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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Aug 2009 : 07:14:06
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First, I have not yet read Paul Kemp's "Twilight War" trilogy.  I know, I need to get my butt in gear.
What I'm wondering is, is there a source for what happens in Sembia after the events of this trilogy? Because I haven't yet read the books, I don't know exactly what happens in Sembia yet, but my thoughts for my (un-Spellplagued) timeline are that the war completely shatters Sembia's economic infrastructure, and the entire nation is annexed and rebuilt by Cormyr. In 1387, the new King Azoun V signs the Dales Compact on behalf of Cormyr, and pledges to recognize and defend the autonomy of the Dales.
So... how compatible is my vision with what happens in the novels? I plan on reading them as soon as I can find copies, so no big spoilers please.  Obviously, in canon, Sembia survives as a nation, but I'm wondering how close it came to dissolution.
Thanks!
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Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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Darkmeer
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2009 : 16:35:09
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Disclaimer: (I've not read the Twilight War trilogy, so I can't really provide any spoilers)
Ahem: If you don't want the spellplague, look up Anatomy of an Apocalypse in Alaundo's Library, which deals with averting the spellplague entirely. Wonderful resource, that is. I'm sure Sage or Wooly have a link handy for that (I always mess it up due to the frames).
Anyhoo, you're left with several different scenarios for Sembia. Sembia could lose, and lose big. Sembia could win big, or somewhere in between. I don't see Cormyr coming into Sembia, that would be too much of a stretch for the military. Some covert stuff, yes, but nothing that the Sembians would generally recognize as "help."
My thought is that the Shades actually win in Sembia. This provides several power groups in the area with reason to conduct operations in Sembia. The Cormyreans would try to stop the shades, but have the shades breathing down their neck. Shadowdale, et all, are all tied up with Zhent raids and the Shades, meaning that it is left to the folk of Featherdale and Tasseldale to stop the encroaching Shades in their woods. I can even see a non-spider-kissing drow allying with the dalesmen in this scenario. This could make at least part of the drow on the surface more welcome. Not pleasantly welcome, but welcome enough to stop the genocidal battles going on right now.
So, at the end of this, you have at least the following power groups involved in a great dalelands campaign:
Purple Dragons and War Wizards (covertly assisting the dales)
Lathanderites, Tymorans, Red Knight's church, Helm's church, and Temus' church all assisting the defenses of the dales, with Selune's and Eilistrae's churches providing nighttime backup.
Vhaerunite Drow raiding the Shades to the South. They recognize that the Shades are bad news for everyone, and they will lose everything if old Cormanthor is destroyed (as the shades likely want). They also have a healthy distrust for the Zhents, whom I would say would be trying to burn down their forest home, which makes them enemies.
Shades and Zhents: These guys make long term plans, and make them work well. They could be allied with the
Zhents, or they could be competing in a power grab for the whole region (more likely). This would mean that even the Zhents and Shades would be attacking each other from time to time. If they are allies, this means that the Zhents would be attacking from the north, the Shades from the south, and covert stuff coming from Anauroch from the northwest. And that's just for the Dales.
If the Dales fall, then it's on to Cormyr, which Cormyr doesn't want, so they are assisting the dales, even as proud as dalesfolk are. So, these folk are trying to keep the dales a "sovereign nation" of sorts, making this all much more interesting.
The Eldeth Veluuthra: This could be interesting, depending on which way their hate flows, perhaps some could be convinced that the vile things invading their forest are a good thing, especially since they are defending it with their lives as well. So, it's possible that they would attack the shades, and the Zhentarim, but fewer dalesmen. (Not sure on this one)
The Elven Court: With the refounding of the elven court, it's very possible that the elves will help, especially on the northern edges of the forest. This helps in two ways: 1) They stay away from the Vhaerunite Drow to the south. 2) They are some of the best spellcasters and archers (although the dalesfolk are no slouches at that). This could turn the tide against the Zhentarim, and possibly even the Shades.
I hope this helps.
/d |
"These people are my family, not just friends, and if you want to get to them you gotta go through ME." |
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Penknight
Senior Scribe
USA
538 Posts |
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Brimstone
Great Reader
USA
3287 Posts |
Posted - 18 Aug 2009 : 18:22:31
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
First, I have not yet read Paul Kemp's "Twilight War" trilogy. I know, I need to get my butt in gear.
Well snap to it you!
I thought they were great novels.
See your Skeleton of Cormyr Lineage Scroll, I left you something special. |
"These things also I have observed: that knowledge of our world is
to be nurtured like a precious flower, for it is the most precious
thing we have. Wherefore guard the word written and heed
words unwritten and set them down ere they fade . . . Learn
then, well, the arts of reading, writing, and listening true, and they
will lead you to the greatest art of all: understanding."
Alaundo of Candlekeep |
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The Simbul
Learned Scribe
173 Posts |
Posted - 19 Aug 2009 : 07:27:24
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First, to Jakk and Darkmeer: you mostly certainly need to read the Twilight War.
Second, much of what happens to Sembia after the civil war and the Shadowstorm is summarized in the Campaign Guide. Essentially the realm is slowly absorbed into Netheril.
Third, the Spellplague would have had little influence on Sembia's ultimate fate, since Mystra was not one of the gods openly meddling therein. Mystra and her servants had far too many other matters to deal with circa 1375 to become involved in what appeared to be a civil war among merchant families. Among other things the Shades came very close to killing Mystra outright thanks to a little beech tree growing in the Solarium of Windsong Tower, a full decade before Cyric had his opportunity. The only point where there was any realistic possibility of Mystra's Chosen becoming involved was during the Shadowstorm itself, at which point Telamont feared the event would draw them into the conflict and thus ruin his otherwise subtle plans to conquer Sembia from behind the scenes. |
Edited by - The Simbul on 19 Aug 2009 07:38:11 |
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 19 Aug 2009 : 08:10:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Darkmeer
Disclaimer: (I've not read the Twilight War trilogy, so I can't really provide any spoilers)
Ahem: If you don't want the spellplague, look up Anatomy of an Apocalypse in Alaundo's Library, which deals with averting the spellplague entirely. Wonderful resource, that is. I'm sure Sage or Wooly have a link handy for that (I always mess it up due to the frames).
