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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe
Israel
352 Posts |
 Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 06:35:14
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The Srinshee said when she took the Ruler's Blade:
"When Oacenth's Vow is fulfilled in the stars above and below, I shall return."
Oacenth's Vow is as follows:
"If we are to survive as the People," he said, "one coronal must vow to unify the tribes of this great land. One coronal must unify sun and moon, sky and sea, and tree, root, and earth, that all may achieve a long-lasting peace and strength in unity."
So, how did the crusade fulfill Oacenth's vow? I suppose you could also go into a discussion about what exactly is the meaning of the vow. 'Sun and moon' might mean moon elf and sun elf, but what about 'sky and sea, and tree, root, and earth'?
Also, what did the Srinshee mean when she said: 'in the stars above and below'?
Any ideas/answers?
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"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.
"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.
"There are no stupid questions – just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."
"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'." |
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Markustay
Realms Explorer extraordinaire
USA
15724 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 07:23:19
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Sky and Sea could be a reference to the Sea Elves and Avariel, since this is apparently about uniting the Elven people.
The other three might be about the Green (Sylvan) Elves - Wood, Wild, and Drow (but don't ask me how, except for wood, which is obvious). I suppose 'earth' could mean the Drow, but that would leave 'root' for Grugach (Wild Elves), which is a little weird (unless you think of them as the 'root tribe' from whence all Wood Elves came).
A bit of a stretch, but that would cover all the major groups. Star Elves weren't created/invented/disovered when the vow was made, so they don't count. The Lythari would be missing as well, but they are sort-of 'half-Fey', so they might also be discounted. |
"I have never in my life learned anything from any man who agreed with me" --- Dudley Field Malone
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Edited by - Markustay on 18 Jun 2009 07:24:10 |
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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe
Israel
352 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 08:32:42
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Yes, I though of this, but did this happen in the crusade? I don't remember any Avariel or Sea Elves participating. Did they come to Myth Drannor later, along with some Drow?
And it still wouldn't answer what the Srinshee meant when she said 'in the stars above and below'. Unless the stars below are Star ELves... ;) |
"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.
"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.
"There are no stupid questions – just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."
"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'." |
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IngoDjan
Learned Scribe
Brazil
146 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 15:13:14
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Maybe the Oacenth's Vow not means what it seems. The elven language is very hard to translate, u know!  |
Ingo Djan
DUNGEON MASTER AO OF THE DIAMONDS!"I see the future repeat the past. It all is a museum of great news. The Time do not stop." |
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Lady Fellshot
Senior Scribe
USA
379 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 15:19:32
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| It might happen in the five year period between the last chapter and epilogue in The Last Mythal. In any case it isn't specifically written down as far as I know, and I didn't see anything in the Grand History of the Realms that would explain it either. I could very well be wrong though and simply don't have a book with the relevant lore. |
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edappel
Learned Scribe
Brazil
211 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 15:22:06
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I may be wrong, but the ruler blade and Srinshee didn't come back yet, right? Seiveril just took Myth Drannor...
Please, correct me if I'm wrong. |
--- Ed Appel
*** I'm a brazilian FR fan. So, feel free to correct my writing mistakes to improve my english. |
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Arivia
Great Reader
Canada
2965 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 15:25:33
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| I know we're all inclined to take Realmsian prophecies quite literally, but it's entirely possible the Oath is metaphorical: that is, as Ilsevele was the first elf to unite the elven peoples and to reclaim Cormanthyr in all ways. I do believe that trilogy does end with a land, air, and underground pincer motion in some way. |
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Brian R. James
Forgotten Realms Game Designer
USA
1098 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 16:53:23
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quote:
Originally posted by edappel
I may be wrong, but the ruler blade and Srinshee didn't come back yet, right? Seiveril just took Myth Drannor...
The Srinshee's return to Myth Drannor is mentioned in the Grand History, under 1377 DR |
Brian R. James - Freelance Game Designer
Follow me on Twitter @brianrjames |
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edappel
Learned Scribe
Brazil
211 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 17:06:01
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| (I hadn't read 4e campaign book cause my DM is still on our "time-jump"... LoL... Ok, thanks for the lore, Brian R. James) |
--- Ed Appel
*** I'm a brazilian FR fan. So, feel free to correct my writing mistakes to improve my english. |
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Ashe Ravenheart
Great Reader
USA
3243 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 17:21:50
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quote:
Originally posted by Brian R. James
quote:
Originally posted by edappel
I may be wrong, but the ruler blade and Srinshee didn't come back yet, right? Seiveril just took Myth Drannor...
The Srinshee's return to Myth Drannor is mentioned in the Grand History, under 1377 DR
Geez, Brian! You keep forgetting to mention that the half-elf ranger Ashe Ravenheart found Ary'Velahr'Kerym (the Warblade) and bonded to it in the battle for Shadowdale...
