large extend Scots-speaking Lowlanders who held and fought for possessions their predominantly Anglish (and to an extend British Celtic) forefathers claimed centuries earlier. |
Cave quid dicis, quando et cui!
Gæð a wyrd swa hio scel!
In memory of Alura Durshavin.
Visit my "Homepage" to find A Guide to the Drow NPCs of Faerûn, Drow and non-Drow PrC and much more. |
Edited by - Zanan on 29 Aug 2009 10:58:11 |
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Jorkens
Great Reader
Norway
2950 Posts |
Posted - 29 Aug 2009 : 12:31:26
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I have no problem with the development of different languages within the Realms, but I do have problems with the earthly influences pasted into the Realms. I figured it was Spellbound that first brought up the links, but was curious whether there were hints in earlier products. The idea was so idiotic it turned me of the whole area. The Russ ideas was no better. I would have thought that by that time they would have lessened the whole Real-World influence thing.
I would separate the linguistics more along the lines of Eastern Germanic (Goths, Vandals and Burgundians (I think)) and the Western Germanic. The eastern family survived to the late early 18th century in Crimea. But even these borders are a bit problematic, especially when the age is concerned as groups migrated from the same area. The north/south border would be newer in my opinion, as there are great lie. Even in the early Viking age Norse and Saxon were mutually understandable although with some emerging differences.
One encounters some of the same problems with the P-Celtic and Q-Celtic border in the British Isles. In many ways linguistics are still struggling with some of the borders set up during the Romantic age, especially when it concerns hypothetical proto-versions of languages.
Now I remember why I did better in the literature-focusing parts of my studies. Poetry is peanuts compared to linguistics and language developments.
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Realms Accents