<chop>
I hope this helps.
/d
Thanks for all the scenario development, Darkmeer; I have all kinds of ideas now. I already knew about "Anatomy of an Apocalypse" and have already downloaded and thoroughly read it. Now, you and I have a novel trilogy to read. I need to obtain the books first; preferably through my local library, as the last thing I need is to buy more books, with all of the 3.x stuff I've been picking up on the cheap lately.
The Simbul: I'm not a big fan of canon on this point. Even with the Shades being as magically powerful as they are, I can't see them maintaining a hold on Sembia between Cormyr and a refounded Cormanthyr. A much safer expansion direction for them is the north side of the Moonsea, especially if they've already obliterated Zhentil Keep and the Citadel of the Raven. I see the northern border of Cormyr and the northern/western border of Cormanthyr and the Dalelands as holding fairly steady, and Netheril having an easier time of it going northeast as mentioned, or southwest into the Western Heartlands south of the High Forest. Just my assessment of the balance of power; I'll have to read the Twilight War before I make any final decisions on the matter, obviously. I've had far too many fellow scribes say "you MUST read these books" for me not to read them at this point.
quote:
Originally posted by Brimstone
See your Skeleton of Cormyr Lineage Scroll, I left you something special.
Yes, yes you did... See my reply in that scroll. I can't wait for the Wizboards to get back up now, so I can see what other goodness is in there... I would not be so enthused about this except for how easily almost all of that lore fits into a non-Spellplagued Realms. |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
Edited by - Jakk on 19 Aug 2009 08:21:22 |
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Darkmeer
Senior Scribe
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 19 Aug 2009 : 17:19:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Jakk
quote:
Originally posted by Darkmeer
Disclaimer: (I've not read the Twilight War trilogy, so I can't really provide any spoilers)
Ahem: If you don't want the spellplague, look up Anatomy of an Apocalypse in Alaundo's Library, which deals with averting the spellplague entirely. Wonderful resource, that is. I'm sure Sage or Wooly have a link handy for that (I always mess it up due to the frames).
<chop>
I hope this helps.
/d
Thanks for all the scenario development, Darkmeer; I have all kinds of ideas now. I already knew about "Anatomy of an Apocalypse" and have already downloaded and thoroughly read it. Now, you and I have a novel trilogy to read. I need to obtain the books first; preferably through my local library, as the last thing I need is to buy more books, with all of the 3.x stuff I've been picking up on the cheap lately.
The Simbul: I'm not a big fan of canon on this point. Even with the Shades being as magically powerful as they are, I can't see them maintaining a hold on Sembia between Cormyr and a refounded Cormanthyr. A much safer expansion direction for them is the north side of the Moonsea, especially if they've already obliterated Zhentil Keep and the Citadel of the Raven. I see the northern border of Cormyr and the northern/western border of Cormanthyr and the Dalelands as holding fairly steady, and Netheril having an easier time of it going northeast as mentioned, or southwest into the Western Heartlands south of the High Forest. Just my assessment of the balance of power; I'll have to read the Twilight War before I make any final decisions on the matter, obviously. I've had far too many fellow scribes say "you MUST read these books" for me not to read them at this point.
I may just have to pick up that trilogy. Although I've got lots of pressure for the game of thrones series as well.
Anyhoo, I always saw the Shades and the Zhentarim as a love/hate alliance, actually. With Bane's seat of power being in Zhentil Keep, any loss there could cause a significant power downgrade for the masked son (I believe Xvim is masquerading as Bane).
The biggest reason I see the Shades winning in Sembia is that Sembia is built on competition within itself. It really wouldn't take much work to start really making the merchant families openly conflict, in my humble opinion. I would see an "Emperor Palpatine" type of figure working all the angles, and eventually you might even have the Silver Ravens versus the merchant families, or worse. To me, it would almost behave like the drow houses of Menzoberranzan (sp? I always misspell it). I say almost because the humans haven't been bred for... ferocity as much.
Also: I realized you had seen the anatomy a few weeks ago in another scroll... sorry about that.
/d |
"These people are my family, not just friends, and if you want to get to them you gotta go through ME." |
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Jakk
Great Reader
Canada
2165 Posts |
Posted - 19 Aug 2009 : 19:41:19
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| Heh... I just ordered the Twilight War trilogy. My library didn't have them, but Chapters.ca had all three titles in stock. So much for not buying novels... I also found Book III of Jack Whyte's Templar trilogy in hardcover for half price, and I got free shipping on my order, so I'm pretty happy... even though I'm buying three books I hadn't planned on owning. |
Playing in the Realms since the Old Grey Box (1987)... and *still* having fun with material published before 2008, despite the NDA'd lore.
If it's comparable in power with non-magical abilities, it's not magic. |
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sfdragon
Great Reader
2285 Posts |
Posted - 20 Aug 2009 : 10:28:22
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well look at it this way, if you dont like them, or dont want them, you can always sell them to a used bookstore or online on ebay.
I never read that trilogy myself.
lack of money and interest. |
why is being a wizard like being a drow? both are likely to find a dagger in the back from a rival or one looking to further his own goals, fame and power
My FR fan fiction
Magister's GAmbit
http://steelfiredragon.deviantart.com/gallery/33539234 |
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Sembia 1375-1385 DR and beyond