(how is this supposed to become canon if everyone forgets to mention it?  ) |
I actually DO know everything. I just have a very poor index of my knowledge.
Ashe's Character Sheet
Alphabetized Index of Realms NPCs |
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Wooly Rupert
Master of Mischief
USA
36797 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 17:57:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart
(how is this supposed to become canon if everyone forgets to mention it? )
Forgets to mention what? |
Candlekeep Forums Moderator
Candlekeep - The Library of Forgotten Realms Lore
http://www.candlekeep.com -- Candlekeep Forum Code of Conduct
I am the Giant Space Hamster of Ill Omen! |
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Menelvagor
Senior Scribe
Israel
352 Posts |
Posted - 18 Jun 2009 : 18:47:09
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quote:
Originally posted by Ashe Ravenheart:
(how is this supposed to become canon if everyone forgets to mention it? )
They don't mention it because it's untrue. Everybody knows that Meneldur, a moon elf wizard found the sword, and gave it to the newly returned Syrumstar Auglamyr for her Choker and some, ahem, 'favors'.
But seriously now, doesn't anybody have an answer? Perhaps one of the writers...? |
"Shall mortal man be more just than God? shall a man be more pure than his maker?
Behold, he put no trust in his servants; and his angels he charged with folly.
How much less them that dwell in houses of clay, whose foundation in the dust, are crushed before the moth?" - Eliphaz the Temanite, Job IV, 17-19.
"Yea, though he live a thousand years twice, yet hath he seen no good: do not all go to one place?" - Ecclesiastes VI, 6.
"There are no stupid questions – just a bunch of inquisitive idiots."
"Let's not call it 'hijacking'. Let's call it 'Thread Drift'." |
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Quale
Master of Realmslore
1757 Posts |
Posted - 20 Jun 2009 : 17:52:55
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| I think the designers just forgot about it, like with the Tree of Souls. And the whole restoration of Myth Drannor, end of the Retreat was forced. |
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BlackAce
Senior Scribe
United Kingdom
358 Posts |
Posted - 21 Jun 2009 : 23:52:48
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quote:
Originally posted by Markustay
Sky and Sea could be a reference to the Sea Elves and Avariel, since this is apparently about uniting the Elven people.
The other three might be about the Green (Sylvan) Elves - Wood, Wild, and Drow (but don't ask me how, except for wood, which is obvious). I suppose 'earth' could mean the Drow, but that would leave 'root' for Grugach (Wild Elves), which is a little weird (unless you think of them as the 'root tribe' from whence all Wood Elves came).
Could also use the Widow Trilogy as feeding into it too. What with the return of the Illithyr as opposed to the drow. |
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Ikki
Seeker
Finland
57 Posts |
Posted - 23 Jun 2009 : 23:34:44
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quote:
Originally posted by Menelvagor
The Srinshee said when she took the Ruler's Blade:
"When Oacenth's Vow is fulfilled in the stars above and below, I shall return."
Oacenth's Vow is as follows:
"If we are to survive as the People," he said, "one coronal must vow to unify the tribes of this great land. One coronal must unify sun and moon, sky and sea, and tree, root, and earth, that all may achieve a long-lasting peace and strength in unity."
So, how did the crusade fulfill Oacenth's vow? I suppose you could also go into a discussion about what exactly is the meaning of the vow. 'Sun and moon' might mean moon elf and sun elf, but what about 'sky and sea, and tree, root, and earth'?
Also, what did the Srinshee mean when she said: 'in the stars above and below'?
Any ideas/answers?
sun, moon and sea are self evident. Sky, well, since avariel are extinct... how about that referring to the Imperial Elven Navy? Tying it closer to the groundling nations..
Tree, root and earth. Now thats a bit more esoteric. Ever heard the "as above, so below"? That was one gross failure of myth drannor, with the tree running wild, losing all contact with the roots..
That is, the great houses (tree) must serve the common elves (roots). Earth, being the home, the nation, that forms the boundry and meeting ground, the reason either exists.
Stars = capable ones. The ones with levels :P
above = houses, below = commoners. Those shouldnt be turned against each other, but united under a singlöe strong coronal.
...and thus we have, one people, one elven race, one nation... myth drannor over all... hail victory! :D |
Edited by - Ikki on 23 Jun 2009 23:38:12 |
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coach
Senior Scribe
USA
479 Posts |
Posted - 24 Jun 2009 : 00:01:39
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Sky, well, since avariel are extinct...
unless you were just poking fun above, this is incorrect i think unless i have missed a 3/3.5 edition canon reference to this occurrence
avariel present in Rogue Dragon trilogy - aerie located in Sossal, and in a forest in Damara |
Bloodstone Lands Sage |
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How Exactly Did The Crusade Fulfill Oacenth's Vow?
